the 144000 of the Revelation of John

[Dilandau]

Did you note, that the number 144000 from the Revelation occurs also in the Maya and Hindu calendars? The Maya, before killed by Bishop Diego De Landa, called the number of 144000 days a "Baktun" and the Hindu call it a dusk or dawn. Isn't it obvious, that John relates to the calendar there? What do you think? What do you think why DeLanda has killed the Maya? Because the Church has seen the Maya can clue to an actual meaning of revelations?

> Weren't the Mayas killed in the same way that many native populations were massacred in the ignorance of the new world colonists? Doesn't any number occur in nature somewhere?

The "new world colonist" (singular) who killed the maya was a Bishop. A Bishop who did that in ordinary of the Church (and for his own sake). He did not goal to dwell on their land. He just killed them and further more, BURNED their scriptures in fire. Burned them beacuse they contained clues. Thats a kind of happening that really scares me off the church. I rather tend to see the obvious truth in the Bible, that is that there are significant numbers mentioned, numbers that are artifical measures of natural circumstances and thus do not appear in nature just by incident or unconscious inspiration, but only by observation they can be counted. I.e. by the observation of time viz planets, as calendars are the place where found them, the Maya and Hindu calendars. Yes, it must be, John wanted to tell something, that in it's depth relates to a calendar. But who the hell has ofuscated (or concealed?) it! I asked my local Bible Study Circle yesterday but - while they were impressed of the facts - no knowledge was in hand. This is the web. Maybe somebody can answer me. This is for sure the correct forum. No other and far not the non-religious take me serious. "Go away with your holy shit" they write..

[VegasRonin]

Huh? :confused:

[bbbv3.5]

wtf?

i agree with ronin.

[VegasRonin]

Okay, let me see if I'm following your thought. You're saying the church killed off the Mayans cause their astronomical knowledge somehow gave them an insight into their idea of Revelations? The church wanted to keep this knowledge unto themselves, alone?

[Rusti]

According to the jehovas witnesses (whom i have no time for my apologies) believe the 144000 isn't the number of days, but the survivors after the events in Revelations.

[Dilandau]

Ronin got it right. And Rusti, even a term such as "people that die or remain living" can mean days that passed or have not passed. It's the question whether you are at the start of a time-cycle or at it's end. If you are at the start, the cycle just has to be counted on. If you are at the end, usually an intercalation has to be made, this means, add some days or omit some days, to get the artificial cycle aligned with the planets again. Such an intercalation has a tradition to be thought to be evil or "Armageddon" in some kind. Armageddon, because the usually familiar "rules of cosmos" (the calendar) are set off from effect for some time. A time without guides. The Maya for example called the remaining five days in their 360-day year a Wuayeb, a void or abyss. Also the Bible has a 360-days so called "prophetic" year. The Revelation reads, that "at the end of time" a great dragon will be free for some time. By "end of time" the end of a calendric cycle is meant and this dragon is the astronomical sign of Draco, the dragon, that is always at the north pole of the heaven. Around the north pole of heaven do our main time-cycles rotate. The day, the year and - what only a few know - the cycle of precession of the equinoxes. Latter means, because the earth axis is tilted, the spring sign of the star signs will be another every ~ 2150 years. After ~ 25780 years (often mentioned as 26000 years) one round fulfills. The 144000 days multiplied by 13 (a Maya factor) are ~ 5200 years and hence a fifth of that cycle. People yell that in 2012 our world will come to an end. But this is crap and not better than taking the Revelation literally. The truth is, that whenever a calendar of some sort comes to an end, it has to be righteously restarted or made anew by specialists. But specialists always have been few and people were afraid to loose their alignment with the seasons and hence their food income from the fields and such. Loosing food means death panic and grave danger. This natural fear has been utilized by the Church. The truth is indeed VERY simple and once you have grasped it, you will see our entire world VERY clearly. Especially it's lack of education. A lack that is maintained by the establishment through the Church so that people are still afraid of the heaven falling unto them. The Church knows this, the establishment knows this and the Diego-De-Landa-guys viz Dragon-slayers who sing to us "there is no dragon but the Lord" are still doing their kind of work today, doing a great job to keep the people dumb and dependent from Church and State as the 'greatest tits of universe' (expression coined after how certain buildings look like). In fact there IS a dragon and that dragon is in our hearts and in our heavens and in our center.

[humanhybrid]

What do you wish to do with this information. Has it effected your life any?, and if so in what way? I do not intend to mock you at all, I am sincere. I am your freind unconditionally.

[Dilandau]

I'm ready to share it with those who like to receive it and I feel joy to do so. It has affected (or effected? im not a native writer) my life from the bottom of my heart. Now I see clear what is going on and what the establishment does with us. Does with anyone of us. Anyone who is not self-conscious and dares to judge on the facts. It can be ignored and put behind other interests though. For example behind a chat with Jesus. Indeed I did so and he said it's now time to tell it to the public.

[humanhybrid]

I'm ready to share it with those who like to receive it and I feel joy to do so. It has affected (or effected? im not a native writer) my life from the bottom of my heart. Now I see clear what is going on and what the establishment does with us. Does with anyone of us. Anyone who is not self-conscious and dares to judge on the facts. It can be ignored and put behind other interests though. For example behind a chat with Jesus. Indeed I did so and he said it's now time to tell it to the public.Ok! I dont think that there is a joy that what an establishment does to us, as humans. But I share the same thoughts as you. I havent or dont have the same info as you but I have came to the same end with what info I have had. Except for connecting fully the blood thirsty genocide of religious cleansing, before the climatic change and after.

[Dilandau]

What climatic change are you writing about? do you mean the weather? What before? What after? Where?

[Edge]

Hurrah for global warming.

Which is also the subject of a great song by thrash-metalers Testament.

[humanhybrid]

What climatic change are you writing about? do you mean the weather? What before? What after? Where? Dilandau Your posts tell a majority of your answers. I am only suggesting as well environmental scientists, that our planet goes through seasons much like spring winter and fall. The difference is that the global seasons are freezing and heating, it seems as though we are in the heating season of the planet now. There will be a point when an ice age will set in, Its not nothing new, its just the way the planet keeps a balance or one could say balance for us humans, if I may say. Humans flourish in the middle of the extreams. Now before I can go any further, you must confirm my claims. Global warming is a real thing Dilandau you must know this? five years ago when I spoke of this, friends, forum readers and even family members said that I was a bit eccentric. Do they now? What do you know about climate change? And how does humans live through it?

[Dilandau]

I aggree that mankind supports a global warming by various habits and can call some ... well this is in doubt here and there ... this is also in doubt. But I'm sure he does... if you can, please help me on the ground.

What concerns me is, that ice ages result from the interaction of the so called Milankovich cycles:

- the tilt of the earth axis is the cause for seasons summer and winter. this tilt varies within some degrees and that within ~ 41000 years. the mean is 23.5 degrees and this is the origin of the 'illuminate' number 23. this is caused by the gravitation of the moon.

- the earth axis, like a spinning top, drawing a circle around the sign of draco within 25780 years. this causes summer or winter to be at a wandering position in relation to the stars. this is caused by the gravitation of the sun and the moon.

- the earth orbit, reagrdless of the earth itself, is closest to sun at a point and this closest point wanders around the sun in ~ 22000 years. this is caused by the gravitation of the other planets. if the earth comes to the closest point in winter, as now is the case, winter is moderate. But about 10000 years ago the closest point has been reached in summer, so that these have been very hot. But allone from this the ice caps would not have been melted so mutch so cause the great flood. Annother cycle is more responsible:

- within 110000 years the orbit of the earth varies between being more or less ellyptic. it can happen that it is less eliptic and hence the earth is more close to sun than ever and for a longer time than ever. if the oppsite is the case, an ice age would happen (ond so it did). If the earth is comming closer to the sun, ice melts.

Now around 10000 years ago, when Atlantis sank, all of these cycles correlated in a way, that caused the ice to melt. If the large 110000 year cycle is a giant mountain, the 22000 year cycle would be a series of little peaks on that mountain and the 41000 cycle also, but modulated onto them. If the height of the mountain measures heat, the warme the higher, around 10000 years ago there was the first warm enough peak after a real ice age. Today we are in a little valley again, but modualted on the giant 110000 year cycle peak that is still raising.

The greatest peak today is probably caused by population / habits. This is different from the flooding of Atlantis.

[autryn2]

Not that I'm trying to hijack this thread or anything, but if you'll just read the 7th Chapter of Revelations, the author specifically identifies who the 144,000 are. They are the number of Jewish people during the last days who convert to Christians:

1After this I saw four angels standing at the four corners of the earth, holding back the four winds of the earth to prevent any wind from blowing on the land or on the sea or on any tree. 2Then I saw another angel coming up from the east, having the seal of the living God. He called out in a loud voice to the four angels who had been given power to harm the land and the sea: 3"Do not harm the land or the sea or the trees until we put a seal on the foreheads of the servants of our God." 4Then I heard the number of those who were sealed: 144,000 from all the tribes of Israel.
5From the tribe of Judah 12,000 were sealed,
from the tribe of Reuben 12,000,
from the tribe of Gad 12,000,
6from the tribe of Asher 12,000,
from the tribe of Naphtali 12,000,
from the tribe of Manasseh 12,000,
7from the tribe of Simeon 12,000,
from the tribe of Levi 12,000,
from the tribe of Issachar 12,000,
8from the tribe of Zebulun 12,000,
from the tribe of Joseph 12,000,
from the tribe of Benjamin 12,000.

[Dilandau]

These 4 angels are well known from the Tarot cards 10 and 21. The Angel that comes from the east must be Raphael from key 6, Lovers. The Land and the Sea can be seen (note the similarity: Sea - see) in key 17 as the inner (sea) and outer (land) reality. To harm them means to miss the goal, in other words, a sin. Seal means covenant. We can read about covenant in Gen 17. The circumcision is a covenant. It's meaning is the understanding of natural borders. I have it understood till here. The numbers are familiar. You can divide 144000 by 66.6 and get a 12th of the 26000 year cycle of precession of the earth axis. The precession of the earth axis is the natural master cycle of the ages. Our history from since the end of the ice age (~ 9600 BC, melting ice, Atlantis and great parts of coats regions worldwide covered with water was the flood of Gilgamesh, Genesis and other culture's flood stories) until the beginning of the age of Aquarius nowadays. Aquarius is the carrier of the waters. While in the body of man this means the blood, in relation the physical Atlantis this means that we are going to build a wall across the pillars of Gibraltar and pump the Mediterranean sea-level down a mile, so that Atlantis reappears with all it's conserved gimmicks and gadgets. Large 'new' areas at the coasts of Italy, Greece, France, Africa and other lands will appear. The numbers from the different Tribes may be applied to the Numbers of persons in the tribes in Moses 4, the book of Numbers. Perhaps a secret system can be discovered. Maybe you should just try around a bit and learn astronomy, add it, relate it, comprehend it...

Israel was a tribe of astronomers. The underlying system starts relatively easy. The number of Israelites is 603550 in the book of numbers. This is about the number of letters in two Torahs. These two Torahs have about 11700 verses all together (the time from the end of Atlantis till today), where that or 11666 solar years are about 12000 lunar years. The Hebrew word for "year" has the gematric value 355 of the number of days in a lunar year. The Jewish calendar is based prior on the lunar year, not the solar year. Each tribe is an age in the cycle of precession. Each age has it's own Torahs (so the Talmud) that lasts for 12000 lunar years (example (http://otaku.onlinehome.de/gaea.html)). 12 of these are nested so that their sum is 144000. In Malkuth every age last only about 144000 divided by 66.6 (Abram, who dies next the 666th verse of the Bible, gives away his tenth part after Melchizedek appeared in verse 355, the lunar year, after the 13th lunar month of the kings of Edom, who are conjunctions of planets Jupiter and Saturn). Further research is required to get it clear.

[Dilandau]

http://otaku.onlinehome.de/atlantis.gif

[autryn2]

How long have you been off your medicine, dude????

Also, what tpye of schizophrenia is it???

[Dilandau]

Shizophrenia: No. You have a very wrong grasp of that.

I did not claim that the world ends. What i wrote literally is, that the map of time, which is a calendar, that ends. And only this one out of 12 that are allways nested around the cycle of precession. YOU saw the world ending beacuse of the very sick end-of-world hype. I did not claim that. It's an intellectual system that ends. Well, theoretically. Practically nothing happens. You just know now what they are fighting with/about: a windmill - with a giant Guymelef hidden inside.

Everybody go here: http://forums.armageddononline.org/showthread.php?t=2171

[autryn2]

Guymelef = a giagantic armored power suit from the Japanese animation series "The Vision of Escaflowne "?????

huh????......

[Dilandau]

THIS POSTING IS MARKING THE END OF RELIGION. Life from now on continues in the place beyond the link in the previous posting. No further religion below! Beware of the dragon!

[autryn2]

Is this sorta what you are talking about???

Revelation 21:

1Then I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away, and there was no longer any sea. 2 I saw the Holy City, the new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, prepared as a bride beautifully dressed for her husband. 3 And I heard a loud voice from the throne saying, "Now the dwelling of God is with men, and he will live with them. They will be his people, and God himself will be with them and be their God. 4 He will wipe every tear from their eyes. There will be no more death or mourning or crying or pain, for the old order of things has passed away."

Also, please give me your definition of the 'dragon'.

[Dilandau]

God is never not with them. A dragon is just everything what a dragon can be. Large is the web and rich are the ressources one can find about them. For the Pey and the Teth and the Lamed and the Samekh, the Guymelef is the Gimel and the Aleph. And together they are the Gimaleph or Guymeleph. This is just a language barrier. The Gimel is the Time and the Aleph is the Master. Calla and Cavin, Shakti and Shiva (sanskrit kala means time). The Master is the Spirit and from the Pey, there stems the fiery steam of air that is the WORD:

For this they call me the Maho Sihan.

[autryn2]

Oh, yeah, I get it....

Indiana Jones and the Temple of Doom....

(where's my whip when I need it???)

I see where you're comming from now...

http://otaku.onlinehome.de/dilandau.html

[Dilandau]

The whoop is the tale of the lieon. :D

[IKnowNothing]

Hi - Let me introduce myself, my name is roy, I am a software developer by trade and even do it as a hobby as i believe if you can think it you can do it - with enough time and enough funding - especially when it comes to software and software solutions, I think very logically and rationally, however recently I have started taking a heavy interest in end of days especially through revelations in the Bible. There are many signs which one equate back to revelations with regards to twin towers and now the +- 144000 etc. etc. How relevant is this number in the wake of the mass death from the Tsunami which is now sitting on 156000. Nostradamus predicts alot of things as well which inevitably have come true, Now he claims the last day of Earth is the year 3567. If this catastrophical natural disaster is truly related to the 144000, what are the next incidents we should be watching out for. I cannot even begin to imaging what and why those people had to go through this ordeal and their poor families how thay can cope with the loss of their loved ones. This is truly a disaster Is it true in the sense that they have now been "Taken" and we are all "Left behind" to improve things or make things right?

[WasteLandWa|2rior]

According to the jehovas witnesses (whom i have no time for my apologies) believe the 144000 isn't the number of days, but the survivors after the events in Revelations.
144000 according to jahovas whitnesses is the nuber of anointed ones who get into heaven....
AND THEY HAVE ALREADY MOSTLY BEEN CHOSEN....
this means that anyone who thinks they are going to heaven ... is kinda stupid
there is only room for 144000 selected ones in gods kingdom.... assumeing this kingdom exists....

[Skippy]

AND THEY HAVE ALREADY MOSTLY BEEN CHOSEN....


And should any of those die before the rapture, they are replaced by someone else who passed wind and thought it was a relgious moment.