Firearms Refresher Course

[Conservative Front]

FIREARMS REFRESHER COURSE ----- From A to Z.

a. An armed man is a citizen. An unarmed man is a subject.
b. A gun in the hand is better than a cop on the phone.
c. Smith & Wesson: The original point and click interface.
d. Gun control is not about guns; it's about control.
e. If guns are outlawed, can we use swords?
f. If guns cause crime, then pencils cause misspelled words.
g. Free men do not ask permission to bear arms.
h. If you don't know your rights you don't have any.
i. Those who trade liberty for security have neither.
j. The United States Constitution © 1791 by "We, The People". All Rights Reserved.
k. What part of "shall not be infringed" do you not understand ?
l. The Second Amendment is in place in case they ignore the others.
m. 64,999,987 firearms owners killed no one yesterday.
n. Guns only have two enemies: Rust and Politicians.
o. Know guns, know peace and safety. No guns, no peace nor safety.
p. You don't shoot to kill; you shoot to stay alive.
q. 911 - government sponsored Dial a Prayer.
r. Assault is a behavior, not a device.
s. Criminals love gun control - it makes their jobs safer.
t. If Guns cause Crime, then Matches cause Arson.
u. Only a government that is afraid of it's citizens tries to control them.
v. You only have the rights you are willing to fight for.
w. Enforce the "gun control laws" we have, don't make more.
x. When you remove the people's right to bear arms, you create slaves.
y. The American Revolution would never have happened with Gun Control.
z. "...a government by the people, for the people..."

[DarkAce]

:rolling:

Great joke! Wait your serious...


I could go ahead and rebuttal, but I prefer being an ass.

[DontBeAfraid]

I liked and agree with the post CF.... Just so you know, the second amendment is a part of the bill of rights that you hate so much.

[dutchie]

Allright, let me be the ass then... CF, of course all of this was meant in a tongue-in-cheek way by you (??) so please let me bring it back to you in the same way...


a. An armed man is a citizen. An unarmed man is a subject.
16 million subjects in my country then...

b. A gun in the hand is better than a cop on the phone.
(as quoted by the criminal that is putting it to your head)

c. Smith & Wesson: The original point and click interface.
Nope. That was made by Xerox.

d. Gun control is not about guns; it's about control.
or the lack of it, as is shown by the grizzly number of gunrelated deaths per year..

e. If guns are outlawed, can we use swords?
Personally I don't care what device Americans prefer to murder eachother with..

f. If guns cause crime, then pencils cause misspelled words.
Judging by the lack of those in this post, you pasted it in..

g. Free men do not ask permission to bear arms.
No, they don't need them at all.

h. If you don't know your rights you don't have any.
I thought we had the law to manage those..

i. Those who trade liberty for security have neither.
I would not want to do that.. I just keep both.

j. The United States Constitution © 1791 by "We, The People". All Rights Reserved.
So?!? Afraid some other country might want to copy them??

k. What part of "shall not be infringed" do you not understand ?
the "shall" part.

l. The Second Amendment is in place in case they ignore the others.
:lol: see DBA´s post

m. 64,999,987 firearms owners killed no one yesterday.
Keep on dreaming...

n. Guns only have two enemies: Rust and Politicians.
Three!! I am number three!!!

o. Know guns, know peace and safety. No guns, no peace nor safety.
I live in a safe and peaceful country (no war since WWII); can you say the same??

p. You don't shoot to kill; you shoot to stay alive.
I eat and breathe to stay alive. Shooting not necessary.

q. 911 - government sponsored Dial a Prayer.
That is plain tasteless.

r. Assault is a behavior, not a device.
Is that why they call it an "Assault rifle"??

s. Criminals love gun control - it makes their jobs safer.
...and their guns easier to buy...

t. If Guns cause Crime, then Matches cause Arson.
...baked beans will make you fart, does that make an onion a bean??

u. Only a government that is afraid of it's citizens tries to control them.
...Hear who's talking!!!

v. You only have the rights you are willing to fight for.
I thought you said that the ones you know are the ones you have. Make your mind up!!

w. Enforce the "gun control laws" we have, don't make more.
More guns? Absolutely right!!

x. When you remove the people's right to bear arms, you create slaves.
Well, you would know about slavery, wouldn't you now??

y. The American Revolution would never have happened with Gun Control.
Maybe that would not have been so bad after all, then...

z. "...a government by the people, for the people..."
Sounds like China to me...


:dork: :bye:

[DontBeAfraid]

Most deaths by guns in america are suicides... And I believe in the individuals right to die. I beleive we need guns for when the government gets out of control dutchie, that was the intention of the second amendment... I strongly agree with the spirit of the 'y' statement.

[dutchie]

Everyone's entitled of their opinion, DBA. I am just convinced that guns won't solve, prevent or secure anything. They're instruments of death, either way you look at it.

To stress the right of having such an instrument in your house as being an example of "freedom" or "liberty" just makes the American people and their idea of freedom and liberty look sad in my eyes. :bncry:

[DarkAce]

It may be DBA, but times have changed. People aren't as simple minded, (well to that degree then) as they are today. We have alternative measures that can be used now, that would actually get results instead of just the brute force way.

[DontBeAfraid]

Its always a last resort DarkAce..... but if you use the world as it is now or as it ever was as any kind of guideline...... Our "alternative ways" often dont get results..... Guns dont kill people, people kill people.... Yes now and then there may be an accident, but how many accidents happen on the streets you use to drive to work everyday.

[humanhybrid]

f. If guns cause crime, then pencils cause misspelled words.
Judging by the lack of those in this post, you pasted it in.. That is so funny. Im a bit confused so everyone please share your diffrences. I know that our constitution declares that we can carry arms and maybe it would be a good thing if in fact our administrative goverment decided to administrate things unconstitutionally BOTH against human rights etc. Do we always carry weopons for this purpose or is it just an excuse? Is it in our intrest to control or eliminate weopons altogether? good day!

[Conservative Front]

Wow, I never though we'd agree on something DontBeAfriad...

---end response to dontbeafriad---

A) Thats you're country and I could careless about it.

B)Id feel safer having an AR-15 by my head fully loaded then trying to dial the cops and hoping they make it on time.

C)nah, Smith and Wesson came out way before Xerox, and when you think about it all you had too do was Point and Click.

D) Most gun deaths are from Suicide in America and I don't think it would have mattered if they had a gun or not they would have done it anyway.

E)Id rather keep my guns to "kill" each other.

F)....

G)Wouldn't taking our Guns away violate rights? our FREE rights?

H)I don't need a law to manage my rights I know them.

I)Ok, good.

J) Umm... Not really I was making a point that are consition was copyrighted therefor shouldn't be changed.

K) Would NOT BE INFRINGED be better?

L) There wouldn't be a first without a second

M) I'm not dreaming thats a proven statistic

N) You're idealogy doesn't threaten my arsenal.

O) Yeah If it wasn't for America's guns all of Europe would be speaking German.

P) If someone breaks into my home and I have a gun I'm certainly going to Shoot to stay alive.

Q) 9-11 as in the phone number not 9/11

R) Assault Rifle is just a term. Any gun can be an Assault weapon which is behavior

S) Yes, If guns are outlawed it does make it easier for criminals to get guns.

T) Shoes can kick, Cars can run people over, Lawmowers cut fingers off, You can strangle someone with a belt, Beat someone with a book whats you're point?

U) I'm for less government much less.

V) the rights we know are the rights we fought for.

W) :crs: Guns save lifes, make more.

X) So would most of Europe Rome,Germany,G.B.,etc...

Y) The New Europe... Reminding us why are Ancestors left Old Europe...

Z) Like China? China has a HUGE government thats controlled by the government much like Europe...

---end response to Dutchie---

[Defiant Noquisi]

Dutchie, I respect your opinion, but as someone who has been able to deter a potential attack from an armed assailant because I was armed at the time, I will never again believe that being armed is not a deterent.

The one thing every responsible gun owner must face is the potential that they may have to pull that trigger. If pulling that trigger and killing an assailant protects my son and myself, I will do so. I will never allow some miscreant to rob my son of his mother and myself of my life because they feel some twisted need to dominate me and take my life. I see it no different than being attacked by a foreign entity.

[Emerald_Dragon]

Count me in on the right to bear arms category. I don't agree with certain guns that would border on military standard assault issue, but I agree with most of it. I'm even a subscriber to the NRA, but am finding their rhetoric, unpalpable. Extreme, Spin.

However, I do agree that guns are not the answer. Is that sitting on a fence? Not in my mind, but i'm sure a good spindoctor will convince you otherwise. Guns are meant for killing things. If you're not gonna eat it, don't shoot it. Then come the criminals that make it difficult for me to be sympathetic to those who don't want people to bear arms.

Its a tough call. England seems to be pretty safe without guns. Too bad Americans aren't mature/secure enough to live without them. Me included.

[Conservative Front]

I agree with you on the NRA to an extent infact I hate the NRA all they do is tell you to voteRepublican and beg for money I was a member for a year they sent me something once a week asking for Money finally I peeled the sticker off my car out of frustration ironic enough with my total of 0.00$ I sent them I still receive a Thank you for you donate at christmas haha.

A good example of what happens when you take peoples guns away look at Australia after the government took all there guns away crime rate when up by 92% People have to put Barbed wire around there house to keep people out. Do a google search on it and you'll find all the information about it.

---end response to emeralddragon---

[dutchie]

England seems to be pretty safe without guns. Too bad Americans aren't mature/secure enough to live without them. Me included.

Why don't you NEVER adress the things that frighten you, CF?!?

This is a mature comment by ED, it has nuance. Yours never have.

[Defiant Noquisi]

Count me in on the right to bear arms category. I don't agree with certain guns that would border on military standard assault issue, but I agree with most of it. I'm even a subscriber to the NRA, but am finding their rhetoric, unpalpable. Extreme, Spin. I dont agree on the "assault" weapons ban since it is possible to assault anyone with anything including your own hands. Since I have trained with military type weapons, I dont see any reason why I cant use them in a place that is safe for me to do so.

The NRA has become much more publically politically motivated but considering that politics is much more emotionally charged than it has been, its a sign of the times.


Its a tough call. England seems to be pretty safe without guns. Too bad Americans aren't mature/secure enough to live without them. Me included. Again, changes in society have made things that way. While England appeared to be "safer", the society is much different than ours. It is an unfair comparison. I dont want to live without them although I can. I have and enjoy using them. I dont have to kill anything to use them. People dont intentionally drive cars to kill people but it happens. Sure, they werent designed to kill as guns were, but they are still used as tools in crime.

Killing is and always will be a choice. Outlawing weapons or not it will still happen. I chose to protect myself and my son as best and as educated as possible.

[dutchie]

While England appeared to be "safer", the society is much different than ours. It is an unfair comparison. I dont want to live without them although I can. I have and enjoy using them.

That"s a very "double" opinion...

* In what respect is British society different from yours?!?
* If it wouldn't be different, you would still cling to your precious weaponry.. In effect, that's what you're saying..

Guns are instruments of death, either way you look at it. I know knives can kill too, but for some reason we don't need legislation for that (maybe they kill too messy?!?). Take it from me, the rest of the Dutch and the British: you do not need guns, you just were told you needed them.

[Defiant Noquisi]

That"s a very "double" opinion...

* In what respect is British society different from yours?!?
* If it wouldn't be different, you would still cling to your precious weaponry.. In effect, that's what you're saying..

Guns are instruments of death, either way you look at it. I know knives can kill too, but for some reason we don't need legislation for that (maybe they kill too messy?!?). Take it from me, the rest of the Dutch and the British: you do not need guns, you just were told you needed them.

Im not really sure how I want to answer this. You almost appear to be bristling while having typed it which makes me feel that it would be safer not to.

I dont understand the precious remark since I dont spend my days cuddled up next to my firearms, I dont feed them or "play" with them. They are tools and I have never posted anything that would allude to them being any different from that. Since I have never killed anything during target practice, I dont see how you can solely equivalate them with only death. There are many other types of weapons that can also fit in this category.

What is precious to me is my freedom of choosing whether to own them or not. Likewise, I should have the choice regarding ANYTHING that is not harmful to someone else in my usage of it. This "selective" freedom of choice is really starting to get on my nerves.

I was never told anything of the sort and I really dont understand your thinking here. I dont rant on you for not having them and I dont see anything wrong with that. If that is an acceptable view and part of your society and/or culture then I have no problems with it. My having firearms has always been a choice in mine, nothing more. If I choose to feed my family with wild game rather than hormone and chemical pumped commercial meat, that is my choice. No one convinced me that I HAD to have guns except for the asshole that wanted a piece of me and didnt get it because I was armed as well. I was able to divert an attack and rape against me because he found out rather quickly that I was no easy target.

I will always die on my feet rather than live on my knees. That is my choice in the society that I live in.

[Defiant Noquisi]

Another thing, while you may not ever understand my choice in having firearms, I would have at least thought that you would respect that I have also done everything I felt I possibly could to learn how to avoid pulling that trigger.

Gun ownership is a responsibility I do not take lightly, ever. I have taken classes including shooting with others. I have also learned other fighting arts as well. I happen to be very effective with my hands. However, unless a perp comes in close enough for me to engage him, my hands are useless and Im not giving him any piece of me if I dont have to.

This is not some game. Target practice is not a game. I enjoy it, I find it fulfilling but it is a very responsible and serious thing to participate in. Please do not equate me with those who chose to use firearms in a violent manner against others for their self gain. I am nothing of the sort, that type of comparison is offensive to me and I have NEVER engaged in that type of activity.

[dutchie]

OK OK OK... I wasn't ranting or anything... Guns - and discussing them - generally make me nervous. They are SO alien to my day to day life, I am truly amazed to see one of the largest peoples of the world being so unified in their wish to own one of the buggers.

I don't dislike anyone for owning a gun. I am sure YOU are very responsible as an owner of a gun. I just doubt the idea that the vast majority of your people will be like you.

Fact remains - but this is a notion that will NEVER sink in with the Americans - you do not NEED a gun. That is the difference between our society and yours: we found out this is true.

DN, I really wasn't mad or anything. Just amazed. :bearhug:

BTW, what does the word "bristling" mean?

[substand]

q. 911 - government sponsored Dial a Prayer.
That is plain tasteless.

I think the tasteless part might be thinking "911" is equivalent to "9/11/2001" ... 911 is our number to dial in case of emergency... not sure if its the same everywhere, so if its not, you have to keep that in mind. The US supreme court found that it is not the police's job to protect individuals from harm, only the community at large. Therefore, dialing 911 (ie, calling the emergency responders) is quite like "dial a prayer"- as in, if someone is in my house about to kill me, it would be retarded for me to dial 911 because the police could not get there before i died (unless i had some way to keep myself alive until they arrived)... I just felt the need to clear that up if you thought he was talking about 9/11 the date. If you weren't talking about that, well then, i have nothing to say on the issue. =)

CF- i'm glad you think so much of the 2nd amendment... i only wish you thought that about the rest of them, especially the 9th and 10th amendments.

guns may not "solve" issues, but they sure help to. it is a very similar thing to owning cars, or knives, or anything else that has the potential to kill people. Why do we prosecute people for crimes they have yet to commit? it doesn't matter if i or you have a gun that sits around, does it? who does it hurt? However, the times it helps in having one goes far underreported, as in DN's case. Gun control/banning really only affects those who agree to abide by it (by definition). So when you "outlaw" guns, only your outlaws will have them, thus putting the rest of the population at a disadvantage... not to mention that "who cares" if i break in to a house anymore? the owner won't have a gun (more than likely) and the worst i can expect if they are home is a beating... and about england being more safe without them, it may be true... but i remember reading about a guy spending prison time for killing an intruder with his sword... and god forbid the day i have to worry about killing someone who is invading my property who may kill me.... THATS messed up.

I'd much rather everyone own guns, and I've got my own, than worry about someone having a gun breaking into my house, and me having to defend myself with a paring knife. I'd rather die knowing my wife and kid weren't raped by an intruder because they killed him, than die unsure of if they got out of the house before I went down or not.

[Defiant Noquisi]

I don't dislike anyone for owning a gun. I am sure YOU are very responsible as an owner of a gun. I just doubt the idea that the vast majority of your people will be like you. The dynamics would have to be carefully looked at. In general terms regarding the entire population I might agree. If you are talking gun owners only, I would disagree. Now if you looked at the potential of the portion of the population that could pass background checks and could be trained, I might disagree but that would depend on how many people would be too afraid of them to be safe. Theres just too many variables.


Fact remains - but this is a notion that will NEVER sink in with the Americans - you do not NEED a gun. That is the difference between our society and yours: we found out this is true. Im not sure what information you are using but I have yet to meet a gun owner who said he "needed" it. We need food, water and shelter, not firearms. This is where societal differences come in. I am not sure but it may be the view you have of us because you might only see people who are publically passionate about it that get on the news. There are a vast majority of us who are calm about things until the government decides they need to take action, and then take it against the people who have never done anything. Another want is for the government to quit punishing innocent people because of the "bad guys". Thats the biggest load of elephant scat Ive ever seen.


BTW, what does the word "bristling" mean? Think of the hair raising up on your cats back when he gets upset. Thats an example of bristling. :kiss:

[midnightsonblaze]

In my opinion -

If governments took guns away from its citizens it would be easier for them to control you and your life style.....especially if the government is corrupt....it would make it far worse.

Remember the American Revolution and breaking away from England.....it wouldn't have happened without guns....and America would most likely be part of England now.

Right to bear arms should be apart of every countries constitution.....just keep this is mind....if you want to rebel and overthrow a corrupt government....you really couldn't do it without ammo......fists and knives wouldn't do much against a police & military force that would be up against you...

later......

:crs:

[substand]

Right to bear arms should be apart of every countries constitution.....just keep this is mind....if you want to rebel and overthrow a corrupt government....you really couldn't do it without ammo......fists and knives wouldn't do much against a police & military force that would be up against you...

I agree with the right to bear arms (and not cutting them from bears and using them to one's pleasure), and i think agree with you in principle... however, its a hard argument that the guns our (US) government allows us to have would ever hold up against tanks and such. Even if they allowed us to buy the sort of weapons they have, I have a hard time beleiving it would help any of us resist a truly and purely tyrannical regime with US power.

I mean, if even 100000 of us owned the type of shit the US military does, AND we all happened to be concentrated in one "defendable" area, its unlikely we'd ever have a chance at repelling the corrupt govt.

[DarkAce]

Wha...Kurt Russel did it! :crs:

[midnightsonblaze]

however, its a hard argument that the guns our (US) government allows us to have would ever hold up against tanks and such. Even if they allowed us to buy the sort of weapons they have, I have a hard time beleiving it would help any of us resist a truly and purely tyrannical regime with US power.

I mean, if even 100000 of us owned the type of shit the US military does, AND we all happened to be concentrated in one "defendable" area, its unlikely we'd ever have a chance at repelling the corrupt govt.

Sub......just keep this in mind......people would pick sides and some people in the military and police force would obviously pick the revolution side......I mean even if it did happen the revolution side would most likely end up having tanks, airplanes and other sorts of high tech weapons......just thinking this as well.....People (al-queda etc.) would also flood into this country from the North, South, East & West with some pretty nasty weapons and ideas themselves to take out gov't forces.

Just a thought though