new pyramid located by satellite!

[tahn1000]

Dr Hawass: About a week ago I got a satellite image of a site that all my life I've wanted to excavate
Ross Coulthart: And what do you see?
Dr Hawass: I can see a pyramid!
Ross Coulthart: There's a pyramid buried?
Dr Hawass: Buried under the sand - and I'm telling you before the opening of your exhibit in Australia, you will hear the news about me discovering a new pyramid.
Ross Coulthart: A pyramid buried?
Dr Hawass: A pyramid buried under the sand!
Ross Coulthart: A whole pyramid?
Dr Hawass: A whole pyramid!

sunday night current affairs show transcript (http://au.tv.yahoo.com/sunday-night/transcripts/article/-/article/8328579/tut-mania-transcript/)

they showed the satellite map on tv,but he was cagey. you couldn't make out a thing and he just waved his hand that quickly. but i'm taking a guess! according to my theory, there should be some sort of structure or subsidiary pyramid south of the khufu pyramid. maybe just the remains but i'm betting something's there.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v638/tahn2000/gizamap1a.jpg

[Fut004]

but i'm taking a guess! according to my theory, there should be some sort of structure or subsidiary pyramid south of the khufu pyramid. maybe just the remains but i'm betting something's there.


Is this you talking now, or is it still Dr.Hawass? If it's not the Doc, can you share this "theory" of yours?

[tahn1000]

Is this you talking now, or is it still Dr.Hawass? If it's not the Doc, can you share this theory of yours?

it's my theory, hence "according to my theory". and if i'm right and something is found there - then i'll share it.

[Fut004]

it's my theory, hence "according to my theory". and if i'm right and something is found there - then i'll share it.

You didn't have quotation marks or tags around anything, so it's not glaringly obvious which part is "you" and which part isn't. Hence my original question.

So you'll only share your "theory" if it's proven to be true? How will anybody know if it's your "theory" or not after it's broadcast on television? For all we know you could just be trying to look smart by claiming you thought of it first.

Also, I italics'd "Theory" in all my comments because something tells me it's not really a theory, more of just a guess.

[Rabid1]

You wonder why people won't take you serious
You say you have a theory but won't discuss it unless you are right? All that means is you wait until someone says or finds something and then say "yup that's what I thought!"

Share the theory, it is that simple.


I wouldn't hold my breath on Hawass' find. Once he really set the standard for Egyptian archeology but I would question anything he says afte his Chasing Mummies show. This guy has shot down every nonsense theory about the pyramids and Sphynx then does a completely fictional "reality show" setting back archeology 100 years. Faking discoveries and situations does nothing to help archeology no matter how much they claim it is bringing archeology to new people. I don't think most people want to think of archeology as faking someone pissing their pants so an old man can rant about the sacred shrine she has desecrated.

He has shown there are no secret chambers under the Sphynx or tunnels connecting the pyramids. He was one of the first to show the Sphinx was most likely carved from a natural formation and has discovered evidence of the slaughter house used to feed the workers who built the pyramids. But after this show he just seems like ab old man desperate for attention.

[Fut004]

Whoa, wait, this Hawass character faked a bunch of shit? That's brutal to his credibility.

I didn't realize that the chambers under the Sphynx weren't true. When did this happen? I was still holding my breath in anticipation of what they'd find under there.

[Rabid1]

Whoa, wait, this Hawass character faked a bunch of shit? That's brutal to his credibility.

I didn't realize that the chambers under the Sphynx weren't true. When did this happen? I was still holding my breath in anticipation of what they'd find under there.

There are a couple of passageways but are considered to have been dug by treasure hunters.

His show is Chasing Mummies. We all can accept that reality TV is it's current form is fake, but even this show takes it to a new level. Apparently the producers forgot about IMDB because they claimed two women to be legitimate fellows but as soon as the first show aired people looked them up to find they are actresses. Now they were smart enough to find girls with archeology cred, but actresses none the less. One episode they showed Hawass ordering only the fellows and 1 camera man were allowed to go with him, yet another shot shows them walking and you can see another camera man following them. Then they break into a tomb "sealed for centuries" yet they charge right in without testing the air or using any type or re-breather. I am no expert in archeology but in some forum people claim to know where this was and that they had simply buried the front of an existing tunnel then dug it out.

Hawass has done a lot for preserving and even getting back Egyptian artifacts and he either thinks this in some way will help that end or he is just an old man out for one last ego stroke. I spent a ton of time as kid reading about archeology and Egyptology had this guy been on TV then I would have tossed all my books.

[tahn1000]

You wonder why people won't take you serious
You say you have a theory but won't discuss it unless you are right? All that means is you wait until someone says or finds something and then say "yup that's what I thought!"

Share the theory, it is that simple.


I wouldn't hold my breath on Hawass' find. Once he really set the standard for Egyptian archeology but I would question anything he says afte his Chasing Mummies show. This guy has shot down every nonsense theory about the pyramids and Sphynx then does a completely fictional "reality show" setting back archeology 100 years. Faking discoveries and situations does nothing to help archeology no matter how much they claim it is bringing archeology to new people. I don't think most people want to think of archeology as faking someone pissing their pants so an old man can rant about the sacred shrine she has desecrated.

He has shown there are no secret chambers under the Sphynx or tunnels connecting the pyramids. He was one of the first to show the Sphinx was most likely carved from a natural formation and has discovered evidence of the slaughter house used to feed the workers who built the pyramids. But after this show he just seems like ab old man desperate for attention.

your attitude is pathetic. everything's been found already and any claim that there's more is "suspect"? you really can't handle anything that isn't already in all the encyclopedias and reference books, can you?

people at the forefront of anything don't have the luxury of pulling up 1000 corroborating sources before they even begin. and if they are good at their job they are at that beginning every time.

and this man's credibility is only under question to sour-ass little pussies like yourself.

Awards received by Zahi Hawass
Cape Breton University/Canadian International College Special Award

2010 - Dr. Hawass was honored with a special award from CBU/CIC for his service as a role model of success in the field of Egyptology.

Honorary Doctorate from the University of Veliko Tarnovo, Bulgaria

2010- Dr. Hawass was awarded an honorary doctorate from the University of Veliko Tarnovo, Bulgaria in recognition of his efforts to preserve Egypt's cultural heritage.

Honorary Doctorate from the Catholic University of Santo Domingo in the Dominican Republic

2009- Dr. Hawass was awarded an honorary doctorate from the Catholic University of Santo Domingo in recognition of his efforts to preserve and protect Egypt's cultural heritage, as well as his achievements in the field of archaeology.

Honorary Doctorate from Bansomdejchaopraya Rajabhat University in Bangkok, Thailand

2009 - Dr. Hawass was awarded an honorary doctorate degree from Bansomdejchaopraya Rajabhat University, Thailand in recognition of his contributions to the field of Egyptology over his career.

Medal of the Spanish Order of Arts and Culture

2009 - Dr. Hawass was presented with this honor by H.E. Cesar Antonio Molina, Spanish Minister of Culture, in recognition of his contributions to world culture and his warm relationship with Spain.

Goodwill Ambassador to Japan

2008 - Dr. Hawass was designated a Goodwill Ambassador to Japan by the Egyptian and Japanese ministries of foreign affairs.

World Tourism Award

2008 - Dr. Hawass was honored with a World Tourism Award in recognition of his dynamic and committed leadership in developing and implementing innovative plans for the management and protection of Egypt's cultural heritage.

Golden Medal of the Royal Bagpipe Band of the Province of Ourense, Spain

2008 - Dr. Hawass was presented with this honor in recognition of his tireless work to promote and protect Egypt's cultural and archaeological heritage. Previous recipients of this award include Their Majesties the King and Queen of Spain, along with His Holiness Pope John Paul II.

Commander, Order of Merit of the Republic of Italy

2008 - Dr. Hawass was awarded the rank of Commander in the Order of Merit of the Italian Republic. This honor is conferred in recognition of outstanding contributions to literature, the economy, public service, and social, philanthropic and humanitarian activities.

Officer, Order of Arts and Letters of the French Republic

2007 - The French Republic honored Dr. Hawass with the grade of Officer in the Order of Arts and Letters. The Order was created in 1957 to recognize persons distinguished by their contributions to arts and letters in France and in the world. Dr. Hawass joins a select group of international recipients of this honor, including William Faulkner and Ella Fitzgerald, among other luminaries.

Paestum Archaeology Award

2006 - The Borsa Mediterranea del Turismo Archaeologico and the Tourist Office of the Province of Salerno, Italy presented Dr. Hawass with this award, which honors achievement in archaeology, the promotion of Mediterranean cooperation, and the promotion of cultural heritage.

Emmy Award

2006 - Dr. Hawass was honored by the American Academy of Television Arts and Sciences with an Emmy award for his performance in a documentary. He is the first Egyptian ever to receive this prestigious award.

Featured in an Exhibition on Archaeology at the Children's Museum of Indianapolis

2006 - The Children's Museum of Indianapolis featured Dr. Hawass in an exhibition to teach children about archaeology.

One of Time Magazine's 100 Most Influential People of 2005

2006 - Time Magazine chose Dr. Hawass as one of the world's 100 most influential figures of the year 2005.

Chosen as a Speaker for the "Adventures of the Mind" Program

2005 - Dr. Hawass was one of 30 famous intellectuals, including Nobel Prize winners, who were invited to lecture to 150 outstanding American high school students at Stanford University.

Honorary Doctorate, The American University in Cairo

2005 - Dr. Hawass was awarded an honorary doctorate by the American University in Cairo. You can read his acceptance speech to that year's graduating class here.

Name Inscribed on CD for the Mars Rover Mission

2002 - Dr. Hawass' name was inscribed on a CD sent up with the 2003 Mars Rover Mission.

"Egyptian Pioneer Award," Spanish Egyptological Society

2002 - Dr. Hawass was honored by the Spanish Egyptological Society as one of the five "Egyptian Pioneers," along with Naguib Mahfouz, Omar Sherif, Umm Kalthoum, and Ahmed Zuweil.

Explorer-in-Residence, National Geographic Society

2001 - Dr. Hawass was selected by the National Geographic Society as an Explorer-in-Residence in recognition of his status as one of the world's outstanding scientists and explorers.

Honored by Mansoura University

2001 - Dr. Hawass joined Umm Kalthoum, Omar Sherif, Ahmed Zuweil, and Naguib Mahfouz as one of the distinguished Egyptians who have been honored by Mansoura University.

Silver Medal, Russian Academy of Natural Sciences

2001 - The Russian Academy of Natural Sciences honored Dr. Hawass with a silver medal and membership in the Academy.

“Distinguished Scholar of the Year” Award, The Association of Egyptian-American Scholars

2000 - The Association of Egyptian-American Scholars presented a crystal obelisk to Dr. Zahi Hawass in recognition of his efforts in archaeology, including his excavations and publications. A reception at the Diplomatic Club of the Ministry of Foreign Affairs was held in celebration of the occasion.

Mellon Fellowship, University of Pennsylvania

2000 - Dr. Hawass was selected for a Mellon Fellowship from the University of Pennsylvania.

Golden Plate Award from the American Academy for Achievement

2000 - The American Academy for Achievement presented Dr. Hawass with the Golden Plate Award, which honors individuals of outstanding achievement as "representatives of the many who excel" in their fields.

First-Class Award in the Arts and Sciences

1998 - Egyptian President Hosni Mubarak presented Dr. Hawass with this award, one of the most prestigious in Egypt, in recognition of his efforts to restore the Great Sphinx at Giza.

"Pride of Egypt" Award

1998 - Dr. Hawass was presented with the "Pride of Egypt" award by members of the foreign press in Egypt in recognition of his achievements in archaeology.

Fulbright Fellowship

1980 - Zahi Hawass was awarded a Fulbright Fellowship to study at the University of Pennsylvania, where he obtained his doctorate in 1987.

http://www.drhawass.com/awards-received-zahi-hawass

as for my theory - if someone of howass' reputation gets crapped on by the likes of you, why should i bother?

[Fut004]

as for my theory - if someone of howass' reputation gets crapped on by the likes of you, why should i bother?
Haha. So you don't have a real theory then. Glad you admit to it, even if we have to read between the lines.

[tahn1000]

howass has been receiving international recognition for decades. he has a satellite map to back up where he wants to dig next (after he finishes his current projects), but because there's "nothing new under the sun", vapid comes in and says he's an old fraud struggling to get attention.

me, i'm just an armchair archeologist and historian. with NONE of howass' credentials behind me - please tell me, why should i expose myself to ridicule?

[Rabid1]

your attitude is pathetic. everything's been found already and any claim that there's more is "suspect"? you really can't handle anything that isn't already in all the encyclopedias and reference books, can you?

people at the forefront of anything don't have the luxury of pulling up 1000 corroborating sources before they even begin. and if they are good at their job they are at that beginning every time.

and this man's credibility is only under question to sour-ass little pussies like yourself.



Lol I never said he hasn't found anything, I simply said I wouldn't hold my breath. His association with that show does bring his motives into question. His announcement could just be to draw attention to himself and the show to help his ratings. Or what he has found could turn out to be nothing. You can have all the credentials in the world and still have ulterior motives.


This is no proof of a new pyramid only his theory that one is there. I hope he finds one, Archeology could use the boost.

You know Tahn it is not what you present but how you present it. Did you ever think that if you came out clean and just discussed it people might take it seriously, or at least if the disagree you might still get your idea across. Your first post here was the one you started about the end of times. You got pissed about it being moved into the religious section. Do you think maybe if you had come out with your ideas about aliens it might have gone differently?

Honestly reading some of your stuff on the internet I am interested, because one idea I read a long time ago was about ancient men creating alien stories, well visitors from the skies, not from all genuine sightings but to bolster their chosen gods by creating enemies from outside their know world and that the alien mythos diverged from religious roots into what it is today. So did an early alien culture visit us and that started the mythos?

[Ningishiddza]

your attitude is pathetic. everything's been found already and any claim that there's more is "suspect"? you really can't handle anything that isn't already in all the encyclopedias and reference books, can you?

Pathetic would describe the sad state of Academia.

Somewhere on this forum in a post from long, long ago I berated turds like Hawass who perpetuate the myth that "Pyramids are Tombs."

I stated something to the effect that no pyramid was every used as a tomb, and that no dead pharaoh were ever inside any pyramid for any period of time, and that the only way to prove the idiotic theory that pyramids are tombs is that you'd have to find a buried pyramid holding a previously unknown pharaoh.


people at the forefront of anything don't have the luxury of pulling up 1000 corroborating sources before they even begin. and if they are good at their job they are at that beginning every time.

and this man's credibility is only under question to sour-ass little pussies like yourself.

Awards received by Zahi Hawass
Cape Breton University/Canadian International College Special Award

2010 - Dr. Hawass was honored with a special award from CBU/CIC for his service as a role model of success in the field of Egyptology.

Honorary Doctorate from the University of Veliko Tarnovo, Bulgaria

2010- Dr. Hawass was awarded an honorary doctorate from the University of Veliko Tarnovo, Bulgaria in recognition of his efforts to preserve Egypt's cultural heritage.

Honorary Doctorate from the Catholic University of Santo Domingo in the Dominican Republic

2009- Dr. Hawass was awarded an honorary doctorate from the Catholic University of Santo Domingo in recognition of his efforts to preserve and protect Egypt's cultural heritage, as well as his achievements in the field of archaeology.

Honorary Doctorate from Bansomdejchaopraya Rajabhat University in Bangkok, Thailand

2009 - Dr. Hawass was awarded an honorary doctorate degree from Bansomdejchaopraya Rajabhat University, Thailand in recognition of his contributions to the field of Egyptology over his career.

Medal of the Spanish Order of Arts and Culture

2009 - Dr. Hawass was presented with this honor by H.E. Cesar Antonio Molina, Spanish Minister of Culture, in recognition of his contributions to world culture and his warm relationship with Spain.

Goodwill Ambassador to Japan

2008 - Dr. Hawass was designated a Goodwill Ambassador to Japan by the Egyptian and Japanese ministries of foreign affairs.

World Tourism Award

2008 - Dr. Hawass was honored with a World Tourism Award in recognition of his dynamic and committed leadership in developing and implementing innovative plans for the management and protection of Egypt's cultural heritage.

Golden Medal of the Royal Bagpipe Band of the Province of Ourense, Spain

2008 - Dr. Hawass was presented with this honor in recognition of his tireless work to promote and protect Egypt's cultural and archaeological heritage. Previous recipients of this award include Their Majesties the King and Queen of Spain, along with His Holiness Pope John Paul II.

Commander, Order of Merit of the Republic of Italy

2008 - Dr. Hawass was awarded the rank of Commander in the Order of Merit of the Italian Republic. This honor is conferred in recognition of outstanding contributions to literature, the economy, public service, and social, philanthropic and humanitarian activities.

Officer, Order of Arts and Letters of the French Republic

2007 - The French Republic honored Dr. Hawass with the grade of Officer in the Order of Arts and Letters. The Order was created in 1957 to recognize persons distinguished by their contributions to arts and letters in France and in the world. Dr. Hawass joins a select group of international recipients of this honor, including William Faulkner and Ella Fitzgerald, among other luminaries.

Paestum Archaeology Award

2006 - The Borsa Mediterranea del Turismo Archaeologico and the Tourist Office of the Province of Salerno, Italy presented Dr. Hawass with this award, which honors achievement in archaeology, the promotion of Mediterranean cooperation, and the promotion of cultural heritage.

Emmy Award

2006 - Dr. Hawass was honored by the American Academy of Television Arts and Sciences with an Emmy award for his performance in a documentary. He is the first Egyptian ever to receive this prestigious award.

Featured in an Exhibition on Archaeology at the Children's Museum of Indianapolis

2006 - The Children's Museum of Indianapolis featured Dr. Hawass in an exhibition to teach children about archaeology.

One of Time Magazine's 100 Most Influential People of 2005

2006 - Time Magazine chose Dr. Hawass as one of the world's 100 most influential figures of the year 2005.

Chosen as a Speaker for the "Adventures of the Mind" Program

2005 - Dr. Hawass was one of 30 famous intellectuals, including Nobel Prize winners, who were invited to lecture to 150 outstanding American high school students at Stanford University.

Honorary Doctorate, The American University in Cairo

2005 - Dr. Hawass was awarded an honorary doctorate by the American University in Cairo. You can read his acceptance speech to that year's graduating class here.

Name Inscribed on CD for the Mars Rover Mission

2002 - Dr. Hawass' name was inscribed on a CD sent up with the 2003 Mars Rover Mission.

"Egyptian Pioneer Award," Spanish Egyptological Society

2002 - Dr. Hawass was honored by the Spanish Egyptological Society as one of the five "Egyptian Pioneers," along with Naguib Mahfouz, Omar Sherif, Umm Kalthoum, and Ahmed Zuweil.

Explorer-in-Residence, National Geographic Society

2001 - Dr. Hawass was selected by the National Geographic Society as an Explorer-in-Residence in recognition of his status as one of the world's outstanding scientists and explorers.

Honored by Mansoura University

2001 - Dr. Hawass joined Umm Kalthoum, Omar Sherif, Ahmed Zuweil, and Naguib Mahfouz as one of the distinguished Egyptians who have been honored by Mansoura University.

Silver Medal, Russian Academy of Natural Sciences

2001 - The Russian Academy of Natural Sciences honored Dr. Hawass with a silver medal and membership in the Academy.

“Distinguished Scholar of the Year” Award, The Association of Egyptian-American Scholars

2000 - The Association of Egyptian-American Scholars presented a crystal obelisk to Dr. Zahi Hawass in recognition of his efforts in archaeology, including his excavations and publications. A reception at the Diplomatic Club of the Ministry of Foreign Affairs was held in celebration of the occasion.

Mellon Fellowship, University of Pennsylvania

2000 - Dr. Hawass was selected for a Mellon Fellowship from the University of Pennsylvania.

Golden Plate Award from the American Academy for Achievement

2000 - The American Academy for Achievement presented Dr. Hawass with the Golden Plate Award, which honors individuals of outstanding achievement as "representatives of the many who excel" in their fields.

First-Class Award in the Arts and Sciences

1998 - Egyptian President Hosni Mubarak presented Dr. Hawass with this award, one of the most prestigious in Egypt, in recognition of his efforts to restore the Great Sphinx at Giza.

"Pride of Egypt" Award

1998 - Dr. Hawass was presented with the "Pride of Egypt" award by members of the foreign press in Egypt in recognition of his achievements in archaeology.

Fulbright Fellowship

1980 - Zahi Hawass was awarded a Fulbright Fellowship to study at the University of Pennsylvania, where he obtained his doctorate in 1987.

as for my theory - if someone of howass' reputation gets crapped on by the likes of you, why should i bother?

That's like thieves congratulating other thieves.

The true test of his scholarship, credibility and reputation rests on one question, and only one question:

The cartouche of how many pharaohs are in the Great Pyramid and what are the names of those pharaohs and when did they rule?

I'll give you a hint: The number of pharaohs is two.

If Hawass does not admit there are two pharaohs and identify them by name, then he has zero credibility.

[TC]

Hmmm... maybe this "other pyramid" is the proverbial brick shit-house...

[tahn1000]

This is no proof of a new pyramid only his theory that one is there. I hope he finds one, Archeology could use the boost.

.... maybe you missed the title of the thread "new pyramid located by satellite", so he hasn't just swung a theory out to air it. he as a SATELLITE IMAGE of the valley and he knows there's something that is pyramid shaped under the sand.

[Fut004]

Hahaha.



they showed the satellite map on tv,but he was cagey. you couldn't make out a thing and he just waved his hand that quickly. but i'm taking a guess!


.... maybe you missed the title of the thread "new pyramid located by satellite", so he hasn't just swung a theory out to air it. he as a SATELLITE IMAGE of the valley and he knows there's something that is pyramid shaped under the sand.

So his evidence is something that you couldn't make out at all, but you still believe it's undeniable proof?

[tahn1000]

if you haven't seen a satellite image before - it's in shades of grey, but it's clearly defined and i think was of the whole valley. and the camera man with the journalist didn't, no doubt wasn't allowed, to show a close up. OBVIOUSLY he isn't going to give it away before he's dug it up.

are you and vapid just petty or what?

[Fut004]

So when is he supposed to start working on this dig?

[tahn1000]

i don't think that was mentioned in the show, but what he expects to find is the pyramid of "a king called kengar".

[Ningishiddza]

Hahaha.

So his evidence is something that you couldn't make out at all, but you still believe it's undeniable proof?

Forget it. This nonsense is from a GPR survey conducted in 2006. It's in the NRIAG Journal of Geophysics, but there's no pyramid there.

[tahn1000]

it didn't say how old the satellite image was, only that he just received it. HOWEVER i doubt he would have received it so late if it taken in 2006.

[Fut004]

i don't think that was mentioned in the show, but what he expects to find is the pyramid of "a king called kengar".

Kengar. Is this one of those completely unknown and secret kings that Egypt had?

[tahn1000]

Kengar. Is this one of those completely unknown and secret kings that Egypt had?

i don't know. he's the archaeologist.

[Fut004]

So you know nothing about it?
Why the hell did you post it then, and defend this dude so much?

[Rabid1]

Kengar. Is this one of those completely unknown and secret kings that Egypt had?

It is probably a misquote from the shows transcript. There is no listing of s rumored or actual king or pharaoh named Kenger in any online listing nor in any of the books I have. Probably a phonetic misspell of something Hawass said.

Edit possibly Khendjer except I do believe they have already found an incomplete pyramid for him.

[Ningishiddza]

it didn't say how old the satellite image was, only that he just received it. HOWEVER i doubt he would have received it so late if it taken in 2006.

Hawass is an Egyptian, and that automatically disqualifies him. Egyptian archaeologist is an oxymoron like "honorable villain." Egypt is the oldest continuous existing civilization, for more than 5,000 years and the only thing they have to show for it is 3 pyramids, a sphinx, and the falafel.

Take away the pyramids and sphinx and Egypt's only tangible contribution to the world is the falafel.

His job is to perpetuate the myth that pyramids are tombs, and that Khufu built the great pyramid, and neither is true.

[Zer0th]

Hawass is an Egyptian, and that automatically disqualifies him. Egyptian archaeologist is an oxymoron like "honorable villain." Egypt is the oldest continuous existing civilization, for more than 5,000 years and the only thing they have to show for it is 3 pyramids, a sphinx, and the falafel.

Take away the pyramids and sphinx and Egypt's only tangible contribution to the world is the falafel.
Implying pre-Egyptian?

Where are you headed, Ning? Nephilim? Atlantis? 10,500BC? Cayce? Bauval? ???

[Ningishiddza]

Implying pre-Egyptian?

The 1st Dynasty were not Egyptians. If they were Egyptians, then everyone after them are not Egyptians.

Narmer, Aha, Djer, Djet and Den are not "Egyptian" names. It's a linguistic free-for-all. You can rule out Mesopotamia. Some have suggested Harappa/Indus Valley as the origin. There is the strange thing with the pharaohs when represented in paintings having a reddish tint for their skin tone, as opposed to those depictions of peoples who were obviously white or black.

If you go to the British Museum and read the letters by Dr Birch, in his first letter for the markings found in the 2nd chamber (Wellington's Chamber), he identifies the pharaoh (Suphis) as one who ruled about 200 years after Khufu. In his second later he identifies the markings found in the 3rd chamber (Campbell's Chamber) as Pharaoh Raufu.

If you read Dawn of Civilization by Gaston Maspero he refers to it as the greatest embarrassment in Egyptology, the fact that no one has been able to reconcile the two very different names in the Great Pyramid.

Anyway, Sneferu's use of white-washed mud-bricks around his pyramid suggests he was attempting to copy the Great Pyramid, which used to be encased in white Tura limestone. I think it was the Journal of the Society of Light and Optics which did a study showing that the albedo (reflectivity) of polished white Tura limestone would produce so many foot-candles of energy (light) so that on the New/Full Moon it would have lit up the entire plateau, been visible from the horizon, and the glow of the Great Pyramid could be seen from as far as 90 miles away (sort of how you see the glow of distant cities at night while driving down the interstate).

If Sneferu was attempting to copy the Great Pyramid, then it already existed in his time, so Khufu couldn't have built it.

[theejames]

Sneferu's use of white-washed mud-bricks around his pyramid suggests he was attempting to copy the Great Pyramid,

How does the Orion/pyramid correlation fit thoery into the Chronology? If several Pharaohs chose to copy their predeccesors, what kept them sticking to the plan regards the positioning and not getting all individual about their plans? How long did it take from the first stone of the first pyramid to the last stone of the last pyramid?

[Ningishiddza]

How does the Orion/pyramid correlation fit thoery into the Chronology?

I suppose you could try to correlate the position of the stars to the orientation and positions of the pyramids. The three stars you're looking at are Mintaka, Alnilam and Alnitak (from west to east).

If the pyramids correspond to magnitude, them Mintaka has to be the pyramid attributed to Men-ka-ra, since it is the smallest and Mintaka has a magnitude of 2.5, while the 2nd Pyramid would be Alnilam with a magnitude of 1.8 and the Great Pyramid Alnitak with a magnitude of 2.0.

The 2nd Pyramid and Great Pyramid are the same height above sea level, but the 2nd Pyramid is actually taller (has a greater height) than the Great Pyramid, because the Great Pyramid sits on an area of the Plateau that is slightly inclined above the rest of the Plateau. In other words someone intended the tops of both pyramids to be the same distance above sea level.

The stars move, and their movement is not just celestial longitude, it's also declination (the position of the star in relation to the Plane of the Ecliptic).

To give you an idea of their movement rate, you can compare the Year 1 BCE position to the Year 2000 position:

Mintaka (1 BCE): 24° Taurus 32' -4° 02'
Mintaka (2000): 22° Gemini 24' -0° 18'

Alnilam (1 BCE): 25° Taurus 38' -4° 44'
Alnilam (2000): 23° Gemini 28' -1° 12'

Alnitak (1 BCE): 26° Taurus 51' -5° 15'
Alnitak (2000): 24° Gemini 41' -1° 57'

The change in celestial longitude is due almost entirely to the phenomenon of precession, so that every 72 years stars/galaxies/nebulae appear to retard by 1° of arc.

All three stars are south of the Planet of the Ecliptic rising north, and Mintaka is moving the fastest.

In theory you could attempt to determine the age by matching the declination at the time built, but something has to be a reference point for the Planet of the Ecliptic. The Nile doesn't appear to be it.

The Sphinx would be the obvious choice, but that fails too.

If you stand on the Equator and look north, the pyramids are aligned Men-ka-ra (Mintaka), Khafre (Alnitak) and Khufu (Alnilam) but the actual order is reversed. You follow?

Standing on the Equator looking north or from space at the Equator looking north this is what you'd see:

http://i71.photobucket.com/albums/i134/ningishiddza/giza-plateau-with-ankh-hafs.jpg

If you are standing on Earth and look up into the night sky, this is what you'd see:

http://i71.photobucket.com/albums/i134/ningishiddza/map-orion.gif

That doesn't fit.

But if you were coming to Earth from the other side of Orion, then this is what you'd see:

http://i71.photobucket.com/albums/i134/ningishiddza/map-orioninverse.gif


If you intend to orient the pyramids to Orion's Belt, then you'd have to view them from the perspective of someone who was coming to Earth from somewhere outside of our Solar System, and indeed, from somewhere beyond Orion.

That all goes back to the mystical number '7' and the fact that only someone not from our Solar System would identify Earth with the number '7' because from their unique perspective, Earth is the 7th Planet, and likewise for them Mars would be the 6th Planet and Venus the 8th Planet.

Pluto the 1st, Neptune the 2nd, Uranus the 3rd, Saturn the 4th, Jupiter the 5th, Mars the 6th and note that in all cases Mars is always pictorially represented as a 6-pointed Star, then Earth is the 7th, and Venus is the 8th and note that Venus is always pictorially represented by an 8-pointed Star.

http://i71.photobucket.com/albums/i134/ningishiddza/morningstar.jpg

There's no evidence linking Khufu or any other pharaoh to the pyramids. In fact there's a stelea which says Khufu made repairs to the Great Pyramid and the Temple to Osiris (also located on the Gizeh Plateau).


If several Pharaohs chose to copy their predeccesors, what kept them sticking to the plan regards the positioning and not getting all individual about their plans?

That's the problem. Why would Sneferu built a step-pyramid and then lay white painted mud-bricks against the outside of the pyramid?

He did that because he was trying to copy something that already existed long before he was born, and that was the Great Pyramid with its White Tura Limestone outer casing (which was stripped by the Arabic tribes and used as building materials, like the Dome of the Rock for example).

If Khufu built the first pyramid, then how many pyramids are on the Gizeh Plateau?

Well, only one, the Great Pyramid.

So, then why does his son, Ra-de-def, build his pyramid at Abu-Rashid located 90 miles to the north of the Great Pyramid?

That doesn't make any sense. There's plenty of room to build a pyramid on the Plateau, since only one is there.

Also, the same people who allegedly built Khufu's pyramid are still alive, yet Ra-de-def's pyramid is a piece of shit that was very poorly constructed and is in very bad shape (that was the only pyramid I saw when in Egypt).

So you have this huge anal retentive pyramid with all of its fancy math stuff, and then a pyramid that looks like it was built by blind squirrels and then another really well-built fancy pyramid. That makes no sense.

What does make sense is that Khufu associated himself with the Great Pyramid which already existed, his son Ra-de-def decided to try to build his own and failed, and then Khafre took the easy way out and appropriated the 2nd Pyramid and Men-ka-ra took the 3rd pyramid.

Of course those are assumptions since none of the pharaohs ever claimed to build the pyramids, and in spite of the immaculate records they kept, there are no records at all about collecting taxes, or purchasing materials or paying workers to build any of them.

Note that many textbooks engage in disinformation by stating that Khafre was 'a' successor to Khufu instead of 'the' successor. That's because Ra-de-def was 'the' successor and not Khafre.


How long did it take from the first stone of the first pyramid to the last stone of the last pyramid?


Mining studies as part of the 2003 feasibility study were based upon the removal of 3.0 Mtpy of aggregate and scalpings in years 1 through 4

That's from a report I found here:

http://www.polarmin.com/downloads/1149236721ERQtechreport.pdf

They are using machinery and only getting 3 Million Metric Tons Per Year over a four year period which averages out to less than 1 Million Metric Tons Per Year.

I think it's the height of the Great Pyramid in polar-diameter inches (1 Inch = 1.1 PD-Inches) is the Polar Diameter of the Earth (hence polar diameter inches) and the perimeter in Pd-Inches is the Polar Circumference of the Earth (as opposed to measuring the Earth's circumference at the Equator -- who would have ever thought of that?), so some have speculated that the mass of the Great Pyramid is a proportional representation of the Mass of the Earth.

Anyway, the Great Pyramid has more than 1.2 Million stone blocks weighing anywhere from 2 US Tons to 20 US Tons.

How many blocks are in the other two? At least twice that amount, so at least 2.4 Million stone blocks.

Supposedly it was completed in the 23rd year of the reign of Khufu, but that isn't what the inscriptions in Campbell's Chamber say (according to Dr Birch the hieroglyph that supposedly indicates an ordinal number, which by the way is in semi-hieratic hieroglyph -- which didn't appear until 600 years after Khufu ruled -- has never been used to represent ordinal numbers ever), but it's claimed he started it in during his 3rd year.

That means they'd have to cut 60,000 stone blocks per year, or 164 blocks per day.

That isn't possible. It's an issue of time and space. Imagine 60 chefs trying to prepare 60 meals and only have 12 available burners in the kitchen. Obviously some chefs will be standing around doing nothing because there's nowhere to work. It's the same in a rock quarry. Because of time and space considerations, there's only so many blocks that can be cut in a given time period.

[tahn1000]

it's absolute rubbish that the belt of orion has anything to do with the orientation of the pyramids. the pyramids line up mostly south-north, and the stars of orion's belt line up roughly east to west. only desperate conspirisists and alien lovers believe that balony.

anyone with an ounce of common sense would have dismissed it as ridiculous without a second thought.

even the orientation of the stars, with the central one clearly out of line, do not match the belt, plus the two northern pyramids are significantly larger than the southern one. if they were going to go to all that trouble just to point out a section of the sky, i'm sure the pyramids would also reflect the magnitude of the stars they referenced. and the stars of orions belt visually as bright as each other.

[Rabid1]

it only desperate conspirisists and alien lovers believe that balony.



The irony of this statement has left me almost speechless.

[tahn1000]

The irony of this statement has left me almost speechless.

you - speechless?! we'll just have to pretend for that part, but in what way, exactly?

when i have something to say, it's because i have reached that opinion through my own research - NOT because everybody is saying it regardless of whether it makes sense or not.

[tahn1000]

oh, and if you don't believe me about the orientation of orion's belt (and how they appear as bright as each other), just step outside and look for yourselves.

[Ningishiddza]

oh, and if you don't believe me about the orientation of orion's belt (and how they appear as bright as each other), just step outside and look for yourselves.

I don't expect small minds to grasp complex ideas.



http://i71.photobucket.com/albums/i134/ningishiddza/PyramidswithOrion.jpg

[Rabid1]

oh, and if you don't believe me about the orientation of orion's belt (and how they appear as bright as each other), just step outside and look for yourselves.


You are getting back to perspective now. Where I live the center star appears brighter. In Nevada they appear much brighter and equal. In Los Angeles, once you get far enough away to see them the lower outside star is more visible. These are differences in places that are hundreds to 2000 miles apart. To suggest what you see is exactly the same everywhere in the world is way off.

[tahn1000]

You are getting back to perspective now. Where I live the center star appears brighter. In Nevada they appear much brighter and equal. In Los Angeles, once you get far enough away to see them the lower outside star is more visible. These are differences in places that are hundreds to 2000 miles apart. To suggest what you see is exactly the same everywhere in the world is way off.

except that the southern pyramid has a base of not even half the size of the other two. none of the stars in orions belt are half the brightness of the other two. the orientation of the pyramids remains wrong no matter where you look up at the sky - which DOESN'T change no matter where you are in the world.

not do i believe that the brightness of the stars changes significantly depending on where you are in the world relative to the rest of those around it. they are, after all, the same stars no matter where you are in the world.

[tahn1000]

I don't expect small minds to grasp complex ideas.



http://i71.photobucket.com/albums/i134/ningishiddza/PyramidswithOrion.jpg

it's called checking the constellation for yourself, ningishiddza. you should verify it for yourself before spreading the same baloney all the time. the stars of orion's belt ARE NOT in the correct orientation and their brightness/visual size ARE NOT reflected in the dimensions of the pyramid.

[tahn1000]

anyway getting back to archaelology, while the interview was being filmed this statue was raised up! it's a statue of amenhotep III. which dates the interview as being filmed on november 5th, and aired in australia on the 14th. so it is definitely current news.

http://www.drhawass.com/blog/press-release-new-statue-amenhotep-iii-uncovered

http://www.drhawass.com/sites/drhawass.com/files/u8403/IMG_0385.JPG

i consider this era - amhotep III to tutenkhamen - to be definitely unexplored as far as major events in the history of our world are concerned.

[Rabid1]

except that the southern pyramid has a base of not even half the size of the other two. none of the stars in orions belt are half the brightness of the other two. the orientation of the pyramids remains wrong no matter where you look up at the sky - which DOESN'T change no matter where you are in the world.

not do i believe that the brightness of the stars changes significantly depending on where you are in the world relative to the rest of those around it. they are, after all, the same stars no matter where you are in the world.


So the temperature, atmospheric conditions, and altitude are exactly the same everywhere in the world when looking at stars and location and orientation have nothing to do with it either? That measn right now where you live it is 20 degrees F, overcast, and windy with a chance of snow just like here. Thanks for setting me straight. I wonder why then everyone doesn't see the exact same eclipse as everyone else?

[tahn1000]

So the temperature, atmospheric conditions, and altitude are exactly the same everywhere in the world when looking at stars and location and orientation have nothing to do with it either? That measn right now where you live it is 20 degrees F, overcast, and windy with a chance of snow just like here. Thanks for setting me straight. I wonder why then everyone doesn't see the exact same eclipse as everyone else?

don't get hysterical. of course when it comes to eclipses everyone won't see the same thing. at least half the planet will miss out, won't it? try - at least try - to present a reasonable argument.

and regardless of weather conditions, we are talking about more IDEAL viewing conditions, like cloudless, not raining or snowing etc which makes the stars twinkle-twinkle more. in which case both the relative brightness and position of the stars is undeniable.

and to set the record straight - just because if you live in the northern hemisphere and you mightn't know this - this stars don't flip upside down when you're looking at them from the southern hemisphere.

[Ningishiddza]

it's called checking the constellation for yourself, ningishiddza. you should verify it for yourself before spreading the same baloney all the time. the stars of orion's belt ARE NOT in the correct orientation and their brightness/visual size ARE NOT reflected in the dimensions of the pyramid.

You obviously have trouble visualizing Earth of the Past. You're probably dumb enough to think that there was a Persian Gulf 10,000 years ago.

The skies today are not how they looked 5,000 or even 9,000 years ago.

I just showed you a map overlay that shows they are in the correct orientation.

No doubt you are not aware of stars that have variable magnitudes and change brightness over time, sometimes quickly over the course of months, sometimes over the course of years.

You don't really know what the magnitude of the stars were 9,000 years ago.

The magnitude of those stars today is 2.0, 1.8 and 2.5, which closely approximates the size of the three pyramids (two are roughly the same size and the third is smaller).

In fact, if you read Anima Astrologia you'll find that Guido Bonatti classified the former Star in Orion’s Belt (Mintaka) as a magnitude 4 and the middle Star in Orion’s Belt (Alnilam) as a magnitude 2 (he wrote most of his works between 1250 and 1290 CE), so apparently the stars looked different just 1,000 years ago, but then you're the resident research expert in Latin works, not me.

By the way, Ptolemy classified Mintaka as a magnitude 5 and Alnilam as a magnitude 2 when he wrote Tetrabilos.


not do i believe that the brightness of the stars changes significantly depending on where you are in the world relative to the rest of those around it. they are, after all, the same stars no matter where you are in the world.

Ooops. I guess I just trampled all over you beliefs.

[tahn1000]

your attitude is pretty sad. clearly they are not in the correct orientation, clearly the size of the pyramids do not reflect their brightness in the sky, and personally in the life of a star and the age of the universe i don't think 9000 or 10000 years is going to make a hell of a lot of difference to either.

[Ningishiddza]

your attitude is pretty sad. clearly they are not in the correct orientation, clearly the size of the pyramids do not reflect their brightness in the sky, and personally in the life of a star and the age of the universe i don't think 9000 or 10000 years is going to make a hell of a lot of difference to either.

Mr Wizard you are dumber than dog shit. Mintaka happens to a variable star. In fact it's a variable binary eclipsed by a mag 7 star. So, it's magnitude will change over time as the mag 7 star separates (Mintaka will become brighter).