Angels

[VegasRonin]

It seems that most people's view of angels, are these the feathered, human looking, beautiful humanoids. These same people attribute these beings with having an affinty towards humans and caring or watching out for us. From what I've read on angels. They're not human looking at all, and they're a terrible force of destruction. Didn't God release 2 angels for 1 night in the Old Testament, and these 2 angels killed like 200,000+ people? The only time in the bible I can recollect of angels being remotely close to humans, is the Sodom and Gomorah story. When Lot and his family took the angels in from the mob that wanted to have their way with them. I'm pretty sure the angels could have defended themselves if they chose. Why do people attribute angels with being good for people? They've never shown up and something good has happened. Do they even exist?

[dutchie]

Well, you first have to believe they exist anyway...

There are religions (like animism in Asia) that state there are "good" and "evil" spirits in the air, not to be confused with the spirits of dead people. A sort of demi-gods.

[VegasRonin]

Good point Dutchie. I'll add that in the topical question.

[DarkAce]

If I remember correctly there are different ranks of angels and some have a different purpose. Like I believe Arch Angels purpose were to defend heaven from the forces of hell.

Didn't the angel Gabriel come to Mary and the angel was described as human looking?

[DarkAce]

Here's some evidence I found:


We know on the authority of Scripture that there are nine orders of angels, viz., Angels, Archangels, Virtues, Powers, Principalities, Dominations, Throne, Cherubim and Seraphim. That there are Angels and Archangels nearly every page of the Bible tell us, and the books of the Prophets talk of Cherubim and Seraphim. St. Paul, too, writing to the Ephesians enumerates four orders when he says: 'above all Principality, and Power, and Virtue, and Domination'; and again, writing to the Colossians he says: 'whether Thrones, or Dominations, or Principalities, or Powers'. If we now join these two lists together we have five Orders, and adding Angels and Archangels, Cherubim and Seraphim, we find nine Orders of Angels.


For a detailed article explaining everything about Angels (yes they are evil ones also) check this site out: http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/01476d.htm

[evilwill]

Wasn't Lucifer an angel?

[DarkAce]

Yes. He and a bunch of other angels went up against God, lost and were casted down to Earth...or hell. This is supposed to have taken place before man was created though...i think.

[prezhorusin04]

Good info DARKACE..i find it very strange that the word ANGEL contains the SUPREME SUMERIAN GOD/GODDESS AN in the title as well as the name for the SUMER-HEBREW god in EL..-AN-G-EL..
Perhaps the G is the sacred G (or geometry) of the Freemasons.?

Though i do believe that there is some kind of "guardian angel" force that helps to watch over us..

Just saying about the AN G & EL:ohwell:

[Two Socks]

Those were some pretty frickin' hilarious angels.

Selma Hayeck can be my angel any day of the week and twice on Sunday.

mmmm...knockers!

[VegasRonin]

So has an angel ever showed itself to man, and catastrophe not follow?

[dutchie]

According to the bible, an angel appeared before Mary, telling her that she would be pregnant. Is that a catastrophe?

[evilwill]

of course it was.........

[VegasRonin]

Being forced to conceive a child that basically seems to be the product of celestial rape may be a bit catastrophic for a woman but who am I? Killing th son of this celestial rapist couldn't have been a good thing. Especially with the father's reputation of destroying whole cities, and occasionally the world.

[prezhorusin04]

See the Sumerian god of heaven iof AN in angel..The sumer-hebreW name for god in EL..In fact most angels have EL in their names..MICHA-EL, GABRI-EL, RAPHA-EL and near ALL holy text angels contain EL at the end of their names..And let's not forget about BELZELBUB!!-BEL is the SUMERIAN name for their sun god who was the chief title of the god MARDUK.

A-lie-N AN-G-ELS:alien: :indiffere :alien: :indiffere :alien:

[Two Socks]

Of course there are similarities in the words used.

Do you know why you ignoranamous?

Because the languages were diversified but in only a few ways. Look at Spanish and the derivitives it uses of Latin. It and many other laguages have their roots established in Latin.

Jesus Christ!

Of course the similarities exist because the languages branched off of one another and utilized the existing root STRUCTURES for their vocabulary foundation.

English uses many languages to create itself. German, Spanish, Latin, French, even some African dialects. . .

Get over it already--EVERYTHING is recycled--including this grandiose scheme you continue to procalim as truth and exonheratingly revealing!

How about your formal education? How's that goin' for you?

[dutchie]

Christ... that's kraaist, when written in Dutch. Kraai st... Kraai is a bird, a crow. ST = super touring, like the Triumph Sprint ST, equipped with cases on the back.

So: Christ is a crow with top and side cases.

Get real, prezhorus.:rollin:

[prezhorusin04]

Christ comes from the Greek word Kristos meaning "annointed one."--
jesus comes from Jeshua and jesse, being related to the word for god in Jehovah..Jesus is also related to "of zeus."

i know where modern language came from . Latin and Greek translation from the PHONICIAN/HEBREWS as a language that would make trade easier about 2000 years ago.For, these Phonicians and hebrews is where we get the modern day phonics.

hey, your just not seeing what i'm saying..THE SUMER-HEBREW WORD EL is THE NAME FOR GOD..EL IS WORSHIPPED AS SATURN..WHY IS EL IN THE WORD ANGEL an almost every angel you will find? Go look it up..THE SATURN GOD OF THE HEBREW EL IS IN THE NAME OF ALMOST EVERY ANGEL IN ANY RELIGION!!!

2SOCKS for someone who misses John Lennon you sure are a jackass.

you really cant deny that the HEBREW EL is in the word angel and the names of angels.

[prezhorusin04]

i'm just asking questions.

[prezhorusin04]

In Sumeria, 2000 years before EGypt, El was worshiped as God symbolized by saturn..All wedding ceromonies took place under Saturn..Thus, we have the wedding "rings" that we place upon the fingers..The rings of Saturn are also related to the crowns that kings wear.

[geedubyah]

You never answered about your formal education.

Well?

[prezhorusin04]

go research the SUMER-HEBREW GOD EL for yourself and see what you think..

i am just trying to release information..i have no reason to sit here and %#@*ing type lies all day.

i'm just tyring to raise some questions so maybe someone will go out and look further into things for themselves.

"THE GIVING OF TRUTH IS THE GIVING OF LOVE."
DAVID ICKE.

"A speculator is a man who observes the future, and acts before it occurs."
Bernard M. Baruch

[Two Socks]

:lol: :rollin: :eek2: :lol: :eek2: :rollin: :lol:

MD, those are some very astute and accurate observations.

(the board joins in collective laughter at prez)

[geedubyah]

You got punk'd!

You got so totally punk'd...you're a writer? Oh, what have you written and why isn't it on the market or bestseller list? Why? Because you are a total baloney artist. And don't blame big brother because you fail to meet or accomplish your alleged dreams.

As for your friends who have gone to college and consider it a waste---well, they need to study real degrees, none of that liberal arts crap AND they need to go after the work they want. Just as MD posted about pursuing your ideals, the good things won't come to you, you have to gou out and EARN them.

Ha hah ha hah! You are so punk'd! Ha hah ha hah!

He didn't attack you personally, he simply used what you provided. Hah hah haha ha :rollin:

Don't get mad prez--he's simply smarter than you! And by all appearances, more ambitious than you--to add insult to injury. HA!:lol:

[geedubyah]

Hah Ha Hah Ha!:eek2: :lol: :rollin: :lol: :eek2:

[prezhorusin04]

i dont know too many published 24 year old writers of books..Let alone best sellers..And trying to finish 3 is no easy task..Don't worry dude..i guarantee you'll be hearing of them soon enough..

you ever written anything more then what's on a computer message board 2socks.?-or read anything more for that matter?

nevermind dude..i dont care what you've read or written..Nor little Mickydik..

Anyone else but the TWO LOVERS wanna try to "punk" me? i'm all up for it..I WONT WRITE ANOTHER THING ON THIS BOARD UNTIL I GET ANSWERS.!

NO DIS-RESPECT.
I'm not here to make people feel bad..Just to question things..i thought that's what this board was about. Am i wrong??

[Two Socks]

I wrote many disertations in college and my Master's Thesis was a wonderful piece that was actually published in Business Journals and national College Business School Monthly's.

Thank you for asking and, while you were punk'd by the 'ol opinionated one himself, don't feel too bad about it.

Because I'm sure it will continue to happen repeatedly as he clearly outranks you in the mental faculties department. :lol:

[Two Socks]

I went to school to learn how to corrupt the system to my benefit and make as much moola as possible. That's the way of the americans...bet you didn't find that in your many books.

You refuse to attend because you know you'll flunk out and be laughed off the campus or be taken away for questioning by the men in black.

The difference is I'm doing something with my life and I have more to show for it than a pile of notes about Roman Polanski and The Summerians that will never add up to more than kindling.

But you know, do whatever blows your hair back, dude.

[evilwill]

Let's keep it civil everyone. And try to stay on topic......

[Two Socks]

"Anyone else but the TWO LOVERS wanna try to "punk" me? i'm all up for it..I WONT WRITE ANOTHER THING ON THIS BOARD UNTIL I GET ANSWERS.!"

OK, now who is this:

Waaaaaa! Waahhaaaawaaahhhh!

I want I want I want I want I want!

Give up? We all clearly see it's prez, or 'cold footed conspiracist'

:lol:
jackass

[Two Socks]

the bottom 15% for other nations.

You shouldn't have posted that figure because it discredits you, rather than adding foundation to your argument.

Yes, you've repeatedly posted how well you can read. Oh, goody. That's super.

No one is here to "blast" you. It's just that those who have accomplished and suceeded in life, are disappointed that someone with your 'talents' is by all appearances wasting them. on imaginary concepts and, well as long you can sleep at night I guess.

About all my moola...yes, those without will get theirs after I'm finshed getting mine. They didn't help support me through school and they sure as hell didn't help to understand the material or sweat out the IRS during those invasive audits.... :rolleyes2

"(though i do feel a great deal of hatred and anger sometimes.)"

That's because you know you've not done anything with your life.

Oh, and:

"I'M NOT TRYING TO BE UNCIVIL OR AN *******."

You sure are, no one else has called people a**h***s, or 'dik', 'gay'. So, lie some more.

Lies make the sun god Ra cry. :lol:

[Two Socks]

"And just how old are you two because you seem pretty immature."

Yeah..this means so much coming from you. Nigga Please.

"Tell me, were you the pimple faced bullies growing up, or were you the ones who got picked on? Both? You seem like the types of guys who would sit around and burn ants with magnifying glasses and pull the wings off flies"

No, I can't speak for MD, but I was not a bully or the one who was picked on. I was the guy who had a perfectly average, run-of-the-mill adolesence. Although, I was part of the group that would light paper bags of dogshiit on peoples doorsteps and watch the commotion. We also did drive-by paint-balling's--now that was fun!

PS--You did use the term gay to reference one of us. So there.

And tell your girl to stop sending me private messages--I don't want to cyber with her.

[VegasRonin]

Thanks for reinforcing your egos rather than your opinions on the Topic guys! :rolleye:

[evilwill]

This is directed to everyone. No need for personal insults. Let's keep it on topic.

Micky and Two Socks. You've had your fun, now stop picking fights.

[Two Socks]

Glad to be of service Vegas. :rollin:

My ego's is now sufficiently satiated because you honored me with your appearance. Thank you. :D

Besides, you know how hard it is to prove who has the bigger whatever while on the internet. . .:lol:

Ok 'dad' (will), I'll be good (for awhile).

prez=crybaby

[prezhorusin04]

DON'T mean for that to happen.i dont feel im instigating things.

i'm truley trying to come at you all with as much respect as possible..i don't try to raise arguments, expecially personal and long ones.-i just promise you all that 90% of the info i am giving here is readily out there..You might have to put some of it together for yourself(which you should) and that's where your own discernment and Intuition comes into play..Your own creativity and imagination..--i mean no one any harm and have good intents with this info, i'm just saying "here are some possible answers.Please look/ask for yourself and tell me what you think." im not trying to come across forcefull,. condesending or violent.i'm just trying to get some feedback on how i could be right or wrong..i don't feel i'm being agressive, though i know you have no reasons to trust me. i feel that very many of these facts are extremely valid ones.

Here are some souces that will maybe help show you that RealiTy is A PyraMid Scheme.

RULE BY SECRECY-JIM MARRS
THE OCCULT CONSPIRACY-MICHAEL HOWARD
THE TUTANKHAMUN PROPHECIES-MAURICE COTTERELL
THE LOST BOOK OF ENKI &DIVINE ENCOUNTERS-ZECHARIA SITCHIN
DOWNSIZE THIS AND STUPID WHITE MEN-MICHAEL MOORE
CHILDREN OF THE MATRIX-DAVID ICKE
THE 60 GREATEST CONSPIRACIES-JOHN VANKIN & WHALEN
BEHOLD A PALE HORSE-WILLIAM COOPER
ENCYCLOPEDIA OF THE GODS-MICHAEL JORDAN
THE ORION MYSTERY-ROBERT BAUVAL
THE EPIC OF GILGAMESH
THE EGYPTIAN BOOK OF THE DEAD

There are many other great works but these are a few.

any suggestions for me and i will happily look into it.

thanx.

angels

[evilwill]

Originally posted by Two Socks
Ok 'dad' (will), I'll be good (for awhile).

prez=crybaby

Good boy 2socks.... now run along and play nice. :p

[dutchie]

Just spent the most useless 15 minutes of my existence, working through the horsesh.t you guys saw fit to throw all over the board...

Prez. Like the ol' saying goes: if you can't do the time, don't do the crime. Your trying to bring up things with the narrowest of scientific foundations and you're doing that with a certainty that is bound to get you fried. My advice (for what it is worth): accompany your statements with solid reasoning and good links to back you up (not from some obscure group of idiots with 1 flimsy homepage). People will given you serious attention then.

If you're being toasted anyway: leave and get a beer.

[prezhorusin04]

none of the information comes from some dudes homepage..As for the scientific info or backings, my friend i am speaking history here..Its in any book you'll use to go look it up in..Not one FACT i have stated on EGYPT OR SUMERIA or any place else for that matter is not noted thoroughly in numerous sources..THE ANUNNAKI, THE GREAT WHITE BROTHERHOOD, THE FREEMASONS, OSIRIS AND THE GODS..THIS INFO IS EVERYWHERE,not just secluded to some back corner of the internet.

all i asked is why the HEBREW NAME OF THE SUMER-HEBREW GODS OF AN AND EL Are both in the word angel as well as the letter of worship in the SACRED G OF FREEMASONRY.??
tHAT'S MY QUESTION, this is an angel board right.?.i think that's a pretty damn good question and all i posted on it is real info..
SATURN AND EL AND THE SUMERIAN WEDDINGS..thAT'S REAL information..I was suprized when i found it out too. WHY DO 90% OF ALL ANGELS IN RELIGIOUS SCRIPTURE END IN EL?-These are QUESTIONS that are worth asking and i shouldn't be burned like a witch for presenting it.!

Sorry i don't post a lot of sites, but i get most of my info from books and not the computer..Especially since i just got a computer..i've posted some very good books that will give you much of the info i just stated..

i'm telling you all, wheather you choose to believe or not, that there is something to what i'm saying..

i find it peculiar that you act as if i'm the one who started the conflict by speaking my mind and posting information..i look at Mickydoo and some of the others and all they do is post negative personal attacks at people who are voicing their opinions.You never say anything to them..LIKE HOW THE HELL IS IT MY FAULT that this information is real and readily available??

look up the GODS AN AND EL AND YOU'LL FIND OUT A TREMENDOUS AMOUNT OF INFO THAT WILL MAYBE HAVE YOU QUESTIONING IF I HAVE ANY VALID POINTS..

Now i'm gonna go erase some of my responses to these two who flimsily tried to discredit my information and go post elsewhere on this board where people are a little more open to possibilities that arn't taught in school..

THanks Dutchie;)

bak 2 my beer
bak 2 an-g-els

[annabelly]

Dutchie.....Could compulsory word limits be introduced to this board? :rolleye:

[AngelTV]

I believe in angels.

[prezhorusin04]

i do too angelt.v.--i'm just wondering if they are not something totally different then what we've imagined them to be.:lol:

[dutchie]

Prez,

IF I CATCH YOU SHOUTING ONCE MORE, BY GOD, I SWEAR I'LL THROW OUT YOUR POST INTO A DARK PLACE WHERE THERE IS ONLY TEETHGRINDING, MOANING, LETHAL FARTING AND COMPULSORY NAILCLEANING 7 TIMES A DAY!!!

Please, please please: limit your posts to readable portions, AND KEEP YOUR FINGERS OFF THE SHIFT KEY!

[evilwill]

Fear the wrath of the mods..... :evil:

As for angels...... As far as I'm concerned, more religious fabrications.

[AngelTV]

Horus, Your concept is a bit narrow. Wings and all. Really. Sometimes angels work through us. Have you ever met someone at the right time and had an influence on them. A total stranger in a train station or a person needing help. Had helpful information or a moment of heroics. Then you have had guidance by an angel.

[annabelly]

Thats nice Angel. I like that.:happy:

[dutchie]

AngelTV is a true romantic... Glad to see there are some left.

[annabelly]

Makes nice, albeit illogical spiritual sense though Dutchie...I think God is the good in us all....sounds very Prez/ Alanesque BUT....its kinda what I think.....:o

[VegasRonin]

If angels do exist I see no reason why they would care to watch over us. It seems their own kingdon comes into peril from time to time, and I would think defending it takes up much of their time.

[annabelly]

Oh for goodness sakes Vegas....ANGELS DON"T HAVE KINGDOMS!!! They...just ....kinda...float around...Honestly - Don't you know anything? :tired:

[dutchie]

Ever seen one, AB? I have not.

[annabelly]

I was kidding Dutchie :p ...I still like Angels view on Angels though.

[DarkAce]

Sometimes angels work through us. Have you ever met someone at the right time and had an influence on them. A total stranger in a train station or a person needing help. Had helpful information or a moment of heroics. Then you have had guidance by an angel.

You mean that's not caused by our own emotions such as compassion? So when someone's helping another person or just being friendly or kind it's not really because it's of their own will, but an angel working through us? :rollin:

What happens when I'm acting like an a-hole? I have the bad angels guiding me?

[AngelTV]

Thanks AB. Dutchie, I use to be a true romantic until I realised that being a romantic means getting your heart shredded everytime. Now I am the "You don't want to go out with me" guy. Funny though that this works just as well.
Darkace, Not everytime you do something good just the times when it really is a coincidence that you were there or right place, right time. The ones where you scratch your head afterwards. I agree that the bad deeds are evil influenced.

[Two Socks]

Being a romantic has nothing to do with getting your heart ripped out--it has everything to do with you being a doormat.

Get over yourself.

And DarkAce was being sarcastic. So, you just agreed with the sarcasm, while debasing your argument.

Way to go genius.

[AngelTV]

He asked me a question. I answered it. Gee does that mean I am punked too. Get over you.

[VegasRonin]

And DarkAce was being sarcastic. So, you just agreed with the sarcasm, while debasing your argument.
What is your stance or argument Two Socks? Do you have one or are you just here to attack people personally who you don't agree with? If you genuinely don't want to debate or exchange an idea within the religion forums then you don't have to post in them. I'm no Christian but your stance is just as fanatical as the Taliban or the so called Christians of the Inquisition. It appears that you've made being an Atheist a personal religion that has no tolerance. :smokin:

[DarkAce]

I see. So the voices I hear telling me to push someone onto the subway tracks are actually evil influences forcing me to do their work! This is going to go great for my defence in court Thrusday:evil:

[evilwill]

:rollin:

There's always a loophole......

:rollin:

[DontBeAfraid]

Actually its me using the shining darkace..... I support a negative population increase.

[Two Socks]

"What is your stance or argument Two Socks? Do you have one or are you just here to attack people personally who you don't agree with? If you genuinely don't want to debate or exchange an idea within the religion forums then you don't have to post in them. I'm no Christian but your stance is just as fanatical as the Taliban or the so called Christians of the Inquisition. It appears that you've made being an Atheist a personal religion that has no tolerance. "

Ha Ha Ha! :rollin: Ha Ha Ha! :rollin: Ha Ha Ha! :rollin: Ha Ha Ha! :rollin:

[VegasRonin]

I am honored that you invested much thought into your reply. In some things one hopes that one is wrong but alas...............:tired:

[AngelTV]

Just thought I would bring this one up again as it goes with the new pic. I can be such a kid sometimes but does three angels in a row get a prize?
:chop:
The ironic thing about using evil as a defense in court is it could get you off for being Insane and you get to go to the funny farm instead of the death penalty. :nono:

[dutchie]

Ah, are those the choices?? :ohmy:

[VegasRonin]

Been reading up a little on these angels. Be they myth or reality, I'm thoroughly convinced they're Jerks!:smokin: Do you guys know, according to Hebrew scripture, they've rebelled not once but twice? These guys can't be trusted, and are way too powerful to screw with. IMO

[DarkAce]

I dunno. I think because of all their past rebellions, if they even ponder the thought, JC or God bitch slaps them and they get sent into the eternal abyss:smokin:

Angels don't have the 'parts' to procreate right? But in the Bible they mated with the daughters of men and the earth had to be flooded. So they either had the necessary 'parts' and God removed them later on, or the Bible is contradicting itself once more.
Besides Angels are bound to serve us, I wonder how you make them come?;)

[AngelTV]

they are a good baseball team but didn't think they were all bad.

These guys can't be trusted, and are way too powerful to screw with. IMO
Yeah so let's call them jerks.
Rather have them om my side then against.;)

[VegasRonin]

Angels don't have the 'parts' to procreate right? But in the Bible they mated with the daughters of men and the earth had to be flooded
Who says they don't have reproductive organs? I read the whole Book of Enoch yesterday. They definitely have reproductive abilities. AngetTV, don't side with a force just because its stronger than you. I thought I knew ya better than that.:ohmy:

[mickydoolittle]

Originally posted by VegasRonin
AngetTV, don't side with a force just because its stronger than you.
You DO have wisdom Ronin! Goddamnit that post is awesome! :Bounce: :respect:

[AngelTV]

Rather have them om my side then against
I would rather have them on my side. Not me on their side. Geez. There is a difference.
You read the Book in one day!
Mickey, there is a brown spot on the end of your tongue.
:rollin: :rollin:

[VegasRonin]

I came across some information that I haven't heard before. Some people think that the Angelic Rebellion hasn't happened yet, and that scripture was talking about future events in this case. I've never heard of this interpretation. Anyone else ever hear of this?

[mickydoolittle]

Originally posted by AngelTV
Mickey, there is a brown spot on the end of your tongue.
:rollin: :rollin:
Oh you bastard. :toast:

[AngelTV]

Heh Heh. Sorry Mickey couldn't help myself. I know you will return the serve in the future.:wine:
VR, give us a brief run down on that scripture please.

[dutchie]

What the hell does it matter if they can do it or not? They sure as hell haven't done it for a very long time... If I were one, I'd be hopping along on my nuts as if they were skippy balls...

[AngelTV]

:rollin: :rollin: Skippy balls:rollin:
Hey are Angels that are still up in heaven allowed to procreate with each other or is that against the rules.
Can someone tell me what the advantages are of being an angels. Do you get perks? Maybe this is why they are rebelling. Better working conditions and a boss who is a bit more approachable. Definitely a suggestion box. More rainbows.
:Bounce: :Bounce:

[VegasRonin]

VR, give us a brief run down on that scripture please.
Its not new scripture or anything most of us haven't heard before. The ideology is new to me. That some people take the Angelic Rebellion as a prophecy of future events. To me, this would screw up a lot of the Biblical time lines, or is it just me?:p

[Bigsky770]

SShhheeesh. . . . . :rollin: :Bounce: :Bounce:
Dutchie. . . Skippy Balls? The 'picture' of this that appears within my imagination is a cause for the likes of unbearable laughter. . . Thanx fer that, needed it more than you know. . . :lol:

Joe (Bigsky770)

[VegasRonin]

Get that stuff off my Angel Topic Joe! Hehehe...:lol:

[Bigsky770]

Just could'nt help it. . . We all need to laugh once in a while, Besides, that one was just too funny to ignore. . .I'm still laughing!:lol: :rollin:

Joe (Bigsky770)

[dutchie]

hm. it was kind of "visual" wasn't it?:p ;)

[LC Jeffries]

Kachina's where originally created to represent the belief that the People came from the Earth. (Gensis). The dolls were made as a representative of their religious and educational training of their children.
The Kachina's gave children taught children how to identify individual personages.

The Kachina is made with man-like bodies and mask-type heads symbolize any and everything in which man has an interest. (Eziekials Seraphen?)

Everything from art, drama, and poetry, has special meaning of the 'Thunder God's.' (Cherab's?)

Kachina's are mainly created in Hopi-land, Navajo-land, and other lands to this day.

Kachina for decades have much unwritten history, All Native American traditions and tribal lore were usually handed down orally. Kachina's a reprsentative of these tradition are revered and have come to preserve a fragment of culture.

There are around 1000 documented Kachina's, and many new characters are frequently invented or created. There js a possibility, that there, may be as many as 2500 Kachina's.

I have a Hoop Dancer and the White Wolf, Hunter.

The markings on the the Kachina represent earth and the universe. Their custumes represent individual men and their lives.

Each Kachina in a sense represent's the joining of man and his Creator as one.

To a member of the People, to have a Kachina it is a Great Honor and a Blessing because he feels linked to God through the symbolism of his kachina.

The people have what is called a 'Blessing Way.' and to me this is a form of that Blessing. To be at one with God.

Lori:cool:

[Two Socks]

Hey LC...how is your class/study coming along?

[LC Jeffries]

The study I'm doing is interesting. It's actually a self study, can't afford college, so I'm trying to use the internet as form of educational tool.

I'm finding where college proff. have posted their exam studies online and I'm using their questions to do the study.

Thanks for asking.:D

[Two Socks]

Ahhh..that is fantastic. Good for you to pursue knowledge. I'm positive MD would be proud to see your seeking knowledge

But, the main point is: are you learning?

[LC Jeffries]

More then you can imagine. Quantum Physics is rather interesting.:Bounce:

[Two Socks]

You should be aware that the board has a number of members who take great interest in QP.

Would you care to meander to the Science forum and learn more or post some topics for debate? You know it would be a good thing!

[LC Jeffries]

I'm nowhere near ready to debate QP. I have alot to study and alot to learn to understand. It's a mindblowing thing for first time QP individuals.

[Two Socks]

Then post a question or questions about certain aspects of QP..the responses would be good because there is so much knowledge here on the board. You can open a topic and then view the debates over the topic and the responses to the topic.

[LC Jeffries]

I just might do that. I've got to go now 6:00 a.m. comes early. Have to get the kids ups for school and I may have to work.

Have a good evening and weekend.

Lori

[VegasRonin]

I love to see debates and idea exchanges without personal attacks. Makes me all warm 'n fuzzy inside.:lol:

[LC Jeffries]

Yes that warm and fuzzy feeling is nice, isn't it?:rollin:

[DontBeAfraid]

Sorry about killing the mood but LC, could you maybe pick one of your sigs then rotate them weekly or daily or whatever....

Your signature(s) takes up over half my screen....

[evilwill]

Angels are an interesting concept. I know very little of what scripture actually says about them. Do they have human form?

[VegasRonin]

Angels are an interesting concept. I know very little of what scripture actually says about them. Do they have human form?
There are many different races (For lack of a better term) of angels. Some are human looking and others border on looking like beasts. There's even hints of some of them being purely ethereal.

[DarkAce]

For info on Angels checkout this link: http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/01476d.htm

About the angels not having reproductive organs, I remember reading and hearing about this long ago. I have no idea where it is in the books of the Bible or if it's even included in the Bible.

[Defiant Noquisi]

If an angel is some kind of wonderful entity doing a good or great work with nothing but caring for you in mind then yes I believe they exist!

I believe I slept with one for three years.....

[LC Jeffries]

I think that is quite romatic. Hope you will always be happy.

Lori:happy:

[mickydoolittle]

LC? Are you enjoying your studies as of late? You seem to not spend as much time here on the board...doin' alright?

[LC Jeffries]

I am. I did my first real study last week. I've been busy taking care of my kids and working as well. The only real time I have to get out and talk at the boards is weekends. As well as the evenings after I get the kids to bed and my husband off to work.

Then I have a limited time as well. I usually try to finish by 11:00 because we have to be up at 6:00 a.m. for the kids to catch the bus's at 7 and 7:30. I am on call at work every morning so if I get a call I have to leave by 9:00 to get to work. Then I have to work with the kids and their homework after I get home then make dinner then.....Well I guess you get the idea. :D

And that's not including doing laundrey, cleaning the house...

I had my nephew here yesterday along with another boy from the neighborhood. Watching out for 3 growing boys and a 13 year old daughter is quite the job especially when they are constantly hungrey. So this past weekend was limited as well.

This time I have right now is a rare one. My son is staying the night with his cousin and my husband is settled down and watching the NFL Playoffs. My daughter is playing her video games. So this is a quiet time for me.

Thank you for asking Micky, hope you've had a nice weekend.

Lori :thumbs:

[LC Jeffries]

Originally posted by DarkAce
For info on Angels checkout this link: http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/01476d.htm

About the angels not having reproductive organs, I remember reading and hearing about this long ago. I have no idea where it is in the books of the Bible or if it's even included in the Bible.

Have you read Genesis 6? It refers to the son's of God loving and taking God's daughters as wives? This could also mean the joining of Cain's daughters with Seth's daughters or it could also be interpeted as fallen angles taking human woman as wives and reproducing with them.

I have had a thought on this particular passage. This is just a theory mind you. So don't take it to heart.

I believe that when angels fall they become physical beings. That is they fall to mortal bodys. Yet still they maintain their supernatural abilities and became the gods of Ancient Rome and Greece.

These fallen angels where able to reproduce with women because they had physical bodies.

I also believe that the fallen one's offspring, started all the storys and the legends of fairies, elves, orc's etc. as well as the giants of the earth. Yes and even vampires and warewolves.

This would go against the theory that all those people and creatures where wiped out in the flood, because it would mean that there had been a few survivors of the flood.

There are still today, people who carry the giant and the elve's genectic codes in their bodies and they grow as giants or are part of the little people of today. I believe somehow we all carry these codes in our bodys and once inawhile they become active and it can effect people today.

Look at basketball players.

I don't know, what do you all think?:cool:

[VegasRonin]

That theory seems to be pretty prevalent Lori. Hehehe, I have Giant genes.:devsmo:

[Two Socks]

I have a giant m... ...oh never mind. :lol:

[AngelTV]

Yeah Lori I like your theory as well. Out of interest, once fallen is there anyway back?

[VegasRonin]

Yeah Lori I like your theory as well. Out of interest, once fallen is there anyway back?
In one of the Apocryphal Books, it says yes. I'll try and find the one I'm speaking of. Not only for Angels but for those in Hell also.:smokin:

[AngelTV]

Well well well. A loophole eh VR. I might need it after New years Eve. Wait to find out.:thumbs:

[LC Jeffries]

Originally posted by AngelTV
Yeah Lori I like your theory as well. Out of interest, once fallen is there anyway back?

I don't know. I though would think that a loving God would allow an angel who has repented fully to return. Though many religious groups believe that a fallen angel has no second chance.

There was an old Christian book that came out oh maybe 10 years ago. I can't remember the title, but it was a story of an angel who had fallen, to live like a mortal man. He had been arrogant and cruel. He though lived with man and lived like a man for awhile. He also learned what it was like to be man and to love like a man.

During the time he came to love man and his creator more then he ever realized. He finally understood why God Created mortal man and in the end was redeemed.

I wish I could remember the book. But I feel that the Prophesy series (Movies) was based on the book with a little something thrown in.

Lori:D

[wejkhke8844843]

God didnt "rape" Mary. She was asked by the Angel Gabriel and she accepted God's plan.

[Edge]

God didnt "rape" Mary. She was asked by the Angel Gabriel and she accepted God's plan.


Refer to my last post int he Catholisim is a false religion thread to find my view on this subject...

Oh and if it did happen it would be an act of beastallity.

[autryn2]

in Huntsville, Alabama, (USA). He has a Suzuki 1000 (bored to 1055). He was riding in the left lane of a 4-lane divided hwy on his bike (with a car on his right driving in the same direction that he was) when a man driving a sedan pulled out from my friend's right and attempted to pull into the median (just in front of him). Trouble was, that this guy was high on drugs (meth) and didn't pull all the way into the median. When he stopped the back end of his sedan extended into both the left lane (the lane my buddy was riding in) and the lane to his right. All my buddy could do was hit the brake, slide his back tire to the left, and lay his bike down before hitting the sedan (going pretty fast). My buddy watched (in slow motion he later told me) as he and his bike flipped over the trunk of the sedan back quarter pannel (he said he watched in slow-mo as the metal of the sedan's fender molded around his left leg as he and his bike flipped). When he landed on the pavement his bike landed behind him and proceeded to push him THRU A BUSY INTERSECTION (in a direction that was toward the left of the direction he was originally traveling) and into the oncomming traffic's left lane. An elderly lady in another car (in the oncomming lane) was bearing down on him traveling in the opposite direction he was sliding and only about 20-30 meters from him.
Here's what happened next:

The old lady, knowing there was no time to stop, and not wanting to see what was going to happen to my buddy, took BOTH her hands off the steering wheel and covered her face with them. The car, with NO ONE STEERING, swerved into the right lane, missed my buddy, and swerved back into the left lane again within the space of about 50 meters, all while the lady had her hands over her face!!!

Do I believe in angels???? You bet!!!

[dutchie]

Great story. But it proves zip. You believe in angels through that story? I had believed in angels, when your friend had jumped off a 50 story building and survived without a scratch...

[autryn2]

19"There was a rich man who was dressed in purple and fine linen and lived in luxury every day. 20At his gate was laid a beggar named Lazarus, covered with sores 21and longing to eat what fell from the rich man's table. Even the dogs came and licked his sores.
22"The time came when the beggar died and the angels carried him to Abraham's side. The rich man also died and was buried. 23In hell,[3] where he was in torment, he looked up and saw Abraham far away, with Lazarus by his side. 24So he called to him, 'Father Abraham, have pity on me and send Lazarus to dip the tip of his finger in water and cool my tongue, because I am in agony in this fire.'
25"But Abraham replied, 'Son, remember that in your lifetime you received your good things, while Lazarus received bad things, but now he is comforted here and you are in agony. 26And besides all this, between us and you a great chasm has been fixed, so that those who want to go from here to you cannot, nor can anyone cross over from there to us.'
27"He answered, 'Then I beg you, father, send Lazarus to my father's house, 28for I have five brothers. Let him warn them, so that they will not also come to this place of torment.'
29"Abraham replied, 'They have Moses and the Prophets; let them listen to them.'
30" 'No, father Abraham,' he said, 'but if someone from the dead goes to them, they will repent.'
31"He said to him, 'If they do not listen to Moses and the Prophets, they will not be convinced even if someone rises from the dead.' "

==================================================

You're probably wondering why I posted the above scripture.
The reason is the last part: 'If they do not listen to Moses and the Prophets, they will not be convinced even if someone rises from the dead."

Some people see angels and miracles in their life.
Some people do not, will not, and refuse to see anything miraculus about anything... they write it off as coincidence, luck, chance, or whatever.

What's the difference in these people???... I don't have an answer.
But I'll tell you this: I feel sorry for those who can't see God in their lives.
(and no, I'm NOT saying I feel superior to these folks... I just wish they could see things from my perspective). I don't need the Bible to tell me there is a God. I see Him in creation (sunsets, wind on grass, smiles on childrens faces, all over the place) and I am comforted. I'm truly sorry others can't.

[dutchie]

I believe you do, I honestly do. Don't feel sorry, I haven't asked you to.

Now, back to our angels....

[VegasRonin]

I see Him in creation (sunsets, wind on grass, smiles on childrens faces, all over the place) and I am comforted. I'm truly sorry others can't.
Wind on Grass? Do you see God in barren and desolate lands, that will not grow food?

Smiles on children's faces? Do you see God in the faces of Jewish or Palestinian children who have lost their parents, fighting in God's name?

Sunsets? Do you see God in a Sunset that brings Hellfire Missiles crashing into a house in the middle of the night?

Just wondering, Do you really see God? :bubble:

[autryn2]

Sitting on the veranda of the clubhouse at Angel Park Golf Course, at sunset, with the purple multi-colored mountains on the left, and the lights of Vegas in the distance on the right, with the air cooling down and blowing on your face....

God is all around!!!

VR, all the negative stuff you talked about is a result of the flaws of man, not a lack of God. If you let your kids play out in the back yard, and your 4 yr. old jumps off the slide instead of sliding down it like you've told him to, and skins his knee... is it your fault or is it just something he has to learn???

God has us out in the back yard (with a big fence around it) and we have the 'run of the place' (free will). If we decide to screw it up, don't blame God.

[Defiant Noquisi]

Sure "angels" exist. An "angel" is every child that isnt screwed up by limited adult thinking. When you grow up and the age of innocence no longer applies, no more angel. Can you return to that? SURE! Thats when you die.

[dutchie]

Golf Course. Ah. :vbroll:

[mickydoolittle]

autryn,

What is your objective in posting as you have? Aside from trying to impart your concept of proof regarding the existence of angels and their acts of random kindness to those you know.

[autryn2]

and I'm not exactly sure what you mean....

Do I have a hidden agenda??? Not at all.

I DO appreciate the oportunity to give my opinion on the topics presented here.

My feeling is that there is an overwhelming amount of folks on this website that either don't believe in God, don't know WHAT to believe, or believe (as you do) that all religion is an evil thing perpitrated(sp?) by unscrupulous men with self-serving motives therefore God isn't real. In general, Christianity gets a bad rap here so , being a person of faith, I'd like to (at least) present a different view point for the people reading these threads.

From your viewpoint, I'm probably a waco (you probably think I'm trying to sell something or at least I've been fooled by some other evil religous zealot).... but from my viewpoint there are SOME folks here that are searching for the truth and not getting alot. So many people here love to wonder, discuss, and/or theorize about every possible reason as to why there is not a God, or no true Christ, or any other possible explanation for our existance, but are unwilliing to seriously consider the possibility of His existence.

I know lots of good people who are sincere about their faith - living their lives trying to serve God instead of themselves. For myself, I am genuine about my belief.... and I do NOT think that, because of my belief, I am any better than other people. I am flawed like everyone else (more than most) but, as a Christian, I am commanded by Christ to share my belief with others. There is a difference between people who believe there is a God and His son Christ (and do nothing about that belief) and those who ACT upon their belief. For myself, I am going to be one who acts.

If you and others here believe otherwise... thats OK. You are entitled to have a differing opinion. The same, however, can be said of me. I'm also entitled to my own opinion about God.... and I believe. Nothing I say might change YOUR belief, but there may be some reading this that haven't made up their minds yet... so there's still a chance that they might explore the possibility of God and Christ... and it might change their lives for the better.

So if I do have an agenda that is it... trying to tell what I believe to be the truth and hoping someone will read it, believe it, and find God (and have a better life and afterlife because of it). But, its not a HIDDEN agenda. :~)

[LC Jeffries]

Autryn,

I'm so glad your here. It does at times get pretty lonely here. There are whole lot of lost people here. I'm always grateful to see a fellow Christian here. There are so few of us here. And you can see why.

:rolling:

[autryn2]

Rather than getting offended by the anti-Christ stuff that is posted here, we should understand that before we realized the truth, God still loved US (and therefore loves the confused people on this site also).

================================================== =======
From Matthew Chapter 9:

10While Jesus was having dinner at Matthew's house, many tax collectors and "sinners" came and ate with him and his disciples. 11When the Pharisees saw this, they asked his disciples, "Why does your teacher eat with tax collectors and 'sinners'?"
12On hearing this, Jesus said, "It is not the healthy who need a doctor, but the sick.
================================================== ======
BTW, I have a copy of John 15:18-19 on my desk at this very moment!!!
It reminds me of why I'm on the 'outside' with secular people alot. We know why, but it still can hurt sometimes.

[Defiant Noquisi]

By what definition would the "lost" fall under?

I have seen many "lost" individuals who have no direction in life. However, I havent seen any posts on this board from anyone looking for guidance of any kind except for the occasional "please explain" type of posting. This leads me to believe that there are no "lost" people on this board that I can see.

Hundreds of years ago, mislead missionaries ("lost" religious leaders of all denominations) thought that my people were "lost", "heathen", "savage" and worshipped the devil.

However, our beliefs were and are still so integrated within us that we have no seperate name for them, none of our beliefs require anything such as books, buildings or confessionals and before contact from immigrants, was pure and without hypocrisy. Our spiritual base is so strong that none of our spiritual leaders, in the entire history as far back as can be told, has ever "fallen from grace" or been "lead into temptation" in such the way as christian leaders(the Bakker's, Jerry Falwell and let us not forget Billy Graham's comments about Jews) have within the guidelines of their beliefs.

Im not questioning the strength of your beliefs, but I do question, based on the teachings (which is why I left christianity behind many years ago) under what pretense could you look at someone and say they are "lost". Wouldnt this be considered a judgement on someone?

Would it not be more prudent to "save" those among your own that are lost, thereby strengthening the example for others to see?

That has been the biggest quandary among the traditionals of all First Nations. How could anyone say that christianity is "better" and others are "lost" without it when they murdered their religious leaders, their men wrote a book that is supposedly "God's law" and to be followed, yet upon reading this book many of our Elders saw that the people who tried to get them to believe in christianity in fact did not live it themselves. We also have yet to understand how anyone could say that we need to be "saved" yet we have never "lost" or spiritual basis in life or contact with the Creator as christians say they have.

Your religious leader/teacher Jesus may have been sacrificed for you but thankfully the Creator of All Things, the Great Mystery, etc has no such requirements and places no such guilt on us. I suppose if we truly were "lost" we might have these atrocities levelled against us as well if the god we believe in was truly that angry for creating such imperfections. As it is, we dont have a cute bumper sticker statement (christians arent perfect, just forgiven) to fall back on just in case.

Really, who is actually the ones who are lost?

[VegasRonin]

Well, we're not really talking angels anymore but hey, threads morph from time to time. This fact I do know. Christian Missionaries always preceded their Homeland's Military forces.

[Defiant Noquisi]

Well, we're not really talking angels anymore but hey, threads morph from time to time. This fact I do know. Christian Missionaries always preceded their Homeland's Military forces. Im glad Im not the only who has noticed this. The wolves are wearing angel clothes.

[Edge]

Rather than getting offended by the anti-Christ stuff that is posted here, we should understand that before we realized the truth, God still loved US (and therefore loves the confused people on this site also).

================================================== =======
From Matthew Chapter 9:

10While Jesus was having dinner at Matthew's house, many tax collectors and "sinners" came and ate with him and his disciples. 11When the Pharisees saw this, they asked his disciples, "Why does your teacher eat with tax collectors and 'sinners'?"
12On hearing this, Jesus said, "It is not the healthy who need a doctor, but the sick.
================================================== ======
BTW, I have a copy of John 15:18-19 on my desk at this very moment!!!
It reminds me of why I'm on the 'outside' with secular people alot. We know why, but it still can hurt sometimes.

If Ignorance is bliss then you must be orgasmic.

Cyberwaste.

[mickydoolittle]

Oh wow! That's fuq'n hilarious. :rolling: :sardonic:

[honeycomb]

hi,

sometimes angels do bring bad news, but to the bad people only. when u read Lot etc, these angels came down to save the good people & destroy the bad people - to me that's good news.

& about the fallen angel, he is satan. satan was too proud to accept adam, so he became a fallen angel. the debate about wether God will forgive him if he repent... err... i don't think that's ours to say. i mean, it's between God & Satan. who are we to judge.

[autryn2]

If the world hates you, know that it has hated me before it hated you. If you were of the world, the world would love its own; but because you are not of the world, but I chose you out of the world, therefore the world hates you: Jesus, John 15:18-19

================================================== ======

The above scripture describes your feelings toward me specifically.
You don't believe in God and hate those that do.
My statement was toward another Christian... not you.

If you have a problem with me (or my opinions)... lets hear it.
Otherwise, name calling is hardly original... or interesting.

[Defiant Noquisi]

.. i don't think that's ours to say. i mean, it's between God & Satan. who are we to judge. Thank you honeycomb, thats an excellent point. How can anyone judge anyone else since according to scripture, this is a sin and would be hypocritical for a christian to do.

Hey Dutchie, ya got an emoticon of an angel with horns? LOL