Oshkosh police conduct door to door gun confiscations

[MetalMilitia]

U.S. Constitution: Second Amendment

A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed.

U.S. Constitution: Fourth Amendment

The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.

Just so we're clear on this.


Oshkosh, Wis. -- Following the shooting of an Oshkosh police officer Saturday night, area residents were forced from their homes, their lawful firearms being confiscated by police.

The Oshkosh Police Department's Special Weapons and Tactics Unit responded to the area, with a K-9 police dog in pursuit of the perpetrator who was reported to have fled on foot.

Citizens' guns were seized through searches of area homes. The police promised to return the firearms after forensic tests proved they were not involved in the crime. The injured officer's name was withheld, but media reports indicate his condition is not life-threatening.

"The message is: Hand over your guns, now!" said Corey Graff, executive director of Wisconsin Gun Owners Inc. "This is a blatant case of guilty-until-proven-innocent and an abuse of police power."

Still, residents in the area are furious about the home invasions by police and what they see as theft of their property. Although early reports are unclear, they indicate a search warrant was issued for two homes, yet additional home owners also had firearms confiscated.

"We want the perpetrator of this crime caught and brought to justice just like everyone else," said Graff. "But that doesn't mean the police should trample citizens' 4th amendment protections, steal lawful private property and enter the home without reasonable suspicion or warrant."

One homeowner in the area said his guns were taken by police, guns that hadn't left his gun safe since last hunting season. Another victim of the police searches -- an elderly women -- reported waking up to officers' searching her home in the early morning hours.

The Oshkosh Northwestern reported, "Residents were not being allowed to return to their homes by press time."


[Editor: boston_liberty] Excerpt: Citizens' guns were seized through searches of area homes. The police promised to return the firearms after forensic tests proved they were not involved in the crime. The injured officer's name was withheld, but media reports indicate his condition is not life-threatening. Still, residents in the area are furious about the home invasions by police and what they see as theft of their property. Although early reports are unclear, they indicate a search warrant was issued for two homes, yet additional home owners also had firearms confiscated.

http://www.wisconsingunowners.org/

Without a warrant, the cops would be trespassing at the time. Fair game for the aforementioned guns. :D

-MM :crs:

[Defiant Noquisi]

That is way too fubared! How can they do that and get away with it? How is it that the people who are supposed to uphold the law are getting away with breaking it? :mad:

[Zyztem]

I am a member at packing.org, a site for information relating to the 2nd Amendment and concealed carry issues. I checked there and this was not mentioned at all. It is now. There are enough people there that this will get spread far in the gun-owning community nationwide.
Thanks for the heads up, MetalMilitia.

[Zyztem]

My bad, it was there. Buried, but there.

[Conservative Front]

If this happened to the entire country I think you would see people go out shooting before the police could take there firearms. That and you'd see a revolt against the government. :shot:

[DarkAce]

Damn those poor wisconstin folk, oh what would they ever so do without their guns!

[Zyztem]

How about not being able to enjoy a constitutionally guaranteed right?

[DarkAce]

It's overrated.

[midnightsonblaze]

First off I hope all the officers involved in this get shitcanned because that's not how business works.......they should of heard of a procedure they learned in school called an 'investigation'. I hope this starts getting national coverage, because when it does it's going to cause a big problem (imo).....

Once the constitution starts being manipulated it's time for people to step in and STOP IT!

[Zyztem]

It's overrated.
As a free person, you're entitled to your opinion and I as a free person respect your right to have it, regardless if I agree with it. However, I do not believe it will be overrated if/when this government decides it's overrated. That is the whole reason for it's existence.

[midnightsonblaze]

It's overrated.


DA.......First off, how would you feel to be woken up in the middle of the night because somebody was rummaging through your things...and to even make it better it was the COPS!!....looking for guns in your house? (I.E the old woman in the article). They(Police) or anybody else has no right just to walk into your home without a warrant. It's against the law. When this type of stuff starts to happen, you need to take a timeout and realize WHAT THE HELL IS GOING ON HERE!?!?

Your rights being violated like that is complete bullshit...it's time for another revolution.....and it starts this year in the White House.....if they can't get a start on things it's up to the people to start taking action.....people need to stand up for themselves and stop being afraid. The civilians out number the police and military in this country, and when it gets down to it, we all can make a change!

:thumbs:

[stewey]

I live in Oshkosh, and this is the first I have heard about it.

Not saying it didn't happen, but there is probably more to it than meets the eye.

[Defiant Noquisi]

I am a member at packing.org, a site for information relating to the 2nd Amendment and concealed carry issues. I checked there and this was not mentioned at all. It is now. There are enough people there that this will get spread far in the gun-owning community nationwide.
Thanks for the heads up, MetalMilitia. Ill have to check out that website. Thanks for posting it. Welcome to the boards and btw, nice avatar if thats Kevin Smith. :D

[Defiant Noquisi]

Your rights being violated like that is complete bullshit...it's time for another revolution.....and it starts this year in the White House.....if they can't get a start on things it's up to the people to start taking action.....people need to stand up for themselves and stop being afraid. The civilians out number the police and military in this country, and when it gets down to it, we all can make a change! I agree with you but it would take the vast majority of citizenry putting down the clicker and getting up off their asses to do that. Since people dont, thats how they get away with it. It is completely incomprehensible that people outside that town are not in outrage over this until it happens to them.

[stewey]

I live here and I haven't even heard of it happening outside this forum.

Oshkosh NorthWestern's website: http://www.wisinfo.com/northwestern/

If anyone finds out more, I would love to hear about it.

Well I live just outside Oshkosh (<10 minute drive to work, I work in Oshkosh), but we get the same media.

[MetalMilitia]

It's overrated.

One person, a neighborhood, a district, a whole town? When would it stop being 'over-rated'? The fact that multiple peoples homes were unlawfully entered, and searched is ridiculous.

We have these rights for a reason, and by just shrugging it off you're opening the door for more of these level events to happen.

They want in my house, they better bring a warrant.

-MM- :crs:

[MacRasta]

Way too funny to read your posts... :grin

I think you people shouldn't be allowed to own a gun, or only under very strict conditions. It sickens me that just about every nut in your country can "just go out" and buy a gun.

Come over here and try to buy a gun, you'll see what I mean.

LeMac

[Defiant Noquisi]

I think you people shouldn't be allowed to own a gun, or only under very strict conditions. It sickens me that just about every nut in your country can "just go out" and buy a gun. Thats not true Mac, not everyone can. However, the laws as they have been took away the rights of law abiding people which allowed criminals an advantage I didnt care for.

Not only that, but in my opinion, laws like that only furthered the decimation of our 2nd Amendment rights to keep and bear arms.

I have no problem with a system such as getting a drivers license where a person would have to take classes and tests, and then prove they knew how to use a firearm properly. I wouldnt mind some kind of set-up where one would have to renew their license every four years as with drivers licenses. I have no problem with a background check and felons not being allowed to have firearms. However, I have a huge problem with someone taking away yet another one of my rights.

I do think that if guns were taken from people like me then the only ones left who have them will be law enforcement and criminals. Right now there appears to be a thinner dividing line between the two.

I also believe in gun control, I use both hands. :shot:

[Zyztem]

I also believe in gun control, I use both hands. :shot:

Thank you!!!!!!!!!!! Also thanks for the welcome, been lurking around, occasionally posting.
I believe you will find much useful information at the site I mentioned, it really opened my eyes (used to have a "who needs 'em attitude"). Lots of current events in the 2A world and politics, great database on licensing issues and reciprocity.
Yup, thats Kevin Smith. It's a pretty good representation of myself, minus the hat- somewhat overweight bearded guy smoking while on the computer. Waitin' for Contributor rights to post the less blurry avatar!

[Defiant Noquisi]

I believe you will find much useful information at the site I mentioned, it really opened my eyes (used to have a "who needs 'em attitude"). Lots of current events in the 2A world and politics, great database on licensing issues and reciprocity. Its not so much as a "who needs em" kind of thing, its a "who has the freedom IF they want one" that I am most protective of. Even if I hadnt been a pistol toter in the past I would still feel the same way.

Theres a country out in or by Europe somewhere, Mac correct me if Im wrong but I keep thinking Sweden, where when one turns of adult age (Im not sure if its male exclusive) they are trained to use military rifles. Im uneducated about this but my dad had mentioned it to me a few times. From what he said, it is that person's responsibility as an adult to be capable of protecting the country should the need arise.

People fear the unknown. It is my belief that if everyone trained in firearms, not neccessarily be required to have them, but at least trained, they would not be so apt to fear them and I believe it would reduce crime. Its kind of like that bumper sticker, "Protected by Smith and Wesson three days a week. You guess which three". People thinking of commiting crimes might be less inclined and even intimidated since the people they used to have as easy marks, wouldnt be so easy anymore.


Yup, thats Kevin Smith. It's a pretty good representation of myself, minus the hat- somewhat overweight bearded guy smoking while on the computer. Waitin' for Contributor rights to post the less blurry avatar! LOL, good for you! The guys here worked damn hard to put this baby back together again and I liked it so much here that I did. Welcome! BTW, if you are also a filmmaker I really want to talk to you! :grin

Girls with guns. Its a good thing! :D

[Zyztem]

LOL, good for you! The guys here worked damn hard to put this baby back together again and I liked it so much here that I did. Welcome! BTW, if you are also a filmmaker I really want to talk to you! :grin

Girls with guns. Its a good thing! :D

If I'm not mistaken, it's Switzerland. The heck of it is, (If I'm not further mistaken) they have less gun accidents per capita than any other country.
As for filmaking, I can't claim that distinction, although I do work with camera equipment everyday (surveillance equipment technician). I've read so many millions of words over the years that I've toyed around starting a few books, but I have commitment issues with them.

[DarkAce]

My overrated comment was directed towards the amendment about the right to bare 'arms'. I'm with Mac, if anyone cares read through our long gun control topic in the Philosophy forum.

Initially I didn't think much of this, considering I don't think these cops are that stupid to go in without warrants in middle class homes like that looking for evidence. It makes no sense. I'm not saying it didn't happen, but perhaps it was an exaggerated event.

[A Lone Voice]

Your rights being violated like that is complete bullshit...it's time for another revolution.....and it starts this year in the White House.....if they can't get a start on things it's up to the people to start taking action.....people need to stand up for themselves and stop being afraid. The civilians out number the police and military in this country, and when it gets down to it, we all can make a change!

:thumbs:

How do we start a revolution "this year in the White House"? By voting for Kerry?! He of the left-wing Democrat gun-control zealots?

The LAST person 2nd Amendment advocates want in the White House is John Kerry......

[MacRasta]

I couldn't tell you what country it is, maybe Dutchie knows... and it doesn't suprise me that this country has the least gun related accidents of Europe.

A few years ago, a lot of European Networks national sport was to go to the US and try to buy a firearm. Agreed, in some states it's much easier than in others but it's still pretty easy compared to western Europe.
About that police and criminal point (only them bearing guns), yeah, that would be a problem. But the origin of that problem is that so many guns were (and still are) being sold, that you have a heck of a lot used guns for sale around there, a big black market. You'll be able to take away practicaly all guns from you folks, ecxept for the police and criminals, as you said. If you didn't get to buy firearms so easily as it was, you didn't need that 2nd amendment(related to firearms, that is), and a whole lot less criminals would have access to guns in the first place.

As firearms are so massively sold in the US, it's big business, big money, so sure the laws must be apropriate. And here I agree with you guys; A right is a right, even how stupid it might be, it can't be broken, there's no copper here who should try to funk my rights!

A little picture about the gun abuse around here : it is VERY, VERY rare that we see a gun-related article in the news. A gang (I'm not sure it's the exact word) called "De Bende van Nijvel" were heavily armed, "robbed" supermarkets, killing a few innocent people on their way out. Not so good, but what seemed a few years afterwards, in each supermarket "robbed", there was always at least 1 important person among those killed (mainly big business guys), so the "robbery's" were more like cover-ups. It is still not know what exactly, but it goes high up in Belgian political circles.
Other shoot-outs are between cops and real robbers, but that happens maybe once a year.

The latest shootings are related to jewel robbers and shop owners. 2 robbers were killed by the shop owners on two seperate occassions. The shop owners fired first (!) but the robbers held guns to their hands.
You must know that these shop owners pay a ridiculous sum of money to the insurance, I wont put a price on it now, I'll try to find the links again. But believe me, it's funking expensive. Plus all the security systems needed in order to make a chance to get an insurance... They simply can't afford another robbery again (6th or 7th time). So what do they do? they go to the shooting range, what's more like an expensive shooting school around here. They get a license, and protect their shop. Now most Belgians don't agree with his use of a gun, I mean, where is this going to?? (the US?) On the other hand, the guy had been terrorized a few times in other occassions, so most of us are glad those 2 are dead, thing is, they must have been shot by cops, not some civilians.

... To feel safe in ones neighborhood ...

I hope my post makes some sense :grin

You guys are stuck with your 2nd amendment, I pitty you. (not bad intended)

Mac

Oh, BTW :shot: :rolling:

[KnowledgeTruth]

You guys remember the John Titor story? About the civil war in '04? Just interesting how things are setting up.

[Defiant Noquisi]

I hear ya Mac on the differences in gun related crime. However, our governments are set up much differently. I also happen to enjoy shooting so its not just a protection thing with me although it is important.