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View Full Version : If you pay someone to keep quiet, and they later Sing, do they owe you your money back?



Cartesiantheater
Mar 12th, 2010, 11:26 AM
Apparently a GOP House member paid a woman to keep quiet about the fact that they sat in a hot tub nude together when she was a minor, and apparently she is suddenly squaking about it.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100312/ap_on_re_us/us_majority_leader_confession


Garn said the woman, who he didn't identify on the floor, has been calling news outlets and that he wanted to be open about the incident that occurred when he was 28 years old, before any stories appeared.


Now, this thread isn't about whether the event should have occurred in the first place, so try to keep that one out of it (and it certainly isn't about politics, so try to keep that out too).

The moral question I would like to investigate HERE is, SINCE he paid her, and she agreed to keep quiet because of the payment, is she obligated to remain quiet? Is it wrong for her to take the money and then go back on her word?



Should be a juicy moral conundrum to explore.

DontBeAfraid
Mar 12th, 2010, 4:20 PM
No, when dealings reach a certain level of "shady" the best you can hope for is that everyone keeps their word. However, since things are super shady you cant expect it and you cant expect people to reciprocate actions one takes in good faith.

Assassin X
Mar 12th, 2010, 4:21 PM
So many complexities and scenarios. But I'd be one of those people who'd be like a quadruple spy. Like I'd make find two people that hate each other and make deals with both just to then stiff them both, but set them up so it looks like they were screwing each other over or something. I'd get rich, they'd kill each other.

As for the question... just because someone pays you doesn't mean you should be quiet. Just means they were dumb to give you money. lol Well ok technically it means they are desperate because they know YOU KNOW about something they did wrong and they are your slave now. lol. I'd use them for everything they got. Maybe money first. Then see what else I could get off of them. After I enjoy blackmailing them I'd talk anyways!

Course I know blackmailing can backfire so you have to be careful. I've done it before. As always I admit things. But I should point out I did it to assholes who deserved it. Such as the dickwad of the neighborhood who vandalized peoples houses and shit. I found some ...."evidence" after pretending I was his friend (just to get inside his house). I used it against him to get some stuff...nothing big. Then after I had my dad take me to the police station. I don't know if he ever got in trouble. But I did see the police there a few weeks later with a van.

Is it wrong to go back on your word? Is it wrong to blackmail? I don't think so. The people you are doing it to are usually guilty people. And legally "going back on your word" would not hold up in court. Its not a legally binding contract. Saying you won't say anything doesn't mean anything. Thats what makes these things so fun. :evlaf:

Kilroy
Mar 12th, 2010, 4:53 PM
I believe she should pay him .I was just wondering what she spent the money on.

DontBeAfraid
Mar 12th, 2010, 5:14 PM
I found some ...."evidence" after pretending I was his friend (just to get inside his house). I used it against him to get some stuff...nothing big. Then after I had my dad take me to the police station.


Is it wrong to go back on your word? Is it wrong to blackmail? I don't think so.


And legally "going back on your word" would not hold up in court. Its not a legally binding It looks like it did hold up in a court of karma though... Im glad you are half retarded now. Being a lying DICK is not cool in the slightest.

JenaS62
Mar 12th, 2010, 5:22 PM
Is it wrong to go back on your word? Is it wrong to blackmail? I don't think so. The people you are doing it to are usually guilty people. And legally "going back on your word" would not hold up in court. Its not a legally binding contract. Saying you won't say anything doesn't mean anything. Thats what makes these things so fun. :evlaf:


I really have to question where you get your morals or lack thereof. Is this what they teach you in your religion? Gays go to hell, stealing and blackmailing are AOK. Sure maybe those being blackmailed are guilty but so are those doing the blackmailing because they know about the infractation and/or in this case, participated in it.

Assassin X
Mar 12th, 2010, 6:21 PM
Court of Karma? And people talk about my beliefs in imaginary things. :P BTW I tell people about my lies. So there for I am a honest lying dick. lol.

As for where I get my morals. Mainly society. After getting sick and seeing how cruel the world was I realized the only people that seem to things done are those that are willing to sacrifice their morals. I'm not totally bad though, not yet. I sound worse then I am. As stated in other topics I have love now so it may change me back to the nice (and naive) old me.

calliope
Mar 12th, 2010, 7:13 PM
Paying someone to keep quiet, or being paid to keep quiet about anything, isn't something I've ever experienced. It must be a rather common phenomenon though. Personally, I think that things like frivolous lawsuits and blackmail are incredibly low life and very low character things to do.

The article though has very scant info on why the woman in question decided just now to go public about it. It would be necessary to know more about what's going on from her point of view, to say, I think. Because she wants to go on more adventures now? That doesn't make much sense.

Apparently there was a confidentiality agreement. Perhaps she was coerced into it. The article doesn't give enough information...but seems to be in favor of offering absolution for the Utah representative's actions, while married, over 20 years ago.

If he were not a public figure involved in legislating moral behavior, then I think, without knowing more about the woman's motives, that the situation would be of a much different tenor.

Cyranothe2nd
Mar 13th, 2010, 12:45 AM
Paying off another person so they won't report legal activity is in itself illegal. She had a moral obligation to not take the money but she certainly has no moral obligation to keep quiet about what happened. What he did was wrong and it was doubly wrong to try to pay her off to keep quiet.

Should she give the money back? I don't know. She certainly shouldn't have agreed to keep quiet but I don't think she had a moral obligation to stay quiet when what happened was both illegal and morally wrong, whether she took the money or not. But since she's broken the "contract"....no, if money is changing hands illegally then there is no contract. She doesn't have to give it back.

GamerGal
Mar 13th, 2010, 5:03 AM
There was no contract. If a deal is illegal, then there is no legal binding contract.

Also, ANOTHER republican who is a pedo? Gee, where have I heard that one before?
http://www.armchairsubversive.org/
My new favorite?
Republican aide Alan David Berlin was arrested on charges that he wanted to engage in sex acts with a 15-year-old boy while dressed in a panda costume.
Wtf? a panda costume? so not only is he a pedo he's a furry enthusiast?

HindSight
Mar 13th, 2010, 9:48 AM
No, minors can't enter legally binding contracts. His loss. (My morals say she should, but the law says she doesn't have to) Two wrongs (naked in the tub AND hush-hush money) don't give him a right.

medicvet
Mar 13th, 2010, 3:52 PM
Okay, when you think of all the fuckers out there getting away with all kinds of shit, to me sitting in a hot tub with a 15 yr old and NOT doing anything sexual just doesn't seem that bad.

My parents were nudists when I was growing up, and as a family we would go out swimming in the Sespe mountains at good river spots, and sometimes to the nude beach by Santa Barbara. There was never anything untoward that went on, but I can imagine if my Dad were alive and ran for politics someone could try to blackmail him against this, and that's just wrong.

Can anyone tell me if there is a law on the books saying that an adult can't be naked with a minor, even if there is nothing untoward that happens?

And if she told him she wanted money and was no longer a minor, the courts should charge her with extortion even if he doesn't. jmo.

There are so many instances in which a minor is harmed and abused sexually, for me, to make such a big deal over nudity jjust doesn't seem right.

HisServant
Mar 13th, 2010, 4:33 PM
No, minors can't enter legally binding contracts. His loss. (My morals say she should, but the law says she doesn't have to)

Good insight...HidSight. LOL She is not responsible for him being a douchebag...she's was a underage and money was the candy that satiated her desire for [sexual knowledge] being kept closely guarded at her age.

It is not immoral for her to go back on her promise now that she is older and wiser. This just means that, even though she was young and foolish by taking the money, she is expressing her undoubted disgust for what he did. He took advantage of her and this is her way of getting back at him. :bondage:

HisServant
Mar 13th, 2010, 4:38 PM
Can anyone tell me if there is a law on the books saying that an adult can't be naked with a minor, even if there is nothing untoward that happens?

Not that I know of, but as a Father, I would rip the lungs from the man who decided to (bathe/jacuzzi) naked with my underage daughter.

I guess this brings up a good point...I haven't really read into the story, but were her parents prive' to the actions being committed at the time? If not, then my point is justified!