Violence

[VegasRonin]

Should violence ever be used as a means to an end? Not counting within the context of war. In a one on one dispute does violence have a place in settling differences?

[annabelly]

No. The pen should always be mightier than the sword.

Negotiation, agreeing to disagree, walking away. Internet's a good example of non violent interaction, and disagreement.

Regarding violence between individuals, and violence between countries, ie war.
War is usually started by some form of psychical oppression, by one country.

I suppose then this also applies to individuals. If you aren't allowed to walk away, then 2 wrongs can possibly make a right?
Don't know.....at some point you have to fight back I suppose...pity if it can't be verbally or legally though.

[evilwill]

Many people don't like to admit it..... but in some cases violence is the only answer or is necessary.

It should be the last option but at times it is needed.

The saying "Violence solves nothing" is crap. In some cases, violence is the answer.

That's how it is in nature. Society has mearly suppressed our urges of violence. But it still lingers.

[prezhorusin04]

to try to speak and act in as much harmony and love as possible, but knowing, and letting your enemies know, the violence that you are capable of.--Physical force as a last resort..Trying to rely on mental and spiritual force.-Respecting the frailty of life and the many gifts that life has offered and granted us.-
Passive Resistence..But you have to be prepared for that last step of all out war when you know that nothing else will work.

The battle is already here and it is raging.-Let us just hope that we might help to sooth the flow of blood.

i don't want to hurt anyone,(usually) but i guess i'm more of a knife and sword kinda fella..You know, back in the good old days when you couldn't wipe out an entire village with an uzi? Or an entire state with a nuke.

hate to keep bringing up MICHAEL MOORE but in BOWLING FOR COLUMBINE he states that the NRA was founded in the same year that the KKK was officially disbanded. And that the very first gun law was in not permiting black people to own them.!

But no, i believe in love and not war..Though i know war is a sometimes harsh reality, and that death of the body is inevitable..But much war and violence would not have to happen if it were not coerced that way.

[dutchie]

Violence is ALWAYS a way of showing that you can not handle a situation in a non-agressive way, thus showing your weakness.

Violence = Weakness
or being unable to resolve things in a non-agressive manner.

[MetalMilitia]

Many people don't like to admit it..... but in some cases violence is the only answer or is necessary.

I say voilence is weakness, and it is normally associated with weak minds. Ones that cannot solve their problems through other means resort to it, and in some cases it is all they know.

I do agree that if push comes to shove there's really not much you can do about it... except to retaliate.

[evilwill]

Unless you want the crap beaten out of you...... sometimes violence is necessary.

It depends on the situation.

[DarkAce]

I guess the situations besides war that you speak of evilwill would probably tie in with pride and peer pressure. If you run away you'd look like a coward or something. Sooo.....
Be like Jesus and take it!:lol:

[Two Socks]

It's no wonder your countries are as 'pusssyfied' as they are.

HA HA :rollin: HA HA :rollin: HA HA:rollin: HA HA :rollin: HA HA

[VegasRonin]

About 3 weeks ago I was watching TV in my Apt. when I heard yelling and banging aginst my wall, which adjoins the neighboring Apt.. I went outside with the intent on going next door to see what was going on. This guy came running out of the Apt. next to me but he left the door open to his Apt.. I looked in and saw a woman all bloodied. She had obviously just had the hell beat out of her. I told her she should call the police but she said if she did, her boyfriend would come back and kill her and her son. The guy had threatened her with doing this. I know how the system works and in all probability he would be back on the streets in about 12 hours or so. Three days later, the same scenario happened again. This time I went next door and beat the daylights out of the guy, and made him pack his belongings and leave. I told the guy if I ever saw him around again, I'd kill him and leave him in the desert (I don't think I would). He hasn't been back since. I believe some people only understand the language of violence, and in this case violence worked.

[SeekNDestroy]

I can't think of a better answer than what you did, but beating people up ought to be wrong. Thanks for destroying my nice liberal idealism :)

It would be great if people like that didn't exist, or we had a better system for dealing with them - but I guess some people just don't understand anything else. I still wouldn't like to use violence to defend myself, but if someone was hurting someone else and I could help (I hope) I would.

I suppose it's just choosing between two evils. Someone will get beaten up either way, so its just making sure it's the one who deserves it more.

[evilwill]

Originally posted by DarkAce
I guess the situations besides war that you speak of evilwill would probably tie in with pride and peer pressure. If you run away you'd look like a coward or something. Sooo.....
Be like Jesus and take it!:lol:

I'm talking about situations where the only way to get out of it is with violence.

Say there's someone harassing you. You attempt to leave but they use physical force to prevent you from doing so. In that case, violence is the only thing that is going to get you out of that.

Nothing to do with pride, it's your physical health at stake.

[VegasRonin]

I'm with you Mike. I wish people like that didn't exist. I suppose there would be no use for people like me if they didn't though. People like that keep me employed.

[dutchie]

I do honestly NOT know what I would have done, VR... But I have to admit that's a difficult one... There are two things I really hate: it's men beating up women and adults beating up kids. Those things usually get me VERY upset (read: pissed off).

And although you might not guess it from my posts, I HAVE a somewhat overpowering appearance that will get most cowards running like hell...:p :lol: :evil: So in most cases (and I'll have to honest) there is no NEED for violence (some ppl say I'm the spitting image of Bud Spencer, the big one from the old spaghetti westerns...)...

[DontBeAfraid]

Im just glad that case isnt filling up the airwaves where I live anymore.....

[RavenWhitefang]

I believe some people only understand the language of violence, and in this case violence worked.

This is very true unfortunately, the overly aggressive people only understand boot to ass. Having been raised in a skrewed up household I learned about it first hand. The last time that demon flared up in me I sent someone to the hospital with a broken jaw for attacking my grandma, that someone was my aunt. She was an extremely violent person and prone to attacking my grandma and me with knives, scissors etc. She finally got the message that night sitting in the hospital alone. Afterwards she left us alone and became a pleasant person to us, out of fear? I dont know. Possibly the fact that she had no one "weaker" (i was 13) to bully around anymore, and knew id bust ass again if she went near grandma.

Some people are addicted to violence like a drug, they get that rush from it, and just continue to do it.

[Defiant Noquisi]

If the evidence prevails and he is found guilty....SHOW NO MERCY! :bondage:

As for the rest, yes violence is a major breakdown of maturity and communication. Sometimes ones education or lack there of fans the flames because the human fight or flight mechanism is already programmed with violence available to it; an easy answer to what looms as a complicated situation.

Additionally, notice that the major power brokers of the world are no less different when it comes to using it as anyone else. They "cut to fit then paint to match" war as if it were wash and wear clothing. Wrinkle resistant of course. ;)

[VegasRonin]

As for the rest, yes violence is a major breakdown of maturity and communication. I don't agree. I think man has made it this far because of his penchant for violence, not in spite of it. No matter how peaceful a philosophy is, there will be dissenters who will go against it. By the nature of the beast, these dissenters will (Either on purpose or accident) create violence. If this philosophy is violently enforced. Then it'll begin to morph into law. Society exist because we're violent and we fear those that are more violent, and have the power to enforce their philosophy on the populace.

[dutchie]

Society exist because we're violent and we fear those that are more violent, and have the power to enforce their philosophy on the populace.

...maybe you should add a little nuance to that and put the word "American" at the beginning of that sentence??

[VegasRonin]

Ah, not just Americans. Your country has been making the news over here quite regularly as of late. Seems violence is rearing its head over there quite regularly.

[dutchie]

...but for us this is a relatively new thing...

Two Islamic schools and one church have been attacked. This morning two handgrenades went off about 2 mls. from where I work. Airspace above The Hague is sealed off, to prevent news helicopters to come too close for comfort. The police has evacuated the entire street and are still having this house covered by riflemen. The raid (from what we know through the media) was this morning at 4 AM, to smoke out an alleged terrorist cell. The queen will adress the nation later on.

Yes, it's true - after the murder of Theo van Gogh, a controversial Dutch film maker, anti islamic sentiments are flaming among certain groups in our society. However, I think there are just a few isolated people that draw media attention, and hopefully this will go out like a candle.

It's sickening to see that the first thing to die in conflicts like this is the nuance. All of a sudden all muslims are potential terrorists in the eyes of those who are less gifted with intelligence and insight.

[VegasRonin]

It's sickening to see that the first thing to die in conflicts like this is the nuance. All of a sudden all muslims are potential terrorists in the eyes of those who are less gifted with intelligence and insight. Ah Dutchie, Zealots on either side don't need much. Like in Lord of The Flies. Civility is actually a thin veil, to be stripped away at one's convenience.

[Defiant Noquisi]

Ah Dutchie, Zealots on either side don't need much. Like in Lord of The Flies. Civility is actually a thin veil, to be stripped away at one's convenience. I most definately agree with that as well as fear of anothers violence. However, I do also believe that many battles fought prior could have been avoided by using an "agree to disagree" mentality. As it were, that veil came off faster than Marilyn Chambers clothing.

[Zach]

http://www.comcast.net/News/GENERAL//XML/1110_AP_Online_Regional___National__US_/ed03c4e8-886f-4f9e-8a2d-d569e20e4777.html


Some people in this world today are just so sick. Related to this, we just had those sniper shootings a few years ago with those 2 guys in the caprice.

[2cool4stats]

There are 2 types of violence. Physical harassment and Self-defense. I think physical harassment, rudeness, and the constant need to use vulgar language for the sake of trying to be funny and wanting attention are all interconnected. It's a sign of insecurity, arrogance, and fear. Pathetic really.

[Defiant Noquisi]

This chick looks like she just achieved climax upon hearing about S. Peterson being sentenced to death.....what a whore.I havent kept up on the details but if there was evidence enough to convict, Id probably have looked the same way. :crs:

[dutchie]

This chick looks like she just achieved climax upon hearing about S. Peterson being sentenced to death.....what a whore.
I just read some articles to update my nonexistent knowledge on this case. Seems to me like this is a waferthin case against this guy. No evidence, just a $25,000 insurance. That's not a reason to kill your wife. The insurance I took on my wife is a lot higher than that.
I get the feeling the California media want this guy's head BADLY!!
Care to enlighten me here?

[dutchie]

article here: http://www.relentlessdefense.com/tips/casesinnews/peterson.case.html

13 December 2004--Death. The jury recommends death. The Peterson verdict is no surprise to those of us who labor in the criminal justice system. The system is rigged. In all cases, excepting those in which an accused citizen faces the death penalty, the defendant has the right to a jury of his peers, as guaranteed in the 6th Amendment. Only those jurors who state that they are willing to apply the death penalty - if the circumstances warrant it - are permitted to sit on “death penalty” cases. When the system is hot after the accused, it allows no softies to interfere with its killing machine; if you're not willing to unleash the government to kill your fellow man, you're never even in the mix.

Needless to say, jurors who are willing to recommend death will very likely favor the prosecution, ignore police testilying and shenanigans, and apply the law without mercy. Essentially, the rule almost guarantees a jury of hard asses.

Further, these jurors, no doubt, had one eye on the sentencing phase, and one on the book deals and television appearances. With the prurient interest in the case erupting, every juror was aware that there was money to be made. How much more exciting - and therefore profitable - to recommend death for Peterson? Reportedly, the jury reached its decision last week, but, to insure the greatest amount of exposure and television coverage, waited until Monday afternoon. Since the jury, when it returned its guilty verdicts, found the necessary “special circumstances” to impose the death penalty, it is absurd to believe that they had not already made up their minds to recommend death. After all, if they had been leaning toward sparing Peterson, why endure two more weeks of captivity and gut wrenching testimony?

And while this jury may have decided Peterson's fate weeks ago, it was not impossible for Attorney Mark Geragos to reach them. Jurors reportedly wept and sobbed during the sentencing phase. One juror, following the verdict, spoke of an emotional “meltdown.” Unfortunately, it is not possible to determine just how much of what any juror in a high profile case says, these days, can be credited.

But, Geragos and Peterson remained defiant and refused to concede what every person on that jury well understood - that Scott Peterson killed his wife and unborn child. Since Peterson shed no tears for Laci or Connor, this jury would shed no tears for him.

[Defiant Noquisi]

From what I have read about it, (and you know the media would never embellish) the need for a conviction due to the pregnancy was so strongly felt by the jury that it wouldve taken less than a breeze to shove in a conviction.

Its a very frightening condition of the current politics; wanton morals win in lew of strong enough evidence to convict.

Even if the guy was guilty of murdering his wife, and I believe he was, it doesnt appear to me (in whats available to research) that there was enough solid evidence to convict him.