eyekwah
Jan 17th, 2005, 10:17 AM
where was god at the time of the tsunami sitin on his fat ass and reading the telegraph where was he in the world wars where was he when the hurracanes hit florida WERE IS HE I THE TIME OF NEED
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Godsgifttomankind
Jan 17th, 2005, 2:24 PM
Hello Eyeqwah,
where was god at the time of the tsunami sitin on his fat ass and reading the telegraph where was he in the world wars where was he when the hurracanes hit florida WERE IS HE I THE TIME OF NEED
This is a very well stated point and one well worth examination and understanding.
Is it the role of a parent to protect a child from every obstacle that comes across their path or is it the role of the parent to give the child the tools, understanding and guidance that the child needs to overcome the obstacles that are placed in their paths and there by build his character?
This society that we call civilization has at it's disposal everything that we need to come to the assistance of the less fortunate and to assist the down trodden. The only thing that is lacking is a unanimous heart felt desire by those in authority to act based upon the needs of others and not upon their own selfish desires. It is events like those that you have mentioned that people wait for until they are forced to take action on matters that should have been dealt with while the problems were just small.
A Civilized society looks after the rights of those that are not able to look after themselves and places the needs of others before the needs of themselves. This is not a matter of vigilantism or imposing greater laws to protect the rights of people but a matter of educating people to overcome their own selfish desires and place the needs of others in front of their own needs.
God has not abandoned us but given us everything that we need to solve our own problems and take responsiblity for the actions of the world community. It is individuals bent on imposing on others their idealogies and understandings that prevent the advancement and create disparaging situations within the world community. Without events such as have been mentioned much of the worlds population would be content to ignore and remain inactive to the needs of others. Events like these are a binding agent that promote cooperation and universality within the world community.
The question is not were is God but upon further examination the question should be why is humanity in such a dire situation and since humanity is made up of individuals why does it take things to reach extreme measures before individuals are willing to stand up and say it is time for a change?
It is easy to point the finger in every direction and look to a higher power, be that government or God; to solve the problems of the world but when it comes down to the crunch it is individual responsiblity that brings forth action and it seems that the only way a child learns to be responsible is by giving him responsibility. God has given us all the responsibility to look after the things in the world around us, which includes a plan and guidance for implementation of that plan. Man has the ability to overcome his environment and use scientific achievement to improve the situation in the world or else ignorance and religious dogma can push us back into the darkages.
where was god at the time of the tsunami sitin on his fat ass and reading the telegraph where was he in the world wars where was he when the hurracanes hit florida WERE IS HE I THE TIME OF NEED
This is a very well stated point and one well worth examination and understanding.
Is it the role of a parent to protect a child from every obstacle that comes across their path or is it the role of the parent to give the child the tools, understanding and guidance that the child needs to overcome the obstacles that are placed in their paths and there by build his character?
This society that we call civilization has at it's disposal everything that we need to come to the assistance of the less fortunate and to assist the down trodden. The only thing that is lacking is a unanimous heart felt desire by those in authority to act based upon the needs of others and not upon their own selfish desires. It is events like those that you have mentioned that people wait for until they are forced to take action on matters that should have been dealt with while the problems were just small.
A Civilized society looks after the rights of those that are not able to look after themselves and places the needs of others before the needs of themselves. This is not a matter of vigilantism or imposing greater laws to protect the rights of people but a matter of educating people to overcome their own selfish desires and place the needs of others in front of their own needs.
God has not abandoned us but given us everything that we need to solve our own problems and take responsiblity for the actions of the world community. It is individuals bent on imposing on others their idealogies and understandings that prevent the advancement and create disparaging situations within the world community. Without events such as have been mentioned much of the worlds population would be content to ignore and remain inactive to the needs of others. Events like these are a binding agent that promote cooperation and universality within the world community.
The question is not were is God but upon further examination the question should be why is humanity in such a dire situation and since humanity is made up of individuals why does it take things to reach extreme measures before individuals are willing to stand up and say it is time for a change?
It is easy to point the finger in every direction and look to a higher power, be that government or God; to solve the problems of the world but when it comes down to the crunch it is individual responsiblity that brings forth action and it seems that the only way a child learns to be responsible is by giving him responsibility. God has given us all the responsibility to look after the things in the world around us, which includes a plan and guidance for implementation of that plan. Man has the ability to overcome his environment and use scientific achievement to improve the situation in the world or else ignorance and religious dogma can push us back into the darkages.
dutchie
Jan 18th, 2005, 5:52 AM
Don't know about YOU, GGTM, but if MY kid would be in danger of being swallowed by a big wave, I would NOT throw her a rubber bed to take care of herself, I would DIVE IN to come to her immediate rescue...
So, where is this supposed "love of God", when he does nothing because we're already "equipped" to take care of ourselves?
Don't you yourself feel the lack of love in that? (Assuming there IS a God, of course...)
So, where is this supposed "love of God", when he does nothing because we're already "equipped" to take care of ourselves?
Don't you yourself feel the lack of love in that? (Assuming there IS a God, of course...)
Godsgifttomankind
Jan 18th, 2005, 11:08 AM
Hello Dutchie and thank-you for your reply,
There is no doubt in any of our minds that your daughters are truly blessed to have a father such as yourself, caring and ever watchful of their needs. Giving them space to be themselves, guiding them in times of need, rescuing them in times of difficulty and pulling them up safe into your arms and holding them tight each at it's most appropriate time. You know and understand from your own experience when to act and when to allow them to find their own strength. There are times when you act out of love to protect and discipline and yet your girls fail to see it as anything but an uncaring act on your part, going to the point of telling you that they hate you for what you have done and yet you as a father know that this moment will pass and your children will in the next breath forgive you and thank-you for being such a wonderful parent.
A childs perspective is based upon their understanding of the world around them and how the actions of others affect them, as time passes their view of the world becomes enlarged, starting with their family then community to the region then the country and at some point they become aware of the needs of the planet. This is the process of awareness that society also deals with and looking back at history we can plot the development based upon the same increased perception.
As individuals we use reason and understanding based upon our own experiences to make sense of the world around us and progress in our theories of it's complexities. The levels of understanding and the verities of theories are based upon different levels of education and experiences thus it is that many still have a child like view of the world around them and have yet to fully come to a clearer understanding of it's purpose or in fact the purpose for their own existence. It is this undeveloped awareness that motivates young and old alike to search for understanding and reason for God to allow things to happen that in their eyes are seen as cruel and uncaring. The hardest and most devastating of these for people to deal with is death and yet for those that have passed on it is a joyous occasion when the child is pulled up into the arms of the father and held firm within his embrace, a point were the interference of the physical world is eliminated and the spirit can soar like a great eagle. The ones that are left behind are the ones that suffer, only because it is a part of the continued process of maturation and it is only through the experience of loss that we are able to place value on the things that are around us.
I do not expect you to embrace fully my words at this time for it is only through the passing of time and the experiences that come with it, that a person is moved towards a greater understanding, as it takes many examples from a parent before the child begins to accept and understand that which has been presented.
You are the greatest example for your girls just as your parents were an example to you but you have also gain much along the way that your parents did not give you, as your daughters will far exceed the example that you have set. This is the evolution of understanding which can have both positive and negative values depending upon how you choose to live your life.
There is no doubt in any of our minds that your daughters are truly blessed to have a father such as yourself, caring and ever watchful of their needs. Giving them space to be themselves, guiding them in times of need, rescuing them in times of difficulty and pulling them up safe into your arms and holding them tight each at it's most appropriate time. You know and understand from your own experience when to act and when to allow them to find their own strength. There are times when you act out of love to protect and discipline and yet your girls fail to see it as anything but an uncaring act on your part, going to the point of telling you that they hate you for what you have done and yet you as a father know that this moment will pass and your children will in the next breath forgive you and thank-you for being such a wonderful parent.
A childs perspective is based upon their understanding of the world around them and how the actions of others affect them, as time passes their view of the world becomes enlarged, starting with their family then community to the region then the country and at some point they become aware of the needs of the planet. This is the process of awareness that society also deals with and looking back at history we can plot the development based upon the same increased perception.
As individuals we use reason and understanding based upon our own experiences to make sense of the world around us and progress in our theories of it's complexities. The levels of understanding and the verities of theories are based upon different levels of education and experiences thus it is that many still have a child like view of the world around them and have yet to fully come to a clearer understanding of it's purpose or in fact the purpose for their own existence. It is this undeveloped awareness that motivates young and old alike to search for understanding and reason for God to allow things to happen that in their eyes are seen as cruel and uncaring. The hardest and most devastating of these for people to deal with is death and yet for those that have passed on it is a joyous occasion when the child is pulled up into the arms of the father and held firm within his embrace, a point were the interference of the physical world is eliminated and the spirit can soar like a great eagle. The ones that are left behind are the ones that suffer, only because it is a part of the continued process of maturation and it is only through the experience of loss that we are able to place value on the things that are around us.
I do not expect you to embrace fully my words at this time for it is only through the passing of time and the experiences that come with it, that a person is moved towards a greater understanding, as it takes many examples from a parent before the child begins to accept and understand that which has been presented.
You are the greatest example for your girls just as your parents were an example to you but you have also gain much along the way that your parents did not give you, as your daughters will far exceed the example that you have set. This is the evolution of understanding which can have both positive and negative values depending upon how you choose to live your life.
dutchie
Jan 19th, 2005, 2:39 AM
Wow, GGTM, you really did some writing there...
I read it three times, to be honest. Not because I didn't understand it, but to make sure I read everything correctly. If I read your words correctly, you're expanding the metaphor of children vs parent, to people vs God. God is a parent; we're his/her children. Once we come to maturity we can appreciate God's "cruelty" which is his way of "letting us go", or showing his parental care. Death is really a feast to those that die, because they finally land into the arms of God, but the ones left behind understand little of this plan, because they can't see the parental care of God in what happened to their deceased loved one(s).
You end by saying I won't grasp much of what you're saying because I haven't come of age myself.
The process you describe in the first paragraph - the child not understanding the care of the parent and responding in an almost hateful way is called puberty. We all went through that phase (at least I hope you did too :wink:) and - without getting too clinical about it - it's all about hormones, nothing else. Once we've outgrown that problem and all of the pimples are gone, we cautiously can start addressing ourselves as being "adults". There's no deity involved in this process, it's a natural thing and most mammals are affected.
Seeing God as a father/mother figure has appealed mankind since the dawn of time. We all regard the parental figure as one that serves as a role model for the rest of our lives and most of us will treat their parents with the respect they (might) deserve.
Now let's leave the metaphor for what it is. It was with a sigh from slight despair I read the paragraph before the last. Man, the sheer arrogance of it!! You really think you have all the wisdom in the world at your disposal, don't you? You address me with an unbelievable level of patronizing disdain, it baffles the mind:
I do not expect you to embrace fully my words at this time for it is only through the passing of time and the experiences that come with it, that a person is moved towards a greater understanding, as it takes many examples from a parent before the child begins to accept and understand that which has been presented.
Did you really think I lack the intelligence to understand what you are saying?! I was brought up in a baptist family. My knowledge of scriptures exceeds that of most others on this board, I assure you. I also assure you not a single dogma discussed on this board is unfamiliar to me. I became a spiritual adult long ago. The difference between you and me is that I REALLY decided to take responsibility into my own hands, and leave the "family nest" altogether.
To me God is not a parent. God is hydrogen, the very fabric of the universe. When you take a look at the world and all of its religions from a universal point of view there is no escape possible from understanding the fact that we're on a petty world with petty ideas of how our petty lives are governed by some petty deity that needs to be worshipped for all time. A deity that wants a bloody sacrifice; a deity that threatens its own creation with eternal damnation and torture when it won't worship him - and it won't discriminate for age at all... There goes your metaphor.
To return the arrogance in a tuned down version: I do expect you to understand my words. At least the essence of it. I don't expect you to come to terms with its implications. That would be asking too much as you so obviously are in deep need of an ideology that will help you through your days. Please don't hate me for stating I feel freed from the bonds of religious slavery I was tied up with for most of my youth. I wish you well with yours.
I did not plan to write such a lengthy reply, but hey - that's what this board is for, isn't it? :2thumbs:
I read it three times, to be honest. Not because I didn't understand it, but to make sure I read everything correctly. If I read your words correctly, you're expanding the metaphor of children vs parent, to people vs God. God is a parent; we're his/her children. Once we come to maturity we can appreciate God's "cruelty" which is his way of "letting us go", or showing his parental care. Death is really a feast to those that die, because they finally land into the arms of God, but the ones left behind understand little of this plan, because they can't see the parental care of God in what happened to their deceased loved one(s).
You end by saying I won't grasp much of what you're saying because I haven't come of age myself.
The process you describe in the first paragraph - the child not understanding the care of the parent and responding in an almost hateful way is called puberty. We all went through that phase (at least I hope you did too :wink:) and - without getting too clinical about it - it's all about hormones, nothing else. Once we've outgrown that problem and all of the pimples are gone, we cautiously can start addressing ourselves as being "adults". There's no deity involved in this process, it's a natural thing and most mammals are affected.
Seeing God as a father/mother figure has appealed mankind since the dawn of time. We all regard the parental figure as one that serves as a role model for the rest of our lives and most of us will treat their parents with the respect they (might) deserve.
Now let's leave the metaphor for what it is. It was with a sigh from slight despair I read the paragraph before the last. Man, the sheer arrogance of it!! You really think you have all the wisdom in the world at your disposal, don't you? You address me with an unbelievable level of patronizing disdain, it baffles the mind:
I do not expect you to embrace fully my words at this time for it is only through the passing of time and the experiences that come with it, that a person is moved towards a greater understanding, as it takes many examples from a parent before the child begins to accept and understand that which has been presented.
Did you really think I lack the intelligence to understand what you are saying?! I was brought up in a baptist family. My knowledge of scriptures exceeds that of most others on this board, I assure you. I also assure you not a single dogma discussed on this board is unfamiliar to me. I became a spiritual adult long ago. The difference between you and me is that I REALLY decided to take responsibility into my own hands, and leave the "family nest" altogether.
To me God is not a parent. God is hydrogen, the very fabric of the universe. When you take a look at the world and all of its religions from a universal point of view there is no escape possible from understanding the fact that we're on a petty world with petty ideas of how our petty lives are governed by some petty deity that needs to be worshipped for all time. A deity that wants a bloody sacrifice; a deity that threatens its own creation with eternal damnation and torture when it won't worship him - and it won't discriminate for age at all... There goes your metaphor.
To return the arrogance in a tuned down version: I do expect you to understand my words. At least the essence of it. I don't expect you to come to terms with its implications. That would be asking too much as you so obviously are in deep need of an ideology that will help you through your days. Please don't hate me for stating I feel freed from the bonds of religious slavery I was tied up with for most of my youth. I wish you well with yours.
I did not plan to write such a lengthy reply, but hey - that's what this board is for, isn't it? :2thumbs:
eyekwah
Jan 19th, 2005, 11:23 AM
if he has given us all the things that we need to fend for our selves i think he has given us them in the form of guns and swords he did not give the survivors of the tsunami very much help the richer copuntrys gave it in the form of moslty money yes they and the question is acctualy where is god no body has known ever have you has your family has any one throught history knowen wher he is if you where to ask me i am all with the theory that humans made god up becuase humans need love we need somthing to look forward to we need a perfect father figure dont if you think on it god is a perfect hero but all our heros av weeknesses has our god have any weeknesses if he has is he the one we should worship
__________________________
clan cameron: Chlanna nan con thigibh a so's gheib sibh feail
__________________________
clan cameron: Chlanna nan con thigibh a so's gheib sibh feail
repentantsinner
Jan 19th, 2005, 1:00 PM
where was god at the time of the tsunami sitin on his fat ass and reading the telegraph where was he in the world wars where was he when the hurracanes hit florida WERE IS HE I THE TIME OF NEED
God works in strange and mysterious ways that the finite human mind cant understand. If 6 million jews were not murdered in ww2 would they have been so adament to have their own country? Would the world have agreed? Maybe it all happened to fulfill biblical prophecy. As for the tsunami, this may be a far fetched idea, but earthquake and natural disasters are going to happen un the end times, it may be later than we think. Also, this may be very far fetched but does God like christians ? They believe in his son so he must. The jews are Gods chosen people. Who hates christians and most of all hates Jews?????........Muslims, followers of Islam. What country in the world has the most muslims in it? What is the most populous muslim country in the world? Indonesia.
God works in strange and mysterious ways that the finite human mind cant understand. If 6 million jews were not murdered in ww2 would they have been so adament to have their own country? Would the world have agreed? Maybe it all happened to fulfill biblical prophecy. As for the tsunami, this may be a far fetched idea, but earthquake and natural disasters are going to happen un the end times, it may be later than we think. Also, this may be very far fetched but does God like christians ? They believe in his son so he must. The jews are Gods chosen people. Who hates christians and most of all hates Jews?????........Muslims, followers of Islam. What country in the world has the most muslims in it? What is the most populous muslim country in the world? Indonesia.
Godsgifttomankind
Jan 19th, 2005, 2:10 PM
Hello Dutchie and I do thank-you for such a lengthy reply,
You end by saying I won't grasp much of what you're saying because I haven't come of age myself.
I apologize if anything that I have written has offended you, for I truly have the utmost respect for you. This is a very challenging issue and it was not my intention to suggest that you had not lived a life of experiences or failed to attain to great understandings on many issues, I was only suggesting that on this particular issue that there are many things that all of us need to come to a greater understanding on. In fact the way that I stated it was to emphasize the fact that it is totally within you ability to fully understand this subject based upon the greater evidence that will be presented.
The process you describe in the first paragraph - the child not understanding the care of the parent and responding in an almost hateful way is called puberty. We all went through that phase (at least I hope you did too :wink:) and - without getting too clinical about it - it's all about hormones, nothing else. Once we've outgrown that problem and all of the pimples are gone, we cautiously can start addressing ourselves as being "adults". There's no deity involved in this process, it's a natural thing and most mammals are affected.
I agree with you totally on this aspect, scientific examination can explain every detail of this process; right down to explaining the chemicals that cause such adverse reactions to authority. Interestingly enough many people still prefer to blame this on the devil and ignore completely the scientific evidence. A wise person like yourself has no need to take literally this symbolism for you have understanding of hormones etc.
Seeing God as a father/mother figure has appealed mankind since the dawn of time. We all regard the parental figure as one that serves as a role model for the rest of our lives and most of us will treat their parents with the respect they (might) deserve.
Symbolic language has always been used to explain the attributes of God, it is mankind that chooses to not recognize the symbolism and take things literally, there by taking a small part of the greater being and bringing it down to a limited status.
Now let's leave the metaphor for what it is. It was with a sigh from slight despair I read the paragraph before the last. Man, the sheer arrogance of it!! You really think you have all the wisdom in the world at your disposal, don't you? You address me with an unbelievable level of patronizing disdain, it baffles the mind:
I believe that we all have all of the wisdom in the world at our disposal and fail to examine it for our own varying reasons. You see it as being arrogant that I am so sure that what I understand is the truth and if this is arrogance then I can not be sorry for have such surety of understanding. There is one important part that I must say while I do have surety of understanding, I would never be so arrogant to say that I understand everything only that we all have the ability to understand everything all in it's due course.
Did you really think I lack the intelligence to understand what you are saying?! I was brought up in a baptist family. My knowledge of scriptures exceeds that of most others on this board, I assure you. I also assure you not a single dogma discussed on this board is unfamiliar to me. I became a spiritual adult long ago. The difference between you and me is that I REALLY decided to take responsibility into my own hands, and leave the "family nest" altogether.
I recognize the great achievements that you have made in your life and do not for one moment question your abilities, if there was any question in my mind to your abilities or your intelligence I would not spend valuable time in discussion with you, learning from your experience and sharing mine. My time here is just as much about my learning as it is about being able to share with others.
To me God is not a parent. God is hydrogen, the very fabric of the universe. When you take a look at the world and all of its religions from a universal point of view there is no escape possible from understanding the fact that we're on a petty world with petty ideas of how our petty lives are governed by some petty deity that needs to be worshipped for all time. A deity that wants a bloody sacrifice; a deity that threatens its own creation with eternal damnation and torture when it won't worship him - and it won't discriminate for age at all... There goes your metaphor.
Wow that is quite a statement and I have to agree with you on every point that you made. A parent is one way of understanding the actions of God but this is not God for God is far more complex than we can ever truly understand. Religion does present a very petty view of the world around us and it is through the careful examination based upon scientific evidence that we begin to form a much greater understanding of the world around us.
God has never threatened creation to eternal damnation that is the teachings of men that have twisted the word of God for their own selfish desires, enslaving people in ignorance and controlling them so that they might have power and authority. Man was given the ability to make their own choices and to overcome oppression of every kind, as such is the example that you have mentioned in breaking free of the 'family nest'. You have pushed yourself not to follow blindly after things that do not make sense to you as each person should.
To return the arrogance in a tuned down version: I do expect you to understand my words. At least the essence of it. I don't expect you to come to terms with its implications. That would be asking too much as you so obviously are in deep need of an ideology that will help you through your days. Please don't hate me for stating I feel freed from the bonds of religious slavery I was tied up with for most of my youth. I wish you well with yours.
I do wish to thank-you for your concern of my welfare and I do understand exactly what you are saying for I recognize completely the slavery that you are speaking of. I can not say that I have had the same experience because I was not born into a family of religion like my mother was, who had already broken the religious bonds and raised me to think for my self and question everything that is told to me. My education was in the field of science and it is through the gifts of intellect and reason that I have been able to come to the clear understanding that I have today. Having gained these experiences and recognition of the slavery that you have spoken of I am able to share a very unique but growing perspective of the world around us. This is not something that is limited to me and my group but is confirmed by every individual that examines the evidence as being understood by every man woman and child from their infancy. This is quite a bold statement and would be taken by most as being arrogant on my part but it has little to do with me, it is the evidence that God has given of His existence and while after years of diligent study , I have a long ways to go in grasping just a small part of it but this I can say from everything that I have search out and understood there is not one piece of evidence that does not fit with the whole.
You end by saying I won't grasp much of what you're saying because I haven't come of age myself.
I apologize if anything that I have written has offended you, for I truly have the utmost respect for you. This is a very challenging issue and it was not my intention to suggest that you had not lived a life of experiences or failed to attain to great understandings on many issues, I was only suggesting that on this particular issue that there are many things that all of us need to come to a greater understanding on. In fact the way that I stated it was to emphasize the fact that it is totally within you ability to fully understand this subject based upon the greater evidence that will be presented.
The process you describe in the first paragraph - the child not understanding the care of the parent and responding in an almost hateful way is called puberty. We all went through that phase (at least I hope you did too :wink:) and - without getting too clinical about it - it's all about hormones, nothing else. Once we've outgrown that problem and all of the pimples are gone, we cautiously can start addressing ourselves as being "adults". There's no deity involved in this process, it's a natural thing and most mammals are affected.
I agree with you totally on this aspect, scientific examination can explain every detail of this process; right down to explaining the chemicals that cause such adverse reactions to authority. Interestingly enough many people still prefer to blame this on the devil and ignore completely the scientific evidence. A wise person like yourself has no need to take literally this symbolism for you have understanding of hormones etc.
Seeing God as a father/mother figure has appealed mankind since the dawn of time. We all regard the parental figure as one that serves as a role model for the rest of our lives and most of us will treat their parents with the respect they (might) deserve.
Symbolic language has always been used to explain the attributes of God, it is mankind that chooses to not recognize the symbolism and take things literally, there by taking a small part of the greater being and bringing it down to a limited status.
Now let's leave the metaphor for what it is. It was with a sigh from slight despair I read the paragraph before the last. Man, the sheer arrogance of it!! You really think you have all the wisdom in the world at your disposal, don't you? You address me with an unbelievable level of patronizing disdain, it baffles the mind:
I believe that we all have all of the wisdom in the world at our disposal and fail to examine it for our own varying reasons. You see it as being arrogant that I am so sure that what I understand is the truth and if this is arrogance then I can not be sorry for have such surety of understanding. There is one important part that I must say while I do have surety of understanding, I would never be so arrogant to say that I understand everything only that we all have the ability to understand everything all in it's due course.
Did you really think I lack the intelligence to understand what you are saying?! I was brought up in a baptist family. My knowledge of scriptures exceeds that of most others on this board, I assure you. I also assure you not a single dogma discussed on this board is unfamiliar to me. I became a spiritual adult long ago. The difference between you and me is that I REALLY decided to take responsibility into my own hands, and leave the "family nest" altogether.
I recognize the great achievements that you have made in your life and do not for one moment question your abilities, if there was any question in my mind to your abilities or your intelligence I would not spend valuable time in discussion with you, learning from your experience and sharing mine. My time here is just as much about my learning as it is about being able to share with others.
To me God is not a parent. God is hydrogen, the very fabric of the universe. When you take a look at the world and all of its religions from a universal point of view there is no escape possible from understanding the fact that we're on a petty world with petty ideas of how our petty lives are governed by some petty deity that needs to be worshipped for all time. A deity that wants a bloody sacrifice; a deity that threatens its own creation with eternal damnation and torture when it won't worship him - and it won't discriminate for age at all... There goes your metaphor.
Wow that is quite a statement and I have to agree with you on every point that you made. A parent is one way of understanding the actions of God but this is not God for God is far more complex than we can ever truly understand. Religion does present a very petty view of the world around us and it is through the careful examination based upon scientific evidence that we begin to form a much greater understanding of the world around us.
God has never threatened creation to eternal damnation that is the teachings of men that have twisted the word of God for their own selfish desires, enslaving people in ignorance and controlling them so that they might have power and authority. Man was given the ability to make their own choices and to overcome oppression of every kind, as such is the example that you have mentioned in breaking free of the 'family nest'. You have pushed yourself not to follow blindly after things that do not make sense to you as each person should.
To return the arrogance in a tuned down version: I do expect you to understand my words. At least the essence of it. I don't expect you to come to terms with its implications. That would be asking too much as you so obviously are in deep need of an ideology that will help you through your days. Please don't hate me for stating I feel freed from the bonds of religious slavery I was tied up with for most of my youth. I wish you well with yours.
I do wish to thank-you for your concern of my welfare and I do understand exactly what you are saying for I recognize completely the slavery that you are speaking of. I can not say that I have had the same experience because I was not born into a family of religion like my mother was, who had already broken the religious bonds and raised me to think for my self and question everything that is told to me. My education was in the field of science and it is through the gifts of intellect and reason that I have been able to come to the clear understanding that I have today. Having gained these experiences and recognition of the slavery that you have spoken of I am able to share a very unique but growing perspective of the world around us. This is not something that is limited to me and my group but is confirmed by every individual that examines the evidence as being understood by every man woman and child from their infancy. This is quite a bold statement and would be taken by most as being arrogant on my part but it has little to do with me, it is the evidence that God has given of His existence and while after years of diligent study , I have a long ways to go in grasping just a small part of it but this I can say from everything that I have search out and understood there is not one piece of evidence that does not fit with the whole.
Godsgifttomankind
Jan 19th, 2005, 3:55 PM
Hello Eyekwah and thank-you for your response,
if he has given us all the things that we need to fend for our selves i think he has given us them in the form of guns and swords he did not give the survivors of the tsunami very much help the richer copuntrys gave it in the form of moslty money yes
Every thing that we have has been given to us and can be used for both good and for bad. As Dutchie has shown so well children are given fathers so that they can dive in and protect them in times of trouble, just as neighbors and friends can come to the aid of people in times of need, this is our responsiblity and show our care and compassion. If countries did nothing after this disaster they would be labeled as ungodly and selfish.
they and the question is acctualy where is god no body has known ever have you has your family has any one throught history knowen wher he is if you where to ask me i am all with the theory that humans made god up becuase humans need love we need somthing to look forward to we need a perfect father figure dont if you think on it god is a perfect hero but all our heros av weeknesses has our god have any weeknesses if he has is he the one we should worship
God can not be seen with the physical eye but is perceived by the inner eye, just as many things that exist around us can only be recognized by their effects. The wind is a good example can you actually see the wind? No but you can feel it's effect. God has been seen by all the peoples of the past and of the present, it is only a matter of coming to terms with how to recognize what it is that you have seen. Everyone has felt the effects of gravity and yet not everyone recognizes how it is brought about. I can explain many things to you but you will not necessarily understand them until you have had the same experience and then it will be more easily understood. Thus God is right before your very eyes and yet the only way that you can ever hope to recognize Him is if someone is able to explain in language that is familiar to you the process of recognition. Religious language is very limiting and yet science provides for us all of the evidence that we need, clear results that become as visible as electrical energy when you have the right medium for illumination. Can you see electrical energy without a light bulb?
[/QUOTE]clan cameron: Chlanna nan con thigibh a so's gheib sibh feail[/QUOTE]
Children are the seeds that we plant or the weeds that we release. Clan glorious
God works in strange and mysterious ways that the finite human mind cant understand.
This would be a good saying but it limits the ability of God to explain the things that are done and thus I would amend it to say 'God works in wonderful and amazing ways that man can only understand when god makes it understood.'
If 6 million jews were not murdered in ww2 would they have been so adament to have their own country? Would the world have agreed? Maybe it all happened to fulfill biblical prophecy.
One day you will have the opportunity to communicate with one of those people and ask them if they begrudge one moment of what they went through to be given the opportunity to end up in the arms of God. It has had such an effect on mankind as a whole that there is not one person that does not think about this event and desire that events like this never happen again, this is the first of many steps in eliminating intolerance in the world of humanity and speaks more of the corruption that exists within each one of us that it takes events like these before we are willing to stand up and say enough is enough.
As for the tsunami, this may be a far fetched idea, but earthquake and natural disasters are going to happen un the end times, it may be later than we think. Also, this may be very far fetched but does God like christians ? They believe in his son so he must. The jews are Gods chosen people. Who hates christians and most of all hates Jews?????........Muslims, followers of Islam. What country in the world has the most muslims in it? What is the most populous muslim country in the world? Indonesia.
Why does the earth need to be shaken?
The only reason that someone would need to be shaken is because they are asleep and it is important that they wake up and get on with what needs to be done. The real question is who is sleeping and what is the important things that need to be done? Is it time that people were given control over their own lives and that tyranny comes to an end? You look at it from the point of who God hates but I think that it has more to do with who God loves and if people fail to put an end to tyranny and abuse then God is left to destroy the corruption and create the opportunity for better societies to emerge out of the rubble.
People debate about Sodom and Gomorrah and yet people fail to realise that out of the ashes of those civilization Abraham created the bases of the great civilizations that we recognize today. Without the destruction and end to corruption there is no possibility for advancement for it is corruption that impedes the advancement of humankind and creates a stumbling block for those that would work the hardest for it's well being. Every struggle that mankind has faced has put an end to tyranny of one type or another and created the opportunity for the people that have survived to progress for the advancement of humanity.
The struggles in the middle east how ever dire and horrific now and in time to come when the final events cease there will arise from the ashes a civilization that no man in this day could begin to dream about. The stepping stones of a free and just society are beginning to be laid, while a system of tyranny and corruption is fighting to retain power but must see its demise.
if he has given us all the things that we need to fend for our selves i think he has given us them in the form of guns and swords he did not give the survivors of the tsunami very much help the richer copuntrys gave it in the form of moslty money yes
Every thing that we have has been given to us and can be used for both good and for bad. As Dutchie has shown so well children are given fathers so that they can dive in and protect them in times of trouble, just as neighbors and friends can come to the aid of people in times of need, this is our responsiblity and show our care and compassion. If countries did nothing after this disaster they would be labeled as ungodly and selfish.
they and the question is acctualy where is god no body has known ever have you has your family has any one throught history knowen wher he is if you where to ask me i am all with the theory that humans made god up becuase humans need love we need somthing to look forward to we need a perfect father figure dont if you think on it god is a perfect hero but all our heros av weeknesses has our god have any weeknesses if he has is he the one we should worship
God can not be seen with the physical eye but is perceived by the inner eye, just as many things that exist around us can only be recognized by their effects. The wind is a good example can you actually see the wind? No but you can feel it's effect. God has been seen by all the peoples of the past and of the present, it is only a matter of coming to terms with how to recognize what it is that you have seen. Everyone has felt the effects of gravity and yet not everyone recognizes how it is brought about. I can explain many things to you but you will not necessarily understand them until you have had the same experience and then it will be more easily understood. Thus God is right before your very eyes and yet the only way that you can ever hope to recognize Him is if someone is able to explain in language that is familiar to you the process of recognition. Religious language is very limiting and yet science provides for us all of the evidence that we need, clear results that become as visible as electrical energy when you have the right medium for illumination. Can you see electrical energy without a light bulb?
[/QUOTE]clan cameron: Chlanna nan con thigibh a so's gheib sibh feail[/QUOTE]
Children are the seeds that we plant or the weeds that we release. Clan glorious
God works in strange and mysterious ways that the finite human mind cant understand.
This would be a good saying but it limits the ability of God to explain the things that are done and thus I would amend it to say 'God works in wonderful and amazing ways that man can only understand when god makes it understood.'
If 6 million jews were not murdered in ww2 would they have been so adament to have their own country? Would the world have agreed? Maybe it all happened to fulfill biblical prophecy.
One day you will have the opportunity to communicate with one of those people and ask them if they begrudge one moment of what they went through to be given the opportunity to end up in the arms of God. It has had such an effect on mankind as a whole that there is not one person that does not think about this event and desire that events like this never happen again, this is the first of many steps in eliminating intolerance in the world of humanity and speaks more of the corruption that exists within each one of us that it takes events like these before we are willing to stand up and say enough is enough.
As for the tsunami, this may be a far fetched idea, but earthquake and natural disasters are going to happen un the end times, it may be later than we think. Also, this may be very far fetched but does God like christians ? They believe in his son so he must. The jews are Gods chosen people. Who hates christians and most of all hates Jews?????........Muslims, followers of Islam. What country in the world has the most muslims in it? What is the most populous muslim country in the world? Indonesia.
Why does the earth need to be shaken?
The only reason that someone would need to be shaken is because they are asleep and it is important that they wake up and get on with what needs to be done. The real question is who is sleeping and what is the important things that need to be done? Is it time that people were given control over their own lives and that tyranny comes to an end? You look at it from the point of who God hates but I think that it has more to do with who God loves and if people fail to put an end to tyranny and abuse then God is left to destroy the corruption and create the opportunity for better societies to emerge out of the rubble.
People debate about Sodom and Gomorrah and yet people fail to realise that out of the ashes of those civilization Abraham created the bases of the great civilizations that we recognize today. Without the destruction and end to corruption there is no possibility for advancement for it is corruption that impedes the advancement of humankind and creates a stumbling block for those that would work the hardest for it's well being. Every struggle that mankind has faced has put an end to tyranny of one type or another and created the opportunity for the people that have survived to progress for the advancement of humanity.
The struggles in the middle east how ever dire and horrific now and in time to come when the final events cease there will arise from the ashes a civilization that no man in this day could begin to dream about. The stepping stones of a free and just society are beginning to be laid, while a system of tyranny and corruption is fighting to retain power but must see its demise.
dutchie
Jan 20th, 2005, 5:57 AM
...A wise person like yourself has no need to take literally this symbolism for you have understanding of hormones etc....
Give me a break....
Symbolic language has always been used to explain the attributes of God, it is mankind that chooses to not recognize the symbolism and take things literally, there by taking a small part of the greater being and bringing it down to a limited status.
In my mind, taking things literally is - assuming understanding of the subject at hand - is always better than chasing imagery. Symbolism has always been intended to educate the ignorant.
I believe that we all have all of the wisdom in the world at our disposal and fail to examine it for our own varying reasons.
Stupidity being #1 there. Disinterest a good #2. However, all the wisdom in the world is just there: in the world. We absorb what we need or what interests us.
You see it as being arrogant that I am so sure that what I understand is the truth and if this is arrogance then I can not be sorry for have such surety of understanding. There is one important part that I must say while I do have surety of understanding, I would never be so arrogant to say that I understand everything only that we all have the ability to understand everything all in it's due course.
There ya go again... you mix up the "truth" with "surety of understanding". Understanding something doesn't make it truth. Arrogance is boasting your knowledge against the alleged lack of it with the person you address. Comforting someone with the thought that eventually knowledge will come, only makes it worse...
I recognize the great achievements that you have made in your life and do not for one moment question your abilities, if there was any question in my mind to your abilities or your intelligence I would not spend valuable time in discussion with you, learning from your experience and sharing mine.
Give me a break already...
Wow that is quite a statement and I have to agree with you on every point that you made. A parent is one way of understanding the actions of God but this is not God for God is far more complex than we can ever truly understand. Religion does present a very petty view of the world around us and it is through the careful examination based upon scientific evidence that we begin to form a much greater understanding of the world around us.
If you agree with me on every point you made, you must agree with the most important point I made: God is hydrogen. Hydrogen is the kickstarting agent in fusion to give birth to all other elements, a process we constantly can witness happening in our own universe.
http://www.universetoday.com/am/publish/leftover_big_bang.html?1412005
http://www.universetoday.com/am/uploads/2005-0114dwarf-lg.jpg (a cloud of primordial hydrogen around galaxy UGC 5288)
This is my idea of God: if God is hydrogen, the basis of all matter in the universe, then ultimately we are actually made of the essence of God ourselves. Somewhere in the history of the universe there came a moment when God gave us life, by providing us with the basic building blocks we need to actually exist - its own matter. In this lies an eternal beauty, don't you think?
So God is not as complex as you say at all - God is actually atomic simplicity in its purest form. We do not need to grasp God's actions - there aren't any. We are all made of God, we ARE God. God was there at the beginning of time itself, and God will exist until the last star in the universe dies out - when all need for time and life itself will cease to be. Now THAT is a comforting thought.
God has never threatened creation to eternal damnation that is the teachings of men that have twisted the word of God for their own selfish desires, enslaving people in ignorance and controlling them so that they might have power and authority. Man was given the ability to make their own choices and to overcome oppression of every kind, as such is the example that you have mentioned in breaking free of the 'family nest'. You have pushed yourself not to follow blindly after things that do not make sense to you as each person should.
I am glad you feel that way.
I do wish to thank-you for your concern of my welfare and I do understand exactly what you are saying for I recognize completely the slavery that you are speaking of. I can not say that I have had the same experience because I was not born into a family of religion like my mother was, who had already broken the religious bonds and raised me to think for my self and question everything that is told to me. My education was in the field of science and it is through the gifts of intellect and reason that I have been able to come to the clear understanding that I have today. Having gained these experiences and recognition of the slavery that you have spoken of I am able to share a very unique but growing perspective of the world around us. This is not something that is limited to me and my group but is confirmed by every individual that examines the evidence as being understood by every man woman and child from their infancy. This is quite a bold statement and would be taken by most as being arrogant on my part but it has little to do with me, it is the evidence that God has given of His existence and while after years of diligent study , I have a long ways to go in grasping just a small part of it but this I can say from everything that I have search out and understood there is not one piece of evidence that does not fit with the whole.
The evidence is all around you. God IS the universe - God IS us. A deity that needs to be worshipped, that needs sacrifice - clearly all of this was man made, as all religions are carbon copied from earlier, now extinct trains of thought. From your words I get the feeling that you (and your group) are merrily seeking knowledge and understanding - what a waste of (divine :wink:) energy, when the answer you seek was staring you in the face all along - even when you look into a mirror.
Give me a break....
Symbolic language has always been used to explain the attributes of God, it is mankind that chooses to not recognize the symbolism and take things literally, there by taking a small part of the greater being and bringing it down to a limited status.
In my mind, taking things literally is - assuming understanding of the subject at hand - is always better than chasing imagery. Symbolism has always been intended to educate the ignorant.
I believe that we all have all of the wisdom in the world at our disposal and fail to examine it for our own varying reasons.
Stupidity being #1 there. Disinterest a good #2. However, all the wisdom in the world is just there: in the world. We absorb what we need or what interests us.
You see it as being arrogant that I am so sure that what I understand is the truth and if this is arrogance then I can not be sorry for have such surety of understanding. There is one important part that I must say while I do have surety of understanding, I would never be so arrogant to say that I understand everything only that we all have the ability to understand everything all in it's due course.
There ya go again... you mix up the "truth" with "surety of understanding". Understanding something doesn't make it truth. Arrogance is boasting your knowledge against the alleged lack of it with the person you address. Comforting someone with the thought that eventually knowledge will come, only makes it worse...
I recognize the great achievements that you have made in your life and do not for one moment question your abilities, if there was any question in my mind to your abilities or your intelligence I would not spend valuable time in discussion with you, learning from your experience and sharing mine.
Give me a break already...
Wow that is quite a statement and I have to agree with you on every point that you made. A parent is one way of understanding the actions of God but this is not God for God is far more complex than we can ever truly understand. Religion does present a very petty view of the world around us and it is through the careful examination based upon scientific evidence that we begin to form a much greater understanding of the world around us.
If you agree with me on every point you made, you must agree with the most important point I made: God is hydrogen. Hydrogen is the kickstarting agent in fusion to give birth to all other elements, a process we constantly can witness happening in our own universe.
http://www.universetoday.com/am/publish/leftover_big_bang.html?1412005
http://www.universetoday.com/am/uploads/2005-0114dwarf-lg.jpg (a cloud of primordial hydrogen around galaxy UGC 5288)
This is my idea of God: if God is hydrogen, the basis of all matter in the universe, then ultimately we are actually made of the essence of God ourselves. Somewhere in the history of the universe there came a moment when God gave us life, by providing us with the basic building blocks we need to actually exist - its own matter. In this lies an eternal beauty, don't you think?
So God is not as complex as you say at all - God is actually atomic simplicity in its purest form. We do not need to grasp God's actions - there aren't any. We are all made of God, we ARE God. God was there at the beginning of time itself, and God will exist until the last star in the universe dies out - when all need for time and life itself will cease to be. Now THAT is a comforting thought.
God has never threatened creation to eternal damnation that is the teachings of men that have twisted the word of God for their own selfish desires, enslaving people in ignorance and controlling them so that they might have power and authority. Man was given the ability to make their own choices and to overcome oppression of every kind, as such is the example that you have mentioned in breaking free of the 'family nest'. You have pushed yourself not to follow blindly after things that do not make sense to you as each person should.
I am glad you feel that way.
I do wish to thank-you for your concern of my welfare and I do understand exactly what you are saying for I recognize completely the slavery that you are speaking of. I can not say that I have had the same experience because I was not born into a family of religion like my mother was, who had already broken the religious bonds and raised me to think for my self and question everything that is told to me. My education was in the field of science and it is through the gifts of intellect and reason that I have been able to come to the clear understanding that I have today. Having gained these experiences and recognition of the slavery that you have spoken of I am able to share a very unique but growing perspective of the world around us. This is not something that is limited to me and my group but is confirmed by every individual that examines the evidence as being understood by every man woman and child from their infancy. This is quite a bold statement and would be taken by most as being arrogant on my part but it has little to do with me, it is the evidence that God has given of His existence and while after years of diligent study , I have a long ways to go in grasping just a small part of it but this I can say from everything that I have search out and understood there is not one piece of evidence that does not fit with the whole.
The evidence is all around you. God IS the universe - God IS us. A deity that needs to be worshipped, that needs sacrifice - clearly all of this was man made, as all religions are carbon copied from earlier, now extinct trains of thought. From your words I get the feeling that you (and your group) are merrily seeking knowledge and understanding - what a waste of (divine :wink:) energy, when the answer you seek was staring you in the face all along - even when you look into a mirror.
Godsgifttomankind
Jan 20th, 2005, 2:13 PM
There ya go again... you mix up the "truth" with "surety of understanding". Understanding something doesn't make it truth. Arrogance is boasting your knowledge against the alleged lack of it with the person you address. Comforting someone with the thought that eventually knowledge will come, only makes it worse...
Points taken, truth is a loaded word and has been so abused in some ways it is better not used. In order for this exchange to be considered arrogant on my part it would have to fit the definition of arrogant which would have to include myself having contempt for the words that you present. I believe that I have done my best to show that I value your opinion and agree with many of the things that you say while at the same time remaining steadfast that evidence and examination will eventually produce the answer which I have stated. This is a complex equation that contains one final resultant, I am quite willing to listen to your explanation for conformation of the result but are you willing to examine my result or are you going to hold it in contempt?
If you agree with me on every point you made, you must agree with the most important point I made: God is hydrogen. Hydrogen is the kickstarting agent in fusion to give birth to all other elements, a process we constantly can witness happening in our own universe.
This is my idea of God: if God is hydrogen, the basis of all matter in the universe, then ultimately we are actually made of the essence of God ourselves. Somewhere in the history of the universe there came a moment when God gave us life, by providing us with the basic building blocks we need to actually exist - its own matter. In this lies an eternal beauty, don't you think?
So God is not as complex as you say at all - God is actually atomic simplicity in its purest form. We do not need to grasp God's actions - there aren't any. We are all made of God, we ARE God. God was there at the beginning of time itself, and God will exist until the last star in the universe dies out - when all need for time and life itself will cease to be. Now THAT is a comforting thought.
This is truly an excellent perspective of God and the world around and I would like to expound upon this a little more. Hydrogen is the simplest form in the atomic structure of our universe from which every other atom forms it's existence. Within this hydrogen atom we find the storage of complex energy arranged in a simplistic field of orbit. The hydrogen atom is a galaxy unto itself with a nucleus or central star and it's circling electrons. Every electron has a 'geocentrical' orbit based upon it's energy and it is this energy that is the basic building block of the atom. Thus the simplest form of God is in fact energy or as you so well stated that god is energy.
The first law of thermodynamics is the conservation of energy and since on the grand scale of things energy can be neither lost nor gained. God will always exist, only the different forms will change.
The evidence is all around you. God IS the universe - God IS us. A deity that needs to be worshipped, that needs sacrifice - clearly all of this was man made, as all religions are carbon copied from earlier, now extinct trains of thought. From your words I get the feeling that you (and your group) are merrily seeking knowledge and understanding - what a waste of (divine :wink:) energy, when the answer you seek was staring you in the face all along - even when you look into a mirror.
Since we have determined that God is this great energy force, is it necessary for us to do all of these things you have mentioned such as worship and sacrifice? The greater question is do we have a choice or does our very make up compel us to act?
I want to use a very visible example to explain our own situation and that is the example of plants. A plant has very little control over it's own existence, it can not choose the place were it is at or what it has for nutrients, these are all decided by outside forces. The only actions that a plant has control of are to do with the direction of it's roots and leaves and these actions are based upon it's very existence, for if it must plant it's roots in the soil to get nutrients and it must turn it's leaves toward the sun in order to use the energy of the sun to preform photosynthesis and thereby achieve it's growth.
The sun is a visible example of a much larger invisible energy source and our first necessity is to understand how that energy source works, once we understand how it works it is a matter of tapping into it or in the case of plants turning our self towards it, it could be compared to going to the library. If you sit at home you remain in the same state of understanding but when you pick yourself up and go to the library and read a book you gain a wealth of understanding. This understanding and knowledge comes from a place were it is stored and released as mankind is able to deal with it and it is revealed or discovered by those that search diligently. It is the resultant of the amount of effort that is put forth and the attraction that one emits. Thus in order for us as individuals to gain the energy that we need to increase our 'geocentrical' orbit around the nucleus(God), we also must place ourselves in a position of absorption with our faces turned toward the object of our creation and adoration. This is called worship but in fact it is life itself when understood from the example that I have given.
Sacrifices are in the same way used to explain what it is that a person must be willing to do in order to overcome the natural forces that exist within our very being that stop us from immediately turning and connecting to this energy. It is a choice that we must make of our own will and recognition and can not be forced upon us. The very make-up of our being is such that it keeps us from doing the very things that we know are right and just and it is only through an exercise of great force and desire that we are able to do what is right and just. This is the education process which little by little gives us the ability to overcome our environment and birth situation to attain unto a greater point of existence. This is the human evolutionary process in it's greatest form and yet most would ignore it for an understanding that has no purpose and places an end where there is no end. The world around us is example after example of cyclical processes and yet we choose as our example a linear understanding and fail to see the parallel to those people of the past that held a linear(flat) understanding of the earth. Existence is not just one dimensional and all of the evidence is clear about that when you examine it.
Points taken, truth is a loaded word and has been so abused in some ways it is better not used. In order for this exchange to be considered arrogant on my part it would have to fit the definition of arrogant which would have to include myself having contempt for the words that you present. I believe that I have done my best to show that I value your opinion and agree with many of the things that you say while at the same time remaining steadfast that evidence and examination will eventually produce the answer which I have stated. This is a complex equation that contains one final resultant, I am quite willing to listen to your explanation for conformation of the result but are you willing to examine my result or are you going to hold it in contempt?
If you agree with me on every point you made, you must agree with the most important point I made: God is hydrogen. Hydrogen is the kickstarting agent in fusion to give birth to all other elements, a process we constantly can witness happening in our own universe.
This is my idea of God: if God is hydrogen, the basis of all matter in the universe, then ultimately we are actually made of the essence of God ourselves. Somewhere in the history of the universe there came a moment when God gave us life, by providing us with the basic building blocks we need to actually exist - its own matter. In this lies an eternal beauty, don't you think?
So God is not as complex as you say at all - God is actually atomic simplicity in its purest form. We do not need to grasp God's actions - there aren't any. We are all made of God, we ARE God. God was there at the beginning of time itself, and God will exist until the last star in the universe dies out - when all need for time and life itself will cease to be. Now THAT is a comforting thought.
This is truly an excellent perspective of God and the world around and I would like to expound upon this a little more. Hydrogen is the simplest form in the atomic structure of our universe from which every other atom forms it's existence. Within this hydrogen atom we find the storage of complex energy arranged in a simplistic field of orbit. The hydrogen atom is a galaxy unto itself with a nucleus or central star and it's circling electrons. Every electron has a 'geocentrical' orbit based upon it's energy and it is this energy that is the basic building block of the atom. Thus the simplest form of God is in fact energy or as you so well stated that god is energy.
The first law of thermodynamics is the conservation of energy and since on the grand scale of things energy can be neither lost nor gained. God will always exist, only the different forms will change.
The evidence is all around you. God IS the universe - God IS us. A deity that needs to be worshipped, that needs sacrifice - clearly all of this was man made, as all religions are carbon copied from earlier, now extinct trains of thought. From your words I get the feeling that you (and your group) are merrily seeking knowledge and understanding - what a waste of (divine :wink:) energy, when the answer you seek was staring you in the face all along - even when you look into a mirror.
Since we have determined that God is this great energy force, is it necessary for us to do all of these things you have mentioned such as worship and sacrifice? The greater question is do we have a choice or does our very make up compel us to act?
I want to use a very visible example to explain our own situation and that is the example of plants. A plant has very little control over it's own existence, it can not choose the place were it is at or what it has for nutrients, these are all decided by outside forces. The only actions that a plant has control of are to do with the direction of it's roots and leaves and these actions are based upon it's very existence, for if it must plant it's roots in the soil to get nutrients and it must turn it's leaves toward the sun in order to use the energy of the sun to preform photosynthesis and thereby achieve it's growth.
The sun is a visible example of a much larger invisible energy source and our first necessity is to understand how that energy source works, once we understand how it works it is a matter of tapping into it or in the case of plants turning our self towards it, it could be compared to going to the library. If you sit at home you remain in the same state of understanding but when you pick yourself up and go to the library and read a book you gain a wealth of understanding. This understanding and knowledge comes from a place were it is stored and released as mankind is able to deal with it and it is revealed or discovered by those that search diligently. It is the resultant of the amount of effort that is put forth and the attraction that one emits. Thus in order for us as individuals to gain the energy that we need to increase our 'geocentrical' orbit around the nucleus(God), we also must place ourselves in a position of absorption with our faces turned toward the object of our creation and adoration. This is called worship but in fact it is life itself when understood from the example that I have given.
Sacrifices are in the same way used to explain what it is that a person must be willing to do in order to overcome the natural forces that exist within our very being that stop us from immediately turning and connecting to this energy. It is a choice that we must make of our own will and recognition and can not be forced upon us. The very make-up of our being is such that it keeps us from doing the very things that we know are right and just and it is only through an exercise of great force and desire that we are able to do what is right and just. This is the education process which little by little gives us the ability to overcome our environment and birth situation to attain unto a greater point of existence. This is the human evolutionary process in it's greatest form and yet most would ignore it for an understanding that has no purpose and places an end where there is no end. The world around us is example after example of cyclical processes and yet we choose as our example a linear understanding and fail to see the parallel to those people of the past that held a linear(flat) understanding of the earth. Existence is not just one dimensional and all of the evidence is clear about that when you examine it.
dutchie
Jan 21st, 2005, 3:43 AM
Points taken, truth is a loaded word and has been so abused in some ways it is better not used. In order for this exchange to be considered arrogant on my part it would have to fit the definition of arrogant which would have to include myself having contempt for the words that you present. I believe that I have done my best to show that I value your opinion and agree with many of the things that you say while at the same time remaining steadfast that evidence and examination will eventually produce the answer which I have stated. This is a complex equation that contains one final resultant, I am quite willing to listen to your explanation for conformation of the result but are you willing to examine my result or are you going to hold it in contempt?
I believe I have given ample evidence to show I do not hold your words in contempt, as you put it. I do think we're already on the path of mutual understanding - we might never reach the crossroads where agreement starts, but that is not my goal anyway; I certainly hope it isn't yours either, because then I would feel compelled to end this conversation quite drastically.
This is truly an excellent perspective of God and the world around and I would like to expound upon this a little more. Hydrogen is the simplest form in the atomic structure of our universe from which every other atom forms it's existence. Within this hydrogen atom we find the storage of complex energy arranged in a simplistic field of orbit. The hydrogen atom is a galaxy unto itself with a nucleus or central star and it's circling electrons. Every electron has a 'geocentrical' orbit based upon it's energy and it is this energy that is the basic building block of the atom. Thus the simplest form of God is in fact energy or as you so well stated that god is energy.
I believe there is only a single proton and one electron in the H atom.. Quantum mechanics tells us that its wave function prevents the electron from collapsing into an infinitely small orbit with an infinite negative energy. Never mind that, in essence we're in agreement so far.
The first law of thermodynamics is the conservation of energy and since on the grand scale of things energy can be neither lost nor gained. God will always exist, only the different forms will change. Since we have determined that God is this great energy force, is it necessary for us to do all of these things you have mentioned such as worship and sacrifice?
Like I said: worship and sacrifice are man made ideas to bind people to a religion and are in essence unneeded and indeed unwanted aspects in the sense that they're the basics of emotional slavery. In other words: no!
The greater question is do we have a choice or does our very make up compel us to act?
Not sure about the direction you're taking me with this question - thus I fail to see the greater amplitude of it..
I want to use a very visible example to explain our own situation and that is the example of plants. A plant has very little control over it's own existence, it can not choose the place were it is at or what it has for nutrients, these are all decided by outside forces. The only actions that a plant has control of are to do with the direction of it's roots and leaves and these actions are based upon it's very existence, for if it must plant it's roots in the soil to get nutrients and it must turn it's leaves toward the sun in order to use the energy of the sun to preform photosynthesis and thereby achieve it's growth.
The sun is a visible example of a much larger invisible energy source and our first necessity is to understand how that energy source works, once we understand how it works it is a matter of tapping into it or in the case of plants turning our self towards it, it could be compared to going to the library. If you sit at home you remain in the same state of understanding but when you pick yourself up and go to the library and read a book you gain a wealth of understanding. This understanding and knowledge comes from a place were it is stored and released as mankind is able to deal with it and it is revealed or discovered by those that search diligently. It is the resultant of the amount of effort that is put forth and the attraction that one emits. Thus in order for us as individuals to gain the energy that we need to increase our 'geocentrical' orbit around the nucleus(God), we also must place ourselves in a position of absorption with our faces turned toward the object of our creation and adoration. This is called worship but in fact it is life itself when understood from the example that I have given.
At first I was under the impression that you tried to say that it's free choice that makes us different from other beings and objects, but reading further on, I understand where our roads part. You can not say goodbye to the notion that God is a "being", although you initially made a good effort in that direction. A being that "created" us; a being that is the subject of our "adoration". Hydrogen is not in need of worship or adoration. It is just there, like it always was and very probably always will be. Our energy is not dependant on us "tapping into" it - it's there already. The energy source is not external; we are MADE of it.
Of course you might argue that the intricacy of the universe has a measure of complexity far greater than ever could be expected to be accomplished by mere chance, so a "governing" force would be a bare necessity in order for this machinery to come into shape, but I reject that idea. The universal forces of nature consist of matter and energy, brought together in the undevisible entity we call space-time. These forces in itself contain no energy that we could describe as "intelligence" (although.. who knows really?) and we have never found a shred of evidence that would make us think otherwise. In fact, I find the idea that we ourselves are part of these universal forces very exciting and reassuring at the same time. There is no need for a heaven or hell, no need for an "afterlife". If I would think of any form of spirituality that could be mixed into this "clinical" universe, it would be this: - yes, energy is being conserved, thus the energy we call "mind" or "spirit" or even "soul" if you will, could also be conserved in a form we have no knowledge of. But this lies in the realm of philosophy and not in physics.
Sacrifices are in the same way used to explain what it is that a person must be willing to do in order to overcome the natural forces that exist within our very being that stop us from immediately turning and connecting to this energy. It is a choice that we must make of our own will and recognition and can not be forced upon us. The very make-up of our being is such that it keeps us from doing the very things that we know are right and just and it is only through an exercise of great force and desire that we are able to do what is right and just. This is the education process which little by little gives us the ability to overcome our environment and birth situation to attain unto a greater point of existence. This is the human evolutionary process in it's greatest form and yet most would ignore it for an understanding that has no purpose and places an end where there is no end. The world around us is example after example of cyclical processes and yet we choose as our example a linear understanding and fail to see the parallel to those people of the past that held a linear(flat) understanding of the earth. Existence is not just one dimensional and all of the evidence is clear about that when you examine it.
Again you astound me - and no contempt whatsoever is intended - by your deep need for an external and intelligent being that would be even the slightest bit interested in our petty attempts to please it through worship or sacrifice. What possible mutual gain, what symbiotic relationship could ever exist between us and a deity? What would it want from us? If it would really be an being of intelligence, powerful enough to create and govern all we see around us until the deepest corners of the cosmos - what possible interest could it have in our willingness to sacrifice and / or worship? What would it gain from that? In what way could we ever benefit from its need of sacrifice or worship?
I'm sure that you will take a minute to let this sink in and I do wonder if there really is not a single spark of logical thinking that would lead you seeing the simplicity behind my abundant display of verbal diarrhea.
I believe I have given ample evidence to show I do not hold your words in contempt, as you put it. I do think we're already on the path of mutual understanding - we might never reach the crossroads where agreement starts, but that is not my goal anyway; I certainly hope it isn't yours either, because then I would feel compelled to end this conversation quite drastically.
This is truly an excellent perspective of God and the world around and I would like to expound upon this a little more. Hydrogen is the simplest form in the atomic structure of our universe from which every other atom forms it's existence. Within this hydrogen atom we find the storage of complex energy arranged in a simplistic field of orbit. The hydrogen atom is a galaxy unto itself with a nucleus or central star and it's circling electrons. Every electron has a 'geocentrical' orbit based upon it's energy and it is this energy that is the basic building block of the atom. Thus the simplest form of God is in fact energy or as you so well stated that god is energy.
I believe there is only a single proton and one electron in the H atom.. Quantum mechanics tells us that its wave function prevents the electron from collapsing into an infinitely small orbit with an infinite negative energy. Never mind that, in essence we're in agreement so far.
The first law of thermodynamics is the conservation of energy and since on the grand scale of things energy can be neither lost nor gained. God will always exist, only the different forms will change. Since we have determined that God is this great energy force, is it necessary for us to do all of these things you have mentioned such as worship and sacrifice?
Like I said: worship and sacrifice are man made ideas to bind people to a religion and are in essence unneeded and indeed unwanted aspects in the sense that they're the basics of emotional slavery. In other words: no!
The greater question is do we have a choice or does our very make up compel us to act?
Not sure about the direction you're taking me with this question - thus I fail to see the greater amplitude of it..
I want to use a very visible example to explain our own situation and that is the example of plants. A plant has very little control over it's own existence, it can not choose the place were it is at or what it has for nutrients, these are all decided by outside forces. The only actions that a plant has control of are to do with the direction of it's roots and leaves and these actions are based upon it's very existence, for if it must plant it's roots in the soil to get nutrients and it must turn it's leaves toward the sun in order to use the energy of the sun to preform photosynthesis and thereby achieve it's growth.
The sun is a visible example of a much larger invisible energy source and our first necessity is to understand how that energy source works, once we understand how it works it is a matter of tapping into it or in the case of plants turning our self towards it, it could be compared to going to the library. If you sit at home you remain in the same state of understanding but when you pick yourself up and go to the library and read a book you gain a wealth of understanding. This understanding and knowledge comes from a place were it is stored and released as mankind is able to deal with it and it is revealed or discovered by those that search diligently. It is the resultant of the amount of effort that is put forth and the attraction that one emits. Thus in order for us as individuals to gain the energy that we need to increase our 'geocentrical' orbit around the nucleus(God), we also must place ourselves in a position of absorption with our faces turned toward the object of our creation and adoration. This is called worship but in fact it is life itself when understood from the example that I have given.
At first I was under the impression that you tried to say that it's free choice that makes us different from other beings and objects, but reading further on, I understand where our roads part. You can not say goodbye to the notion that God is a "being", although you initially made a good effort in that direction. A being that "created" us; a being that is the subject of our "adoration". Hydrogen is not in need of worship or adoration. It is just there, like it always was and very probably always will be. Our energy is not dependant on us "tapping into" it - it's there already. The energy source is not external; we are MADE of it.
Of course you might argue that the intricacy of the universe has a measure of complexity far greater than ever could be expected to be accomplished by mere chance, so a "governing" force would be a bare necessity in order for this machinery to come into shape, but I reject that idea. The universal forces of nature consist of matter and energy, brought together in the undevisible entity we call space-time. These forces in itself contain no energy that we could describe as "intelligence" (although.. who knows really?) and we have never found a shred of evidence that would make us think otherwise. In fact, I find the idea that we ourselves are part of these universal forces very exciting and reassuring at the same time. There is no need for a heaven or hell, no need for an "afterlife". If I would think of any form of spirituality that could be mixed into this "clinical" universe, it would be this: - yes, energy is being conserved, thus the energy we call "mind" or "spirit" or even "soul" if you will, could also be conserved in a form we have no knowledge of. But this lies in the realm of philosophy and not in physics.
Sacrifices are in the same way used to explain what it is that a person must be willing to do in order to overcome the natural forces that exist within our very being that stop us from immediately turning and connecting to this energy. It is a choice that we must make of our own will and recognition and can not be forced upon us. The very make-up of our being is such that it keeps us from doing the very things that we know are right and just and it is only through an exercise of great force and desire that we are able to do what is right and just. This is the education process which little by little gives us the ability to overcome our environment and birth situation to attain unto a greater point of existence. This is the human evolutionary process in it's greatest form and yet most would ignore it for an understanding that has no purpose and places an end where there is no end. The world around us is example after example of cyclical processes and yet we choose as our example a linear understanding and fail to see the parallel to those people of the past that held a linear(flat) understanding of the earth. Existence is not just one dimensional and all of the evidence is clear about that when you examine it.
Again you astound me - and no contempt whatsoever is intended - by your deep need for an external and intelligent being that would be even the slightest bit interested in our petty attempts to please it through worship or sacrifice. What possible mutual gain, what symbiotic relationship could ever exist between us and a deity? What would it want from us? If it would really be an being of intelligence, powerful enough to create and govern all we see around us until the deepest corners of the cosmos - what possible interest could it have in our willingness to sacrifice and / or worship? What would it gain from that? In what way could we ever benefit from its need of sacrifice or worship?
I'm sure that you will take a minute to let this sink in and I do wonder if there really is not a single spark of logical thinking that would lead you seeing the simplicity behind my abundant display of verbal diarrhea.
Godsgifttomankind
Jan 21st, 2005, 1:32 PM
I believe I have given ample evidence to show I do not hold your words in contempt, as you put it. I do think we're already on the path of mutual understanding - we might never reach the crossroads where agreement starts, but that is not my goal anyway; I certainly hope it isn't yours either, because then I would feel compelled to end this conversation quite drastically.
Dialog I believe is based up showing someone else the same respect that you want them to show you and is not about agreement as much as it is about challenging each other to examine our understandings to get a more indepth understanding of the world around us.
Like I said: worship and sacrifice are man made ideas to bind people to a religion and are in essence unneeded and indeed unwanted aspects in the sense that they're the basics of emotional slavery. In other words: no!
I agree with you on this point for there is great wisdom in these words.
Not sure about the direction you're taking me with this question - thus I fail to see the greater amplitude of it..
Every example of existence that we observe in the universe, like a planet, star, plant or animal is set in motion and governed by it's environment, any changes that occur can be calculated and understood through scientific means. Thus clear evidence shows us that a plant is compelled to turn it's leaves toward the sun to gain energy or that the gravity from the Sun compels the Earth to remain in orbit. How is it possible that everything else that exists is compelled to act in a certain way and yet most believe that such is not the case for mankind?
At first I was under the impression that you tried to say that it's free choice that makes us different from other beings and objects, but reading further on, I understand where our roads part. You can not say goodbye to the notion that God is a "being", although you initially made a good effort in that direction. A being that "created" us; a being that is the subject of our "adoration". Hydrogen is not in need of worship or adoration. It is just there, like it always was and very probably always will be. Our energy is not dependant on us "tapping into" it - it's there already. The energy source is not external; we are MADE of it.
It is exactly free choice that makes us different but that does not mean that our environment and the world around us does not compel us to act in certain ways or end up at a certain point, it only proves that we have the ability to overcome our environment.
We all use limited understanding to try and explain unlimited potential, while each in our own way can come to a certain understanding and familiarity, we can in no ways grasp the whole picture. All of the words that I use such as being, creation and adoration have much wider meaning to me than the average religious person. God does not need our adoration, nor do our parents need our adoration but this state of love is part of a healthy relationship, it allows for growth while hatred and animosity lead to decay. The world is made up of life which is growth and death which is decay. Accumulation of energy is growth and release of energy is decay, so in order for us to grow we need to accumulate energy and in order to accumulate energy we have to align our selves with the source of that energy, choosing not to align ourselves is something that we can measure or sense and directly affects our energy level. Life is a process by which we learn to align ourselves to the energy source and maintain the growth process there by overcoming death or the decay process. This is not saying that your body will not die and decay, only that your energy will continue growing after you have been freed from the physical body.
Of course you might argue that the intricacy of the universe has a measure of complexity far greater than ever could be expected to be accomplished by mere chance, so a "governing" force would be a bare necessity in order for this machinery to come into shape, but I reject that idea. The universal forces of nature consist of matter and energy, brought together in the undevisible entity we call space-time. These forces in itself contain no energy that we could describe as "intelligence" (although.. who knows really?) and we have never found a shred of evidence that would make us think otherwise. In fact, I find the idea that we ourselves are part of these universal forces very exciting and reassuring at the same time. There is no need for a heaven or hell, no need for an "afterlife". If I would think of any form of spirituality that could be mixed into this "clinical" universe, it would be this: - yes, energy is being conserved, thus the energy we call "mind" or "spirit" or even "soul" if you will, could also be conserved in a form we have no knowledge of. But this lies in the realm of philosophy and not in physics.
It is by understanding the composition and make up of the physical world and the application of physical laws that we can come to a greater understanding of things that are beyond the physical world. This what the new physics is all about gaining understanding of these things based upon physical changes that occur because of things beyond this physical realm. Scientist have yet to discover the evidence that you are speaking of and yet God has presented clear proofs and evidence to the fact, evidence that upon examination reveals the answers to all of these great mysteries. Evidence that Newton examined and yearned to fully grasp but was only allowed a small taste, evidence that Einstein sweated over and desired to dive deeper into. That evidence is still there for those that seek to find it pushing the world itself into greater and greater understanding. It is no accident that we are were we are in understanding and awareness, this time has been promised to mankind for more than six thousand years and we fail to see the forest for all the trees.
Again you astound me - and no contempt whatsoever is intended - by your deep need for an external and intelligent being that would be even the slightest bit interested in our petty attempts to please it through worship or sacrifice. What possible mutual gain, what symbiotic relationship could ever exist between us and a deity? What would it want from us? If it would really be an being of intelligence, powerful enough to create and govern all we see around us until the deepest corners of the cosmos - what possible interest could it have in our willingness to sacrifice and / or worship? What would it gain from that? In what way could we ever benefit from its need of sacrifice or worship?
I'm sure that you will take a minute to let this sink in and I do wonder if there really is not a single spark of logical thinking that would lead you seeing the simplicity behind my abundant display of verbal diarrhea.
Do you want your arm to worship your brain? Of course not, but it does require that your arm is obedient to the commands of your brain and that a synaptic connection exists so that when your eyes see something and the brain wants to pick it up that the arm is obedient and lowers so the fingers can grab it. The arm can never understand how the brain works, it's function is only to do what the brain tells it to do. We are that arm that is given free will but it is in our best interests to be obedient to the brain, our failure to be obedient has consequences and if we follow the example and the arm was to be lowered to pick up something to eat, then the consequences would be that the body including the arm would become weak because of not eating.
Dialog I believe is based up showing someone else the same respect that you want them to show you and is not about agreement as much as it is about challenging each other to examine our understandings to get a more indepth understanding of the world around us.
Like I said: worship and sacrifice are man made ideas to bind people to a religion and are in essence unneeded and indeed unwanted aspects in the sense that they're the basics of emotional slavery. In other words: no!
I agree with you on this point for there is great wisdom in these words.
Not sure about the direction you're taking me with this question - thus I fail to see the greater amplitude of it..
Every example of existence that we observe in the universe, like a planet, star, plant or animal is set in motion and governed by it's environment, any changes that occur can be calculated and understood through scientific means. Thus clear evidence shows us that a plant is compelled to turn it's leaves toward the sun to gain energy or that the gravity from the Sun compels the Earth to remain in orbit. How is it possible that everything else that exists is compelled to act in a certain way and yet most believe that such is not the case for mankind?
At first I was under the impression that you tried to say that it's free choice that makes us different from other beings and objects, but reading further on, I understand where our roads part. You can not say goodbye to the notion that God is a "being", although you initially made a good effort in that direction. A being that "created" us; a being that is the subject of our "adoration". Hydrogen is not in need of worship or adoration. It is just there, like it always was and very probably always will be. Our energy is not dependant on us "tapping into" it - it's there already. The energy source is not external; we are MADE of it.
It is exactly free choice that makes us different but that does not mean that our environment and the world around us does not compel us to act in certain ways or end up at a certain point, it only proves that we have the ability to overcome our environment.
We all use limited understanding to try and explain unlimited potential, while each in our own way can come to a certain understanding and familiarity, we can in no ways grasp the whole picture. All of the words that I use such as being, creation and adoration have much wider meaning to me than the average religious person. God does not need our adoration, nor do our parents need our adoration but this state of love is part of a healthy relationship, it allows for growth while hatred and animosity lead to decay. The world is made up of life which is growth and death which is decay. Accumulation of energy is growth and release of energy is decay, so in order for us to grow we need to accumulate energy and in order to accumulate energy we have to align our selves with the source of that energy, choosing not to align ourselves is something that we can measure or sense and directly affects our energy level. Life is a process by which we learn to align ourselves to the energy source and maintain the growth process there by overcoming death or the decay process. This is not saying that your body will not die and decay, only that your energy will continue growing after you have been freed from the physical body.
Of course you might argue that the intricacy of the universe has a measure of complexity far greater than ever could be expected to be accomplished by mere chance, so a "governing" force would be a bare necessity in order for this machinery to come into shape, but I reject that idea. The universal forces of nature consist of matter and energy, brought together in the undevisible entity we call space-time. These forces in itself contain no energy that we could describe as "intelligence" (although.. who knows really?) and we have never found a shred of evidence that would make us think otherwise. In fact, I find the idea that we ourselves are part of these universal forces very exciting and reassuring at the same time. There is no need for a heaven or hell, no need for an "afterlife". If I would think of any form of spirituality that could be mixed into this "clinical" universe, it would be this: - yes, energy is being conserved, thus the energy we call "mind" or "spirit" or even "soul" if you will, could also be conserved in a form we have no knowledge of. But this lies in the realm of philosophy and not in physics.
It is by understanding the composition and make up of the physical world and the application of physical laws that we can come to a greater understanding of things that are beyond the physical world. This what the new physics is all about gaining understanding of these things based upon physical changes that occur because of things beyond this physical realm. Scientist have yet to discover the evidence that you are speaking of and yet God has presented clear proofs and evidence to the fact, evidence that upon examination reveals the answers to all of these great mysteries. Evidence that Newton examined and yearned to fully grasp but was only allowed a small taste, evidence that Einstein sweated over and desired to dive deeper into. That evidence is still there for those that seek to find it pushing the world itself into greater and greater understanding. It is no accident that we are were we are in understanding and awareness, this time has been promised to mankind for more than six thousand years and we fail to see the forest for all the trees.
Again you astound me - and no contempt whatsoever is intended - by your deep need for an external and intelligent being that would be even the slightest bit interested in our petty attempts to please it through worship or sacrifice. What possible mutual gain, what symbiotic relationship could ever exist between us and a deity? What would it want from us? If it would really be an being of intelligence, powerful enough to create and govern all we see around us until the deepest corners of the cosmos - what possible interest could it have in our willingness to sacrifice and / or worship? What would it gain from that? In what way could we ever benefit from its need of sacrifice or worship?
I'm sure that you will take a minute to let this sink in and I do wonder if there really is not a single spark of logical thinking that would lead you seeing the simplicity behind my abundant display of verbal diarrhea.
Do you want your arm to worship your brain? Of course not, but it does require that your arm is obedient to the commands of your brain and that a synaptic connection exists so that when your eyes see something and the brain wants to pick it up that the arm is obedient and lowers so the fingers can grab it. The arm can never understand how the brain works, it's function is only to do what the brain tells it to do. We are that arm that is given free will but it is in our best interests to be obedient to the brain, our failure to be obedient has consequences and if we follow the example and the arm was to be lowered to pick up something to eat, then the consequences would be that the body including the arm would become weak because of not eating.
dutchie
Jan 24th, 2005, 6:59 AM
Every example of existence that we observe in the universe, like a planet, star, plant or animal is set in motion and governed by it's environment, any changes that occur can be calculated and understood through scientific means. Thus clear evidence shows us that a plant is compelled to turn it's leaves toward the sun to gain energy or that the gravity from the Sun compels the Earth to remain in orbit. How is it possible that everything else that exists is compelled to act in a certain way and yet most believe that such is not the case for mankind?
That's nonsense - every human must obey to the laws of physics. We live and die while being bound to the same restrictions that apply to any living being. We can be as educated as you want, once you take our source of simple oxygen away from us for more than 5 minutes, we just die. But you said "most" - so I take it you do not count yourself among those? I don't..
It is exactly free choice that makes us different but that does not mean that our environment and the world around us does not compel us to act in certain ways or end up at a certain point, it only proves that we have the ability to overcome our environment.
We all use limited understanding to try and explain unlimited potential, while each in our own way can come to a certain understanding and familiarity, we can in no ways grasp the whole picture. All of the words that I use such as being, creation and adoration have much wider meaning to me than the average religious person. God does not need our adoration, nor do our parents need our adoration but this state of love is part of a healthy relationship, it allows for growth while hatred and animosity lead to decay. The world is made up of life which is growth and death which is decay. Accumulation of energy is growth and release of energy is decay, so in order for us to grow we need to accumulate energy and in order to accumulate energy we have to align our selves with the source of that energy, choosing not to align ourselves is something that we can measure or sense and directly affects our energy level. Life is a process by which we learn to align ourselves to the energy source and maintain the growth process there by overcoming death or the decay process. This is not saying that your body will not die and decay, only that your energy will continue growing after you have been freed from the physical body.
You think adoration is a state of love that is vital to a healthy relationship. But how can there be a state of love between us and that which is already a part of us anyway?!? This is the part in my argumentation you decide to skip over and over again: God is NOT a being - we, the plants and seas, the planet, the solar system, the Galaxy, the universe even, are God. God is all around us, we are made of God. I would immediately agree to use any other term for it if that better describes what I truly mean (i.e. universal spirit, The Energy, whatever) but God has a nice ring to it - especially when taking the unexplainable and stuff like that and placing it all under the umbrella of energy, the latter being the composite of matter, gravity and space-time.
It is by understanding the composition and make up of the physical world and the application of physical laws that we can come to a greater understanding of things that are beyond the physical world. This what the new physics is all about gaining understanding of these things based upon physical changes that occur because of things beyond this physical realm. Scientist have yet to discover the evidence that you are speaking of and yet God has presented clear proofs and evidence to the fact, evidence that upon examination reveals the answers to all of these great mysteries. Evidence that Newton examined and yearned to fully grasp but was only allowed a small taste, evidence that Einstein sweated over and desired to dive deeper into. That evidence is still there for those that seek to find it pushing the world itself into greater and greater understanding. It is no accident that we are were we are in understanding and awareness, this time has been promised to mankind for more than six thousand years and we fail to see the forest for all the trees.Now you're cloaking your arguments in vagueness.. Not to be offensive, mind you - but "..the evidence is still there for those that seek to find it.." - ah, come on! What evidence is that?!? "God has presented clear proofs and evidence that upon examination reveals the answers to all of these mysteries..." Do me a favor, and share two or three of these answers with us!!
We started out great with our dialogue, but if you decide to take this into the realm of "secret knowledge" and "unrevealed answers", I'm off.
Do you want your arm to worship your brain? Of course not, but it does require that your arm is obedient to the commands of your brain and that a synaptic connection exists so that when your eyes see something and the brain wants to pick it up that the arm is obedient and lowers so the fingers can grab it. The arm can never understand how the brain works, it's function is only to do what the brain tells it to do. We are that arm that is given free will but it is in our best interests to be obedient to the brain, our failure to be obedient has consequences and if we follow the example and the arm was to be lowered to pick up something to eat, then the consequences would be that the body including the arm would become weak because of not eating.
Another metaphor. It explains perfectly what you fail to see - or don't want to see, I'm not sure which it is.. The arm, the brain and the eyes are all PART OF THE SAME ENTITY: the body. This in fact is the essence of my argumentation.
That's nonsense - every human must obey to the laws of physics. We live and die while being bound to the same restrictions that apply to any living being. We can be as educated as you want, once you take our source of simple oxygen away from us for more than 5 minutes, we just die. But you said "most" - so I take it you do not count yourself among those? I don't..
It is exactly free choice that makes us different but that does not mean that our environment and the world around us does not compel us to act in certain ways or end up at a certain point, it only proves that we have the ability to overcome our environment.
We all use limited understanding to try and explain unlimited potential, while each in our own way can come to a certain understanding and familiarity, we can in no ways grasp the whole picture. All of the words that I use such as being, creation and adoration have much wider meaning to me than the average religious person. God does not need our adoration, nor do our parents need our adoration but this state of love is part of a healthy relationship, it allows for growth while hatred and animosity lead to decay. The world is made up of life which is growth and death which is decay. Accumulation of energy is growth and release of energy is decay, so in order for us to grow we need to accumulate energy and in order to accumulate energy we have to align our selves with the source of that energy, choosing not to align ourselves is something that we can measure or sense and directly affects our energy level. Life is a process by which we learn to align ourselves to the energy source and maintain the growth process there by overcoming death or the decay process. This is not saying that your body will not die and decay, only that your energy will continue growing after you have been freed from the physical body.
You think adoration is a state of love that is vital to a healthy relationship. But how can there be a state of love between us and that which is already a part of us anyway?!? This is the part in my argumentation you decide to skip over and over again: God is NOT a being - we, the plants and seas, the planet, the solar system, the Galaxy, the universe even, are God. God is all around us, we are made of God. I would immediately agree to use any other term for it if that better describes what I truly mean (i.e. universal spirit, The Energy, whatever) but God has a nice ring to it - especially when taking the unexplainable and stuff like that and placing it all under the umbrella of energy, the latter being the composite of matter, gravity and space-time.
It is by understanding the composition and make up of the physical world and the application of physical laws that we can come to a greater understanding of things that are beyond the physical world. This what the new physics is all about gaining understanding of these things based upon physical changes that occur because of things beyond this physical realm. Scientist have yet to discover the evidence that you are speaking of and yet God has presented clear proofs and evidence to the fact, evidence that upon examination reveals the answers to all of these great mysteries. Evidence that Newton examined and yearned to fully grasp but was only allowed a small taste, evidence that Einstein sweated over and desired to dive deeper into. That evidence is still there for those that seek to find it pushing the world itself into greater and greater understanding. It is no accident that we are were we are in understanding and awareness, this time has been promised to mankind for more than six thousand years and we fail to see the forest for all the trees.Now you're cloaking your arguments in vagueness.. Not to be offensive, mind you - but "..the evidence is still there for those that seek to find it.." - ah, come on! What evidence is that?!? "God has presented clear proofs and evidence that upon examination reveals the answers to all of these mysteries..." Do me a favor, and share two or three of these answers with us!!
We started out great with our dialogue, but if you decide to take this into the realm of "secret knowledge" and "unrevealed answers", I'm off.
Do you want your arm to worship your brain? Of course not, but it does require that your arm is obedient to the commands of your brain and that a synaptic connection exists so that when your eyes see something and the brain wants to pick it up that the arm is obedient and lowers so the fingers can grab it. The arm can never understand how the brain works, it's function is only to do what the brain tells it to do. We are that arm that is given free will but it is in our best interests to be obedient to the brain, our failure to be obedient has consequences and if we follow the example and the arm was to be lowered to pick up something to eat, then the consequences would be that the body including the arm would become weak because of not eating.
Another metaphor. It explains perfectly what you fail to see - or don't want to see, I'm not sure which it is.. The arm, the brain and the eyes are all PART OF THE SAME ENTITY: the body. This in fact is the essence of my argumentation.
faceless
Jan 24th, 2005, 7:49 AM
god has a plan....maybe this is what he had planned for these people..that died in the tsunami and wars etc.
Godsgifttomankind
Jan 24th, 2005, 10:48 AM
Thank-you Dutchie for your replies,
It is truly enjoyable to have the opportunity to maintain a continued dialogue, where we are able to grow in understanding and share each others understanding. I am pleased with the challenges that you present and the clarity of understanding that you express. I believe that if we all maintained such a level of challenge while keeping it within the parameters of respect that you have shown fosters a greater array of diverse understandings while at the same time allowing people to feel safe to share those things that they charish the most. You are truly a blessing to us all.
That's nonsense - every human must obey to the laws of physics. We live and die while being bound to the same restrictions that apply to any living being. We can be as educated as you want, once you take our source of simple oxygen away from us for more than 5 minutes, we just die. But you said "most" - so I take it you do not count yourself among those? I don't..
I do believe that man is very much compelled to act in a certain manner and no matter how complex the world around us is, the simplicity of it is that of a do or a don't. This is the limitation of our freewill and is reflected in everything around us including the computer language for the base of computing language is binary, 1 meaning do and 0 meaning don't. Existence is based upon doing and none existence is not doing, thus we can choose not to do something but in essence we are choosing non-existence and since our desire is to exist we are compelled to choose to do. Thus if someone claims that things are predetermined they are correct and if someone says we have a choice they are also correct, for it is by our choice that we live and yet who would truly choose to die, so existence wins out over non existence.
You think adoration is a state of love that is vital to a healthy relationship. But how can there be a state of love between us and that which is already a part of us anyway?!? This is the part in my argumentation you decide to skip over and over again: God is NOT a being - we, the plants and seas, the planet, the solar system, the Galaxy, the universe even, are God. God is all around us, we are made of God. I would immediately agree to use any other term for it if that better describes what I truly mean (i.e. universal spirit, The Energy, whatever) but God has a nice ring to it - especially when taking the unexplainable and stuff like that and placing it all under the umbrella of energy, the latter being the composite of matter, gravity and space-time.
The question of love is very simple, when you love something you look after it for it is a part of you, when you hate something you separate yourself from it, thus if your brother is your arm and you hate your brother is this not the same as cutting off your arm?
In truth I have not skipped you point on God not being a being for to be means to exist and since you say that God is, then clearly God exists and is not limited to the physical existence that many desire to present. Thus I agree with your representation of God and clarify your statement to say that God is not the being that most religious people present.
Now you're cloaking your arguments in vagueness.. Not to be offensive, mind you - but "..the evidence is still there for those that seek to find it.." - ah, come on! What evidence is that?!? "God has presented clear proofs and evidence that upon examination reveals the answers to all of these mysteries..." Do me a favor, and share two or three of these answers with us!!
We started out great with our dialogue, but if you decide to take this into the realm of "secret knowledge" and "unrevealed answers", I'm off.
I would be glad to share as many answers as you would like, please specify a field of thought or science that you want the answers for.
The trick with knowledge is that it is only knowledge once it has been acquired, prior to that point it remains hidden or a mystery to us. A mystery that we have the capacity to solve and need to unravel in order to gain the knowledge. Science is the greatest tool that we have for discovering the answers to all of these as yet unresolved issues. Science is a systematic examination of evidence to provide these answers and when you use the same systematic approach to understanding the word of God clear evidence appears to answers that have been hidden since the beginning of time. Hidden only because each person must be willing and want to find the answers.
Another metaphor. It explains perfectly what you fail to see - or don't want to see, I'm not sure which it is.. The arm, the brain and the eyes are all PART OF THE SAME ENTITY: the body. This in fact is the essence of my argumentation.
Then let us final agree that we see in the same fashion and that it is only a matter of language by which we see differently and work to gain clarity of understanding on each others language.
It is truly enjoyable to have the opportunity to maintain a continued dialogue, where we are able to grow in understanding and share each others understanding. I am pleased with the challenges that you present and the clarity of understanding that you express. I believe that if we all maintained such a level of challenge while keeping it within the parameters of respect that you have shown fosters a greater array of diverse understandings while at the same time allowing people to feel safe to share those things that they charish the most. You are truly a blessing to us all.
That's nonsense - every human must obey to the laws of physics. We live and die while being bound to the same restrictions that apply to any living being. We can be as educated as you want, once you take our source of simple oxygen away from us for more than 5 minutes, we just die. But you said "most" - so I take it you do not count yourself among those? I don't..
I do believe that man is very much compelled to act in a certain manner and no matter how complex the world around us is, the simplicity of it is that of a do or a don't. This is the limitation of our freewill and is reflected in everything around us including the computer language for the base of computing language is binary, 1 meaning do and 0 meaning don't. Existence is based upon doing and none existence is not doing, thus we can choose not to do something but in essence we are choosing non-existence and since our desire is to exist we are compelled to choose to do. Thus if someone claims that things are predetermined they are correct and if someone says we have a choice they are also correct, for it is by our choice that we live and yet who would truly choose to die, so existence wins out over non existence.
You think adoration is a state of love that is vital to a healthy relationship. But how can there be a state of love between us and that which is already a part of us anyway?!? This is the part in my argumentation you decide to skip over and over again: God is NOT a being - we, the plants and seas, the planet, the solar system, the Galaxy, the universe even, are God. God is all around us, we are made of God. I would immediately agree to use any other term for it if that better describes what I truly mean (i.e. universal spirit, The Energy, whatever) but God has a nice ring to it - especially when taking the unexplainable and stuff like that and placing it all under the umbrella of energy, the latter being the composite of matter, gravity and space-time.
The question of love is very simple, when you love something you look after it for it is a part of you, when you hate something you separate yourself from it, thus if your brother is your arm and you hate your brother is this not the same as cutting off your arm?
In truth I have not skipped you point on God not being a being for to be means to exist and since you say that God is, then clearly God exists and is not limited to the physical existence that many desire to present. Thus I agree with your representation of God and clarify your statement to say that God is not the being that most religious people present.
Now you're cloaking your arguments in vagueness.. Not to be offensive, mind you - but "..the evidence is still there for those that seek to find it.." - ah, come on! What evidence is that?!? "God has presented clear proofs and evidence that upon examination reveals the answers to all of these mysteries..." Do me a favor, and share two or three of these answers with us!!
We started out great with our dialogue, but if you decide to take this into the realm of "secret knowledge" and "unrevealed answers", I'm off.
I would be glad to share as many answers as you would like, please specify a field of thought or science that you want the answers for.
The trick with knowledge is that it is only knowledge once it has been acquired, prior to that point it remains hidden or a mystery to us. A mystery that we have the capacity to solve and need to unravel in order to gain the knowledge. Science is the greatest tool that we have for discovering the answers to all of these as yet unresolved issues. Science is a systematic examination of evidence to provide these answers and when you use the same systematic approach to understanding the word of God clear evidence appears to answers that have been hidden since the beginning of time. Hidden only because each person must be willing and want to find the answers.
Another metaphor. It explains perfectly what you fail to see - or don't want to see, I'm not sure which it is.. The arm, the brain and the eyes are all PART OF THE SAME ENTITY: the body. This in fact is the essence of my argumentation.
Then let us final agree that we see in the same fashion and that it is only a matter of language by which we see differently and work to gain clarity of understanding on each others language.
dutchie
Jan 25th, 2005, 4:04 AM
I do believe that man is very much compelled to act in a certain manner and no matter how complex the world around us is, the simplicity of it is that of a do or a don't. This is the limitation of our freewill and is reflected in everything around us including the computer language for the base of computing language is binary, 1 meaning do and 0 meaning don't. Existence is based upon doing and none existence is not doing, thus we can choose not to do something but in essence we are choosing non-existence and since our desire is to exist we are compelled to choose to do. Thus if someone claims that things are predetermined they are correct and if someone says we have a choice they are also correct, for it is by our choice that we live and yet who would truly choose to die, so existence wins out over non existence.Your little philosophical detour does not excite me all that much.. We do not exist - or non-exist for that matter - by choice. That choice was made - like it or not - by our parents. We can chose to terminate our existence, but that is not the "natural" thing to do. The limits to where a human must be driven in order to decide to take its life are truly bizar - there's nothing we more cling to than life itself, and it doesn't matter a damn if you're twenty or ninety.
With respect to the fact that the choice for suicide is unnatural, I don't believe that choice or free will are synonymous with our bare existence, or that they even play a vital role in that process.
The question of love is very simple, when you love something you look after it for it is a part of you, when you hate something you separate yourself from it, thus if your brother is your arm and you hate your brother is this not the same as cutting off your arm?
In truth I have not skipped you point on God not being a being for to be means to exist and since you say that God is, then clearly God exists and is not limited to the physical existence that many desire to present. Thus I agree with your representation of God and clarify your statement to say that God is not the being that most religious people present.God is not a being at all. WE and all that surrounds us are MADE of this entity, which is a cocktail of hydrogen (matter), gravity and space-time. I just called it "God", a name to serve as a convenient vehicle for this definition and cut some slack for the so far unexplained.
I would be glad to share as many answers as you would like, please specify a field of thought or science that you want the answers for.OK then, how will the universe end? The closed universe, resulting in The Big Crunch? The open, cooling universe? Or the flat, eternal universe?
Can a systematical study of "the word of God" tell you if space-time could be curved to an extent that it would make instant interstellar travel possible?
OK, on a more phylosophical note: what exactly is "love"?
The trick with knowledge is that it is only knowledge once it has been acquired, prior to that point it remains hidden or a mystery to us. A mystery that we have the capacity to solve and need to unravel in order to gain the knowledge. Science is the greatest tool that we have for discovering the answers to all of these as yet unresolved issues. Science is a systematic examination of evidence to provide these answers and when you use the same systematic approach to understanding the word of God clear evidence appears to answers that have been hidden since the beginning of time. Hidden only because each person must be willing and want to find the answers.Not true. True knowledge only exists under the absolute realisation that always only part of all wisdom can be known. What you say is like: "playing the piano isn't hard, once you've learned how to do it", and in essence this is true, but (and I know this from experience) we can study playing the piano all of our lives and never accomplish true mastership. Knowledge is always an ongoing process in which it's astounding to see how little was gained and how much is still to be discovered.
Then let us final agree that we see in the same fashion and that it is only a matter of language by which we see differently and work to gain clarity of understanding on each others language.
Hm... I still think to me the idea of God is a more abstract notion than is the case with you.. I don't know if you noticed, but language is not the problem here, I think. Terminology might be a better word. In conclusion I think I believe in a omni-incorporating combination of matter, gravity and space-time, while you believe in a being - maybe not a separate entity, but something with "awareness" anyway...
With respect to the fact that the choice for suicide is unnatural, I don't believe that choice or free will are synonymous with our bare existence, or that they even play a vital role in that process.
The question of love is very simple, when you love something you look after it for it is a part of you, when you hate something you separate yourself from it, thus if your brother is your arm and you hate your brother is this not the same as cutting off your arm?
In truth I have not skipped you point on God not being a being for to be means to exist and since you say that God is, then clearly God exists and is not limited to the physical existence that many desire to present. Thus I agree with your representation of God and clarify your statement to say that God is not the being that most religious people present.God is not a being at all. WE and all that surrounds us are MADE of this entity, which is a cocktail of hydrogen (matter), gravity and space-time. I just called it "God", a name to serve as a convenient vehicle for this definition and cut some slack for the so far unexplained.
I would be glad to share as many answers as you would like, please specify a field of thought or science that you want the answers for.OK then, how will the universe end? The closed universe, resulting in The Big Crunch? The open, cooling universe? Or the flat, eternal universe?
Can a systematical study of "the word of God" tell you if space-time could be curved to an extent that it would make instant interstellar travel possible?
OK, on a more phylosophical note: what exactly is "love"?
The trick with knowledge is that it is only knowledge once it has been acquired, prior to that point it remains hidden or a mystery to us. A mystery that we have the capacity to solve and need to unravel in order to gain the knowledge. Science is the greatest tool that we have for discovering the answers to all of these as yet unresolved issues. Science is a systematic examination of evidence to provide these answers and when you use the same systematic approach to understanding the word of God clear evidence appears to answers that have been hidden since the beginning of time. Hidden only because each person must be willing and want to find the answers.Not true. True knowledge only exists under the absolute realisation that always only part of all wisdom can be known. What you say is like: "playing the piano isn't hard, once you've learned how to do it", and in essence this is true, but (and I know this from experience) we can study playing the piano all of our lives and never accomplish true mastership. Knowledge is always an ongoing process in which it's astounding to see how little was gained and how much is still to be discovered.
Then let us final agree that we see in the same fashion and that it is only a matter of language by which we see differently and work to gain clarity of understanding on each others language.
Hm... I still think to me the idea of God is a more abstract notion than is the case with you.. I don't know if you noticed, but language is not the problem here, I think. Terminology might be a better word. In conclusion I think I believe in a omni-incorporating combination of matter, gravity and space-time, while you believe in a being - maybe not a separate entity, but something with "awareness" anyway...
Godsgifttomankind
Jan 25th, 2005, 10:18 AM
Hello Dutchie an thank-you for your reply,
Your little philosophical detour does not excite me all that much.. We do not exist - or non-exist for that matter - by choice. That choice was made - like it or not - by our parents. We can chose to terminate our existence, but that is not the "natural" thing to do. The limits to where a human must be driven in order to decide to take its life are truly bizar - there's nothing we more cling to than life itself, and it doesn't matter a damn if you're twenty or ninety.
With respect to the fact that the choice for suicide is unnatural, I don't believe that choice or free will are synonymous with our bare existence, or that they even play a vital role in that process.
It is interesting how you echo the exact sentiment that I am working to express, that when you look closely we really do not have a choice in the overall scheme of things. We can make small choices which affect our temporary existence but in the overall equation we can only choose to live for choosing to die as you have said is extremely unnatural.
God is not a being at all. WE and all that surrounds us are MADE of this entity, which is a cocktail of hydrogen (matter), gravity and space-time. I just called it "God", a name to serve as a convenient vehicle for this definition and cut some slack for the so far unexplained.
As I have previously stated we are in total agreement on this issue, I have just been trying to explain how the word that are used to explain a limited understanding, God looks like man; are just as relevant to explaining a far greater understanding that God is the word used for everything that exists.
OK then, how will the universe end? The closed universe, resulting in The Big Crunch? The open, cooling universe? Or the flat, eternal universe?
The universe is infinite having no beginning and no end, full of examples of planets and stars in varying stages of birth, growth, decay and death. In order for the universe to end everything that now exists would have to become non-existent
and man's studies and understanding of the laws that govern us tell us that this is not only improbable but impossible. Once matter exists it can change forms but it can never become non-existent.
Can a systematical study of "the word of God" tell you if space-time could be curved to an extent that it would make instant interstellar travel possible?
The word of God clearly states that instant interstellar travel is achieved once we have overcome the limitations of this physical existence.
OK, on a more phylosophical note: what exactly is "love"?
Love can be explained in many ways and I am choosing to use the explanation that it is a force but even this is very simplified. Forces are of two different kinds ones that promote growth and ones that promote decay and thus having positive and negative values. Love has a positive value and is the cohesive force that bonds people together while hatred has a negative value and causes decay and dissolution. Love is so powerful that it can cause two totally opposite beings to become one or a diverse and estranged society to become fused together in unity. There is no other force that exists that is capable of this and yet it is by exertion of our will that we choose to Love for love is not a natural reaction.
Not true. True knowledge only exists under the absolute realisation that always only part of all wisdom can be known. What you say is like: "playing the piano isn't hard, once you've learned how to do it", and in essence this is true, but (and I know this from experience) we can study playing the piano all of our lives and never accomplish true mastership. Knowledge is always an ongoing process in which it's astounding to see how little was gained and how much is still to be discovered.
Then you are agreeing with my first point in regards to hidden knowledge and mysteries that have yet to be revealed for a master is someone that has devoted themselves to understanding one field of thought and even at the end of their life that they have only scratched the surface.
Hm... I still think to me the idea of God is a more abstract notion than is the case with you.. I don't know if you noticed, but language is not the problem here, I think. Terminology might be a better word. In conclusion I think I believe in a omni-incorporating combination of matter, gravity and space-time, while you believe in a being - maybe not a separate entity, but something with "awareness"
This is very interesting, you believe that your understanding is more abstract than mine and yet when I examine your comments, I see that what you present is abstract but limited to that which is seen specifically hydrogen. I agree with your abstraction version but do not limit it to this realm that can be seen but take it further into the unseen realm. A realm that can only be understood by using reason and examination, such is the example of energy which is only recognizable when it is made manifest in the visible realm such as light.
In the seen or physical realm there are different levels of awareness the most simplistic form is that of a plant, then animals and at the top of the scale of awareness is man, who has the capacity to be aware of things in the invisible realm. You have presented an understanding that awareness is limited to this physical realm and yet the evidence that I have examined tells me that awareness exists in the unseen realm and far exceeds the awareness that is experienced by man and is the source of all awareness.
Your little philosophical detour does not excite me all that much.. We do not exist - or non-exist for that matter - by choice. That choice was made - like it or not - by our parents. We can chose to terminate our existence, but that is not the "natural" thing to do. The limits to where a human must be driven in order to decide to take its life are truly bizar - there's nothing we more cling to than life itself, and it doesn't matter a damn if you're twenty or ninety.
With respect to the fact that the choice for suicide is unnatural, I don't believe that choice or free will are synonymous with our bare existence, or that they even play a vital role in that process.
It is interesting how you echo the exact sentiment that I am working to express, that when you look closely we really do not have a choice in the overall scheme of things. We can make small choices which affect our temporary existence but in the overall equation we can only choose to live for choosing to die as you have said is extremely unnatural.
God is not a being at all. WE and all that surrounds us are MADE of this entity, which is a cocktail of hydrogen (matter), gravity and space-time. I just called it "God", a name to serve as a convenient vehicle for this definition and cut some slack for the so far unexplained.
As I have previously stated we are in total agreement on this issue, I have just been trying to explain how the word that are used to explain a limited understanding, God looks like man; are just as relevant to explaining a far greater understanding that God is the word used for everything that exists.
OK then, how will the universe end? The closed universe, resulting in The Big Crunch? The open, cooling universe? Or the flat, eternal universe?
The universe is infinite having no beginning and no end, full of examples of planets and stars in varying stages of birth, growth, decay and death. In order for the universe to end everything that now exists would have to become non-existent
and man's studies and understanding of the laws that govern us tell us that this is not only improbable but impossible. Once matter exists it can change forms but it can never become non-existent.
Can a systematical study of "the word of God" tell you if space-time could be curved to an extent that it would make instant interstellar travel possible?
The word of God clearly states that instant interstellar travel is achieved once we have overcome the limitations of this physical existence.
OK, on a more phylosophical note: what exactly is "love"?
Love can be explained in many ways and I am choosing to use the explanation that it is a force but even this is very simplified. Forces are of two different kinds ones that promote growth and ones that promote decay and thus having positive and negative values. Love has a positive value and is the cohesive force that bonds people together while hatred has a negative value and causes decay and dissolution. Love is so powerful that it can cause two totally opposite beings to become one or a diverse and estranged society to become fused together in unity. There is no other force that exists that is capable of this and yet it is by exertion of our will that we choose to Love for love is not a natural reaction.
Not true. True knowledge only exists under the absolute realisation that always only part of all wisdom can be known. What you say is like: "playing the piano isn't hard, once you've learned how to do it", and in essence this is true, but (and I know this from experience) we can study playing the piano all of our lives and never accomplish true mastership. Knowledge is always an ongoing process in which it's astounding to see how little was gained and how much is still to be discovered.
Then you are agreeing with my first point in regards to hidden knowledge and mysteries that have yet to be revealed for a master is someone that has devoted themselves to understanding one field of thought and even at the end of their life that they have only scratched the surface.
Hm... I still think to me the idea of God is a more abstract notion than is the case with you.. I don't know if you noticed, but language is not the problem here, I think. Terminology might be a better word. In conclusion I think I believe in a omni-incorporating combination of matter, gravity and space-time, while you believe in a being - maybe not a separate entity, but something with "awareness"
This is very interesting, you believe that your understanding is more abstract than mine and yet when I examine your comments, I see that what you present is abstract but limited to that which is seen specifically hydrogen. I agree with your abstraction version but do not limit it to this realm that can be seen but take it further into the unseen realm. A realm that can only be understood by using reason and examination, such is the example of energy which is only recognizable when it is made manifest in the visible realm such as light.
In the seen or physical realm there are different levels of awareness the most simplistic form is that of a plant, then animals and at the top of the scale of awareness is man, who has the capacity to be aware of things in the invisible realm. You have presented an understanding that awareness is limited to this physical realm and yet the evidence that I have examined tells me that awareness exists in the unseen realm and far exceeds the awareness that is experienced by man and is the source of all awareness.
autryn2
Jan 25th, 2005, 3:44 PM
Lets hold the responses under a 1,000 words, OK???? :~)
Yall are a little optimistic concerning my attention span!
Back to the subject..... pretty easy.
God didn't put us here for our comfort.
We are here to learn, grow, and develop faith in Him thru TRIALS.
We all have them. Get used to it. There is more that follows.
Your final breath here is not your last minute to exist. There is more...
Yall are a little optimistic concerning my attention span!
Back to the subject..... pretty easy.
God didn't put us here for our comfort.
We are here to learn, grow, and develop faith in Him thru TRIALS.
We all have them. Get used to it. There is more that follows.
Your final breath here is not your last minute to exist. There is more...
BigPheces
Jan 25th, 2005, 4:15 PM
So let me get this straight, my reason for existance is to learn about and learn to believe in something that there is no proof, evidence, or reason for? That seems like a very shallow existance to me... I was put here by God to learn about God, so I can die and go to God? That type of cyclic logic seems like a big waste of time, since I could skip the whole "life on earth" phase and just be told by this all powerful being what we are to know. Basically, what I don't understand is whats in it for us, or for "it"?
I seem to much agree with Dutchie in this one, where there is no "being", just stuff out there. I find it hard to believe that someone (something?) would create this HUGE universe of ours, put us and only us in it, and then watch us like a big TV show... though of course I'd be a prime time hit if that were the case!
I seem to much agree with Dutchie in this one, where there is no "being", just stuff out there. I find it hard to believe that someone (something?) would create this HUGE universe of ours, put us and only us in it, and then watch us like a big TV show... though of course I'd be a prime time hit if that were the case!
autryn2
Jan 26th, 2005, 11:29 AM
What up, BP!!!
Are you a parent??? Got any kids??? Ever let em out into the back yard on their own for a while???? Maybe to just see how they react to not being under your wing every moment???? See how they'll do without you there??? If you did, I bet you watched thru the kitchen window to make sure they were ok.
We're in the back yard... and God is watching thru the kitchen window.
We're here to learn and grow up, and learning about God and growing in faith is only a part of it (a vital part, but part none the less).
Are you a parent??? Got any kids??? Ever let em out into the back yard on their own for a while???? Maybe to just see how they react to not being under your wing every moment???? See how they'll do without you there??? If you did, I bet you watched thru the kitchen window to make sure they were ok.
We're in the back yard... and God is watching thru the kitchen window.
We're here to learn and grow up, and learning about God and growing in faith is only a part of it (a vital part, but part none the less).
MacRasta
Jan 26th, 2005, 1:13 PM
What up, BP!!!
Are you a parent??? Got any kids??? Ever let em out into the back yard on their own for a while???? Maybe to just see how they react to not being under your wing every moment???? See how they'll do without you there??? If you did, I bet you watched thru the kitchen window to make sure they were ok.
We're in the back yard... and God is watching thru the kitchen window.
We're here to learn and grow up, and learning about God and growing in faith is only a part of it (a vital part, but part none the less).
Total BS buddy :mad: What the funk are you comparing with, huh?
Ali Mac:ban:
Are you a parent??? Got any kids??? Ever let em out into the back yard on their own for a while???? Maybe to just see how they react to not being under your wing every moment???? See how they'll do without you there??? If you did, I bet you watched thru the kitchen window to make sure they were ok.
We're in the back yard... and God is watching thru the kitchen window.
We're here to learn and grow up, and learning about God and growing in faith is only a part of it (a vital part, but part none the less).
Total BS buddy :mad: What the funk are you comparing with, huh?
Ali Mac:ban:
BigPheces
Jan 26th, 2005, 1:26 PM
Autryn, your response gives me even more questions that I don't think can be answered, as they are pure conjecture and (in my eyes) the human minds obsession to be parented and cared for by someone "greater" than us; i.e. the parent reference you used.
We're here to learn and grow up, and learning about God and growing in faith is only a part of it (a vital part, but part none the less).
What are we here to learn? What will this knowledge gain for us? What will us having this knowledge gain for God? And once again, why should this god care about us at all? What does God do with our "faith"? Is it transmitted to it and used as sustinance? As food? Isn't it very self-centered by human-kind to assume that we are the center of this god's existance?
I have a feeling that any answers to these questions I get will be cyclic and based on "faith" as opposed to fact. I will admit that there are things in this universe that we can't explain... yet. But given the time, who knows what we could figure out?
We're here to learn and grow up, and learning about God and growing in faith is only a part of it (a vital part, but part none the less).
What are we here to learn? What will this knowledge gain for us? What will us having this knowledge gain for God? And once again, why should this god care about us at all? What does God do with our "faith"? Is it transmitted to it and used as sustinance? As food? Isn't it very self-centered by human-kind to assume that we are the center of this god's existance?
I have a feeling that any answers to these questions I get will be cyclic and based on "faith" as opposed to fact. I will admit that there are things in this universe that we can't explain... yet. But given the time, who knows what we could figure out?
Godsgifttomankind
Jan 27th, 2005, 7:15 AM
Hello BP and welcome,
It is a pleasure to have you join us with your questions as well as all that you have to offer, I hope that you enjoy yourself and that we can learn from each other.
Autryn, your response gives me even more questions that I don't think can be answered, as they are pure conjecture and (in my eyes) the human minds obsession to be parented and cared for by someone "greater" than us; i.e. the parent reference you used.
Given that we are raised in a nurturing environment, it is quite reasonable for people to search to sustain that environment. Every example of life shows us that for life to continue these nurturing environments must exist. It could be said that people are obsessed with eating and this would be correct based upon the reality if we do not eat we die.
What are we here to learn?
The most important thing that we are here to learn is the purpose of our existence.
What will this knowledge gain for us?
Once we have learned the purpose of our existence it is possible for us to place ourselves squarely into the role for which we were created.
What will us having this knowledge gain for God?
When we come to an understanding of our relationship with God and place ourselves in the position for which we were created, we become an integral part of God and work toward the betterment of the whole.
And once again, why should this god care about us at all?
Part of recognizing our purpose is recognizing that we are in fact a part of God. The analogy of God as the father and we as children, worked well as an explanation in societies were family bonds are very strong and serve as a good example, however with the disintegration of family units there is an analogy that works far better. These of course are analogies used to simplify and explain something far more complex than is possible to grasp in it's totality. Quantum physics provides a far greater understanding but since we are not all quantum physicist these analogies provide the stepping stones along the path of understanding.
We thus can use the human body to explain our relationship with God where God is the head or brains of the operation and we are one of the cells of one of the organs with in that body. As a cell our existence depends upon receiving our basic needs from the blood, without the blood our systems fail and as a cell we cease to exist. Since a cell is an integral part of the body and the life of the body depends upon the survival of each cell and the brain depends upon the rest of the body for it's existence then the brain is compelled to act in such a way as to sustain the life of itself and all the other cells.
What does God do with our "faith"? Is it transmitted to it and used as sustinance? As food? Isn't it very self-centered by human-kind to assume that we are the center of this god's existance?
Faith is action based upon understanding, for example we know that as long as we put food in our mouth we will continue to exist, when we stop putting food in our mouth our life ends. We may not have total understanding of how this system works but because of our faith in it we continue to feed ourselves. Faith is a very powerful force but so is wisdom and understanding and none of these should be an excuse to ignore the others for faith without wisdom and understanding is superstition and wisdom and understanding without faith is contempt.
Not being the center of God's existence but a part of it, we can come to an understanding that just as with the body if a cell does not function with in the body or is responsible for uncontrolled cell division(cancer) the continued existence of the body depends upon elimination of the problem.
I have a feeling that any answers to these questions I get will be cyclic and based on "faith" as opposed to fact. I will admit that there are things in this universe that we can't explain... yet. But given the time, who knows what we could figure out?
I hope that these answers were not cyclical in nature but based upon a reasonable presentation of evidence. It is by gaining understanding of the workings of the world that we can see that we can begin to understand the workings of that part of the world that we can not see for everything that exists is governed by one universal law.
Thank-you again your questions have been the catalyst for a new and greater understanding of my own.
It is a pleasure to have you join us with your questions as well as all that you have to offer, I hope that you enjoy yourself and that we can learn from each other.
Autryn, your response gives me even more questions that I don't think can be answered, as they are pure conjecture and (in my eyes) the human minds obsession to be parented and cared for by someone "greater" than us; i.e. the parent reference you used.
Given that we are raised in a nurturing environment, it is quite reasonable for people to search to sustain that environment. Every example of life shows us that for life to continue these nurturing environments must exist. It could be said that people are obsessed with eating and this would be correct based upon the reality if we do not eat we die.
What are we here to learn?
The most important thing that we are here to learn is the purpose of our existence.
What will this knowledge gain for us?
Once we have learned the purpose of our existence it is possible for us to place ourselves squarely into the role for which we were created.
What will us having this knowledge gain for God?
When we come to an understanding of our relationship with God and place ourselves in the position for which we were created, we become an integral part of God and work toward the betterment of the whole.
And once again, why should this god care about us at all?
Part of recognizing our purpose is recognizing that we are in fact a part of God. The analogy of God as the father and we as children, worked well as an explanation in societies were family bonds are very strong and serve as a good example, however with the disintegration of family units there is an analogy that works far better. These of course are analogies used to simplify and explain something far more complex than is possible to grasp in it's totality. Quantum physics provides a far greater understanding but since we are not all quantum physicist these analogies provide the stepping stones along the path of understanding.
We thus can use the human body to explain our relationship with God where God is the head or brains of the operation and we are one of the cells of one of the organs with in that body. As a cell our existence depends upon receiving our basic needs from the blood, without the blood our systems fail and as a cell we cease to exist. Since a cell is an integral part of the body and the life of the body depends upon the survival of each cell and the brain depends upon the rest of the body for it's existence then the brain is compelled to act in such a way as to sustain the life of itself and all the other cells.
What does God do with our "faith"? Is it transmitted to it and used as sustinance? As food? Isn't it very self-centered by human-kind to assume that we are the center of this god's existance?
Faith is action based upon understanding, for example we know that as long as we put food in our mouth we will continue to exist, when we stop putting food in our mouth our life ends. We may not have total understanding of how this system works but because of our faith in it we continue to feed ourselves. Faith is a very powerful force but so is wisdom and understanding and none of these should be an excuse to ignore the others for faith without wisdom and understanding is superstition and wisdom and understanding without faith is contempt.
Not being the center of God's existence but a part of it, we can come to an understanding that just as with the body if a cell does not function with in the body or is responsible for uncontrolled cell division(cancer) the continued existence of the body depends upon elimination of the problem.
I have a feeling that any answers to these questions I get will be cyclic and based on "faith" as opposed to fact. I will admit that there are things in this universe that we can't explain... yet. But given the time, who knows what we could figure out?
I hope that these answers were not cyclical in nature but based upon a reasonable presentation of evidence. It is by gaining understanding of the workings of the world that we can see that we can begin to understand the workings of that part of the world that we can not see for everything that exists is governed by one universal law.
Thank-you again your questions have been the catalyst for a new and greater understanding of my own.
dutchie
Jan 27th, 2005, 7:48 AM
The purpose of our existence is the existence itself. Why are people always seeking more behind it? Why should there be an afterlife, with streets of gold and blah blah blah??
I am happy to return to that of which I am made of. That is the physical purpose of my body. The psychological fulfillment of that purpose is evident: enjoy your existence, each and every minute of it.
Give your own life meaning; don't put divine chance at work there... Take responsibility for your life and for those that were entrusted to you by life itself. The past is a gas, only to be seen by eyes peering deep into the universe. The future is yours.
I am happy to return to that of which I am made of. That is the physical purpose of my body. The psychological fulfillment of that purpose is evident: enjoy your existence, each and every minute of it.
Give your own life meaning; don't put divine chance at work there... Take responsibility for your life and for those that were entrusted to you by life itself. The past is a gas, only to be seen by eyes peering deep into the universe. The future is yours.
Antony
Mar 8th, 2005, 2:46 AM
where was god at the time of the tsunami sitin on his fat ass and reading the telegraph where was he in the world wars where was he when the hurracanes hit florida WERE IS HE I THE TIME OF NEED
Why is God always to blame? I don'tHave the room to explain all that your asking, but look at all the destruction man has done to the envirenment.We have polluted everything we touch.We,man is responsible for the tsunami.No you personally wouldn't harm anyone, but our way of life does.Look at our ozone as one example. we put air planes,sattelites,chemicle sprayes, etc. in the sky.God does show us the right way. We know right from wrong. What your asking is for God to bring everything to a screeching halt. It is coming but there are things yet to happen. I believe you understand.And God is big enough to forgive you for what you said.
Why is God always to blame? I don'tHave the room to explain all that your asking, but look at all the destruction man has done to the envirenment.We have polluted everything we touch.We,man is responsible for the tsunami.No you personally wouldn't harm anyone, but our way of life does.Look at our ozone as one example. we put air planes,sattelites,chemicle sprayes, etc. in the sky.God does show us the right way. We know right from wrong. What your asking is for God to bring everything to a screeching halt. It is coming but there are things yet to happen. I believe you understand.And God is big enough to forgive you for what you said.
eyekwah
Sep 12th, 2005, 7:53 PM
if we did everything by the book or 'bible' we would not be able too advance and prosper like we have done and ther would be even more wars revloved around religion there is no reason why god cant help us i think ther either isno god or he just simply refuses to help or we have grown to strongfor him to contend with i blame god simply becuase it is right to blame him for he and the other gods have either been createdby us or created us so in turn they should stand by us and make sure no harm comes to us or as minimil harm they.if he did creat us why did he give us the knoledge to advance as we are and why did he stand and watch this when he could at any moment either stop it or he could gaze into the future and guess that we would become more stronger than he.
I DO NOT NEED FOR GIVNESS FROM SOMONE OR SOMTHING I DO NOT BEILIVE IN
HE SHOULD BE ASKING FORGIVNESS FROM US
I DO NOT NEED FOR GIVNESS FROM SOMONE OR SOMTHING I DO NOT BEILIVE IN
HE SHOULD BE ASKING FORGIVNESS FROM US
B.NyeTheUruk-Hai
Sep 12th, 2005, 9:05 PM
We,man is responsible for the tsunami.
LOL!!! Thanks for the laugh, Antony! I'd LOVE to hear your explanation of how exactly man is responsible for causing an underwater earthquake...
LOL!!! Thanks for the laugh, Antony! I'd LOVE to hear your explanation of how exactly man is responsible for causing an underwater earthquake...
Philosopher Foelhe
Sep 13th, 2005, 1:03 AM
Holy thread necromancy, Batman! Should I even bother to answer the original question here? Ah, what the hell.
It seems to me the "natural disaster" argument is the atheistic version of the "martyr" argument theists throw out from time to time - it's build entirely on emotion and it basically assumes the speaker was right at the beginning. Plus it springs from a fear of death, which is reasonable but needs to be overcome for the argument's sake.
If a god exists, and if that god gives a damn about any of us, we can pretty much assume that death is not the end. The people that died in the tsunami had a rough time of it, to be sure, but some of them clawed their way out of the wreckage, and others died. If a loving god exists, those that died moved on, either to another plane (the afterlife in all its forms) or back into the cycle (reincarnation). So, we have people that survived, and people that simply moved on to another place. I'm not sure either of those things could be described as neglectful.
It seems to me the "natural disaster" argument is the atheistic version of the "martyr" argument theists throw out from time to time - it's build entirely on emotion and it basically assumes the speaker was right at the beginning. Plus it springs from a fear of death, which is reasonable but needs to be overcome for the argument's sake.
If a god exists, and if that god gives a damn about any of us, we can pretty much assume that death is not the end. The people that died in the tsunami had a rough time of it, to be sure, but some of them clawed their way out of the wreckage, and others died. If a loving god exists, those that died moved on, either to another plane (the afterlife in all its forms) or back into the cycle (reincarnation). So, we have people that survived, and people that simply moved on to another place. I'm not sure either of those things could be described as neglectful.
nrj
Sep 13th, 2005, 3:46 AM
God works in strange and mysterious ways that the finite human mind cant understand. When I just saw the title of the thread, I could bet my watch someone would say this.
If 6 million jews were not murdered in ww2 would they have been so adament to have their own country? You have stated, with you're own words, many times that we have free will. Anyone but me see the wierdness (is that a word?) when someone blame two things on the Holocaust? god AND us? Any way, those jews did not get their own country. They died. But their fellow jews got the country. How could God, with his love for us, assume that the children wanted to sacrifice themselves for a geographical area? If I was a child again, then I would not give a crap about my people having their own country! And frankly, I don't care about it now either.
Also, this may be very far fetched but does God like christians ? They believe in his son so he must. The jews are Gods chosen people. Who hates christians and most of all hates Jews?????........Muslims, followers of Islam. What country in the world has the most muslims in it? What is the most populous muslim country in the world? Indonesia. You're right! That was a farfetched idea, since christians, jews, atheist's and agnostics to died in that disaster. And din't the wave hit India, Somalia and Thailand to?
If 6 million jews were not murdered in ww2 would they have been so adament to have their own country? You have stated, with you're own words, many times that we have free will. Anyone but me see the wierdness (is that a word?) when someone blame two things on the Holocaust? god AND us? Any way, those jews did not get their own country. They died. But their fellow jews got the country. How could God, with his love for us, assume that the children wanted to sacrifice themselves for a geographical area? If I was a child again, then I would not give a crap about my people having their own country! And frankly, I don't care about it now either.
Also, this may be very far fetched but does God like christians ? They believe in his son so he must. The jews are Gods chosen people. Who hates christians and most of all hates Jews?????........Muslims, followers of Islam. What country in the world has the most muslims in it? What is the most populous muslim country in the world? Indonesia. You're right! That was a farfetched idea, since christians, jews, atheist's and agnostics to died in that disaster. And din't the wave hit India, Somalia and Thailand to?
nrj
Sep 13th, 2005, 3:49 AM
I don'tHave the room to explain all that your asking, but look at all the destruction man has done to the envirenment.We have polluted everything we touch.We,man is responsible for the tsunami. Did you go to school as a child? You can throw 50 cubic meter oil right into the forest, but that wont cause the tectonic plates to slam around at all.
Defiant Noquisi
Sep 18th, 2005, 10:36 PM
clan cameron: Chlanna nan con thigibh a so's gheib sibh feail
Children are the seeds that we plant or the weeds that we release. Clan glorious Ok,Im not big into Gaelic but isnt that "Sons of the hounds come here and get flesh"? Ive seen that on every Clan Cameron webpage so GGTMK's translation makes no sense to me. Then again, it could have come out for children to come and sing or something to that affect if you really dont know the translations. Please correct me if Im wrong. Theres a Morrison in the house!
The All Powerful has just posted. :indec:
Children are the seeds that we plant or the weeds that we release. Clan glorious Ok,Im not big into Gaelic but isnt that "Sons of the hounds come here and get flesh"? Ive seen that on every Clan Cameron webpage so GGTMK's translation makes no sense to me. Then again, it could have come out for children to come and sing or something to that affect if you really dont know the translations. Please correct me if Im wrong. Theres a Morrison in the house!
The All Powerful has just posted. :indec:
Jake99
Sep 19th, 2005, 11:44 AM
Where was God when man ignored all the TV programs about the inadequacies of the levies in New Orleans. And where was God when man polluted the planet and contributed to global warming with a wasteful and inefficient way of life? And where was god when the lines were drawn on the map and the possession wars raged on? He was standing against this way of life with everything he had in the form of his mediator and servant right at Y2K as he said he would trying to stop you and lead you to peace and prosperity. But do you listen? No, so do not blame the misery of this world on god and listen to the one he has placed his seal of approval on if you really wish to change. He comes as a thief in the night and you missed him again because you think the messiah must be a madman. Upset and determined is more like it but the world would rather sleep until death than wake up and live.
Philosopher Foelhe
Sep 19th, 2005, 1:15 PM
"Son of God", read the thread. The discussion is about the tsunami in Asia, not the hurricane in New Orleans. Pollution doesn't affect tsunamis unless the wave brings nuclear waste with it or something, which wasn't the case here. In the future, try to pay attention to what's being said, lest you look like a moron.
Oh, and a "thief in the night" doesn't ramble on like a drunken lunatic. If you're the "mediator and servant", if you're supposed to "lead us to peace and prosperity", feel free to go do that, instead of constantly repeating yourself to a bunch of people who are bored by your predictability and illogic. As soon as you do something worth notice, I may just start listening to you. And saving an overgrown twinkie company isn't worth notice.
Oh, and a "thief in the night" doesn't ramble on like a drunken lunatic. If you're the "mediator and servant", if you're supposed to "lead us to peace and prosperity", feel free to go do that, instead of constantly repeating yourself to a bunch of people who are bored by your predictability and illogic. As soon as you do something worth notice, I may just start listening to you. And saving an overgrown twinkie company isn't worth notice.
nrj
Sep 19th, 2005, 1:53 PM
Well said, Foelhe. Sure, i like he's system a bit, but actually giving the planet to him and trusting him... Nah... But, when the time of globalisation comes, well, unless there's any better systems I will take that system.
B.NyeTheUruk-Hai
Sep 19th, 2005, 3:47 PM
Jake, like the little cakes that he makes, is much like a twinkie himself -- he's got a golden exterior, but instead of being filled with a tasty cream filling, he's full of something MUCH, much different...
Jake99
Sep 20th, 2005, 11:02 AM
Philosopher Foelhe,
You may think its no big deal to turn chaos, war, waste, injuries and failure into peace and prosperity at several of the largest bakeries in the world but I know what a challenge it was to lead and succeed in such an effort. If you are unwilling to change you will end up further into the chaos this world is in. God and I stood against your ways at the millennium and your judges and elect got their butt kicked in every way just like the bible, koran and all the rest predicted. This topic is about where is god when the world is in such turmoil. Listed below is where he is and who he is working through to try and save your soul. My foot is on Satans head and I patiently await your unconditional surrender as I have of the United States of America. We have accepted your challenges and defended our position now its time for the disciples of Satan to accept that they are in check mate.
<img src="http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b5/James99/scan3.jpg" alt="Image hosted by Photobucket.com">
<img src="http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b5/James99/scan4.jpg" alt="Image hosted by Photobucket.com">
<img src="http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b5/James99/scan5.jpg" alt="Image hosted by Photobucket.com">
<img src="http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b5/James99/scan6.jpg" alt="Image hosted by Photobucket.com">
<img src="http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b5/James99/scan7.jpg" alt="Image hosted by Photobucket.com">
<img src="http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b5/James99/scan8.jpg" alt="Image hosted by Photobucket.com">
<img src="http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b5/James99/scan9.jpg" alt="Image hosted by Photobucket.com">
<img src="http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b5/James99/scan10.jpg" alt="Image hosted by Photobucket.com">
<img src="http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b5/James99/Jim.jpg" alt="Image hosted by Photobucket.com">
You may think its no big deal to turn chaos, war, waste, injuries and failure into peace and prosperity at several of the largest bakeries in the world but I know what a challenge it was to lead and succeed in such an effort. If you are unwilling to change you will end up further into the chaos this world is in. God and I stood against your ways at the millennium and your judges and elect got their butt kicked in every way just like the bible, koran and all the rest predicted. This topic is about where is god when the world is in such turmoil. Listed below is where he is and who he is working through to try and save your soul. My foot is on Satans head and I patiently await your unconditional surrender as I have of the United States of America. We have accepted your challenges and defended our position now its time for the disciples of Satan to accept that they are in check mate.
<img src="http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b5/James99/scan3.jpg" alt="Image hosted by Photobucket.com">
<img src="http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b5/James99/scan4.jpg" alt="Image hosted by Photobucket.com">
<img src="http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b5/James99/scan5.jpg" alt="Image hosted by Photobucket.com">
<img src="http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b5/James99/scan6.jpg" alt="Image hosted by Photobucket.com">
<img src="http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b5/James99/scan7.jpg" alt="Image hosted by Photobucket.com">
<img src="http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b5/James99/scan8.jpg" alt="Image hosted by Photobucket.com">
<img src="http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b5/James99/scan9.jpg" alt="Image hosted by Photobucket.com">
<img src="http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b5/James99/scan10.jpg" alt="Image hosted by Photobucket.com">
<img src="http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b5/James99/Jim.jpg" alt="Image hosted by Photobucket.com">
Philosopher Foelhe
Sep 20th, 2005, 11:17 AM
Oh, Jesus, are you still bitching about that? I don't give a damn how hard it was. And if it was really so tricky, what in the hell do you think changing the world will be? A picnic?
Maybe I didn't make myself clear - if you are the son of god, and if you've "stood against our ways" with corrupt judges or whatever the hell you're trying to say, then go make world peace happen. Okay? Then I will be happy to listen to you, but in the meantime I have to concentrate on what actually matters.
Maybe I didn't make myself clear - if you are the son of god, and if you've "stood against our ways" with corrupt judges or whatever the hell you're trying to say, then go make world peace happen. Okay? Then I will be happy to listen to you, but in the meantime I have to concentrate on what actually matters.
B.NyeTheUruk-Hai
Sep 20th, 2005, 2:55 PM
You'd think that the defender of all humanity would know how to link to some photos on a message board...
Jake99
Sep 21st, 2005, 10:15 AM
What do I look like a secretary or a computer wizard? I am a man used by god to show you how to use what you have according to the recommendations of the bible that you obviously do not understand a word of. And with very little education I have outperformed large numbers of experts in almost every field of endeavor that mattered to god. My actual father can tell you how to do almost anything and yet he is blind as a bat and dumb as a rock when it comes to leadership ability which is what I excel in way beyond what any of you can do. Your comment is about as dumb as sending a person to college so he can be an insurance adjuster or a banker. I did not get a secretary or a personal assistant and no one trained me to do anything in the areas of law and engineering where I am a totally accomplished and successful person as in 99.9%. Go back to sleep and wait for the next hurricane to expose your incompetent leadership and systems. Gods plan is to overthrow the knuckleheads that this planet elects and change to a simple system that is fair and prosperous for all. And that is what I have been demonstrating for decades while the worlds leaders promote war and waste. You are a very long way from peace, prosperity, consistency, simplicity, waste control and environmental management.
B.NyeTheUruk-Hai
Sep 21st, 2005, 12:00 PM
What do I look like a secretary or a computer wizard?
Actually, as you've previously boasted, you look like Paul Newman...
I am a man used by god to show you how to use what you have according to the recommendations of the bible that you obviously do not understand a word of.
You see, here is just one of MANY ways where your elaborate ruse bites itself in the ass. In one of your very early posts here on AO, you mentioned that you've never actually read the Bible yourself and that you really don't know anything about it. Hmmm...
You are a very long way from peace, prosperity, consistency, simplicity, waste control and environmental management.
Your existence is adequate evidence of our deficiency in waste control...
Actually, as you've previously boasted, you look like Paul Newman...
I am a man used by god to show you how to use what you have according to the recommendations of the bible that you obviously do not understand a word of.
You see, here is just one of MANY ways where your elaborate ruse bites itself in the ass. In one of your very early posts here on AO, you mentioned that you've never actually read the Bible yourself and that you really don't know anything about it. Hmmm...
You are a very long way from peace, prosperity, consistency, simplicity, waste control and environmental management.
Your existence is adequate evidence of our deficiency in waste control...
nrj
Sep 21st, 2005, 1:11 PM
Jake, you cannot possibly think that we will follow a man who says he's better then us. I won't. I will follow a humble man, who only loves his fellow earthlings and does NOT love himself more.
Philosopher Foelhe
Sep 21st, 2005, 5:31 PM
My actual father can tell you how to do almost anything and yet he is blind as a bat and dumb as a rock when it comes to leadership ability which is what I excel in way beyond what any of you can do.
YOUR leadership ability is far superior to OURS?!? ROFLMAO!
Quick vote, everyone! If you had the option to follow either Jake here or... hell, I'll nominate myself, since I haven't even been here very long. Which of us would you follow?
(I'm not exactly expecting much voter turn-out on this one, but what the hell. Maybe I should make a new thread. *ponders*)
YOUR leadership ability is far superior to OURS?!? ROFLMAO!
Quick vote, everyone! If you had the option to follow either Jake here or... hell, I'll nominate myself, since I haven't even been here very long. Which of us would you follow?
(I'm not exactly expecting much voter turn-out on this one, but what the hell. Maybe I should make a new thread. *ponders*)
Mezurashi
Sep 21st, 2005, 5:41 PM
I'd follow whomever had the best/most booze/drugs.
and herein lies the problem with gaining followers to prove ones self - just about anyone can do it with the right appeal and there's enough humans that just about anyone can find others who agree with them.
Phil - how big is your stash? Jake isn't into that stuff :lol:
and herein lies the problem with gaining followers to prove ones self - just about anyone can do it with the right appeal and there's enough humans that just about anyone can find others who agree with them.
Phil - how big is your stash? Jake isn't into that stuff :lol:
Philosopher Foelhe
Sep 21st, 2005, 5:48 PM
Well, it wouldn't exactly be hard for me to get ahold of some pretty prime stuff. Heroin up your alley, or you looking for something a little more exciting?
Seriously, though, I do think there are certain things which are appreciated in far larger numbers than what Jake's selling. Of course, this whole set-up is nonsense anyway, but if the way Jake acts on here is any sign whatsoever, he couldn't lead himself out of a wet paper bag.
Seriously, though, I do think there are certain things which are appreciated in far larger numbers than what Jake's selling. Of course, this whole set-up is nonsense anyway, but if the way Jake acts on here is any sign whatsoever, he couldn't lead himself out of a wet paper bag.
Sabazi
Sep 21st, 2005, 5:59 PM
Where was God when man ignored all the TV programs about the inadequacies of the levies in New Orleans. And where was God when man polluted the planet and contributed to global warming with a wasteful and inefficient way of life? And where was god when the lines were drawn on the map and the possession wars raged on? He was standing against this way of life with everything he had in the form of his mediator and servant right at Y2K as he said he would trying to stop you and lead you to peace and prosperity. But do you listen? No, so do not blame the misery of this world on god and listen to the one he has placed his seal of approval on if you really wish to change. He comes as a thief in the night and you missed him again because you think the messiah must be a madman. Upset and determined is more like it but the world would rather sleep until death than wake up and live.
Who exactly has he placed his seal of approval on?
Who exactly has he placed his seal of approval on?
Defiant Noquisi
Sep 21st, 2005, 5:59 PM
Jake, like the little cakes that he makes, is much like a twinkie himself -- he's got a golden exterior, but instead of being filled with a tasty cream filling, he's full of something MUCH, much different... LOL, damn that was sweet! Having some Indian persuasion myself, a Twinkie has an entirely different and derogatory meaning. No matter how tan you get on the outside, youre still all white on the inside. Hehehehe
Sabazi
Sep 21st, 2005, 6:10 PM
Philosopher Foelhe,
You may think its no big deal to turn chaos, war, waste, injuries and failure into peace and prosperity at several of the largest bakeries in the world but I know what a challenge it was to lead and succeed in such an effort. If you are unwilling to change you will end up further into the chaos this world is in. God and I stood against your ways at the millennium and your judges and elect got their butt kicked in every way just like the bible, koran and all the rest predicted. This topic is about where is god when the world is in such turmoil. Listed below is where he is and who he is working through to try and save your soul. My foot is on Satans head and I patiently await your unconditional surrender as I have of the United States of America. We have accepted your challenges and defended our position now its time for the disciples of Satan to accept that they are in check mate.
Whoa, excessive.
You may think its no big deal to turn chaos, war, waste, injuries and failure into peace and prosperity at several of the largest bakeries in the world but I know what a challenge it was to lead and succeed in such an effort. If you are unwilling to change you will end up further into the chaos this world is in. God and I stood against your ways at the millennium and your judges and elect got their butt kicked in every way just like the bible, koran and all the rest predicted. This topic is about where is god when the world is in such turmoil. Listed below is where he is and who he is working through to try and save your soul. My foot is on Satans head and I patiently await your unconditional surrender as I have of the United States of America. We have accepted your challenges and defended our position now its time for the disciples of Satan to accept that they are in check mate.
Whoa, excessive.
B.NyeTheUruk-Hai
Sep 21st, 2005, 8:00 PM
Quick vote, everyone! If you had the option to follow either Jake here or... hell, I'll nominate myself, since I haven't even been here very long. Which of us would you follow?
Hmmm, that's a close one... Foelhe's a good guy with a good head on his shoulders. On the other hand, there's Fake... errr... I mean Jake, who has access to unlimited quantities of Twinkies. He's also got his foot on Satan's head! Come on! You've gotta admit that's pretty cool! But then again, you could wake up one morning with a razor-tipped arrow up against your temple and a crazy-assed deity-wannabee holding the bow. I'm gonna have to think about this one...
Hmmm, that's a close one... Foelhe's a good guy with a good head on his shoulders. On the other hand, there's Fake... errr... I mean Jake, who has access to unlimited quantities of Twinkies. He's also got his foot on Satan's head! Come on! You've gotta admit that's pretty cool! But then again, you could wake up one morning with a razor-tipped arrow up against your temple and a crazy-assed deity-wannabee holding the bow. I'm gonna have to think about this one...
Beatnik Bob
Sep 21st, 2005, 9:02 PM
The Zohar says that G-d had to step-back from humanity in order for it to actually continue in existence. Because if G-d was too close. Humanity would cease to exist. That's one job of our spirit though: our connection to G-d so we are not totally in the dark, and cut-off from G-d.
Beatnik Bob
Sep 21st, 2005, 9:13 PM
HEY JAKE!!!!!!!!!!!! Im the son of G-d too!! :lol: :lol:
Edit: And i choose you Foelhe! *then mutters under his breath*.......not some ego-centric twinkie.
Edit: And i choose you Foelhe! *then mutters under his breath*.......not some ego-centric twinkie.
Philosopher Foelhe
Sep 21st, 2005, 10:21 PM
Jake, who has access to unlimited quantities of Twinkies
Ah, hell! Didn't realize I was running against a Twinkie guy! Well, I'm screwed. If you'll excuse me, I'll go prepare my concession speech.
Ah, hell! Didn't realize I was running against a Twinkie guy! Well, I'm screwed. If you'll excuse me, I'll go prepare my concession speech.
nrj
Sep 21st, 2005, 11:40 PM
Well, it's a hard one... Fascism and a guy who walks around with bows and arrows and says he is the son of god, or Foelhe, a perfectly sane person who got some good thinking and have a good attitude... Sorry, Jake, Foelhe has my vote. If you will countinue saying we are lesser then us, that we are not as good as you and that you're the son of god who wants to make us follow the Bible, then forget me voting for you.
Sure, you're system's good on some points, but I wouldn't follow you when you act like that.
Sure, you're system's good on some points, but I wouldn't follow you when you act like that.
Jake99
Sep 22nd, 2005, 12:26 PM
Lets see first off I do not love myself, I am a servant of yours and gods. Secondly I have done many things that none of you could or would. Thirdly the leaders of this world are a complete failure and I don't hear any of you suggesting another way of managing this planet. If you keep going in the same direction you will end up at the same destination. I am the best repairman this world has seen and all I see is people destroying things. I cannot keep up with your system. As presidents Chavez and Castro have said the world cannot afford to operate as America does. It is the most wasteful system ever used by far. Some say the increased storms on this planet are because of mans contributions to global warming and the US just keeps promoting the system that causes it. Dear, Knuckleheads its time to wake up.
And I do not need to read the bible it made perfect sense to me the first time I heard it and each time since. I do not see a puzzle as you do.
And I do not need to read the bible it made perfect sense to me the first time I heard it and each time since. I do not see a puzzle as you do.
Philosopher Foelhe
Sep 22nd, 2005, 12:42 PM
Lets see first off I do not love myself, I am a servant of yours and gods.
Every post you've made to "prove" you are God's chosen has sounded like a love-letter to your own abilities. Meanwhile you mock those of us who disagree with you and claim you are far superior to us. If that's not loving yourself, I don't know what is.
Secondly I have done many things that none of you could or would.
You managed a bakery. Con-friggin-gratulations. And I'm sure I've done many things YOU could or would not do. That doesn't make me the messiah, it just means I have strengths you don't, passions that you don't.
Thirdly the leaders of this world are a complete failure and I don't hear any of you suggesting another way of managing this planet.
Foolish man. Some of us understand that the world is not the pinnacle it could be, but we don't spit out random solutions because we know how hard it is to change things, and we understand absolute change must be taken one step at a time. I at least will continue to try to save the world, but I certainly don't think there's a easy fix-it-all band-aid we can throw on the problem.
Some say the increased storms on this planet are because of mans contributions to global warming and the US just keeps promoting the system that causes it.
Some people don't know what they're talking about. There have been massive storms before, they just don't happen very often. You can't say that because we were unlucky enough to catch one, that we're the cause.
And we're talking about a TSUNAMI here. A tsunami? You've heard the term? As in, "Caused by the earth moving, which is not something we mere humans can control"?
Dear, Knuckleheads its time to wake up.
The correct grammar is, "Dear Knuckleheads, it's time to wake up." You misplaced the comma and forgot the apostrophy. So, who's the knucklehead again?
And I do not need to read the bible it made perfect sense to me the first time I heard it and each time since.
Which would be fine, if you hadn't claimed earlier that you weren't even familiar with the bible. Your story doesn't stand up.
Every post you've made to "prove" you are God's chosen has sounded like a love-letter to your own abilities. Meanwhile you mock those of us who disagree with you and claim you are far superior to us. If that's not loving yourself, I don't know what is.
Secondly I have done many things that none of you could or would.
You managed a bakery. Con-friggin-gratulations. And I'm sure I've done many things YOU could or would not do. That doesn't make me the messiah, it just means I have strengths you don't, passions that you don't.
Thirdly the leaders of this world are a complete failure and I don't hear any of you suggesting another way of managing this planet.
Foolish man. Some of us understand that the world is not the pinnacle it could be, but we don't spit out random solutions because we know how hard it is to change things, and we understand absolute change must be taken one step at a time. I at least will continue to try to save the world, but I certainly don't think there's a easy fix-it-all band-aid we can throw on the problem.
Some say the increased storms on this planet are because of mans contributions to global warming and the US just keeps promoting the system that causes it.
Some people don't know what they're talking about. There have been massive storms before, they just don't happen very often. You can't say that because we were unlucky enough to catch one, that we're the cause.
And we're talking about a TSUNAMI here. A tsunami? You've heard the term? As in, "Caused by the earth moving, which is not something we mere humans can control"?
Dear, Knuckleheads its time to wake up.
The correct grammar is, "Dear Knuckleheads, it's time to wake up." You misplaced the comma and forgot the apostrophy. So, who's the knucklehead again?
And I do not need to read the bible it made perfect sense to me the first time I heard it and each time since.
Which would be fine, if you hadn't claimed earlier that you weren't even familiar with the bible. Your story doesn't stand up.
B.NyeTheUruk-Hai
Sep 22nd, 2005, 2:05 PM
The correct grammar is, "Dear Knuckleheads, it's time to wake up." You misplaced the comma and forgot the apostrophy. So, who's the knucklehead again?
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAA!!!!!!! ! Ya gotta love irony...
Which would be fine, if you hadn't claimed earlier that you weren't even familiar with the bible. Your story doesn't stand up.
Exactly, he's shooting himself in the foot. And another thing that I just realized is that the only internet "evidence" that Jake has supplied for us that shows that he was in court is a first-person account that was written by Jake himself! No third party evidence at all. But then again, Jake works in mysterious ways...
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAA!!!!!!! ! Ya gotta love irony...
Which would be fine, if you hadn't claimed earlier that you weren't even familiar with the bible. Your story doesn't stand up.
Exactly, he's shooting himself in the foot. And another thing that I just realized is that the only internet "evidence" that Jake has supplied for us that shows that he was in court is a first-person account that was written by Jake himself! No third party evidence at all. But then again, Jake works in mysterious ways...
midnight21
Sep 22nd, 2005, 3:50 PM
all of you may question where god is during all this. but the truth is, these things were already prophecied in the bible and they must happen. once these things have passed, jesus himself will come and a rapture will happen. then those left behind will undergo the tribulation and deal with the anti-christ and all kinds of unfortunate disasters.
Nobody will know when this will happen. not even the dead or the angels in heaven or jesus. only god himself. But until then, all what we can do is sit around and wait, looking for info and learing what to expect.
(as for the dead...they are probably already taken care of, though i'm no expert at what happens after people die in these events....)
but remember, this is the christian belief and i'm not forcing it on anybody. i'm just writing what was basically written in the bible...
Nobody will know when this will happen. not even the dead or the angels in heaven or jesus. only god himself. But until then, all what we can do is sit around and wait, looking for info and learing what to expect.
(as for the dead...they are probably already taken care of, though i'm no expert at what happens after people die in these events....)
but remember, this is the christian belief and i'm not forcing it on anybody. i'm just writing what was basically written in the bible...
B.NyeTheUruk-Hai
Sep 22nd, 2005, 4:10 PM
And I do not need to read the bible it made perfect sense to me the first time I heard it and each time since.
Unfortunately, you said in an early post that you've NEVER read the Bible and that you didn't know what the contents of the Bible were. Which is it, Fakester? Have you or have you not read the Bible? Make up your mind...
Unfortunately, you said in an early post that you've NEVER read the Bible and that you didn't know what the contents of the Bible were. Which is it, Fakester? Have you or have you not read the Bible? Make up your mind...
nrj
Sep 22nd, 2005, 4:10 PM
Please, let me hear this prophecies you're talking about. There's been LOADS of tsunamis in the past, not to mention hurricanes. And if you play with prophecies and words long enough, you'll get what you want.
Beatnik Bob
Sep 22nd, 2005, 6:14 PM
Ok Foelhe, answer me this: would a Christian worship Jake, because obviously he claims to be G-d's twin sist-I mean brother. And Jesus claimed to be God too. So if Christians worshiped Jesus just because he was supposedly a nice humble man, and they believed him to be divine, would Christians also worship G-d incarnated as a twinkie(Jake)? Because Jake claims to be a divine-bakery-worker. So we have to "deities" here. Would a Christian worship Jake because he is supposedly divine?
Philosopher Foelhe
Sep 22nd, 2005, 7:44 PM
... I think the overwhelming evidence thus far says that no, they would not. Judging from reactions on this site at least.
But Jesus also claimed to be a teacher, and Jake99 is, at least in some way, claiming to be a teacher as well. Perhaps he's not actually putting it that way, but he claims to know the best way for us to act in any situation, so I'd assume he's offering to teach us this. So, can you believe that Jesus was a great teacher without believing Jake is?
I know that's not a perfect example, but my point is, it's still possible to refuse to believe something, but continue to believe something similar because of the differences between those two statements.
But Jesus also claimed to be a teacher, and Jake99 is, at least in some way, claiming to be a teacher as well. Perhaps he's not actually putting it that way, but he claims to know the best way for us to act in any situation, so I'd assume he's offering to teach us this. So, can you believe that Jesus was a great teacher without believing Jake is?
I know that's not a perfect example, but my point is, it's still possible to refuse to believe something, but continue to believe something similar because of the differences between those two statements.
B.NyeTheUruk-Hai
Sep 23rd, 2005, 8:33 AM
Please, let me hear this prophecies you're talking about. There's been LOADS of tsunamis in the past, not to mention hurricanes. And if you play with prophecies and words long enough, you'll get what you want.
What's even funnier about these "prophecies" is that we've had a war that involved virtually the ENTIRE WORLD. And not just one world war, but TWO world wars! And guess what? We're still here, people! If anything were to herald the end of the world, you'd think that it would be a WORLD WAR. Stop waiting for something that's not going to happen and get on with your lives...
What's even funnier about these "prophecies" is that we've had a war that involved virtually the ENTIRE WORLD. And not just one world war, but TWO world wars! And guess what? We're still here, people! If anything were to herald the end of the world, you'd think that it would be a WORLD WAR. Stop waiting for something that's not going to happen and get on with your lives...
Mezurashi
Sep 23rd, 2005, 9:38 AM
I figured it out last night.
God is a voyeur and he hides in my bedroom whenever me and my lady are 'doing it.' I never see him but she always does, at least she keeps calling to him - makes me concerned she might have some 'Mary Mother of God' aspirations or something.
And sometimes God is laughing at me when I am suffering from the flu, or my own personal excesses, and usually in the bathroom.
And I'm sure God hangs out quite often in strip clubs ... people keep talking to him there too.
God is a voyeur and he hides in my bedroom whenever me and my lady are 'doing it.' I never see him but she always does, at least she keeps calling to him - makes me concerned she might have some 'Mary Mother of God' aspirations or something.
And sometimes God is laughing at me when I am suffering from the flu, or my own personal excesses, and usually in the bathroom.
And I'm sure God hangs out quite often in strip clubs ... people keep talking to him there too.
Jake99
Sep 23rd, 2005, 10:58 AM
I have been a teacher my whole life as a athlete, soldier and businessman. I have produced some big time winners. Every employee in several bakeries was trained by me personally in some way or another and I changed everything that was a problem as quickly as possible. I have fixed thousands of problems and none of them took more than 3 days to accomplish after approval or my direction. Chaos, accidents and waste to peace, safety and prosperity in moments. God works through me extremely quickly which is why I am so successful at what others ignore and continue to accept as ok. I would never let you worship me for I am not god but he can be me. I am a man, gods puppet if you will. Worship him but follow me to him, I am the truth and the way, no one comes to the father but by me. You can serve god as I do if you are on the right path as I am. I am not perfect or sinless or from a virgin birth but my success rate where others fail is about 99.95%. I have challenged many of your leaders and elect and the following is just one of many instances when I mopped the floor with your best attorneys in Boston. I have the right answer and the right defense every time and I prove that for your sake not mine. I can defend my position and I step forward and present it no matter what the odds and win every time. The following was not written by me and some of it is not even correct but it is close to what happened at Y2K. I had 20 hearings and 2 trials within a year of either side of Y2K and I won on every point of view, while pounding my fist and eluding to being the messiah, christ or whatever you call me. They found my chariot of fire, that god picked out two years earlier parked in front of a tomb after the bow incident. It added to the fear that I generated in the courtrooms where I or god manipulated every second of what took place. I handed them a time bomb and it blew up in their face 50 times. You need to fear god not me for he is not happy with what he sees through me, except for when he and I are in charge which is very pleasing to him and extremely advantageous to you. get smart and get behind me and the chaos ends very quickly as always.
<img src="http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b5/James99/scan3.jpg" alt="Image hosted by Photobucket.com">
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<img src="http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b5/James99/Jim.jpg" alt="Image hosted by Photobucket.com">
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Philosopher Foelhe
Sep 23rd, 2005, 11:03 AM
I have the right answer and the right defense every time and I prove that for your sake not mine.
And yet, with all of your ability to prove everyone wrong, you still can't convince anyone on this forum that you're truly blessed by God.
Y'know what, it doesn't matter. Even if you are God's chosen, I'm not interested in you. You worship a god that lets you threaten an innocent man with a bow and arrow? You worship a god that lets you lay off hundreds of workers and then shrug it off and blame "the system"?
You have no compassion, no empathy and no honor. Even if you are the chosen one, your god is not worth worshipping.
And yet, with all of your ability to prove everyone wrong, you still can't convince anyone on this forum that you're truly blessed by God.
Y'know what, it doesn't matter. Even if you are God's chosen, I'm not interested in you. You worship a god that lets you threaten an innocent man with a bow and arrow? You worship a god that lets you lay off hundreds of workers and then shrug it off and blame "the system"?
You have no compassion, no empathy and no honor. Even if you are the chosen one, your god is not worth worshipping.
Beatnik Bob
Sep 23rd, 2005, 4:55 PM
I have been a teacher my whole life as a athlete, soldier and businessman. I have produced some big time winners. Every employee in several bakeries was trained by me personally in some way or another and I changed everything that was a problem as quickly as possible. I have fixed thousands of problems and none of them took more than 3 days to accomplish after approval or my direction. Chaos, accidents and waste to peace, safety and prosperity in moments. God works through me extremely quickly which is why I am so successful at what others ignore and continue to accept as ok. I would never let you worship me for I am not god but he can be me. I am a man, gods puppet if you will. Worship him but follow me to him, I am the truth and the way, no one comes to the father but by me. You can serve god as I do if you are on the right path as I am. I am not perfect or sinless or from a virgin birth but my success rate where others fail is about 99.95%. I have challenged many of your leaders and elect and the following is just one of many instances when I mopped the floor with your best attorneys in Boston. I have the right answer and the right defense every time and I prove that for your sake not mine. I can defend my position and I step forward and present it no matter what the odds and win every time. The following was not written by me and some of it is not even correct but it is close to what happened at Y2K. I had 20 hearings and 2 trials within a year of either side of Y2K and I won on every point of view, while pounding my fist and eluding to being the messiah, christ or whatever you call me. They found my chariot of fire, that god picked out two years earlier parked in front of a tomb after the bow incident. It added to the fear that I generated in the courtrooms where I or god manipulated every second of what took place. I handed them a time bomb and it blew up in their face 50 times. You need to fear god not me for he is not happy with what he sees through me, except for when he and I are in charge which is very pleasing to him and extremely advantageous to you. get smart and get behind me and the chaos ends very quickly as always.
Yes, i can totally understand how smart your god is by him making the incredibly genius choice of picking a good bakery worker to lead the whole world to salvation! By the way.......you wouldn't happen to be one of those whacked-out-jesus-worshipers would you? Because since you are supposedly"God's Son", you know that one of G-d's attributes is Einsoff: or nothingness without end. Thus, no form.
Yes, i can totally understand how smart your god is by him making the incredibly genius choice of picking a good bakery worker to lead the whole world to salvation! By the way.......you wouldn't happen to be one of those whacked-out-jesus-worshipers would you? Because since you are supposedly"God's Son", you know that one of G-d's attributes is Einsoff: or nothingness without end. Thus, no form.
Beatnik Bob
Sep 23rd, 2005, 5:37 PM
Wait..........is this who you put your foot on Jake???
http://www.cnn.com/SPECIALS/2001/bush.100/images/cut.row2.col4.bush.pic.jpg
Edit: I added the http thing for everyones convinience. Thanks for pointing out my mistake nrj :2thumbs:
http://www.cnn.com/SPECIALS/2001/bush.100/images/cut.row2.col4.bush.pic.jpg
Edit: I added the http thing for everyones convinience. Thanks for pointing out my mistake nrj :2thumbs:
nrj
Sep 24th, 2005, 3:20 AM
LOL Bob! Talk about cracking the shit out of him! But you forgot to write: //http when you were adding the picture. Just as a reminder in the future.
Jake99
Sep 24th, 2005, 10:10 AM
George Bush is the anti christ at this point in time, Satan is as god is, invisible. I am the human soldier in the God VS Satan war. I went to church from age 7-10 and 1 hour a week during the school year from 9-13. I also receive the "Sayings of Jesus" in Email and I agree with it because it is how I think and do. If you understood it the way I live it, we would have very few problems. You think a being a bakery manager for Wonder/Hostess is an easy task? That company fell like a stone the day I left because I refused to lay off another worker while the CEO gets paid millions to wreck the place and the lives of the work force. I say its the toughest job I have seen, its very fast like a Nascar race times ten and it takes a pit crew and many smart people and extensive machinery to make it happen. My teams finished first almost every time, nationally. No matter what is ordered and how much, it is a daily deadline you have to meet. Every minute counts and is counted as well as every man hour and material. I am the only one that I know of that has been consistently successful at getting and keeping it under control. I could count my mistakes and failures over 21 years and thousands of decisions and system changes on one hand and none of the mistakes were serious. And by the way Jesus was a carpenter who was gifted and guided the same as I am, I don't need your education to outperform you. Miracles are simple to perform you just have to be on the path that creates them. I don't need a hundred people to do the work of 50 and this system needs 50 for the lobs that do not get done, I did the right thing by automating, this system just has no experience at getting a job done efficiently with the work force that is available. Your leaders are the worst managers I could ever imagine and that is based on the fruit from their tree. Just how many large companies are going to file for bankruptcy before you wake up?
nrj
Sep 24th, 2005, 10:37 AM
I say its the toughest job I have seen Wait till you see world management...
I could count my mistakes and failures over 21 years and thousands of decisions and system changes on one hand and none of the mistakes were serious. When it comes to world management, every mistak is serious.
And by the way Jesus was a carpenter who was gifted and guided the same as I am, I don't need your education to outperform you. So, son of god, you wanna try you're luck at Starcraft, or will you bail again?
I could count my mistakes and failures over 21 years and thousands of decisions and system changes on one hand and none of the mistakes were serious. When it comes to world management, every mistak is serious.
And by the way Jesus was a carpenter who was gifted and guided the same as I am, I don't need your education to outperform you. So, son of god, you wanna try you're luck at Starcraft, or will you bail again?
Philosopher Foelhe
Sep 24th, 2005, 2:58 PM
I went to church from age 7-10 and 1 hour a week during the school year from 9-13.
My God! You changed your story AGAIN! First you'd never heard the bible at all, then you'd heard it once and understood it instantly, then you trained on it for six years? Which is it?
You're the son of God, shouldn't you be doing miracles? Shouldn't you be worrying about people, not corporations? Why did you threaten a judge who was just doing his job? You're the person with "all the answers", why couldn't you convince that CEO to take a paycut? Why can't you convince any of us who you are? Stop throwing the same old schtick around and actually think about some of the harder questions.
My God! You changed your story AGAIN! First you'd never heard the bible at all, then you'd heard it once and understood it instantly, then you trained on it for six years? Which is it?
You're the son of God, shouldn't you be doing miracles? Shouldn't you be worrying about people, not corporations? Why did you threaten a judge who was just doing his job? You're the person with "all the answers", why couldn't you convince that CEO to take a paycut? Why can't you convince any of us who you are? Stop throwing the same old schtick around and actually think about some of the harder questions.
Sammy56
Sep 25th, 2005, 9:55 PM
I left because I refused to lay off another worker while the CEO gets paid millions to wreck the place and the lives of the work force.
As I recall, a few months back in another thread you and me had a debate about laying of workers and making everything automated. You thought that you could make everything better by doing just that, but now you are saying you refused to lay of more workers? I don't get it Jake, which is it? Lay them off or keep them?
Philosopher, as much as I admire your attempt to try and reason with Jake, it is probably not going to get you very far. I tried to for quite awhile and I have all but given up. He thinks he is the son of God and nothing we say is going to change his mind.
As I recall, a few months back in another thread you and me had a debate about laying of workers and making everything automated. You thought that you could make everything better by doing just that, but now you are saying you refused to lay of more workers? I don't get it Jake, which is it? Lay them off or keep them?
Philosopher, as much as I admire your attempt to try and reason with Jake, it is probably not going to get you very far. I tried to for quite awhile and I have all but given up. He thinks he is the son of God and nothing we say is going to change his mind.
nrj
Sep 25th, 2005, 10:47 PM
Well, I can pretty much agree about that one, Sammy. I even made a thread to make him realise how screwed up his reasoning is, but he wont listen to that either.
Sammy56
Sep 25th, 2005, 11:36 PM
I even made a thread to make him realise how screwed up his reasoning is, but he wont listen to that either.
I know, I've looked at it a couple times. I refuse to participate though, because Jake would just frustrate me to much. By the way, I love your signature.
I know, I've looked at it a couple times. I refuse to participate though, because Jake would just frustrate me to much. By the way, I love your signature.
VegasRonin
Sep 26th, 2005, 12:17 AM
You guys mock Jake but he's obviously part of the new trinity. You have the Creme filling, the Angel cake, and the Baker. The road to salvation can only be achieved by embracing the twinkie and all of its subsequent parts; for they are One!
nrj
Sep 26th, 2005, 5:23 AM
I think I've found the best oppurtunity ever to say "LOL".
B.NyeTheUruk-Hai
Sep 26th, 2005, 9:17 AM
Anything BUT JESUS?
I CLEARLY mentioned Christians here, Cherisa, which covers Jesus by default. Come on...
I CLEARLY mentioned Christians here, Cherisa, which covers Jesus by default. Come on...
Jake99
Sep 26th, 2005, 10:07 AM
Anything BUT JESUS?[/QUOTE]
Thanks Cherisa you hit the nail on the head. I have never owned a bible and I have never studied one, childhood education is a different thing. Jesus was a carpenter.
Thanks Cherisa you hit the nail on the head. I have never owned a bible and I have never studied one, childhood education is a different thing. Jesus was a carpenter.
Jake99
Sep 26th, 2005, 11:08 AM
Asking the CEO to take a pay cut solves nothing, its the system that needs to be changed and I believe in standard rates of pay. I want to eliminate as many jobs as possible so I have the work force to do all that needs to be done. Get rid of the military and recycle the weapons into sea side resort type housing that can handle category 6 hurricanes. Even after Jesus performed many miracles he had no friends and no believers and he searched on foot to try and find one. Luckily I have the internet, I save my feet for the tennis court. As a manager I was not looking for friends, I was solving problems constantly and setting an example regardless of what people said about me. It was my job to judge everything and everyone and I never got a complaint from an employee or the company about my efforts or decisions. I was assisted by a divine power which allowed me to work at many times the speed of anyone else you have ever heard of, the bakery was the perfect place to perform. The same divinity has put on athletic displays like you have never seen before on many fields of play. Some said I was nuts for even caring as I do, others in the largest US unions said I should be the president of ITT when I was 25 and president of the US at 40. I don't want either job and I did finish last of 450 in high school which makes the calls even more alarming. I am a rebel and a miracle worker, and my intent is to bring peace prosperity and long life to all on earth. Results are the only thing that matters to me and all I see in this world is smoke and mirrors and a total lack of managerial ability. I promise you that God is not happy with your ways and leadership, technology on the other hand he is very pleased with and so am I. Let me show you how to use what you have already developed and how to get to the new world. Sincerely, Jimbo
Ps: I am known by many names, about 25.
Ps: I am known by many names, about 25.
nrj
Sep 26th, 2005, 11:19 AM
I am known by many names, about 25. Let me guess a few of them:
Fake99, The-great-bringer-of :bs:, Paul Newman wannabe, the-psycho-with-bows-and arrows, the faker... oh, I mean baker.
Fake99, The-great-bringer-of :bs:, Paul Newman wannabe, the-psycho-with-bows-and arrows, the faker... oh, I mean baker.
B.NyeTheUruk-Hai
Sep 26th, 2005, 11:57 AM
technology on the other hand he is very pleased with and so am I
Oh, both of you are pleased with nuclear weapons and advanced weaponry, are you?
Oh, both of you are pleased with nuclear weapons and advanced weaponry, are you?
Philosopher Foelhe
Sep 26th, 2005, 1:59 PM
Philosopher, as much as I admire your attempt to try and reason with Jake, it is probably not going to get you very far. I tried to for quite awhile and I have all but given up. He thinks he is the son of God and nothing we say is going to change his mind.
... Yeah, you're probably right. Unfortunately that little voice in the back of my head demands that I try to save this idiot from himself, so I won't be giving up quite yet. Kudos for having the brains not to get involved here. :D
Anything BUT JESUS?
Cherisa, I find that Nye only openly mocks Christianity when someone is using it to defend sheer stupidity. Which, sadly, happens a lot. Also, given it's detailed "mythology", violent history and widespread use, Christianity is inherently mockable.
I have never owned a bible and I have never studied one, childhood education is a different thing.
Ladies and gentlemen, watch in amazement as Jake changes his story again, claiming he knows nothing about the bible...
Even after Jesus performed many miracles he had no friends and no believers and he searched on foot to try and find one.
And then CLAIMS BIBLICAL KNOWLEDGE in the very next post! Jake, do you like making your story sound absolutely absurd, or can you just not keep a story straight to save your life?
And... where did I put that bible? *ruffle ruffle ruffle* Ah. You are incorrect, sir. According to the Book of Matthew, when Jesus returned from the desert, he called Simon Peter, Andrew, James and John to him. This was before any miracles took place.
Star employee blah blah blah favorite in the office blah blah blah
Jake, if you can pull up some invoices or something showing me exactly how successful your business was, that would be great. Could we at least see this amazing, miraculous success you've had?
Besides, just because you've done well in business doesn't mean you're the messiah. Hell, my mother works as a secretary at the city electric company; when she started, the place was a slow, disorganized beast, but in two years she's organized the place to top efficiency. Is she your competition in the eyes of God, or is she just good at her job?
I promise you that God is not happy with your ways and leadership, technology on the other hand he is very pleased with and so am I.
First of all, God is never going to be happy with the leadership. The only way we will ever have good leaders is if we tear down the government and start over. And you know why? Because systems tend toward entropy.
Even if your plan comes into play, and even if it works alright at the beginning, it will eventually fail. Flaws will come into the system, making that system fall. And because you're so assured you've got the perfect plan here, I bet you have no safety net for when people start falling through the cracks. Am I right?
Ps: I am known by many names, about 25.
Yeah, I've got a couple names for you too. :2fu:
... Yeah, you're probably right. Unfortunately that little voice in the back of my head demands that I try to save this idiot from himself, so I won't be giving up quite yet. Kudos for having the brains not to get involved here. :D
Anything BUT JESUS?
Cherisa, I find that Nye only openly mocks Christianity when someone is using it to defend sheer stupidity. Which, sadly, happens a lot. Also, given it's detailed "mythology", violent history and widespread use, Christianity is inherently mockable.
I have never owned a bible and I have never studied one, childhood education is a different thing.
Ladies and gentlemen, watch in amazement as Jake changes his story again, claiming he knows nothing about the bible...
Even after Jesus performed many miracles he had no friends and no believers and he searched on foot to try and find one.
And then CLAIMS BIBLICAL KNOWLEDGE in the very next post! Jake, do you like making your story sound absolutely absurd, or can you just not keep a story straight to save your life?
And... where did I put that bible? *ruffle ruffle ruffle* Ah. You are incorrect, sir. According to the Book of Matthew, when Jesus returned from the desert, he called Simon Peter, Andrew, James and John to him. This was before any miracles took place.
Star employee blah blah blah favorite in the office blah blah blah
Jake, if you can pull up some invoices or something showing me exactly how successful your business was, that would be great. Could we at least see this amazing, miraculous success you've had?
Besides, just because you've done well in business doesn't mean you're the messiah. Hell, my mother works as a secretary at the city electric company; when she started, the place was a slow, disorganized beast, but in two years she's organized the place to top efficiency. Is she your competition in the eyes of God, or is she just good at her job?
I promise you that God is not happy with your ways and leadership, technology on the other hand he is very pleased with and so am I.
First of all, God is never going to be happy with the leadership. The only way we will ever have good leaders is if we tear down the government and start over. And you know why? Because systems tend toward entropy.
Even if your plan comes into play, and even if it works alright at the beginning, it will eventually fail. Flaws will come into the system, making that system fall. And because you're so assured you've got the perfect plan here, I bet you have no safety net for when people start falling through the cracks. Am I right?
Ps: I am known by many names, about 25.
Yeah, I've got a couple names for you too. :2fu:
Jake99
Sep 26th, 2005, 6:07 PM
I have worked with groups of people in the 100 to 500 person range from nearly every corner of the Earth. Some of them don't even speak english and it makes training a bigger challenge. That is a far cry from organizing an office, which I also do. I wear every hat and actually do every job just to see how it can be improved as I fix every part of the system. If you can find anyone who has more knowledge on any job in the numerous facilities I have managed I would be surprized. I leave no stone unturned and I listen to and resolve every complaint until their are none. I wish I could post documents that prove what I did but that would be unlawful. If you believe in me, someday the documents will be available and the difference between my leadership and those before me is startlingly clear. I don't take no for an answer and just because someone else tried and failed to make a good idea work does not mean I do not try again. Its where I find the most success, doing what others say wont work because they tried before. A good idea is usually a good idea, it just depends on the effort to make it work.
And as far as the so called honorable judges doing their job. they violate laws and rights on an every day basis because they can get away with it. Had I broken the law as many times as they did in just my cases, I would be behind bars for life. Arrests without rights being read or reason being presented, no bail allowed, no charges filed, illegal incarcerations, failure to present a case, going to trial without a case, restraining orders without cause or reason and the list goes on and on. Maybe you want to be led by lawyers but I want to put them out of business. Maybe Hillary Clinton can show you the way her and her husband have been involved in many mysterious deaths and corruption. Funny how people who are ready to testify against then turn up dead and paper trails get shredded. She might even win the presidential election.
And as far as the so called honorable judges doing their job. they violate laws and rights on an every day basis because they can get away with it. Had I broken the law as many times as they did in just my cases, I would be behind bars for life. Arrests without rights being read or reason being presented, no bail allowed, no charges filed, illegal incarcerations, failure to present a case, going to trial without a case, restraining orders without cause or reason and the list goes on and on. Maybe you want to be led by lawyers but I want to put them out of business. Maybe Hillary Clinton can show you the way her and her husband have been involved in many mysterious deaths and corruption. Funny how people who are ready to testify against then turn up dead and paper trails get shredded. She might even win the presidential election.
Sammy56
Sep 27th, 2005, 12:22 AM
Originally Posted by Philosopher Foelhe
... Yeah, you're probably right. Unfortunately that little voice in the back of my head demands that I try to save this idiot from himself, so I won't be giving up quite yet.
I know how you feel. I tried to reason with Jake for what seemed like forever. Eventually I gave up because he would never answer my questions, just post more about how he is the messiah because of his so call "superior" genetics and the fact that everyone in his family is a wonderful athlete. Plus of course, all of the crimes he has committed, which even though they threated people lives, we obviously done for the good of all humanity.
Originally Posted by Jake99
Some of them don't even speak english and it makes training a bigger challenge.
Well, I could interpret this in one of two ways. First, is that you do not speak any languages other then english, because if you did, you would have no problem training those who do not speak english. Since you are the "Son of God" I figured you would have no problem learning other languages, but perhaps I am wrong. My second interpretation is that you look down on those who cannot speak english and see them as not as intelligent as those who do speak it. I do not remember when or where, but you once said english should become the language of the entire world. I of course disagreed because once I started studying another language last year, I realized how much english was a cobbled together mess of a language and how there would be many choices better suited if there were to be an international standard language. Either point here can be used as evidence against your claims, however.
Originally Posted by Jake99
If you can find anyone who has more knowledge on any job in the numerous facilities I have managed I would be surprized.
Okay, I think I will give this a shot using myself as an example. I do not have an official "job", but I am a student, which is a huge amount of hard work right now and which I do consider to be a "job" of sorts. I am not a half bad student if I do say so myself. I make straight A's and I am in the top 3% of my class. You, on the other hand, graduated last in you class. Obviously, I think I am the better student, and therefore more successful at this "job" then you were.
Originally Posted by Jake99
If you believe in me, someday the documents will be available
And if we don't believe you, the documents will never appear probably because some corrupt, immoral judge will have burned them to keep the world from knowing the power of Jake99. Right...
Originally Posted by Jake99
And as far as the so called honorable judges doing their job. they violate laws and rights on an every day basis because they can get away with it.
I knew we would get to those corrupt, immoral judges eventually!
Originally Posted by Jake99
Maybe you want to be led by lawyers but I want to put them out of business.
You know, one of my best friends is a lawyer. I really do not understand why you think they are all so evil. Of course, there probably are nasty lawyers out there working for only their own gain and not caring about harming other people, but I dare you to name one profession that does not have people like that.
Curse you Philosopher. I have been totally able to ignore Jake for the past couple of months but now you have gotten me to try and make him see reason again. A fruitless task!
... Yeah, you're probably right. Unfortunately that little voice in the back of my head demands that I try to save this idiot from himself, so I won't be giving up quite yet.
I know how you feel. I tried to reason with Jake for what seemed like forever. Eventually I gave up because he would never answer my questions, just post more about how he is the messiah because of his so call "superior" genetics and the fact that everyone in his family is a wonderful athlete. Plus of course, all of the crimes he has committed, which even though they threated people lives, we obviously done for the good of all humanity.
Originally Posted by Jake99
Some of them don't even speak english and it makes training a bigger challenge.
Well, I could interpret this in one of two ways. First, is that you do not speak any languages other then english, because if you did, you would have no problem training those who do not speak english. Since you are the "Son of God" I figured you would have no problem learning other languages, but perhaps I am wrong. My second interpretation is that you look down on those who cannot speak english and see them as not as intelligent as those who do speak it. I do not remember when or where, but you once said english should become the language of the entire world. I of course disagreed because once I started studying another language last year, I realized how much english was a cobbled together mess of a language and how there would be many choices better suited if there were to be an international standard language. Either point here can be used as evidence against your claims, however.
Originally Posted by Jake99
If you can find anyone who has more knowledge on any job in the numerous facilities I have managed I would be surprized.
Okay, I think I will give this a shot using myself as an example. I do not have an official "job", but I am a student, which is a huge amount of hard work right now and which I do consider to be a "job" of sorts. I am not a half bad student if I do say so myself. I make straight A's and I am in the top 3% of my class. You, on the other hand, graduated last in you class. Obviously, I think I am the better student, and therefore more successful at this "job" then you were.
Originally Posted by Jake99
If you believe in me, someday the documents will be available
And if we don't believe you, the documents will never appear probably because some corrupt, immoral judge will have burned them to keep the world from knowing the power of Jake99. Right...
Originally Posted by Jake99
And as far as the so called honorable judges doing their job. they violate laws and rights on an every day basis because they can get away with it.
I knew we would get to those corrupt, immoral judges eventually!
Originally Posted by Jake99
Maybe you want to be led by lawyers but I want to put them out of business.
You know, one of my best friends is a lawyer. I really do not understand why you think they are all so evil. Of course, there probably are nasty lawyers out there working for only their own gain and not caring about harming other people, but I dare you to name one profession that does not have people like that.
Curse you Philosopher. I have been totally able to ignore Jake for the past couple of months but now you have gotten me to try and make him see reason again. A fruitless task!
Philosopher Foelhe
Sep 27th, 2005, 12:50 AM
Arrests without rights being read or reason being presented, no bail allowed, no charges filed, illegal incarcerations, failure to present a case, going to trial without a case, restraining orders without cause or reason and the list goes on and on.
... Gosh, Jake, eight different crimes and only TWO of them have a thing to do with judges. Well... maybe three. Could any AOers versed in law please tell me if "failure to present a case" falls on the lawyer's shoulders? It seems like a no-brainer, but I'll admit I don't know much about the legal system.
Beyond that you have "Restraining orders without cause or reason". Uh, Jake, are you sure the judge didn't at least make a mistake here? Even if there was no reason, that doesn't mean a law was broken, just that a judge might've made a mistake. (Of course, if I was dealing with someone who claimed to be the son of God, I'd slap a restraining order on his ass so fast he'd leave the courtroom spinning. Maybe that's just me.)
"Going to trial without a case" is kind've serious, I guess, but I don't think that calls for a lifetime sentance.
... I'd continue chopping this post into bits, but it seems Sammy has taken it upon herself to help me with this task.
First, is that you do not speak any languages other then english, because if you did, you would have no problem training those who do not speak english. Since you are the "Son of God" I figured you would have no problem learning other languages, but perhaps I am wrong.
... Whoa. Logical. I wouldn't've thought of that. Kind of strange that a god who normally makes an appearance through "speaking in tongues" can't understand Spanish.
Okay, I think I will give this a shot using myself as an example. I do not have an official "job", but I am a student, which is a huge amount of hard work right now and which I do consider to be a "job" of sorts. I am not a half bad student if I do say so myself. I make straight A's and I am in the top 3% of my class. You, on the other hand, graduated last in you class. Obviously, I think I am the better student, and therefore more successful at this "job" then you were.
Technically, Jake said it had to be the facilities he "managed", so school doesn't count.
Realistically, Jake, why did you do so horribly in school? I wouldn't think Algebra would be a match for the messiah. Not that I'm one to talk, but then I'm not claiming to be Godspawn.
You know, one of my best friends is a lawyer. I really do not understand why you think they are all so evil.
The problem with criminal defense lawyers, at least, is that they pretty much have to defend everyone to the best of their ability. So, if they know their client committed a murder, but if it's possible to get them off, there's a frustrating conflict between work ethics and just plain ethics. Sometimes they take the low road
Not saying I think lawyers are all bad, because I don't. But they do get thrown into these difficult situations pretty regularly, so I can see why some people would find them suspect.
Curse you Philosopher. I have been totally able to ignore Jake for the past couple of months but now you have gotten me to try and make him see reason again.
If I'm going down, I'm taking you all with me! :D
Seriously, though, I'm glad I did. Your debate skill always impresses me, and it's been far too long since I've seen you cut loose on someone. Brava!
... Gosh, Jake, eight different crimes and only TWO of them have a thing to do with judges. Well... maybe three. Could any AOers versed in law please tell me if "failure to present a case" falls on the lawyer's shoulders? It seems like a no-brainer, but I'll admit I don't know much about the legal system.
Beyond that you have "Restraining orders without cause or reason". Uh, Jake, are you sure the judge didn't at least make a mistake here? Even if there was no reason, that doesn't mean a law was broken, just that a judge might've made a mistake. (Of course, if I was dealing with someone who claimed to be the son of God, I'd slap a restraining order on his ass so fast he'd leave the courtroom spinning. Maybe that's just me.)
"Going to trial without a case" is kind've serious, I guess, but I don't think that calls for a lifetime sentance.
... I'd continue chopping this post into bits, but it seems Sammy has taken it upon herself to help me with this task.
First, is that you do not speak any languages other then english, because if you did, you would have no problem training those who do not speak english. Since you are the "Son of God" I figured you would have no problem learning other languages, but perhaps I am wrong.
... Whoa. Logical. I wouldn't've thought of that. Kind of strange that a god who normally makes an appearance through "speaking in tongues" can't understand Spanish.
Okay, I think I will give this a shot using myself as an example. I do not have an official "job", but I am a student, which is a huge amount of hard work right now and which I do consider to be a "job" of sorts. I am not a half bad student if I do say so myself. I make straight A's and I am in the top 3% of my class. You, on the other hand, graduated last in you class. Obviously, I think I am the better student, and therefore more successful at this "job" then you were.
Technically, Jake said it had to be the facilities he "managed", so school doesn't count.
Realistically, Jake, why did you do so horribly in school? I wouldn't think Algebra would be a match for the messiah. Not that I'm one to talk, but then I'm not claiming to be Godspawn.
You know, one of my best friends is a lawyer. I really do not understand why you think they are all so evil.
The problem with criminal defense lawyers, at least, is that they pretty much have to defend everyone to the best of their ability. So, if they know their client committed a murder, but if it's possible to get them off, there's a frustrating conflict between work ethics and just plain ethics. Sometimes they take the low road
Not saying I think lawyers are all bad, because I don't. But they do get thrown into these difficult situations pretty regularly, so I can see why some people would find them suspect.
Curse you Philosopher. I have been totally able to ignore Jake for the past couple of months but now you have gotten me to try and make him see reason again.
If I'm going down, I'm taking you all with me! :D
Seriously, though, I'm glad I did. Your debate skill always impresses me, and it's been far too long since I've seen you cut loose on someone. Brava!
salvador
Sep 27th, 2005, 6:03 AM
I want to eliminate as many jobs as possible so I have the work force to do all that needs to be done.I was with you until the word "so."
Get rid of the military and recycle the weapons into sea side resort type housing that can handle category 6 hurricanes.Ah! This is an excellent idea. Why does no one listen to him?
I am known by many names, about 25.Wait... It's not! ... It is! ... LEGION!
How the hell are you, you old bugger? Still possessing pigs these days? We should get together and commandeer a vagrant.
Get rid of the military and recycle the weapons into sea side resort type housing that can handle category 6 hurricanes.Ah! This is an excellent idea. Why does no one listen to him?
I am known by many names, about 25.Wait... It's not! ... It is! ... LEGION!
How the hell are you, you old bugger? Still possessing pigs these days? We should get together and commandeer a vagrant.
evilwill
Sep 27th, 2005, 7:20 AM
Originally Posted by Jake99
Get rid of the military and recycle the weapons into sea side resort type housing that can handle category 6 hurricanes.
Show me a building that could withstand such forces that isn't a damn bunker.
Get rid of the military and recycle the weapons into sea side resort type housing that can handle category 6 hurricanes.
Show me a building that could withstand such forces that isn't a damn bunker.
Mezurashi
Sep 27th, 2005, 7:30 AM
The All Power Full is IN MY PANTS where it's always been (maniacal laughter).
and the last time I told the Pres of a Comapny what to do he listened to me as well, made some cash and his company runs better now (true story).
But this does not make me the Son Of God, though I will consider upping myself to Son of Buddha - the long and winding road ...
and the last time I told the Pres of a Comapny what to do he listened to me as well, made some cash and his company runs better now (true story).
But this does not make me the Son Of God, though I will consider upping myself to Son of Buddha - the long and winding road ...
Jake99
Sep 27th, 2005, 9:57 AM
I have been charged with many crimes but never convicted of one, and I was prosecuted to teach me a lesson about standing against and as a way for god to teach the law to you and reveal me to you. I do like some lawyers but most of them will do anything to win. I want the truth and they want a yes or no answer which distorts the truth intentionally. The truth and nothing but the truth cannot be told without discussion.
I had no problem teaching people who did not speak my language they did fine, I teach and lead by example and I am very good at hand signals and demonstrations. The only reason I would convert the world to English is because I speak it and you have to pick one if you want to get efficient. World business is mainly done in English and although their may be better languages most of the worlds technology is understood in English. If god stands within me as I say he does then it is in your best interest to speak my language.
My siblings finished high in all their classes through college and very little of what they were taught has been put to use. I say pick your field of work and get that education and if you want to change jobs get that education and stop wasting time teaching people how to do everything. I had no use for anything more than basics and filling my head with (useless to me) information was a waste of time and brainpower. Your brain is like a computer, you can fill it with junk if you want like who invented what in what year. I intentionally refused to fill my head with garbage.
I know its tough to build strong enough housing to handle the forces of nature and if it looks like a bunker so be it. Paint the bunker into the landscape so it looks natural and does the job. I dislike the single family pink houses with the useless black shutters, do what you want on the inside. And use your labor to recycle everything instead of hiding it under a pile of dirt.
I had no problem teaching people who did not speak my language they did fine, I teach and lead by example and I am very good at hand signals and demonstrations. The only reason I would convert the world to English is because I speak it and you have to pick one if you want to get efficient. World business is mainly done in English and although their may be better languages most of the worlds technology is understood in English. If god stands within me as I say he does then it is in your best interest to speak my language.
My siblings finished high in all their classes through college and very little of what they were taught has been put to use. I say pick your field of work and get that education and if you want to change jobs get that education and stop wasting time teaching people how to do everything. I had no use for anything more than basics and filling my head with (useless to me) information was a waste of time and brainpower. Your brain is like a computer, you can fill it with junk if you want like who invented what in what year. I intentionally refused to fill my head with garbage.
I know its tough to build strong enough housing to handle the forces of nature and if it looks like a bunker so be it. Paint the bunker into the landscape so it looks natural and does the job. I dislike the single family pink houses with the useless black shutters, do what you want on the inside. And use your labor to recycle everything instead of hiding it under a pile of dirt.
nrj
Sep 27th, 2005, 10:05 AM
Ok, Jake, here's a challenge for you: translate the swedish word "lagom" to english.
Sammy56
Sep 27th, 2005, 3:54 PM
Originally Posted by Philosopher Foelhe
Seriously, though, I'm glad I did. Your debate skill always impresses me, and it's been far too long since I've seen you cut loose on someone. Brava!
Thank you Philosopher. It's nice to receive a compliment from someone who I consider to be very intelligent and wise. I love the way you are able to be level headed in a debate. You present all sides of the issue and argue your opinion at the same time without starting a flame war.
Originally Posted by Jake99
I have been charged with many crimes but never convicted of one
Well, maybe you got lucky or maybe you just had a good lawyer, but if I we to pick someone to run the entire world, I doubt I would choose someone who had a long list of charges filed against themselves, regardless of whether they were convicted or not.
Originally Posted by Jake99
I want the truth and they want a yes or no answer which distorts the truth intentionally.
I don't think so. Sometimes the answer that is truthful, regardless of how complicated the question, is quite simple. It's when you get a question with grey areas that a yes or no will usually not suffice, but that doesn't mean someone who is trying to make it simple by saying just yes or no is deliberately going out of their way to trick you. Thats a big problem here at AO. Most of the questions we debate over do not have yes or no answers, or if they do, we do not know enough to give for sure the correct one.
Originally Posted by Jake99
I had no problem teaching people who did not speak my language
Then why did you say they are more difficult to train? If you speak their language, then there should be no problems, unless you are assuming that those who do not speak English are not as intelligent as those who do. That is not very messiah-like if you ask me.
Originally Posted by Jake99
The only reason I would convert the world to English is because I speak it...If god stands within me as I say he does then it is in your best interest to speak my language.
Well Jake, a lot of people speak English. I think it is the second most common language in the world. But that doesn't disprove the fact that it is one of the hardest languages to learn and that there are many more that are better suited for an international language. Besides, I think that having the entire world speak the same language would hurt us. Language is part of heritage; it helps identify you with a certain group of people. I think we should embrace our differences, not destroy them for the sake of efficiency. Now, you also say that it is in everyones best interest to speak English because you do and you are the "chosen" of God. Even if you somehow were, this makes no sense to me. I think it is well within God's reach to understand different languages, and I do not see why his son would have a problem with it either. Technically, if you go by the Bible (which I have no idea if you do or not because you have changed your story so many times), the first language God used to communicate with humans is Hebrew, which is a long-shot from English.
Originally Posted by nrj
Ok, Jake, here's a challenge for you: translate the swedish word "lagom" to english.
The problem with this challenge is that Jake could either use his messianic powers, or a simple online dictionary and we would never know the difference. As a matter a fact, I did the latter myself and it took me less then a minute to do so.
Seriously, though, I'm glad I did. Your debate skill always impresses me, and it's been far too long since I've seen you cut loose on someone. Brava!
Thank you Philosopher. It's nice to receive a compliment from someone who I consider to be very intelligent and wise. I love the way you are able to be level headed in a debate. You present all sides of the issue and argue your opinion at the same time without starting a flame war.
Originally Posted by Jake99
I have been charged with many crimes but never convicted of one
Well, maybe you got lucky or maybe you just had a good lawyer, but if I we to pick someone to run the entire world, I doubt I would choose someone who had a long list of charges filed against themselves, regardless of whether they were convicted or not.
Originally Posted by Jake99
I want the truth and they want a yes or no answer which distorts the truth intentionally.
I don't think so. Sometimes the answer that is truthful, regardless of how complicated the question, is quite simple. It's when you get a question with grey areas that a yes or no will usually not suffice, but that doesn't mean someone who is trying to make it simple by saying just yes or no is deliberately going out of their way to trick you. Thats a big problem here at AO. Most of the questions we debate over do not have yes or no answers, or if they do, we do not know enough to give for sure the correct one.
Originally Posted by Jake99
I had no problem teaching people who did not speak my language
Then why did you say they are more difficult to train? If you speak their language, then there should be no problems, unless you are assuming that those who do not speak English are not as intelligent as those who do. That is not very messiah-like if you ask me.
Originally Posted by Jake99
The only reason I would convert the world to English is because I speak it...If god stands within me as I say he does then it is in your best interest to speak my language.
Well Jake, a lot of people speak English. I think it is the second most common language in the world. But that doesn't disprove the fact that it is one of the hardest languages to learn and that there are many more that are better suited for an international language. Besides, I think that having the entire world speak the same language would hurt us. Language is part of heritage; it helps identify you with a certain group of people. I think we should embrace our differences, not destroy them for the sake of efficiency. Now, you also say that it is in everyones best interest to speak English because you do and you are the "chosen" of God. Even if you somehow were, this makes no sense to me. I think it is well within God's reach to understand different languages, and I do not see why his son would have a problem with it either. Technically, if you go by the Bible (which I have no idea if you do or not because you have changed your story so many times), the first language God used to communicate with humans is Hebrew, which is a long-shot from English.
Originally Posted by nrj
Ok, Jake, here's a challenge for you: translate the swedish word "lagom" to english.
The problem with this challenge is that Jake could either use his messianic powers, or a simple online dictionary and we would never know the difference. As a matter a fact, I did the latter myself and it took me less then a minute to do so.
nrj
Sep 27th, 2005, 5:44 PM
Sammy, you have not translated that word to swedish. There is no word for "lagom" in english. It's not medium, it's not correct, it's not rightly and it's not "just about right". Language scientists have tried for years to find a proper equivalent, and they've failed.
Mezurashi
Sep 27th, 2005, 5:46 PM
sort of like 'giri' in Japanese...
nrj
Sep 27th, 2005, 5:51 PM
Hm... Funny, I study japanese, but have not yet heard that word.
Mezurashi
Sep 27th, 2005, 6:01 PM
it's one of those that can't be translated into English as one word. it's sort of a combination of Duty, Obligation and Debt at the same time, but it also has aspects of Service, Altruism and so forth. Hard to explain in English, I've tried, but I understand it's meaning because me first language is Japanese.
And, hey, anyone out there speak Navaho? I heard that's one of the toughest to learn as a second language.
And, hey, anyone out there speak Navaho? I heard that's one of the toughest to learn as a second language.
Jake99
Sep 27th, 2005, 6:07 PM
I don't just defend charges and human and legal rights I also have prosecuted them. Its a demonstration of who is guiding me and the failures of the judicial system. I have probably disciplined 30 union workers for poor work performance, a few up to discharge and not once did I get a complaint from the Teamsters or Bakery, Confectionary and Tobacco workers unions, my judgements were fair. The B.C.T. went to arbitration once, and with an attorney that never even addressed the judge, I presented and won the case in less than an hour. I only was given one days notice before going to court. My attorneys for my many defenses never presented a defense that I did not tell them to present and I won from the witness stand under oath with fire coming out of my mouth.
Yes or no is seldom a clear answer to a complicated question and it is heavily used to distort the truth by lawyers. I guess by limiting the answers they think their distortions are ethical. Its a long way from the whole truth and I have told them so, turning their questions into my questions. A trial is a debate just like it is here.
I only say it is more difficult to train people of foreign languages ( to me) because the verbal skills are gone from the equation. God may understand every language but I do not, what I do understand is that we are all the same and if we spoke the same the training of people and management of the world would be easier. Heritage is just as inefficient and unimportant as holidays. 24/7/365 is the way to go, we are trying to unify into one people, put the holidays and weekends away forever. Today is Peter Pumpkin day and tomorrow is Sally's birthday is just a bunch of garbage that we do not need. Start ups and shut downs are inefficient and so is giving everyone the same days off.
Yes or no is seldom a clear answer to a complicated question and it is heavily used to distort the truth by lawyers. I guess by limiting the answers they think their distortions are ethical. Its a long way from the whole truth and I have told them so, turning their questions into my questions. A trial is a debate just like it is here.
I only say it is more difficult to train people of foreign languages ( to me) because the verbal skills are gone from the equation. God may understand every language but I do not, what I do understand is that we are all the same and if we spoke the same the training of people and management of the world would be easier. Heritage is just as inefficient and unimportant as holidays. 24/7/365 is the way to go, we are trying to unify into one people, put the holidays and weekends away forever. Today is Peter Pumpkin day and tomorrow is Sally's birthday is just a bunch of garbage that we do not need. Start ups and shut downs are inefficient and so is giving everyone the same days off.
B.NyeTheUruk-Hai
Sep 27th, 2005, 7:11 PM
Language scientists have tried for years to find a proper equivalent, and they've failed.
I bet that Fake... errr... Jake will find the english equivalent! He's defeated all of our best language scientists like a rented mule in the best universities in the world, AND he actually FAILED grade 2 english class WHILE squeezing out solid milk chocolate Twinkies from his holy hole...
I bet that Fake... errr... Jake will find the english equivalent! He's defeated all of our best language scientists like a rented mule in the best universities in the world, AND he actually FAILED grade 2 english class WHILE squeezing out solid milk chocolate Twinkies from his holy hole...
Beatnik Bob
Sep 27th, 2005, 7:45 PM
whacked-out-jesus-worshipers
What?! So it's OK to believe in Budda, Vishna, Isis, Satan, Anything BUT JESUS?
Did I ever say it was better to worship Indra than Jesus? If you're going to be pagan and rip-offish Christianity is the best route to take :2thumbs:
Also Buddhists don't worship Buddha, they follow his teachings that he achieved through enlightenment. And even if they did, as you seem to believe, why would that be so bad? Because Buddha and Jesus were both humans.
What?! So it's OK to believe in Budda, Vishna, Isis, Satan, Anything BUT JESUS?
Did I ever say it was better to worship Indra than Jesus? If you're going to be pagan and rip-offish Christianity is the best route to take :2thumbs:
Also Buddhists don't worship Buddha, they follow his teachings that he achieved through enlightenment. And even if they did, as you seem to believe, why would that be so bad? Because Buddha and Jesus were both humans.
Sammy56
Sep 27th, 2005, 9:58 PM
Originally Posted by nrj
Sammy, you have not translated that word to swedish. There is no word for "lagom" in english. It's not medium, it's not correct, it's not rightly and it's not "just about right".
I apologize. When I found an online dictionary it told me it meant "just about correct".
Originally Posted by Jake99
God may understand every language but I do not
BUT YOU ARE THE FREAKING SON OF GOD!!! YOU CAN PERFORM MIRACLES, BUT YOU CANNOT UNDERSTAND OTHER LANGUAGES??? WTF JAKE??? THAT MAKES NO SENSE!!!
Originally Posted by Jake99
Heritage is just as inefficient and unimportant as holidays.
No, no, no, I do not agree with this at all. Neither heritage nor holidays are unimportant or inefficient. Heritage is what makes us unique. I think we should celebrate our differences. And also, I'm glad you are so great that you can afford to work seven days a week. How about you work on holidays and weekend while the rest of us enjoy a break. Plus, I'd think you of all people would at least enjoy Christmas and Easter, but I guess not.
Sammy, you have not translated that word to swedish. There is no word for "lagom" in english. It's not medium, it's not correct, it's not rightly and it's not "just about right".
I apologize. When I found an online dictionary it told me it meant "just about correct".
Originally Posted by Jake99
God may understand every language but I do not
BUT YOU ARE THE FREAKING SON OF GOD!!! YOU CAN PERFORM MIRACLES, BUT YOU CANNOT UNDERSTAND OTHER LANGUAGES??? WTF JAKE??? THAT MAKES NO SENSE!!!
Originally Posted by Jake99
Heritage is just as inefficient and unimportant as holidays.
No, no, no, I do not agree with this at all. Neither heritage nor holidays are unimportant or inefficient. Heritage is what makes us unique. I think we should celebrate our differences. And also, I'm glad you are so great that you can afford to work seven days a week. How about you work on holidays and weekend while the rest of us enjoy a break. Plus, I'd think you of all people would at least enjoy Christmas and Easter, but I guess not.
Philosopher Foelhe
Sep 28th, 2005, 1:16 AM
I have been charged with many crimes but never convicted of one
... Were you not just talking about how the Clintons were practically getting away with murder?
And, I'm far too lazy to actually look this up, but weren't you hit with a restraining order? Not only does that impunge your perfect record (no, a restraining order does not count as a crime, but stop whimpering about the details) but since it was so "undeserved", it doesn't make sense that you were such a god in the court. You screwed up on the restraining order, why didn't you have any screw-ups in legal court?
I had no use for anything more than basics and filling my head with (useless to me) information was a waste of time and brainpower.
That's the dumbest excuse I ever heard! (Untrue. Sorry. Forgot the other things Jake has said on this forum.) I had horrible grades in school, honest truth, but I still understood the details and could've done well if I'd bothered to take the time. And that's me with my puny, mortal brain - what about you, oh messiah? What subjects did the Son of God find unable to grasp with a trifling of effort?
Thank you Philosopher. It's nice to receive a compliment from someone who I consider to be very intelligent and wise. I love the way you are able to be level headed in a debate. You present all sides of the issue and argue your opinion at the same time without starting a flame war.
Aw, shucks! :D Well, even if Jake continues to be stubborn and elusive, at least we get to work together while ripping apart a ridiculous and illogical argument! Fun fun!
There is no word for "lagom" in english.
sort of like 'giri' in Japanese...
... Such words exist? The poet in me takes this as a heroic challenge! Not that I'm crazy enough to think I could solve this problem, but hey, it might be fun to give it a shot!
Yes or no is seldom a clear answer to a complicated question and it is heavily used to distort the truth by lawyers.
Which is why we have a lovely, lovely thing called "cross-examination". Have you ever actually been in a courtroom? Your inability to grasp the most basic ideas of law is blowing my mind, and I got all I know about court procedure from "Judging Amy". I hate to think of the physical pain any actual lawyers reading this crap have to go through.
24/7/365 is the way to go, we are trying to unify into one people, put the holidays and weekends away forever.
Y'know, I love the fact that you think we should allow you to lead PEOPLE, since if everything you say is true, that's the one thing you have absolutely no grasp of. Do you not realize the psychological advantages to occasionally cutting loose and celebrating? If you work people seven days a week, they're not going to be as productive or focused.
If you're going to be pagan and rip-offish Christianity is the best route to take
Bob, do the words "on topic" mean nothing to you? Stop frothing at the mouth every time you hear the word "Christianity". It doesn't cast doubt on the other religion, it casts doubt on your mental stability.
WTF JAKE??? THAT MAKES NO SENSE!!!
Then we're all on the same page! Excellent. Let's precede to Jake's next carefully constructed post, "Unbelievable Bullshit in D Minor".
... Were you not just talking about how the Clintons were practically getting away with murder?
And, I'm far too lazy to actually look this up, but weren't you hit with a restraining order? Not only does that impunge your perfect record (no, a restraining order does not count as a crime, but stop whimpering about the details) but since it was so "undeserved", it doesn't make sense that you were such a god in the court. You screwed up on the restraining order, why didn't you have any screw-ups in legal court?
I had no use for anything more than basics and filling my head with (useless to me) information was a waste of time and brainpower.
That's the dumbest excuse I ever heard! (Untrue. Sorry. Forgot the other things Jake has said on this forum.) I had horrible grades in school, honest truth, but I still understood the details and could've done well if I'd bothered to take the time. And that's me with my puny, mortal brain - what about you, oh messiah? What subjects did the Son of God find unable to grasp with a trifling of effort?
Thank you Philosopher. It's nice to receive a compliment from someone who I consider to be very intelligent and wise. I love the way you are able to be level headed in a debate. You present all sides of the issue and argue your opinion at the same time without starting a flame war.
Aw, shucks! :D Well, even if Jake continues to be stubborn and elusive, at least we get to work together while ripping apart a ridiculous and illogical argument! Fun fun!
There is no word for "lagom" in english.
sort of like 'giri' in Japanese...
... Such words exist? The poet in me takes this as a heroic challenge! Not that I'm crazy enough to think I could solve this problem, but hey, it might be fun to give it a shot!
Yes or no is seldom a clear answer to a complicated question and it is heavily used to distort the truth by lawyers.
Which is why we have a lovely, lovely thing called "cross-examination". Have you ever actually been in a courtroom? Your inability to grasp the most basic ideas of law is blowing my mind, and I got all I know about court procedure from "Judging Amy". I hate to think of the physical pain any actual lawyers reading this crap have to go through.
24/7/365 is the way to go, we are trying to unify into one people, put the holidays and weekends away forever.
Y'know, I love the fact that you think we should allow you to lead PEOPLE, since if everything you say is true, that's the one thing you have absolutely no grasp of. Do you not realize the psychological advantages to occasionally cutting loose and celebrating? If you work people seven days a week, they're not going to be as productive or focused.
If you're going to be pagan and rip-offish Christianity is the best route to take
Bob, do the words "on topic" mean nothing to you? Stop frothing at the mouth every time you hear the word "Christianity". It doesn't cast doubt on the other religion, it casts doubt on your mental stability.
WTF JAKE??? THAT MAKES NO SENSE!!!
Then we're all on the same page! Excellent. Let's precede to Jake's next carefully constructed post, "Unbelievable Bullshit in D Minor".
Mezurashi
Sep 28th, 2005, 7:25 AM
... Such words exist? The poet in me takes this as a heroic challenge! Not that I'm crazy enough to think I could solve this problem, but hey, it might be fun to give it a shot!
an English word that is difficult/impossible to translate into other languages ... I've run into some in my time but I can't think of any. I was trying to give nrj something to chew on and you guys could have a contest to see who could 'invent' a word fastest.
Jake99 is living in an institution, heavily medicated, and he came from a background of wealth and highly domineering, controlling parents. I estimate Jake's age to be between 25 and 40. he is probably sexually neutral, or he's has been chemically castrated due to youthful excesses. he feels great personal guilt for having hurt people, but he does not have the werewithal or personal intergity to apologize or make restitution, so he overcompensates by inventing a helpful persona to tell the world how much better he can make it. his experiencs in he working field include every job his parents arranged for him and he failed at all of them. He attended the best schools only to wash out before the end of the first semester. his life has been a series of irreconcilable failures and his own debauched hedonism causing him no end of grief.
Jake will live life pampered by those paid to keep him safe and away from mainstream society, though if his parents lose their cash he will probably wind up in some Public Hell Bedlam Pit like everyone else with no money.
**this ten second psychoanalysis brought to you by Assumption & Intuition - Causing and Solving the World's Problems Throughout History**
an English word that is difficult/impossible to translate into other languages ... I've run into some in my time but I can't think of any. I was trying to give nrj something to chew on and you guys could have a contest to see who could 'invent' a word fastest.
Jake99 is living in an institution, heavily medicated, and he came from a background of wealth and highly domineering, controlling parents. I estimate Jake's age to be between 25 and 40. he is probably sexually neutral, or he's has been chemically castrated due to youthful excesses. he feels great personal guilt for having hurt people, but he does not have the werewithal or personal intergity to apologize or make restitution, so he overcompensates by inventing a helpful persona to tell the world how much better he can make it. his experiencs in he working field include every job his parents arranged for him and he failed at all of them. He attended the best schools only to wash out before the end of the first semester. his life has been a series of irreconcilable failures and his own debauched hedonism causing him no end of grief.
Jake will live life pampered by those paid to keep him safe and away from mainstream society, though if his parents lose their cash he will probably wind up in some Public Hell Bedlam Pit like everyone else with no money.
**this ten second psychoanalysis brought to you by Assumption & Intuition - Causing and Solving the World's Problems Throughout History**
Jake99
Sep 28th, 2005, 10:54 AM
I want to run the world system 24/7/365 and only work you for a few years. Maybe you have Mon, Tues, Wed Thurs off or Sat, Sun, Mon, Tues, but the system operates every day, no holidays or weekends. Just work days and non work days depending on your schedule. I can keep a parent home with children, educate in the home and reduce travel time by 50% in a matter of a few months. If you only work 3 days a week the other 4 you can call your holiday. Christmas is a joke that supports the retail market place which I stand against.
I have lived in the lap of luxury my whole life and I never asked for or received assistance from my parents beyond age 19, I am now 50. When you corner the market in telephone sales and invest in real estate the chances of ever going broke are extremely remote. In fact I knew no one in the businesses I worked for. If I stood with my parents I would be on the 50' yacht or at the beach cottage with the rest of my family in Borne Ma. or at the many high end luxury homes they own in metro west Massachusetts for the holidays. The last I lived with my parents I was 15. I then lived with my grandfather until I was 19, my grandfather I agreed with my parents I do not.
Many doctors have examined me and have found no mental disorders and they have testified to that in court. They originally called my words grandiose until they found out that what I said I did was true. At that point it is just a statement of fact even if you say it is bragging. Its not bragging its a demonstration of divinity and ability to do what others have not been able to do. Attention deficit disorder is a minor problem but it is also an extreme advantage, which means its not a problem.
I am not sexually active, but I have plenty of opportunity. At least once a year I get a kiss from a woman I just met and many women half my age have asked to date me, usually they are divorced with kids but its still a compliment. I dated some of the best looking women I have seen in my youth and many said my x was one of the prettiest they ever saw. Anyone of my 6 siblings could make, and one has made the cover of beauty magazines. And that was Bride magazine twice in her 30s after having triplets.
Yes I was given a restraining order that was dismissed as soon as I presented my case in court (very unusual) and then it was presented to a different court the next day (highly unethical) and served again. And 3 days later I was arrested for doing what the police department instructed me to do. At that point the judge who had me arrested sent his assistant to bail me out and apologize. That too has never been done before, I was being set up without cause which was later testified to at a dangerousness hearing. What was I supposed to do wait until their case improved before calling them on their illegal procedures?
And I spent at least 10 years preventing lost time injuries and mental and physical stress in the work place. What did bother me was that I had to automate to make the injuries go away which caused unemployment in areas that have had employment problems. I reduced accident costs by about 500,000 a year, but many preferred the injuries to the unemployment. And I do not lie it leaves you open to failure.
I find history to be irrelevant as in who did what and when, I am in the here and now just give me the info that someone else found first. I can grasp all subjects, like I said my siblings and parents are my witness to my ability, they are top end scholars. I had better things to learn and calculus is not one of them.
I have been to court about 30 times, on the witness stand in my own defense twice, directed every word of my defense and never lost on even one point of view.
I have lived in the lap of luxury my whole life and I never asked for or received assistance from my parents beyond age 19, I am now 50. When you corner the market in telephone sales and invest in real estate the chances of ever going broke are extremely remote. In fact I knew no one in the businesses I worked for. If I stood with my parents I would be on the 50' yacht or at the beach cottage with the rest of my family in Borne Ma. or at the many high end luxury homes they own in metro west Massachusetts for the holidays. The last I lived with my parents I was 15. I then lived with my grandfather until I was 19, my grandfather I agreed with my parents I do not.
Many doctors have examined me and have found no mental disorders and they have testified to that in court. They originally called my words grandiose until they found out that what I said I did was true. At that point it is just a statement of fact even if you say it is bragging. Its not bragging its a demonstration of divinity and ability to do what others have not been able to do. Attention deficit disorder is a minor problem but it is also an extreme advantage, which means its not a problem.
I am not sexually active, but I have plenty of opportunity. At least once a year I get a kiss from a woman I just met and many women half my age have asked to date me, usually they are divorced with kids but its still a compliment. I dated some of the best looking women I have seen in my youth and many said my x was one of the prettiest they ever saw. Anyone of my 6 siblings could make, and one has made the cover of beauty magazines. And that was Bride magazine twice in her 30s after having triplets.
Yes I was given a restraining order that was dismissed as soon as I presented my case in court (very unusual) and then it was presented to a different court the next day (highly unethical) and served again. And 3 days later I was arrested for doing what the police department instructed me to do. At that point the judge who had me arrested sent his assistant to bail me out and apologize. That too has never been done before, I was being set up without cause which was later testified to at a dangerousness hearing. What was I supposed to do wait until their case improved before calling them on their illegal procedures?
And I spent at least 10 years preventing lost time injuries and mental and physical stress in the work place. What did bother me was that I had to automate to make the injuries go away which caused unemployment in areas that have had employment problems. I reduced accident costs by about 500,000 a year, but many preferred the injuries to the unemployment. And I do not lie it leaves you open to failure.
I find history to be irrelevant as in who did what and when, I am in the here and now just give me the info that someone else found first. I can grasp all subjects, like I said my siblings and parents are my witness to my ability, they are top end scholars. I had better things to learn and calculus is not one of them.
I have been to court about 30 times, on the witness stand in my own defense twice, directed every word of my defense and never lost on even one point of view.
B.NyeTheUruk-Hai
Sep 28th, 2005, 2:19 PM
I estimate Jake's age to be between 25 and 40. he is probably sexually neutral, or he's has been chemically castrated due to youthful excesses.
He was castrated due to exposure to the many chemicals that make up Twinkies...
When you corner the market in telephone sales
I KNEW IT!!! Jake is the asshole behind those annoying phone calls while I'm eating dinner!!! I don't need my ducts cleaned, Jake, so piss off!
I have lived in the lap of luxury my whole life
I suspect that you're intimately familiar with the laps of MANY men...
He was castrated due to exposure to the many chemicals that make up Twinkies...
When you corner the market in telephone sales
I KNEW IT!!! Jake is the asshole behind those annoying phone calls while I'm eating dinner!!! I don't need my ducts cleaned, Jake, so piss off!
I have lived in the lap of luxury my whole life
I suspect that you're intimately familiar with the laps of MANY men...
Philosopher Foelhe
Sep 28th, 2005, 2:24 PM
Many doctors have examined me and have found no mental disorders and they have testified to that in court. They originally called my words grandiose until they found out that what I said I did was true. At that point it is just a statement of fact even if you say it is bragging.
Hold up! You said you proved everything you said true. That tells me two things.
1) A psychiatrist would demand solid documentation and unquestionable proof, the same way we all have. So, you were able to prove much of this... why can't you now?
2) Did you tell the doctors you were the messiah? Obviously you must've, since you claim you don't lie, and an omission of the truth that large would be a definite lie. So, how did you prove that? Can you perchance do it again?
I suspect that you're intimately familiar with the laps of MANY men...
Oi! *thwaps Nye* We'll have none of that, thank you very much.
Hold up! You said you proved everything you said true. That tells me two things.
1) A psychiatrist would demand solid documentation and unquestionable proof, the same way we all have. So, you were able to prove much of this... why can't you now?
2) Did you tell the doctors you were the messiah? Obviously you must've, since you claim you don't lie, and an omission of the truth that large would be a definite lie. So, how did you prove that? Can you perchance do it again?
I suspect that you're intimately familiar with the laps of MANY men...
Oi! *thwaps Nye* We'll have none of that, thank you very much.
B.NyeTheUruk-Hai
Sep 28th, 2005, 2:34 PM
Oi! *thwaps Nye* We'll have none of that, thank you very much.
Sorry, Foelhe! This is a jab meant solely for Jake. It's just too much fun to make jabs like that at homophobes! But please, PLEASE don't tell me that you want to taste the creamy filling of Jake's Twinkie... not that there's anything wrong with that! ;-)
*NOTE- Thank Darwin that Vox isn't still here or he'd give you a mouthful... err... EARful regarding your wicked ways! Giggidy giggidy giggidy...
Sorry, Foelhe! This is a jab meant solely for Jake. It's just too much fun to make jabs like that at homophobes! But please, PLEASE don't tell me that you want to taste the creamy filling of Jake's Twinkie... not that there's anything wrong with that! ;-)
*NOTE- Thank Darwin that Vox isn't still here or he'd give you a mouthful... err... EARful regarding your wicked ways! Giggidy giggidy giggidy...
Philosopher Foelhe
Sep 28th, 2005, 2:43 PM
It's just too much fun to make jabs like that at homophobes!
True. Carry on.
But please, PLEASE don't tell me that you want to taste the creamy filling of Jake's Twinkie... not that there's anything wrong with that!
Nah, I like my men coherent.
Besides, it's bad enough meeting a guy's parents in normal circumstances. Can you imagine having to go up to God Almighty and say something like, "Hi, I'm banging your son. It's nice to meet you."
*NOTE- Thank Darwin that Vox isn't still here or he'd give you a mouthful... err... EARful regarding your wicked ways! Giggidy giggidy giggidy...
Ah, I remember Vox from my lurking days. Yeah, nothing quite as satisfying in my book as reading a post and thinking, "I may be doomed to hell, but at least I can parse a sentance."
True. Carry on.
But please, PLEASE don't tell me that you want to taste the creamy filling of Jake's Twinkie... not that there's anything wrong with that!
Nah, I like my men coherent.
Besides, it's bad enough meeting a guy's parents in normal circumstances. Can you imagine having to go up to God Almighty and say something like, "Hi, I'm banging your son. It's nice to meet you."
*NOTE- Thank Darwin that Vox isn't still here or he'd give you a mouthful... err... EARful regarding your wicked ways! Giggidy giggidy giggidy...
Ah, I remember Vox from my lurking days. Yeah, nothing quite as satisfying in my book as reading a post and thinking, "I may be doomed to hell, but at least I can parse a sentance."
Sammy56
Sep 28th, 2005, 4:31 PM
First off, I am going to thank Nye and Philosopher for a great laugh. You guys are freaking hysterical! Now, on the the serious stuff...
Originally Posted by Jake99
If I stood with my parents I would be on the 50' yacht or at the beach cottage with the rest of my family in Borne Ma. or at the many high end luxury homes they own in metro west Massachusetts for the holidays.
I want to run the world system 24/7/365 and only work you for a few years.
Most businesses do not have the means to works 24/7, even if it is only temporarily. And what about after those few years you work people? How will they support themselves? I asked the question the last time you and I were in a debate, and I did not get a satisfactory answer then, but I would really enjoy one now. Plus, by only working people for a few years you are severely going to limit both a persons advancement opportunities and the workforce in general. There just is not enough people in the country to work for 5 years and then retire before thirty. You would collapse the economy.
Originally Posted by Jake99
Christmas is a joke that supports the retail market place which I stand against.
Name one thing in the modern world you do not stand against, because it seems like the only thing you support is your own agenda, which has a tendency to randomly change.
Originally Posted by Jake99
I have lived in the lap of luxury my whole life
You know Jake, that is great. I am glad you had such an easy life, but most people out there have not. How can you relate to them? You do not know what it is like to be poor, suppressed by your superiors, rejected by your peers, abused by you spouse, or even abused by your parents. Until you can go through the same experiences as your followers and relate to their pain, you will never be a successful leader.
Originally Posted by Jake99
If I stood with my parents I would be on the 50' yacht or at the beach cottage with the rest of my family in Borne Ma. or at the many high end luxury homes they own in metro west Massachusetts for the holidays.
Just more proof for my point above...
Originally Posted by Jake99
Many doctors have examined me and have found no mental disorders and they have testified to that in court.
You honestly expect us to believe this? If so, you are going to have to provide us with some proof. REAL proof.
Originally Posted by Jake99
Attention deficit disorder is a minor problem but it is also an extreme advantage, which means its not a problem.
Don't you just love contradictory statements?
Originally Posted by Jake99
I am not sexually active, but I have plenty of opportunity. At least once a year I get a kiss from a woman I just met
Congratulations Romeo. But honestly, is sex something the messiah should be thinking about constantly? I mean, I think he might be more preoccupied in saving the world and all that, but I guess not.
Originally Posted by Jake99
many women half my age have asked to date me, usually they are divorced with kids but its still a compliment.
Why would it not be a compliment? I mean, they are probably single mothers and them finding the time to think about a man seems to me like it would be a bigger compliment then one coming from someone who does not have kids. What, do you have something against divorces?
Originally Posted by Jake99
many said my x was one of the prettiest they ever saw
Guess not...
Originally Posted by Jake99
Anyone of my 6 siblings could make, and one has made the cover of beauty magazines. And that was Bride magazine twice in her 30s after having triplets.
And how much plastic surgery? I am sure there was plenty of money for it anyway, as you lived in luxury houses when you were younger and probably still do now.
Originally Posted by Jake99
And I do not lie it leaves you open to failure.
No kidding. But you said earlier you have never failed at any task. Which is it? Or have you changed your story again?
Originally Posted by Jake99
I find history to be irrelevant
You shouldn't. History repeats itself over and over. If you do not study the past, you cannot hope to understand the future.
Originally Posted by Jake99
I said my siblings and parents are my witness to my ability, they are top end scholars.
Please Jake, tell me why the fact that your parents and siblings are intelligent makes you the messiah? Really, I think it is a question of your intelligence, not theirs. You are not the messiah because of the talents of other people. I don't think you are the messiah at all as a matter of fact, but the only way you have a hope of changing my mind is to provide proof, but that seems to be something you cannot accomplish.
Originally Posted by Jake99
If I stood with my parents I would be on the 50' yacht or at the beach cottage with the rest of my family in Borne Ma. or at the many high end luxury homes they own in metro west Massachusetts for the holidays.
I want to run the world system 24/7/365 and only work you for a few years.
Most businesses do not have the means to works 24/7, even if it is only temporarily. And what about after those few years you work people? How will they support themselves? I asked the question the last time you and I were in a debate, and I did not get a satisfactory answer then, but I would really enjoy one now. Plus, by only working people for a few years you are severely going to limit both a persons advancement opportunities and the workforce in general. There just is not enough people in the country to work for 5 years and then retire before thirty. You would collapse the economy.
Originally Posted by Jake99
Christmas is a joke that supports the retail market place which I stand against.
Name one thing in the modern world you do not stand against, because it seems like the only thing you support is your own agenda, which has a tendency to randomly change.
Originally Posted by Jake99
I have lived in the lap of luxury my whole life
You know Jake, that is great. I am glad you had such an easy life, but most people out there have not. How can you relate to them? You do not know what it is like to be poor, suppressed by your superiors, rejected by your peers, abused by you spouse, or even abused by your parents. Until you can go through the same experiences as your followers and relate to their pain, you will never be a successful leader.
Originally Posted by Jake99
If I stood with my parents I would be on the 50' yacht or at the beach cottage with the rest of my family in Borne Ma. or at the many high end luxury homes they own in metro west Massachusetts for the holidays.
Just more proof for my point above...
Originally Posted by Jake99
Many doctors have examined me and have found no mental disorders and they have testified to that in court.
You honestly expect us to believe this? If so, you are going to have to provide us with some proof. REAL proof.
Originally Posted by Jake99
Attention deficit disorder is a minor problem but it is also an extreme advantage, which means its not a problem.
Don't you just love contradictory statements?
Originally Posted by Jake99
I am not sexually active, but I have plenty of opportunity. At least once a year I get a kiss from a woman I just met
Congratulations Romeo. But honestly, is sex something the messiah should be thinking about constantly? I mean, I think he might be more preoccupied in saving the world and all that, but I guess not.
Originally Posted by Jake99
many women half my age have asked to date me, usually they are divorced with kids but its still a compliment.
Why would it not be a compliment? I mean, they are probably single mothers and them finding the time to think about a man seems to me like it would be a bigger compliment then one coming from someone who does not have kids. What, do you have something against divorces?
Originally Posted by Jake99
many said my x was one of the prettiest they ever saw
Guess not...
Originally Posted by Jake99
Anyone of my 6 siblings could make, and one has made the cover of beauty magazines. And that was Bride magazine twice in her 30s after having triplets.
And how much plastic surgery? I am sure there was plenty of money for it anyway, as you lived in luxury houses when you were younger and probably still do now.
Originally Posted by Jake99
And I do not lie it leaves you open to failure.
No kidding. But you said earlier you have never failed at any task. Which is it? Or have you changed your story again?
Originally Posted by Jake99
I find history to be irrelevant
You shouldn't. History repeats itself over and over. If you do not study the past, you cannot hope to understand the future.
Originally Posted by Jake99
I said my siblings and parents are my witness to my ability, they are top end scholars.
Please Jake, tell me why the fact that your parents and siblings are intelligent makes you the messiah? Really, I think it is a question of your intelligence, not theirs. You are not the messiah because of the talents of other people. I don't think you are the messiah at all as a matter of fact, but the only way you have a hope of changing my mind is to provide proof, but that seems to be something you cannot accomplish.
liberdave
Sep 28th, 2005, 4:37 PM
sweet, I came across this article and I think Beatnik Bob needs to comment on this... http://www.mg.co.za/articlePage.aspx?articleid=251463&area=/insight/insight__international/
Jake99
Sep 29th, 2005, 12:47 PM
That's exactly what Jesus did.
I have experienced much of your pain to the extreme with the exception of the things that would hinder my success. It would be pretty tough to help others if I had trouble helping myself. You had better be sucessful and extremely smart if you want to stand against and survive to complete your mission. I want you to live better than I have and I have had it all. Much of what I had I did not even need. My focus is and has been since I was a child to resolve the conflict, suffering and waste on this planet. That has been my focus and specialty as a manager for what I would call the most difficult and challenging manufacturing operations I know of.
Take college for instance, we separate children from their home so they can learn things they may never use and let them learn for themself how to live in an environment that is uncontrolled and in many ways dangerous, a waste of time and very expensive. I like the way the military and unions train, pick your profession and in very short order you are productivly in the work force with all the knowledge and on the job training you need. And if after a commitment period you wish to try something else, bid on it and get trained and placed for that purpose. And your credits and benefits go with you from job to job for life. Ability combined with proper education can make a surgeon out of a 16 year old, and if he works until 30 in a world that has few accidents, you will have to make room for the next generation and retire him. If I taught you what I know about being a manager and an engineer you could be as effective as I have been in 1 year and it took me 20 years. I did it the hard way because their were no successful managers to train me. I turned many failures into winners just by showing them how to easily do what they had not been able to do. Peace, prosperity and consistency is what I converted total chaos into.
I have been in jail and in a mental hospital, the military, the work force, in courts. in leadership roles, owned 7 homes, separated from my child and divorced. I have stood up to and defeated countless bullies and solved countless systematic problems that are hurting people and causing waste. I can have anything I want if I submit to the ways of this world. But instead I spend everything I have trying to help people like you who I have never even seen. I see many people on the news that are in desperate trouble and I have yet to hear of a problem that they have that I cannot solve legally, permanently and quickly.
No I did not admit that I was the christ when examined by doctors and they were not aware of that to my knowledge. I was behind bars and the judicial system wanted me to stay there for standing against them, and they knew I was claiming to be the christ by my words and actions. The judicial system was up against their worst nightmare, a judge who outranked them and a man who was way smarter and more accomplished than they had encountered before. It was a blind mental examination and I responded from a legal and general point of view in defense of my actions. I did 20 days the first time I stood up to them and 44 the second and 1 the third and I saw many people being mistreated and drugged for just being unfortunate and mentally stressed out from life in general. I did not ask to see my files but many of the doctors and orderlies said I was the most gifted and normal person they had seen and I was the only one to ever just walk out of those institutions with no restrictions or requirements and I was never drugged.
I have felt the pain in my hands, heart, back and wallet and I did that on purpose with purpose when I did not have to. If I wont do the job I wont let anyone else do it either and I do not approve of working hard. So I experience the hard work and redesign the system based on my personal experience doing the job. Most often just watching and listening to complaints and looking at results is enough to get busy finding a better way. And I communicate all of my intentions in writing to all persons affected in advance of changing anything. And if I make a mistake I admit it in writing and communicate as to how it happened and what not to as well as what to do. I would have far fewer businesses and only make great products. Democratically evaluate every product as a consumer and get rid of private business. A convenience store is not nearly as convenient as a direct distribution system. Order all products over the internet and provide services 24/7/365. Don't stop because its Saturday, stop because you ran out of work to do. Equal opportunity and make room for the next generation to build and maintain their own homes and environment.
Cherisa is the closest to understanding me because she understands that my ways are not your ways. I am not of this world, I am of the next and new world here on Earth. Sometimes I ramble sorry.
I have experienced much of your pain to the extreme with the exception of the things that would hinder my success. It would be pretty tough to help others if I had trouble helping myself. You had better be sucessful and extremely smart if you want to stand against and survive to complete your mission. I want you to live better than I have and I have had it all. Much of what I had I did not even need. My focus is and has been since I was a child to resolve the conflict, suffering and waste on this planet. That has been my focus and specialty as a manager for what I would call the most difficult and challenging manufacturing operations I know of.
Take college for instance, we separate children from their home so they can learn things they may never use and let them learn for themself how to live in an environment that is uncontrolled and in many ways dangerous, a waste of time and very expensive. I like the way the military and unions train, pick your profession and in very short order you are productivly in the work force with all the knowledge and on the job training you need. And if after a commitment period you wish to try something else, bid on it and get trained and placed for that purpose. And your credits and benefits go with you from job to job for life. Ability combined with proper education can make a surgeon out of a 16 year old, and if he works until 30 in a world that has few accidents, you will have to make room for the next generation and retire him. If I taught you what I know about being a manager and an engineer you could be as effective as I have been in 1 year and it took me 20 years. I did it the hard way because their were no successful managers to train me. I turned many failures into winners just by showing them how to easily do what they had not been able to do. Peace, prosperity and consistency is what I converted total chaos into.
I have been in jail and in a mental hospital, the military, the work force, in courts. in leadership roles, owned 7 homes, separated from my child and divorced. I have stood up to and defeated countless bullies and solved countless systematic problems that are hurting people and causing waste. I can have anything I want if I submit to the ways of this world. But instead I spend everything I have trying to help people like you who I have never even seen. I see many people on the news that are in desperate trouble and I have yet to hear of a problem that they have that I cannot solve legally, permanently and quickly.
No I did not admit that I was the christ when examined by doctors and they were not aware of that to my knowledge. I was behind bars and the judicial system wanted me to stay there for standing against them, and they knew I was claiming to be the christ by my words and actions. The judicial system was up against their worst nightmare, a judge who outranked them and a man who was way smarter and more accomplished than they had encountered before. It was a blind mental examination and I responded from a legal and general point of view in defense of my actions. I did 20 days the first time I stood up to them and 44 the second and 1 the third and I saw many people being mistreated and drugged for just being unfortunate and mentally stressed out from life in general. I did not ask to see my files but many of the doctors and orderlies said I was the most gifted and normal person they had seen and I was the only one to ever just walk out of those institutions with no restrictions or requirements and I was never drugged.
I have felt the pain in my hands, heart, back and wallet and I did that on purpose with purpose when I did not have to. If I wont do the job I wont let anyone else do it either and I do not approve of working hard. So I experience the hard work and redesign the system based on my personal experience doing the job. Most often just watching and listening to complaints and looking at results is enough to get busy finding a better way. And I communicate all of my intentions in writing to all persons affected in advance of changing anything. And if I make a mistake I admit it in writing and communicate as to how it happened and what not to as well as what to do. I would have far fewer businesses and only make great products. Democratically evaluate every product as a consumer and get rid of private business. A convenience store is not nearly as convenient as a direct distribution system. Order all products over the internet and provide services 24/7/365. Don't stop because its Saturday, stop because you ran out of work to do. Equal opportunity and make room for the next generation to build and maintain their own homes and environment.
Cherisa is the closest to understanding me because she understands that my ways are not your ways. I am not of this world, I am of the next and new world here on Earth. Sometimes I ramble sorry.
Sammy56
Sep 29th, 2005, 8:35 PM
Here we go again...
Originally Posted by Jake99
I have experienced much of your pain to the extreme with the exception of the things that would hinder my success.
Well, we have a problem. The same problem a friend of mine had. You have never tasted failure, have you? If you do not fail at something in your life, you will never understand the true value of success. And until you do fail, you will take that success for granted. You will not know what to do when you do fail, and it is bound to happen. It does not make you a bad person to fail, it only makes you a bad person if you do not try again. But you, Jake, are not perfect. Eventually, if you haven't already, you will fail at something, and you will not know how to handle it.
Originally Posted by Jake99
It would be pretty tough to help others if I had trouble helping myself.
Not true at all. My best friend is wonderful at helping others with their problems, but when it comes to her own, she does not even know where to start. Actually, I find that being able to help others but not yourself is more common then being able to do both.
Originally Posted by Jake99
I would call the most difficult and challenging manufacturing operations I know of.
Jake, can you please tell us how making Twinkies is the hardest job in the world? Because I can think of ones that are quite a bit more difficult.
Originally Posted by Jake99
Take college for instance, we separate children from their home so they can learn things they may never use and let them learn for themself how to live in an environment that is uncontrolled and in many ways dangerous,
Well Jake, while some of this may be true, that is how the world is. It's not a nice place, and eventually people have to learn how to live in it on their own, without the help of their parents. Some are ready earlier then others, but it is something we must all do eventually. And these people are not children, they are young adults. Yes, they do have a tendency to make irresponsible decisions, but that is how you learn- from your mistakes.
Originally Posted by Jake99
I have yet to hear of a problem that they have that I cannot solve legally, permanently and quickly.
Okay then Jake, I want you to fix my problem Tell me how I can quickly solve all of my family problems. Tell me how to do it without any negative or lasting effects. It should be easy for such a great problem-solver as yourself.
Originally Posted by Jake99
I have felt the pain in my hands, heart, back and wallet and I did that on purpose with purpose when I did not have to.
No, no, no Jake, this does not work. You cannot pretend to put yourself through hardship. In the back of your mind you always know you can get out of it. I doubt you have ever been in a position where you have felt pain that cannot be stopped or controlled. You have never had to worry about how to feed you family because you are not making enough money to pay the mortgage and buy food, never had to be afraid of going to work because you are mistreated by your boss or your coworkers, and you never had to fear coming home because you know as soon as you walk in the door you will be greeted by a parent who just wants to inflict pain upon you and make you feel as insignificant as possible. Unless you live through these situations for real, you will NEVER understand the pain of those who live through that hell everyday.
Originally Posted by Jake99
I do not approve of working hard.
Why not? That is how you become successful, by working hard and "going above and beyond the call of duty". How can you be proud of an accomplishment if you did no work to receive your award? Trust me Jake, if you ever become ruler of the world, you will work harder then you could ever imagine.
Originally Posted by Jake99
I have experienced much of your pain to the extreme with the exception of the things that would hinder my success.
Well, we have a problem. The same problem a friend of mine had. You have never tasted failure, have you? If you do not fail at something in your life, you will never understand the true value of success. And until you do fail, you will take that success for granted. You will not know what to do when you do fail, and it is bound to happen. It does not make you a bad person to fail, it only makes you a bad person if you do not try again. But you, Jake, are not perfect. Eventually, if you haven't already, you will fail at something, and you will not know how to handle it.
Originally Posted by Jake99
It would be pretty tough to help others if I had trouble helping myself.
Not true at all. My best friend is wonderful at helping others with their problems, but when it comes to her own, she does not even know where to start. Actually, I find that being able to help others but not yourself is more common then being able to do both.
Originally Posted by Jake99
I would call the most difficult and challenging manufacturing operations I know of.
Jake, can you please tell us how making Twinkies is the hardest job in the world? Because I can think of ones that are quite a bit more difficult.
Originally Posted by Jake99
Take college for instance, we separate children from their home so they can learn things they may never use and let them learn for themself how to live in an environment that is uncontrolled and in many ways dangerous,
Well Jake, while some of this may be true, that is how the world is. It's not a nice place, and eventually people have to learn how to live in it on their own, without the help of their parents. Some are ready earlier then others, but it is something we must all do eventually. And these people are not children, they are young adults. Yes, they do have a tendency to make irresponsible decisions, but that is how you learn- from your mistakes.
Originally Posted by Jake99
I have yet to hear of a problem that they have that I cannot solve legally, permanently and quickly.
Okay then Jake, I want you to fix my problem Tell me how I can quickly solve all of my family problems. Tell me how to do it without any negative or lasting effects. It should be easy for such a great problem-solver as yourself.
Originally Posted by Jake99
I have felt the pain in my hands, heart, back and wallet and I did that on purpose with purpose when I did not have to.
No, no, no Jake, this does not work. You cannot pretend to put yourself through hardship. In the back of your mind you always know you can get out of it. I doubt you have ever been in a position where you have felt pain that cannot be stopped or controlled. You have never had to worry about how to feed you family because you are not making enough money to pay the mortgage and buy food, never had to be afraid of going to work because you are mistreated by your boss or your coworkers, and you never had to fear coming home because you know as soon as you walk in the door you will be greeted by a parent who just wants to inflict pain upon you and make you feel as insignificant as possible. Unless you live through these situations for real, you will NEVER understand the pain of those who live through that hell everyday.
Originally Posted by Jake99
I do not approve of working hard.
Why not? That is how you become successful, by working hard and "going above and beyond the call of duty". How can you be proud of an accomplishment if you did no work to receive your award? Trust me Jake, if you ever become ruler of the world, you will work harder then you could ever imagine.
Philosopher Foelhe
Sep 30th, 2005, 2:05 AM
I can have anything I want if I submit to the ways of this world. But instead I spend everything I have trying to help people like you who I have never even seen. I see many people on the news that are in desperate trouble and I have yet to hear of a problem that they have that I cannot solve legally, permanently and quickly.
And how many major problems have you solved? And I'm not talking about the twinkie factory, I'm talking about globally. How old did you say you were, forty-five? That's twenty-five years out in the real world, trying to turn the universe on it's ear, and none of us had even heard of you until you started posting here. How much longer do you think you have?
You say you have to "submit to the world", but what does that even mean? Do I "submit to the world" by trying to help people directly rather than going for some universal "purity"? I solve problems using the flawed but still useful system we have, spending my time helping people rather than fighting against that system. That's not submitting to the world, that's being a part of it. And the best way to affect anything is to get your hands in.
Ability combined with proper education can make a surgeon out of a 16 year old, and if he works until 30 in a world that has few accidents, you will have to make room for the next generation and retire him.
Great, Jake, let's take a gigantic leap backward. Let's take people who are going through major psychological and physiological changes, and let's force them to choose a profession they may hate in a year, and let's work 'em. You hate college because it's "uncontrolled and dangerous", but you want to throw kids into a high-stress profession when they haven't even learned how to take care of themselves?
If I wont do the job I wont let anyone else do it either and I do not approve of working hard.
You don't approve of working hard? Ladies and gentlemen, the man who is going to completely redesign the world... but not while working hard.
Actually, I find that being able to help others but not yourself is more common then being able to do both.
*raises hand* Guilty.
Unless you live through these situations for real, you will NEVER understand the pain of those who live through that hell everyday.
I'm not sure I agree with this. Well, partly I do, but I do think that human empathy can help to bridge the gap here.
Otherwise I completely agree with everything in your post. :2thumbs:
And how many major problems have you solved? And I'm not talking about the twinkie factory, I'm talking about globally. How old did you say you were, forty-five? That's twenty-five years out in the real world, trying to turn the universe on it's ear, and none of us had even heard of you until you started posting here. How much longer do you think you have?
You say you have to "submit to the world", but what does that even mean? Do I "submit to the world" by trying to help people directly rather than going for some universal "purity"? I solve problems using the flawed but still useful system we have, spending my time helping people rather than fighting against that system. That's not submitting to the world, that's being a part of it. And the best way to affect anything is to get your hands in.
Ability combined with proper education can make a surgeon out of a 16 year old, and if he works until 30 in a world that has few accidents, you will have to make room for the next generation and retire him.
Great, Jake, let's take a gigantic leap backward. Let's take people who are going through major psychological and physiological changes, and let's force them to choose a profession they may hate in a year, and let's work 'em. You hate college because it's "uncontrolled and dangerous", but you want to throw kids into a high-stress profession when they haven't even learned how to take care of themselves?
If I wont do the job I wont let anyone else do it either and I do not approve of working hard.
You don't approve of working hard? Ladies and gentlemen, the man who is going to completely redesign the world... but not while working hard.
Actually, I find that being able to help others but not yourself is more common then being able to do both.
*raises hand* Guilty.
Unless you live through these situations for real, you will NEVER understand the pain of those who live through that hell everyday.
I'm not sure I agree with this. Well, partly I do, but I do think that human empathy can help to bridge the gap here.
Otherwise I completely agree with everything in your post. :2thumbs:
Jake99
Sep 30th, 2005, 12:41 PM
Only one has ever truly loved me and I chose to help those who hate and mock me instead of the one who loved me. If I had given the fruits of my labor to the one who loved me I could not serve the many who hate me or do the work of god.
I have failed in a big way, I could not convince my x wife who I was and she divorced me without my telling her I was the christ. I can think of no bigger failure than that, many of her friends said I was a saint and it amazed them that I would put up with her. She was very much of this world and I am very much not of this world. She did all the fighting and complaining, i just learned what the problems were from her and incorporated it into my education and plan to prevent such discontent. Remember Lotts wife.
The Hostess cake and Wonder bread factory is a series of usually 8 semi automated race tracks each the length of a football field with many machines and people from all corners of the world. I have given tours to hundreds of people that were very impressed at the size and speed of the operation. Each day is different based on what ever is ordered and you change over to many varieties and meet transportation schedules no matter what the customer asks for. Its like NASCAR racing but you are not budgeted to come in second. You get a written report card for every minute of every day and every material and labor hour verses the product you ship. And everything has to be delivered fresh you cannot stock pile or freeze the product to meet the orders. All kinds of things can go wrong since the lines are continuous and if one thing breaks down the entire line can be down. If one employee is late or sick or gets hurt it creates problems and if one person or machine makes a mistake it effects everyone and everything, immediately. Bakeries in general are notorious for inefficiency, stress and lost time accidents. Bakeries can chew up people and product pretty quick if you let your guard down. I am an extremely hands on person and I have performed every job in the manufacturing and plant level management process. No one else in that company has nearly the experience or success that I do. Considering that I designed or modified more of the operation that all others in the company combined I would say that I have solved at least a thousand problems permanently. Accidents, waste and stress nearly disappeared as a result. Its the same thing I want to do globally.
I can solve most family problems with nothing more than a simple operating system that dramatically reduces the time you are at work or school and increases the time you spend with your family. It also eliminates stress over bills and food, shelter, clothing and medical needs. And it cleans up and manages the environment at the same time. Just post the jobs you need done and bid on them and if you don't like being an auto mechanic bid off after a reasonable commitment period just like the militaries and unionized companies operate.
The reason you have never heard of me before is because I was busy demonstrating the simple system and learning first hand what it takes to run the world operating system that the bible recommends. Don't say that you can do it until you can prove that you have done it. Not that proving it can be done by what I say I did, but by what I did, and how I did it. Don't take my word for it, investigate, the truth is in my work and the results. I was not a leader intent on making friends I was a leader to show you the way. Friends ask too many questions and I was on a secret mission.
If I were in it for me, (as most people have to be) I would be spanking golf balls every day and living in the castles I left behind. Or maybe I should be sunning myself on the Yacht that my brother in law just bought. He sells telephones if you can believe that, I want to give them away for free.
Do a map search of 6096 Pebblebrook lane, North Olmsted Ohio. Notice that the house is surrounded by 45 holes of 3 golf top notch public golf courses that I could hit a ball to anyone of from my yard. I was the first owner but I moved when the teamsters local 19 collapsed from fraud and the Cleveland bakery closed.
I have failed in a big way, I could not convince my x wife who I was and she divorced me without my telling her I was the christ. I can think of no bigger failure than that, many of her friends said I was a saint and it amazed them that I would put up with her. She was very much of this world and I am very much not of this world. She did all the fighting and complaining, i just learned what the problems were from her and incorporated it into my education and plan to prevent such discontent. Remember Lotts wife.
The Hostess cake and Wonder bread factory is a series of usually 8 semi automated race tracks each the length of a football field with many machines and people from all corners of the world. I have given tours to hundreds of people that were very impressed at the size and speed of the operation. Each day is different based on what ever is ordered and you change over to many varieties and meet transportation schedules no matter what the customer asks for. Its like NASCAR racing but you are not budgeted to come in second. You get a written report card for every minute of every day and every material and labor hour verses the product you ship. And everything has to be delivered fresh you cannot stock pile or freeze the product to meet the orders. All kinds of things can go wrong since the lines are continuous and if one thing breaks down the entire line can be down. If one employee is late or sick or gets hurt it creates problems and if one person or machine makes a mistake it effects everyone and everything, immediately. Bakeries in general are notorious for inefficiency, stress and lost time accidents. Bakeries can chew up people and product pretty quick if you let your guard down. I am an extremely hands on person and I have performed every job in the manufacturing and plant level management process. No one else in that company has nearly the experience or success that I do. Considering that I designed or modified more of the operation that all others in the company combined I would say that I have solved at least a thousand problems permanently. Accidents, waste and stress nearly disappeared as a result. Its the same thing I want to do globally.
I can solve most family problems with nothing more than a simple operating system that dramatically reduces the time you are at work or school and increases the time you spend with your family. It also eliminates stress over bills and food, shelter, clothing and medical needs. And it cleans up and manages the environment at the same time. Just post the jobs you need done and bid on them and if you don't like being an auto mechanic bid off after a reasonable commitment period just like the militaries and unionized companies operate.
The reason you have never heard of me before is because I was busy demonstrating the simple system and learning first hand what it takes to run the world operating system that the bible recommends. Don't say that you can do it until you can prove that you have done it. Not that proving it can be done by what I say I did, but by what I did, and how I did it. Don't take my word for it, investigate, the truth is in my work and the results. I was not a leader intent on making friends I was a leader to show you the way. Friends ask too many questions and I was on a secret mission.
If I were in it for me, (as most people have to be) I would be spanking golf balls every day and living in the castles I left behind. Or maybe I should be sunning myself on the Yacht that my brother in law just bought. He sells telephones if you can believe that, I want to give them away for free.
Do a map search of 6096 Pebblebrook lane, North Olmsted Ohio. Notice that the house is surrounded by 45 holes of 3 golf top notch public golf courses that I could hit a ball to anyone of from my yard. I was the first owner but I moved when the teamsters local 19 collapsed from fraud and the Cleveland bakery closed.
Philosopher Foelhe
Oct 1st, 2005, 12:25 AM
Only one has ever truly loved me and I chose to help those who hate and mock me instead of the one who loved me. If I had given the fruits of my labor to the one who loved me I could not serve the many who hate me or do the work of god.
Huh. We might actually have something in common.
If I were in it for me, (as most people have to be) I would be spanking golf balls every day and living in the castles I left behind. Or maybe I should be sunning myself on the Yacht that my brother in law just bought.
But Jake, why do you only see these two options? You make it sound like unless you conquer the world, you'll have no choice but to sit around and ignore everyone in the world. Why did you choose a bakery, when you could've been streamlining the foster care system, or rooting out corruption among the police? You say you want to save the world, so why didn't you test your system in an environment where it could do more good?
Huh. We might actually have something in common.
If I were in it for me, (as most people have to be) I would be spanking golf balls every day and living in the castles I left behind. Or maybe I should be sunning myself on the Yacht that my brother in law just bought.
But Jake, why do you only see these two options? You make it sound like unless you conquer the world, you'll have no choice but to sit around and ignore everyone in the world. Why did you choose a bakery, when you could've been streamlining the foster care system, or rooting out corruption among the police? You say you want to save the world, so why didn't you test your system in an environment where it could do more good?
Jake99
Oct 1st, 2005, 9:43 AM
You cannot fight corruption you must eliminate the cause of it and the opportunity for it to exist. If you let me lead you, not conquer you, I can solve everyone of the problems you refer to and all the rest. Plenty of people have done what you have recommended and none have succeeded because the system prevents success. What your leaders work their whole life failing at I can fix in 5 minutes with a simple system. I ended up in the bakery because it was the best opportunity to lead by example and turn chaos into peace and prosperity, I did not chose it, it chose me. I eliminated all of their problems and they had just as many as foster care and police corruption. And I have taken on police corruption and judicial misconduct in five courts of law and I won every time. I did not conquer them because they have immunity, but I did demonstrate the errors of their ways and prove that I am the christ in the process. I have also prosecuted many employees for poor work performance without a complaint over my judgements from a union or a court of law. No one has ever protested against my leadership.
Philosopher Foelhe
Oct 1st, 2005, 3:45 PM
You cannot fight corruption you must eliminate the cause of it and the opportunity for it to exist.
That's fighting it.
Besides, you can't completely eliminate corruption. Entropy is a constant in any system. You simply have to remain aware of your situation, and watchful for sinister mistakes.
What your leaders work their whole life failing at I can fix in 5 minutes with a simple system.
That reminds me. How are you going to put this system to work, anyway? Even assuming your system will work, how can you convince governments around the world to listen to you? Tell them you're the messiah? You'd be laughed out of the building. And what is the process you'll take to change the U.S.'s straight-up capitalism into this weird mix of three systems? Where would you even start?
I did demonstrate the errors of their ways and prove that I am the christ in the process.
How did you prove you were Christ?
That's fighting it.
Besides, you can't completely eliminate corruption. Entropy is a constant in any system. You simply have to remain aware of your situation, and watchful for sinister mistakes.
What your leaders work their whole life failing at I can fix in 5 minutes with a simple system.
That reminds me. How are you going to put this system to work, anyway? Even assuming your system will work, how can you convince governments around the world to listen to you? Tell them you're the messiah? You'd be laughed out of the building. And what is the process you'll take to change the U.S.'s straight-up capitalism into this weird mix of three systems? Where would you even start?
I did demonstrate the errors of their ways and prove that I am the christ in the process.
How did you prove you were Christ?
nrj
Oct 1st, 2005, 4:01 PM
How did you prove you were Christ?
DUH! He was a pinball wiz in high school!
DUH! He was a pinball wiz in high school!
Sammy56
Oct 1st, 2005, 10:34 PM
Originally Posted by Philosopher Foelhe
I'm not sure I agree with this. Well, partly I do, but I do think that human empathy can help to bridge the gap here.
I agree with you on that human empathy can help to bridge the gap, but I think to really and truly understand a person's pain, you had to have lived through a similar situation, which according to Jake, he has not. That is why I believe Jake would not make a great world leader because he says he has never had to go through real hardship, only that he has "forced" himself through pain. To me that means he has never truly lived though it and therefore, while he may be able to sympathize, he can never understand it 100%.
Originally Posted by nrj
DUH! He was a pinball wiz in high school!
Don't forget those superior genetics of his! I mean, his brothers and sisters are awesome at sports, so he must be the Christ! There just is no other answer...
I'm not sure I agree with this. Well, partly I do, but I do think that human empathy can help to bridge the gap here.
I agree with you on that human empathy can help to bridge the gap, but I think to really and truly understand a person's pain, you had to have lived through a similar situation, which according to Jake, he has not. That is why I believe Jake would not make a great world leader because he says he has never had to go through real hardship, only that he has "forced" himself through pain. To me that means he has never truly lived though it and therefore, while he may be able to sympathize, he can never understand it 100%.
Originally Posted by nrj
DUH! He was a pinball wiz in high school!
Don't forget those superior genetics of his! I mean, his brothers and sisters are awesome at sports, so he must be the Christ! There just is no other answer...
B.NyeTheUruk-Hai
Oct 2nd, 2005, 10:39 AM
Don't forget those superior genetics of his! I mean, his brothers and sisters are awesome at sports, so he must be the Christ! There just is no other answer...
And don't forget that he gets kisses from single mothers...
And don't forget that he gets kisses from single mothers...
nrj
Oct 2nd, 2005, 11:11 AM
My aunt once kissed me on the cheek, and she's a single mother. Kneel before me!
B.NyeTheUruk-Hai
Oct 2nd, 2005, 7:12 PM
All Shall Kneel Before The Messianic Animal Magnetism Of Nrj !!!!!!!!!
Sammy56
Oct 2nd, 2005, 8:02 PM
All Shall Kneel Before The Messianic Animal Magnetism Of Nrj !!!!!!!!!
No Nye! Don't, for it is blasphemy of the All- Powerful Messiah Jake99! Nrj can speak Swedish, which is something Jake cannot, and which is a language which is not the great universal language of Jake bull crap, English! Plus, in an ironic twist of fate, nrj can form English sentences and paragraphs that are actually understandable! Another thing Jake cannot achieve! And if the messiah cannot do it, it must be evil! Nrj is the Antichrist!
No Nye! Don't, for it is blasphemy of the All- Powerful Messiah Jake99! Nrj can speak Swedish, which is something Jake cannot, and which is a language which is not the great universal language of Jake bull crap, English! Plus, in an ironic twist of fate, nrj can form English sentences and paragraphs that are actually understandable! Another thing Jake cannot achieve! And if the messiah cannot do it, it must be evil! Nrj is the Antichrist!
nrj
Oct 3rd, 2005, 12:01 AM
I have been revealed. :evbat:
Philosopher Foelhe
Oct 3rd, 2005, 3:46 AM
Well, something has been revealed, anyway. :Bog:
nrj
Oct 3rd, 2005, 3:53 AM
Ok, I have removed the ignore from Jake so he can answer a question: If you're the messiah, Jake, how come a swede makes less typos and grammatic faults then you, an american?
nrj
Oct 3rd, 2005, 6:48 AM
We are here to learn, grow, and develop faith in Him thru TRIALS. Imagine this. A wave is heading you're way, nearly super sonic speed. It's about 6 meters, and when it hits the shore it becomes 13. The wave hits the shore, since Indonesias alarm system sucks. So, you have a wave coming right at you, about 100 kilometers an hour, and it's 13 meters high. What do you do?
Jake99
Oct 3rd, 2005, 4:35 PM
The answer is electronic Communism and to start it you lay off all the people in jobs that are automated or unnecessary like sales and advertising, stock markets, and convert to internet product demonstrations and direct distribution purchases. Standardize wages and prices, use one electronic monetary system ( no currency), One mandatory language, standardized basic education ( mostly done in home over the internet and on the job training) and socialize or communise the basic human needs. Their are no sinister mistakes to be watchful of because nothing is hidden and everything is electronically documented just like todays bar code inventory systems. Post every job on the planet so all you would have to do is bid on one and work your way up the ladder or bid onto something else. All your credits and benefits are globally transferable. All of the environmental issues that the world does not address now has plenty of manpower and resources available to it. Retire early, keep families together and live in peace, prosperity and good health for 150 years instead of 80 years or whatever.
I have proven I am the christ in many hundreds of ways but you have to look at the total picture to understand what I have been doing and how super fast it was done. I don't lose in court, where I have been standing against the judicial system and representing a very large company VS labor unions many times. I am the most efficient and successful business leader in all of time according to the fruit from the tree, no smoke and mirrors. My writing skills do leave much to be desired ( I slept through school on purpose and with purpose) but I have never given a directive that was not followed to my satisfaction by the thousand people I have led and directed daily. I speak a language you have never heard before and that too is intentional (tongues), I was not trained by this world and thus I am not of this world. Yes I did pay attention to the basic education and I am well educated in every industrial art, but then I closed my ears and opened my mind to what the bible and my inner direction was telling me and followed that path. I went the other way the first time I heard of a middleman like a salesman and a system called capitalism.
And if a tsunami came at a beach front house it is a break away floatation device or it is built in a way that it survives. I would not have retail shops, merchandise and infrastructure close to natural disaster zones. A break away floating home or a building that has no first or second floor might be possible solutions. Most people were killed by the destroyed buildings and retail junk that was in the water not by the water itself. The trees in the water were a factor but if you climbed on top of a floating building its nothing more than an amusement ride and a life preserver. And by all means get a better warning system as the first place to start.
Nrj
I am glad you are talking again and I hope I did a better job in off topic to answer a delicate question that I really cannot answer at this point in time. Things will change dramatically in ways that I cannot predict, if you get on the system that the bibles recommend. I am here to show you how to convert to that simple biblical operating system and make it work perfectly for the rest of time. If experience is what you base ability on then I too have the most experience. Being a pin ball wizard was nothing more that having the biggest tennis serve or being the best competitor at every sport I played and I played most of them. I was not performing for me I was performing for you. I did have a blast though and I still do. You can watch the Red Sox and the Yankees all you want and never see a baseball player with as much ability as I have. I don't play that often and its usually sand lot sports, Nerf, whiffle, Junior varsity footballs and soft balls but I turn heads doing things no one else can do, all the time. I am your gift and I am at your service free of charge and I guarantee all my work (as always). No one has ever asked for a refund and nothing I have designed has ever failed to do at least what I said it would. Most often I underestimate what a new system will do so I can outperform what is budgeted or promised and can't possibly fail. Everybody wins and I act as if it was nothing and go on to the next task.
I have proven I am the christ in many hundreds of ways but you have to look at the total picture to understand what I have been doing and how super fast it was done. I don't lose in court, where I have been standing against the judicial system and representing a very large company VS labor unions many times. I am the most efficient and successful business leader in all of time according to the fruit from the tree, no smoke and mirrors. My writing skills do leave much to be desired ( I slept through school on purpose and with purpose) but I have never given a directive that was not followed to my satisfaction by the thousand people I have led and directed daily. I speak a language you have never heard before and that too is intentional (tongues), I was not trained by this world and thus I am not of this world. Yes I did pay attention to the basic education and I am well educated in every industrial art, but then I closed my ears and opened my mind to what the bible and my inner direction was telling me and followed that path. I went the other way the first time I heard of a middleman like a salesman and a system called capitalism.
And if a tsunami came at a beach front house it is a break away floatation device or it is built in a way that it survives. I would not have retail shops, merchandise and infrastructure close to natural disaster zones. A break away floating home or a building that has no first or second floor might be possible solutions. Most people were killed by the destroyed buildings and retail junk that was in the water not by the water itself. The trees in the water were a factor but if you climbed on top of a floating building its nothing more than an amusement ride and a life preserver. And by all means get a better warning system as the first place to start.
Nrj
I am glad you are talking again and I hope I did a better job in off topic to answer a delicate question that I really cannot answer at this point in time. Things will change dramatically in ways that I cannot predict, if you get on the system that the bibles recommend. I am here to show you how to convert to that simple biblical operating system and make it work perfectly for the rest of time. If experience is what you base ability on then I too have the most experience. Being a pin ball wizard was nothing more that having the biggest tennis serve or being the best competitor at every sport I played and I played most of them. I was not performing for me I was performing for you. I did have a blast though and I still do. You can watch the Red Sox and the Yankees all you want and never see a baseball player with as much ability as I have. I don't play that often and its usually sand lot sports, Nerf, whiffle, Junior varsity footballs and soft balls but I turn heads doing things no one else can do, all the time. I am your gift and I am at your service free of charge and I guarantee all my work (as always). No one has ever asked for a refund and nothing I have designed has ever failed to do at least what I said it would. Most often I underestimate what a new system will do so I can outperform what is budgeted or promised and can't possibly fail. Everybody wins and I act as if it was nothing and go on to the next task.
Beatnik Bob
Oct 3rd, 2005, 6:23 PM
This may seem blasphemous to you Jake......but I can name quite a few gifted and talented people and incredibly ingenious scientists and great leaders, off the top of my head. OH NO!!!!!!! The world is crawling with messiahs'!!!!!!!!!!!!
Beatnik Bob
Oct 3rd, 2005, 6:29 PM
Wow, why don't we just name a book in the New Testament, "The Book Of Jake".
Philosopher Foelhe
Oct 3rd, 2005, 6:57 PM
Imagine this. A wave is heading you're way, nearly super sonic speed. It's about 6 meters, and when it hits the shore it becomes 13. The wave hits the shore, since Indonesias alarm system sucks. So, you have a wave coming right at you, about 100 kilometers an hour, and it's 13 meters high. What do you do?
Well, you die. Of course, the question remains, do you die fighting to survive even when you know the odds are hopeless? Or do you bow your head and wait for the end? Do you curse the heartless God who put you in that situation, or do you accept the fact that this is merely your time?
Wow, why don't we just name a book in the New Testament, "The Book Of Jake".
*rubs temples* Bob, if you can't understand the difference between a raving lunatic and a wise man who inspired many to follow him, you have no business discussing theology. Please put aside this meaningless and frankly annoying grudge you have against Christianity - it detracts from your other points.
Well, you die. Of course, the question remains, do you die fighting to survive even when you know the odds are hopeless? Or do you bow your head and wait for the end? Do you curse the heartless God who put you in that situation, or do you accept the fact that this is merely your time?
Wow, why don't we just name a book in the New Testament, "The Book Of Jake".
*rubs temples* Bob, if you can't understand the difference between a raving lunatic and a wise man who inspired many to follow him, you have no business discussing theology. Please put aside this meaningless and frankly annoying grudge you have against Christianity - it detracts from your other points.
B.NyeTheUruk-Hai
Oct 3rd, 2005, 7:08 PM
Imagine this. A wave is heading you're way, nearly super sonic speed. It's about 6 meters, and when it hits the shore it becomes 13. The wave hits the shore, since Indonesias alarm system sucks. So, you have a wave coming right at you, about 100 kilometers an hour, and it's 13 meters high. What do you do?
I would shit my pants.
I would shit my pants.
Mezurashi
Oct 3rd, 2005, 8:33 PM
Imagine this. A wave is heading you're way, nearly super sonic speed. It's about 6 meters, and when it hits the shore it becomes 13. The wave hits the shore, since Indonesias alarm system sucks. So, you have a wave coming right at you, about 100 kilometers an hour, and it's 13 meters high. What do you do?
I've said this before and I'll say it again -- if there is no chance I can survive, I will watch the last big show I'm going to see and maybe even go out with a defiant "F**k You!" I hope I will not cower in fear, because the inevitable is something I hope to confront with bravado, the last measure. However, if there was a chance I could outrun the doom, I would try. And for sure I would feel fear in fleeing, adrenaline helps one run faster after all.
Now, Ill pose another dilemma. Two children, a boy and a girl, are trapped on railroad tracks and a train is coming at them. You have enough time to rescue one of them and yourself or sacrifice yourself to rescue both of them. Which one would you save? Or would you try to save both?
I've said this before and I'll say it again -- if there is no chance I can survive, I will watch the last big show I'm going to see and maybe even go out with a defiant "F**k You!" I hope I will not cower in fear, because the inevitable is something I hope to confront with bravado, the last measure. However, if there was a chance I could outrun the doom, I would try. And for sure I would feel fear in fleeing, adrenaline helps one run faster after all.
Now, Ill pose another dilemma. Two children, a boy and a girl, are trapped on railroad tracks and a train is coming at them. You have enough time to rescue one of them and yourself or sacrifice yourself to rescue both of them. Which one would you save? Or would you try to save both?
nrj
Oct 4th, 2005, 2:41 AM
Well, you die. Of course, the question remains, do you die fighting to survive even when you know the odds are hopeless? Or do you bow your head and wait for the end? Do you curse the heartless God who put you in that situation, or do you accept the fact that this is merely your time? I would of course try and run away from the wave (not that I can) and then die. I understood a long time ago: we are alone. But, I would try to fight for survival and I wouldn't curse that god hates me, since I don't believe he's there.
nrj
Oct 4th, 2005, 2:50 AM
That post was way to long for me to answer. But the bit were you adress me I feel obligated to reply.
Things will change dramatically in ways that I cannot predict, if you get on the system that the bibles recommend. I'm sorry, but you can count me out of that. Fuck the Bible. I will not follow the Bible just because you tell me to do so.
I am here to show you how to convert to that simple biblical operating system and make it work perfectly for the rest of time. If experience is what you base ability on then I too have the most experience. No one has the experience of world management, Jake.
You can watch the Red Sox and the Yankees all you want and never see a baseball player with as much ability as I have.I have no idea of what the Yankees or the Red Sox is. I've heard them a couple of times on american movies, but I can't say I know what it is.
Things will change dramatically in ways that I cannot predict, if you get on the system that the bibles recommend. I'm sorry, but you can count me out of that. Fuck the Bible. I will not follow the Bible just because you tell me to do so.
I am here to show you how to convert to that simple biblical operating system and make it work perfectly for the rest of time. If experience is what you base ability on then I too have the most experience. No one has the experience of world management, Jake.
You can watch the Red Sox and the Yankees all you want and never see a baseball player with as much ability as I have.I have no idea of what the Yankees or the Red Sox is. I've heard them a couple of times on american movies, but I can't say I know what it is.
evilwill
Oct 4th, 2005, 3:22 AM
A question for Jake.
You claim that the bible states a highly efficient system of world management that will work and change things for the better. If such a system exists, why hasn't anyone else put forward these ideas?
You claim that the bible states a highly efficient system of world management that will work and change things for the better. If such a system exists, why hasn't anyone else put forward these ideas?
Philosopher Foelhe
Oct 4th, 2005, 1:24 PM
Two children, a boy and a girl, are trapped on railroad tracks and a train is coming at them. You have enough time to rescue one of them and yourself or sacrifice yourself to rescue both of them. Which one would you save? Or would you try to save both?
Try to save both, on the assumption that the world is not quite so mathematical and it's hard to realize when you have no chance of getting out alive. Plus, y'know, adrenaline.
I understood a long time ago: we are alone.
You mean, you believed from a long time ago: we are alone. :D
I wouldn't curse that god hates me, since I don't believe he's there.
Well, would you curse circumstance? Would you rail against the bad luck that put you in this situation?
I have no idea of what the Yankees or the Red Sox is. I've heard them a couple of times on american movies, but I can't say I know what it is.
The Yankees and Red Sox are two baseball teams over here in the states. I don't know if you play baseball in your country, but you can at least find info about that online. I think.
Try to save both, on the assumption that the world is not quite so mathematical and it's hard to realize when you have no chance of getting out alive. Plus, y'know, adrenaline.
I understood a long time ago: we are alone.
You mean, you believed from a long time ago: we are alone. :D
I wouldn't curse that god hates me, since I don't believe he's there.
Well, would you curse circumstance? Would you rail against the bad luck that put you in this situation?
I have no idea of what the Yankees or the Red Sox is. I've heard them a couple of times on american movies, but I can't say I know what it is.
The Yankees and Red Sox are two baseball teams over here in the states. I don't know if you play baseball in your country, but you can at least find info about that online. I think.
Jake99
Oct 4th, 2005, 2:54 PM
The reason why no one has used or even tried the system that is recommended in the bible: Is because humanity decided, for what ever reason to sell the fruit of the earth and draw lines on the map rather than be paid to manage and distribute it. Every person is a stock holder in every natural resource and that includes the air that you breath. You are supposed to be rewarded or paid for your service in protecting and reaping not negotiating the price that man has put on the ingredients of the world. I have no problem valuating products and services so that the person who puts forth the most effort gets paid the most. Currency and bills to pay would no longer exist within minutes of following my leadership. That does not sound like the freedom, peace and prosperity that George Bush is offering. Debt and threats are skyrocketing and the environment is being severely damaged every minute that totally misguided men Like George Bush are in control of this planet.
I have concentrated on doing all of the things that George Bush and everyone like him cannot do and I am 100% successful at running one of the largest and most difficult businesses on the planet. George Bush has never even properly managed a push cart and I have never seen the man do anything but fail according to the bible, profits and ethics in general. Starting the holy war is the best thing he ever did because now he can take a knee on behalf of those who stand behind him, as he should. Its time to step into my world or stay in his world. Will you be left behind? Will you be first or last into the kingdom? As I understand it St. Andrews is the only environmentally friendly golf course on the planet, as such I would discontinue the practices in place at all the others immediately. Stop trying to make a profit...... Sell your time and effort only and stop doing jobs that are destructive and unnecessary. You will never go to war again if you follow me to the kingdom of heaven on earth. This new world I can promise you in the name of god as his son and humble but formidable servant.
I have concentrated on doing all of the things that George Bush and everyone like him cannot do and I am 100% successful at running one of the largest and most difficult businesses on the planet. George Bush has never even properly managed a push cart and I have never seen the man do anything but fail according to the bible, profits and ethics in general. Starting the holy war is the best thing he ever did because now he can take a knee on behalf of those who stand behind him, as he should. Its time to step into my world or stay in his world. Will you be left behind? Will you be first or last into the kingdom? As I understand it St. Andrews is the only environmentally friendly golf course on the planet, as such I would discontinue the practices in place at all the others immediately. Stop trying to make a profit...... Sell your time and effort only and stop doing jobs that are destructive and unnecessary. You will never go to war again if you follow me to the kingdom of heaven on earth. This new world I can promise you in the name of god as his son and humble but formidable servant.
nrj
Oct 4th, 2005, 3:31 PM
You mean, you believed from a long time ago: we are alone. :D Point taken.
Well, would you curse circumstance? Would you rail against the bad luck that put you in this situation? When I watched my great grandmother die it was the most awful thing I've ever seen. Even though she was in her latter 80:s, she always came to birthday parties and all those things and I played with her and listened to her stories as a child. She meant alot to me. That day, I didn't curse anyone for taking her away from me. I just cried, because I hadn't shown much gratitude to her. I live by a philosphy that is: remember the good times. So, I cried because I knew I hadn't been there for her as much as I should've, not because she was gone.
The Yankees and Red Sox are two baseball teams over here in the states. I don't know if you play baseball in your country, but you can at least find info about that online. I think. Looked them up. No, we don't play baseball in Sweden. Closest you can come, is brännboll wich kind of reminds a bit about baseball.
Well, would you curse circumstance? Would you rail against the bad luck that put you in this situation? When I watched my great grandmother die it was the most awful thing I've ever seen. Even though she was in her latter 80:s, she always came to birthday parties and all those things and I played with her and listened to her stories as a child. She meant alot to me. That day, I didn't curse anyone for taking her away from me. I just cried, because I hadn't shown much gratitude to her. I live by a philosphy that is: remember the good times. So, I cried because I knew I hadn't been there for her as much as I should've, not because she was gone.
The Yankees and Red Sox are two baseball teams over here in the states. I don't know if you play baseball in your country, but you can at least find info about that online. I think. Looked them up. No, we don't play baseball in Sweden. Closest you can come, is brännboll wich kind of reminds a bit about baseball.
Beatnik Bob
Oct 4th, 2005, 7:35 PM
*rubs temples* Bob, if you can't understand the difference between a raving lunatic and a wise man who inspired many to follow him, you have no business discussing theology. Please put aside this meaningless and frankly annoying grudge you have against Christianity - it detracts from your other points. Didn't Jake say that he is respected and followed by thousands of Twinkie workers.....and he puked on Satan or something? He must be wise to be able to operate such an incredibly vast empire.
Wait I just have to say this......why don’t you just lay off!!!!! You don't know what you’re getting into!!!! Leave me alone, CAPIESHE!!???!?!!! *rubs his temples* can I put my bum on Satan too?? Teach me the make Jake......my old' daddy-o. :lol::lol:
Wait I just have to say this......why don’t you just lay off!!!!! You don't know what you’re getting into!!!! Leave me alone, CAPIESHE!!???!?!!! *rubs his temples* can I put my bum on Satan too?? Teach me the make Jake......my old' daddy-o. :lol::lol:
Philosopher Foelhe
Oct 5th, 2005, 12:46 AM
I live by a philosphy that is: remember the good times.
That's a good philosophy, I think.
Didn't Jake say that he is respected and followed by thousands of Twinkie workers.....
No, he said he worked in a twinkie factory. He's actually said pretty specifically that he has no followers and no one believes him. And he's also said he's only had one person who ever cared for him. And now that I think about it, this makes no sense. Jake? If your business sense was so miraculous, why the hell didn't anyone in the company give a damn about you? If we're supposed to bow before you based only on the rumor of your actions, why didn't the people who were there give you your due?
You don't know what you’re getting into!!!! Leave me alone, CAPIESHE!!???!?!!!
Ah, the pain! I knew I'd never live that one down. Believe it or not, guys, I'm really not this prone to outbursts IRL. Honest.
That's a good philosophy, I think.
Didn't Jake say that he is respected and followed by thousands of Twinkie workers.....
No, he said he worked in a twinkie factory. He's actually said pretty specifically that he has no followers and no one believes him. And he's also said he's only had one person who ever cared for him. And now that I think about it, this makes no sense. Jake? If your business sense was so miraculous, why the hell didn't anyone in the company give a damn about you? If we're supposed to bow before you based only on the rumor of your actions, why didn't the people who were there give you your due?
You don't know what you’re getting into!!!! Leave me alone, CAPIESHE!!???!?!!!
Ah, the pain! I knew I'd never live that one down. Believe it or not, guys, I'm really not this prone to outbursts IRL. Honest.
Jake99
Oct 5th, 2005, 12:29 PM
Everyone had to follow my lead, I worked my way up from part time help to plant superintendent or assistant superintendent of manufacturing. Every other department is a support function that is there to assist my department: shipping, receiving, accounting, engineering and sanitation. Many people were thrilled with what I did for them and the company was eustatic, but I intentionally did not have personal relationships with people I had to judge and lead. I was offered an opportunity to re-engineer the entire company and or be on the top of the heap in production management. A few union members of which I did not belong suggested I run for US President and they even gave me a tee shirt with my name and President ITT on it when I was 25 as a going away gift, after only being a supervisor in my first year. I have been on the same path secretively, yet in plain view since I was just a small child. I am a better american football player than anyone I have ever seen and I have been watching the NFL and playing all of my life. No I am not the fastest anymore, age and 3 knee surgeries have slowed me down but I have put on athletic performances in many sports in my late 30's to mid 40's that would blow your mind.
nrj
Oct 5th, 2005, 1:57 PM
A few union members of which I did not belong suggested I run for US President and they even gave me a tee shirt with my name and President ITT on it when I was 25 as a going away gift, after only being a supervisor in my first year. My sister's got a Mickey Mouse t-shirt. Does that mean my sister is a Mickey Mouse candidat?
Beatnik Bob
Oct 5th, 2005, 9:45 PM
I have put on athletic performances in many sports in my late 30's to mid 40's that would blow your mind. And yet you are still unknown to anybody but yourself......."He's a real nowhere man, sitting in his nowhere land, making all his nowhere plans for nobody......."
This reminds me.......if you’re some Jesus dude, then you obviously go by the teachings of God.....and can thus not tell a lie. So, to put it bluntly.......who the hell are you really!!??!
And I just thought of something everyone! I'm a messiah!!! Because I have a computer at my house, and am proficient with the use of this computer, and not everyone on the planet can wield the The Great Holy Box of Micro-Chips! All hail the brain-cell killer! And guess what guys? I'm proficient in sitting in a chair as well!!! All hail, me, the great chair messiah! God chose me because of my amazing skills of being able to sit in a chair since the age of -1! (or whatever). So! Come forth my loyal chair and micro-chip disciples! I will lead all of you to salvation. And under me we shall all experience years of prosperity. If you let me lead the world, no one, I repeat no one would ever be bored, or become tired of standing! Wood and silicon for all!
This reminds me.......if you’re some Jesus dude, then you obviously go by the teachings of God.....and can thus not tell a lie. So, to put it bluntly.......who the hell are you really!!??!
And I just thought of something everyone! I'm a messiah!!! Because I have a computer at my house, and am proficient with the use of this computer, and not everyone on the planet can wield the The Great Holy Box of Micro-Chips! All hail the brain-cell killer! And guess what guys? I'm proficient in sitting in a chair as well!!! All hail, me, the great chair messiah! God chose me because of my amazing skills of being able to sit in a chair since the age of -1! (or whatever). So! Come forth my loyal chair and micro-chip disciples! I will lead all of you to salvation. And under me we shall all experience years of prosperity. If you let me lead the world, no one, I repeat no one would ever be bored, or become tired of standing! Wood and silicon for all!
Philosopher Foelhe
Oct 5th, 2005, 9:46 PM
A few union members of which I did not belong suggested I run for US President and they even gave me a tee shirt with my name and President ITT on it when I was 25 as a going away gift, after only being a supervisor in my first year.
... Wow, that's freaky. The same thing happened to me a few years ago. Well, not exactly - a few friends made a petition to get me elected to the presidency, without my knowledge, and passed it around the college campus I lived nearby. I think they got like two hundred signatures. Damn, that was a weird year - every time I stopped by the library, I'd have someone wander up to me, introduce themselves and grill me on the issues from out of nowhere. And of course I didn't know about the damn thing, so I just assumed we had a bunch of political nuts wandering around the school. I about killed my friends when I found out about it.
Y'know, everytime you say something about your life, you make me think, "Jake and I really do have a lot in common." It's starting to creep me out. Could you tell me you were a rodeo clown, or you experimented with Scientology or something? Just so I can say, just once, "Well, I'd never consider doing that, ever." It would be a huge relief. Thanks.
... Wow, that's freaky. The same thing happened to me a few years ago. Well, not exactly - a few friends made a petition to get me elected to the presidency, without my knowledge, and passed it around the college campus I lived nearby. I think they got like two hundred signatures. Damn, that was a weird year - every time I stopped by the library, I'd have someone wander up to me, introduce themselves and grill me on the issues from out of nowhere. And of course I didn't know about the damn thing, so I just assumed we had a bunch of political nuts wandering around the school. I about killed my friends when I found out about it.
Y'know, everytime you say something about your life, you make me think, "Jake and I really do have a lot in common." It's starting to creep me out. Could you tell me you were a rodeo clown, or you experimented with Scientology or something? Just so I can say, just once, "Well, I'd never consider doing that, ever." It would be a huge relief. Thanks.
nrj
Oct 6th, 2005, 12:38 AM
Ok, Jake, have you done anything wich is physically impossible i.e. a miracle?
Jake99
Oct 6th, 2005, 4:49 PM
I consider it impossible for any man to accomplish what I have been able to do because I see the fruit from your tree and I see mine. What your leaders together cannot do I do with ease. If members of the Teamsters union and I.T.T.are so impressed with the first 16 months of your leadership at age 25 that you win the best bakery award 4 quarters in a row and get a T shirt that says they want you to lead the company, I think its quite clear I am not of this world. And that was just the beginning of a total and complete domination of performances for the next 20 years in 4 other plants. When you are me you move quickly and no one knows what you are doing because if they did I would not be the thief in the night that comes to save you. I absolutly garauntee peace and prosperity it has been left in my wake my entire life. I also expect to make home entertainment a standard just point and click and watch whatever you want. No more black outs and fees to pay, everyone has a home ticket to every broadcast.
Beatnik Bob
Oct 6th, 2005, 5:37 PM
I also expect to make home entertainment a standard just point and click and watch whatever you want. No more black outs and fees to pay, everyone has a home ticket to every broadcast. ALRIGHT JAKE! Masturbation within one click! You do understand that you work at Hostess right? And God isn't very proud of you for feeding young children empty calories. I bet God is already contemplating switching you for an organic-milk-farmer. And I bet you're really some teenager who is pretending to be a Hostess dude, playing the part, and so you think you really are intelligent for making up your whole character, so therefore really do think you are an genius 17 year old, who came up with that whole character. And thus really do believe you are a messiah.
Beatnik Bob
Oct 6th, 2005, 5:44 PM
Did you also know that Bill Cosby made "Fat Albert" as a college (and maybe high school, I can't remember) project? And he was also an incredibly good sports player, not to mention an unlimited source of humor.
B.NyeTheUruk-Hai
Oct 6th, 2005, 6:11 PM
not to mention an unlimited source of humor.
Just like Jake!
Did you also know that Bill Cosby made "Fat Albert" as a college (and maybe high school, I can't remember) project?
Yet another similarity to Jake... Jake has the Twinkies while Cosby has the Jello Pudding Pops!!!
Just like Jake!
Did you also know that Bill Cosby made "Fat Albert" as a college (and maybe high school, I can't remember) project?
Yet another similarity to Jake... Jake has the Twinkies while Cosby has the Jello Pudding Pops!!!
nrj
Oct 6th, 2005, 9:51 PM
I consider it impossible for any man to accomplish what I have been able to do because I see the fruit from your tree and I see mine. *sigh* Arrogance, arrogance, arrogance. And if you consider that a miracle, then I have performed plenty. I got in to one of Gothenburgs finest multimedia school, even though I had like 60 % G. But do you see me boasting about it? No, I move on . You see, that's the difference between ordinary people and you, Jake. Other people understands that they were just lucky.
Jake99
Oct 11th, 2005, 11:47 AM
Its not luck when you win nearly every time, and its not luck when you do things that all others combined cannot. Wonder / Hostess is made of the best baking ingredients known to man and it is a fresh and perishable product which is the toughest to manage and distribute. It is also the largest fleet of trucks by one company in the US as of 10 years ago. The only thing George Bush knows how to run is a war ( which he has someone else manage) and a series of destructive social and environmental practices ( also managed by someone else). The man is an air head with no ability to fix anything and his track record is the worst I have ever seen. I just cant wait to see Hillary and her criminal friends take the reigns George and the incompetent buffoons.
Beatnik Bob
Oct 11th, 2005, 4:30 PM
God doesn't like it when you feed poor little children empty calories.......you are an essential component to why America has so many obese poeple. By the way.....is the job you do really hard and time consuming Jake?
Philosopher Foelhe
Oct 11th, 2005, 9:37 PM
Can I ask you a personal question, Jake? You say you're infallible, you never make mistakes, but why did you marry your ex-wife?
You yourself have claimed that she was "of the earth" and that she always complained. And you also claim to be the son of God, so you have no excuse for not seeing how the relationship would turn out. So, why? Why did you put yourself through a divorce?
You yourself have claimed that she was "of the earth" and that she always complained. And you also claim to be the son of God, so you have no excuse for not seeing how the relationship would turn out. So, why? Why did you put yourself through a divorce?
nrj
Oct 12th, 2005, 1:19 AM
Its not luck when you win nearly every time Yes, it is.
and its not luck when you do things that all others combined cannot. I doub't the entire world can't make a bakery become succesfull.
Jake, no offense, but I don't class that as miracles. So far I've seen, NO ONE ON THIS FORUM class that as miracles. Only yourself.
and its not luck when you do things that all others combined cannot. I doub't the entire world can't make a bakery become succesfull.
Jake, no offense, but I don't class that as miracles. So far I've seen, NO ONE ON THIS FORUM class that as miracles. Only yourself.
B.NyeTheUruk-Hai
Oct 12th, 2005, 8:56 AM
Can I ask you a personal question, Jake? You say you're infallible, you never make mistakes, but why did you marry your ex-wife?
Good point, Foelhe. Jake is apparently successful at EVERYTHING in life. Yet marriage, something that many people would consider one of the most important things in life, is something that he failed MISERABLY at. Son of God indeed...
Good point, Foelhe. Jake is apparently successful at EVERYTHING in life. Yet marriage, something that many people would consider one of the most important things in life, is something that he failed MISERABLY at. Son of God indeed...
Beatnik Bob
Oct 12th, 2005, 5:31 PM
Philosopher Foelhe saw through your descuise Jake, start thinking fast!
And seriusly, is it really time consuming? The job that you do? Because if it is, how do you find time to debate on this sight. And if it's not, then how do you manage to train your workers so fast? Because, according to you, we of this Earth, are supposedly really stupid, so we need a lot of time for things to be explained to us.
And seriusly, is it really time consuming? The job that you do? Because if it is, how do you find time to debate on this sight. And if it's not, then how do you manage to train your workers so fast? Because, according to you, we of this Earth, are supposedly really stupid, so we need a lot of time for things to be explained to us.
Jake99
Oct 13th, 2005, 6:16 PM
I married the granddaughter of a crooked lawyer and city court judge who later became the corporation council for the city of Buffalo NY. He was also associated with the Italian mob and he went to church every week in his Cadillac. My ex wife was knock out beautiful like Catherine Zeta Jones and she was fine until she got the upper hand and tried to be a leader in the home, mother and wife with no patience or leadership experience. As a man in this state and country the chances of retaining control of your children in the event of divorce is systematically unlikely. As soon as you disagree with or council your wife for being unfriendly, she can use the threat of divorce and file unfounded restraining orders. So all a man can do is endure what he can and then stand against anyone who assists the woman, harms the children or discriminates against the man. Men get crushed all day every day in family court and in most cases the woman being empowered with legal control over the children is the problem. And if you don't agree to divorce then the women file restraining orders that land you in jail by intention to separate you as permanently as possible from your children. Not to mention that the women and courts bring your young children into police stations and courts to testify against their own fathers. That is cruel and unusual punishment when no crime has even been committed and child abuse at the highest level. Someone should be severely corrected for even thinking of doing such a thing to a man and his children. I have the perfect solution for criminals like the american mother and the US Judicial system, its called the written law, human rights, equal rights and constitutional rights which they have been caught violating on an all day every day basis for decades. Its time the home wreckers and child abusers were put under the scope of the law they vowed to adhere to and protect. If I believed in jails they would be full of divorce lawyers who are clearly violating human rights and doing tremendous harm to all people of this world.
I have not declared any income for 5 years since I took a severance package from the bakery. I have built two small businesses during those years but my income and work is hidden and protected to some degree.
Did you know that direct ( income tax) taxation is not legal according to the IRS code and Constitution in the US? The instructions for filling out a 1040 form are specifically for use by foreigners, the last I checked which was 5 years ago. The "save a patriot" organization has been trying to get the federal government to bring the IRS to court for years but they are immune and refuse to defend their illegal position of enforcing direct taxation. These by the way are the same fools that respond to the disasters waiting to happen that they have been building for years along the coast lines of all countries. All of the US coastal buildings are in harms way and we just had major floods on the East coast. The manpower is too busy playing with stocks and bonds, lotteries, sales and advertisements that I do not want or need.
I am obligated to take on the criminals of this world and the best place to do that is in a court house against them and the system that protects them and threatens everyone. I ask for the courts surrender verbally, in writing, through my lawyer over the fax machine and through the mail just to make sure they understand that they need to take a knee. They are the wolves in sheeps clothing that all were warned of. I am the man the lions cannot eat.
I have not declared any income for 5 years since I took a severance package from the bakery. I have built two small businesses during those years but my income and work is hidden and protected to some degree.
Did you know that direct ( income tax) taxation is not legal according to the IRS code and Constitution in the US? The instructions for filling out a 1040 form are specifically for use by foreigners, the last I checked which was 5 years ago. The "save a patriot" organization has been trying to get the federal government to bring the IRS to court for years but they are immune and refuse to defend their illegal position of enforcing direct taxation. These by the way are the same fools that respond to the disasters waiting to happen that they have been building for years along the coast lines of all countries. All of the US coastal buildings are in harms way and we just had major floods on the East coast. The manpower is too busy playing with stocks and bonds, lotteries, sales and advertisements that I do not want or need.
I am obligated to take on the criminals of this world and the best place to do that is in a court house against them and the system that protects them and threatens everyone. I ask for the courts surrender verbally, in writing, through my lawyer over the fax machine and through the mail just to make sure they understand that they need to take a knee. They are the wolves in sheeps clothing that all were warned of. I am the man the lions cannot eat.
Philosopher Foelhe
Oct 13th, 2005, 9:36 PM
My ex wife was knock out beautiful like Catherine Zeta Jones and she was fine until she got the upper hand and tried to be a leader in the home, mother and wife with no patience or leadership experience. As a man in this state and country the chances of retaining control of your children in the event of divorce is systematically unlikely. As soon as you disagree with or council your wife for being unfriendly, she can use the threat of divorce and file unfounded restraining orders. So all a man can do is endure what he can and then stand against anyone who assists the woman, harms the children or discriminates against the man.
... Okay, I understand why you divorced your wife, but that wasn't my question. My question was why you married your wife in the first place. Didn't you realize she was going to become twisted. If you did, why put yourself through the pain? If you didn't, how can we trust you to set up a long-term system? After all, you couldn't guess the reactions of someone very close to you, on a personal level - how are you going to possibly understand the reactions of mankind to your system, let alone the process of the system itself?
Did you know that direct ( income tax) taxation is not legal according to the IRS code and Constitution in the US?
Really? Well, in this case I'd say it should definately be legalized, as income tax is the fairest taxation method we really have right now. Frankly I find your hatred of the tax a little absurd, as it seems like the closest we have right now to your plan.
... Okay, I understand why you divorced your wife, but that wasn't my question. My question was why you married your wife in the first place. Didn't you realize she was going to become twisted. If you did, why put yourself through the pain? If you didn't, how can we trust you to set up a long-term system? After all, you couldn't guess the reactions of someone very close to you, on a personal level - how are you going to possibly understand the reactions of mankind to your system, let alone the process of the system itself?
Did you know that direct ( income tax) taxation is not legal according to the IRS code and Constitution in the US?
Really? Well, in this case I'd say it should definately be legalized, as income tax is the fairest taxation method we really have right now. Frankly I find your hatred of the tax a little absurd, as it seems like the closest we have right now to your plan.
nrj
Oct 14th, 2005, 1:27 AM
... Okay, I understand why you divorced your wife, but that wasn't my question. My question was why you married your wife in the first place. Didn't you realize she was going to become twisted? Actually, Foelhe, I myself have misjudged a relationship, so I know it ain't that easy to see the future.
But the Son of God should have foresight. I agree on that.
But the Son of God should have foresight. I agree on that.
B.NyeTheUruk-Hai
Oct 14th, 2005, 9:27 AM
EDIT: OOPS! Double post! How did that happen? I'm sure that would NEVER happen to Jake...
B.NyeTheUruk-Hai
Oct 14th, 2005, 9:28 AM
My ex wife was knock out beautiful like Catherine Zeta Jones
Why am I not surprised? I'm also sure that your shit smells like roses...
she was fine until she got the upper hand and tried to be a leader in the home, mother and wife with no patience or leadership experience.
HAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!! Wow, the messiah is Archie Bunker!!! LOL!!! News flash, Jake... Marriage is a PARTNERSHIP...
Did you know that direct ( income tax) taxation is not legal according to the IRS code and Constitution in the US?
Well then, judging by your past "miraculous" exploits, you should be able to fix this situation in about 3 hours. THAT would convince me that you were the messiah, Jake. And if you could do this in the States, could you do the same thing in Canada? Our taxes are even higher here...
Really? Well, in this case I'd say it should definately be legalized, as income tax is the fairest taxation method we really have right now. Frankly I find your hatred of the tax a little absurd, as it seems like the closest we have right now to your plan.
Agreed, Foelhe. Income tax is NECESSARY. How can you POSSIBLY run a country without paying people to run it for its citizens? I'm sure that Jake will have an answer to this...
Why am I not surprised? I'm also sure that your shit smells like roses...
she was fine until she got the upper hand and tried to be a leader in the home, mother and wife with no patience or leadership experience.
HAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!! Wow, the messiah is Archie Bunker!!! LOL!!! News flash, Jake... Marriage is a PARTNERSHIP...
Did you know that direct ( income tax) taxation is not legal according to the IRS code and Constitution in the US?
Well then, judging by your past "miraculous" exploits, you should be able to fix this situation in about 3 hours. THAT would convince me that you were the messiah, Jake. And if you could do this in the States, could you do the same thing in Canada? Our taxes are even higher here...
Really? Well, in this case I'd say it should definately be legalized, as income tax is the fairest taxation method we really have right now. Frankly I find your hatred of the tax a little absurd, as it seems like the closest we have right now to your plan.
Agreed, Foelhe. Income tax is NECESSARY. How can you POSSIBLY run a country without paying people to run it for its citizens? I'm sure that Jake will have an answer to this...
nrj
Oct 14th, 2005, 10:05 AM
Really? Well, in this case I'd say it should definately be legalized, as income tax is the fairest taxation method we really have right now. Frankly I find your hatred of the tax a little absurd, as it seems like the closest we have right now to your plan. Ah! Missed the taxes! Well, I've been paying taxes now for about a year, and I got to tell ya: It fucking stinks... I pay 40% of my income to the goverment, and then much is spent on clothes and other nescesarities. Buuuuuuut, that's the swedish taxes off course. Don't know how much you have in the states, but I'm sure you don't pay 40% to the goeverment.
Jake99
Oct 14th, 2005, 11:35 AM
The Internal Revenue Service would not be in business 24 hours after entering a court house in defense of its operation and activities. There are at least 12 hours of compiled evidence and video prosecution presentations against them that clearly outline the illegal nature of the IRS existence and performance that the federal government refuses to hear. The government and the IRS wrote the rules by which I ask them to perform, they are not my rules they put them in writing not I. I however can read, and what they say is that direct taxation is illegal in the US. I use rule of law in all of my court battles and protests which is why I do not lose.
You should be able to raise a family with any woman without the fear of having your home turned upside down by the leadership of fools that effect you, your wife and children. I gave up on trying to lead her and spent my time punching those who were invading my home with as much legal firepower as I have. I have been at war both declared and undeclared since I was 11 years old with the leaders and systems the world stands behind. What you are using is the opposite of what it suggests in all of your holy books and that my friends leads to Satans world and is the work of the anti christ.
And as far as your taxation system and huge government wastes of time and energy. I can do at least twice what you are doing with a small fraction of the manpower and resources your systems use. I also have specialized in changing systems that people said was the best they could find and my new systems shut their mouth in minutes about having the best system. I am way outside the box you are stuck in and have been since I was a teenager.
Its not the age its the experience.
You should be able to raise a family with any woman without the fear of having your home turned upside down by the leadership of fools that effect you, your wife and children. I gave up on trying to lead her and spent my time punching those who were invading my home with as much legal firepower as I have. I have been at war both declared and undeclared since I was 11 years old with the leaders and systems the world stands behind. What you are using is the opposite of what it suggests in all of your holy books and that my friends leads to Satans world and is the work of the anti christ.
And as far as your taxation system and huge government wastes of time and energy. I can do at least twice what you are doing with a small fraction of the manpower and resources your systems use. I also have specialized in changing systems that people said was the best they could find and my new systems shut their mouth in minutes about having the best system. I am way outside the box you are stuck in and have been since I was a teenager.
Its not the age its the experience.
Philosopher Foelhe
Oct 14th, 2005, 1:53 PM
Jake, stop being such a weasel and answer my question. Why did you marry your wife?
B.NyeTheUruk-Hai
Oct 14th, 2005, 8:20 PM
Its not the age its the experience.
I strongly suspect that a tenuous grasp on reality is also a major factor...
I strongly suspect that a tenuous grasp on reality is also a major factor...
Jake99
Oct 15th, 2005, 12:02 PM
I married my wife because I loved her and considered her a good friend and mate which she was to some degree. I don't blame what happened to me, my family and our marriage on her, she was just misled by the mainsteam. She divorced me, I had no other choice but to save myself from her empowered wrath and stand against those who were training and supporting her. I was an abused husband both mentally and physically and I always kept my composure and took it or dealt with it like a man. I never hit her or engaged in arguments that were by design meant to separate me from my home. And besides I was destined to take on the world at the millennium and I knew that I would have to resolve the domestic quarrels so it was just a training session. I had to experience the worst that a man could suffer and yet be totally strong enough to live through it and win your support. Between P.M.S., bad operating systems and stress my wife turned into a bundle of chaotic, destructive, impatient, nervous energy that I could not endorse or assist. I unlike others understand how she became such an unreasonable, irresponsible and uncaring person. The dogs were more important than I was to her because they loved her no matter what she did and I spoke out about her performance as a diabolically destructive threat to the serenity of the home. She did much better with the anti PMS pills but did not like being drugged and decided divorce was a better solution to her problems than protecting her family from the harm she was administering. I don't agree with drugs either, its the system I wish to change so we don't need drugs to function normally and rationally.
I joined the US Marines so I could defend myself against anyone and anything and after I strapped on my armor and climbed to the top of the cliff where only Jesus has ever been I thrust a sword into everyone of your incompetent and destructive leaders in defiance of their ways in the court room where they were most vulnerable. You see once you have fulfilled all of the prophesies, you have already proven that you outrank and outperform the rest of the world combined and only one man can do that. He is known to you as the christ among many other names you call him/ me by. I see all of the disasters that mankind either creates or is incapable of managing every day in the news and I can manage everyone of those things to near perfection just like I have in the bakeries, Marines and business's I managed. I have been trained and become extremely successful in an urgency and permanent and temporary problem solving environment and I am the best that the world has ever seen at that. Ask and you shall receive: give me 1 loaf of bread or 1 fish and I will multiply it ten fold, happens to be a engineering specialty of mine. And yet the bakeries are in bankruptcy court and the fish are being over harvested or contaminated by those leaders that I clean up behind as usual. I cannot keep up with the leadership of this world and that is why I would insist that they stay home where they can do less damage or change their ways.
Take the earthquakes in the Himalayas that have left 2.5 million homeless and likewise for Katrina victims. The first thing I would do is evacuate people to proper buildings that are freed up by no longer needing all the middlemen systems. Then as soon as the people are healthy enough to build new housing and related infrastructure that is what they would be doing, which would again leave the buildings available for the next refugees. Only as a temporary measure would I send tents and mobile homes to shelter people until they could be removed. I only need a few planes for human travel since I don't have any salesman which leaves allot of human transport planes at the ready for evacuations anywhere in the world on a moments notice. Thats a far cry from leaving people in tents through the worst weather conditions like 15' of annual snowfall which is normal in the quake region.
I joined the US Marines so I could defend myself against anyone and anything and after I strapped on my armor and climbed to the top of the cliff where only Jesus has ever been I thrust a sword into everyone of your incompetent and destructive leaders in defiance of their ways in the court room where they were most vulnerable. You see once you have fulfilled all of the prophesies, you have already proven that you outrank and outperform the rest of the world combined and only one man can do that. He is known to you as the christ among many other names you call him/ me by. I see all of the disasters that mankind either creates or is incapable of managing every day in the news and I can manage everyone of those things to near perfection just like I have in the bakeries, Marines and business's I managed. I have been trained and become extremely successful in an urgency and permanent and temporary problem solving environment and I am the best that the world has ever seen at that. Ask and you shall receive: give me 1 loaf of bread or 1 fish and I will multiply it ten fold, happens to be a engineering specialty of mine. And yet the bakeries are in bankruptcy court and the fish are being over harvested or contaminated by those leaders that I clean up behind as usual. I cannot keep up with the leadership of this world and that is why I would insist that they stay home where they can do less damage or change their ways.
Take the earthquakes in the Himalayas that have left 2.5 million homeless and likewise for Katrina victims. The first thing I would do is evacuate people to proper buildings that are freed up by no longer needing all the middlemen systems. Then as soon as the people are healthy enough to build new housing and related infrastructure that is what they would be doing, which would again leave the buildings available for the next refugees. Only as a temporary measure would I send tents and mobile homes to shelter people until they could be removed. I only need a few planes for human travel since I don't have any salesman which leaves allot of human transport planes at the ready for evacuations anywhere in the world on a moments notice. Thats a far cry from leaving people in tents through the worst weather conditions like 15' of annual snowfall which is normal in the quake region.
Beatnik Bob
Oct 15th, 2005, 8:24 PM
JAKE!!!!!!!!!!!!
Son of God indeed..........I looked up the info about you on this forum, and under interests you missspelt snowboard!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! You called it snoboard
You're so extremely perfect Jake.......you have no faults whatsoever, the next time I see a Twinkie......I'll know it is derived from a divine source..........
:lol:
And you must of been able to see past the woman's beauty, and know that you would need to divorce her.
And Jake, you're like 50 years old, and you haven't lead me one micrometer anywhere!
And you talked on this thread about being extremely athletic in your younger days. Well, and this is true, my grandmother is over 80 years old, and she takes a walk every morning, around the town, and she lives with no one, and manages her life quite nicely. And I'm talking an 80 year old woman who gardens, and grows her own......well, almost all her own food in a garden. And you have already lost the use of playing sports quite early on, compared to my grandmother's age.
Son of God indeed..........I looked up the info about you on this forum, and under interests you missspelt snowboard!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! You called it snoboard
You're so extremely perfect Jake.......you have no faults whatsoever, the next time I see a Twinkie......I'll know it is derived from a divine source..........
:lol:
And you must of been able to see past the woman's beauty, and know that you would need to divorce her.
And Jake, you're like 50 years old, and you haven't lead me one micrometer anywhere!
And you talked on this thread about being extremely athletic in your younger days. Well, and this is true, my grandmother is over 80 years old, and she takes a walk every morning, around the town, and she lives with no one, and manages her life quite nicely. And I'm talking an 80 year old woman who gardens, and grows her own......well, almost all her own food in a garden. And you have already lost the use of playing sports quite early on, compared to my grandmother's age.
stewey
Oct 15th, 2005, 9:05 PM
where was god at the time of the tsunami sitin on his fat ass and reading the telegraph where was he in the world wars where was he when the hurracanes hit florida WERE IS HE I THE TIME OF NEED
He was too busy checking your spelling
He was too busy checking your spelling
Jake99
Oct 17th, 2005, 6:46 PM
As of last winter I was still one of the best snoboarders on the slopes of New England and that is how it is spelled in the industry. I stopped playing tennis a few years ago due to not wanting a fourth knee surgery and my serve and overheads were top notch at that time. The last time I performed at softball was at 40 when I hit 2 homeruns and made several defensive plays that you won't see on TV. The only time in my life that I was not the best player on the field is when one of my brothers is playing as well. They are highly trained in every sport and I still win occasionally which should never happen. Their is no sport that I cannot compete at a very high level at even today but it is no longer a focus of my time and I am not in shape due to an injury.
75% of all US Christians get divorced and the rest are not necessarily happy. My job is to make divorce unlikely and you don't get the experience you need by marrying a wall flower. I took on what some have called the prettiest and most difficult woman they ever saw by intention. If I cant handle her then no one can and that is a systematic problem. I know exactly why she was unhappy because she gave me that information as the years went by.
God was with me writting to you when the hurricanes demolished your ill thought out stick houses and oil tanks you left on the beach.
75% of all US Christians get divorced and the rest are not necessarily happy. My job is to make divorce unlikely and you don't get the experience you need by marrying a wall flower. I took on what some have called the prettiest and most difficult woman they ever saw by intention. If I cant handle her then no one can and that is a systematic problem. I know exactly why she was unhappy because she gave me that information as the years went by.
God was with me writting to you when the hurricanes demolished your ill thought out stick houses and oil tanks you left on the beach.
Beatnik Bob
Oct 18th, 2005, 5:28 PM
No one wants to hear you bitch any more.......
Jake99
Oct 21st, 2005, 12:43 PM
You are the ones that are bitching I am just offering solutions. Its what I do which would make coming to a forum like this obsolete. You see I got so tired of hearing people complain that I resolved all the things they complain about and I did it really fast. Complaints working for me last about a week before they are permanently resolved. From what I see the world leaders have never even permanently resolved one complaint. Nice job on disaster relief, what a JOKE.
Beatnik Bob
Oct 21st, 2005, 4:30 PM
You are the ones that are bitching I am just offering solutions. Its what I do which would make coming to a forum like this obsolete. You see I got so tired of hearing people complain that I resolved all the things they complain about and I did it really fast. Complaints working for me last about a week before they are permanently resolved. From what I see the world leaders have never even permanently resolved one complaint. Nice job on disaster relief, what a JOKE. Wait a second, as the 'son of God' you should not be accusing others of bitching. And can you fix the complaint of me wanting my great, great, great, grandmother rise from the dead again? Can you resolve that in a week, by bringing her back to life?
Philosopher Foelhe
Oct 22nd, 2005, 1:07 AM
You see I got so tired of hearing people complain that I resolved all the things they complain about and I did it really fast.
Okay, Jake, I have a complaint for you to resolve. See, you've been trying to prove you're the messiah, but your definition of proof leaves something to be desired. My complaint is that you can't prove to me that you are the messiah. I'd like you to at least make me think it's possible.
And before you try, a few things.
No complaining my version of "proof" is substandard. If you're the messiah, you can make it work.
No saying that I don't believe because I don't want to believe. I've dealt with wackier shit than this without even blinking. And I've believed some of it, because it logically fit. If it's real, you can make it fit.
I think my posts on this site should tell you what I'll need to know. After all, if you are the messiah, I assume you can read between the lines. If you have questions, feel free to ask, although to be fair I don't really know if I can explain my own mental state.
Sound fair? Great. Take all the time you want.
... And because I doubt your reply is going to be worthwhile, something I've been wanting to say for awhile. This is probably going to be my last post to you on this topic, and I want the record to be straight.
During our little chats, I have been sarcastic and perhaps harsh. So it's possible you think I dislike you. Truth is, I've been willing to do damn near anything to get through that thick skull of yours, not because I've wanted to prove you wrong, but because I'm actually concerned about you. I don't think you're the messiah. You haven't been consistent or convincing during your time here. I think you're trapped in your delusion, or you've been playing a complicated game at our expense because your own life feels inadequate. Doesn't really matter which.
I may not respect you, I may never agree with you, but I certainly wish you well. I hope you get the help you need, Jake. Sorry I couldn't provide it.
Okay, Jake, I have a complaint for you to resolve. See, you've been trying to prove you're the messiah, but your definition of proof leaves something to be desired. My complaint is that you can't prove to me that you are the messiah. I'd like you to at least make me think it's possible.
And before you try, a few things.
No complaining my version of "proof" is substandard. If you're the messiah, you can make it work.
No saying that I don't believe because I don't want to believe. I've dealt with wackier shit than this without even blinking. And I've believed some of it, because it logically fit. If it's real, you can make it fit.
I think my posts on this site should tell you what I'll need to know. After all, if you are the messiah, I assume you can read between the lines. If you have questions, feel free to ask, although to be fair I don't really know if I can explain my own mental state.
Sound fair? Great. Take all the time you want.
... And because I doubt your reply is going to be worthwhile, something I've been wanting to say for awhile. This is probably going to be my last post to you on this topic, and I want the record to be straight.
During our little chats, I have been sarcastic and perhaps harsh. So it's possible you think I dislike you. Truth is, I've been willing to do damn near anything to get through that thick skull of yours, not because I've wanted to prove you wrong, but because I'm actually concerned about you. I don't think you're the messiah. You haven't been consistent or convincing during your time here. I think you're trapped in your delusion, or you've been playing a complicated game at our expense because your own life feels inadequate. Doesn't really matter which.
I may not respect you, I may never agree with you, but I certainly wish you well. I hope you get the help you need, Jake. Sorry I couldn't provide it.
Jake99
Oct 22nd, 2005, 12:11 PM
I have been playing this game since I was a little boy and leaving the extensive proof behind me the whole way. Christ can do things that no one else has ever done and that is what I have done. You can call them miracles but magic was never used just common sense, smart work, superior ability and a different mindset. What your leaders cannot achieve I have always accomplished in a very short period of time. You cannot find the destination you seek by going in the opposite direction but its right in front of you when you are going in the right direction. The world has millions of people in the homeless and hungry category and I can solve that problem permanently in less than a year without a single charity being involved and no one on the earth is negatively effected. And with that comes all the other things I have talked about at the same time. I need no currency, no insurance company, no stock market, no tax collector, very few lawyers and the list goes on and on. What I need is quality products that last which is the opposite of what I see in the market place and coastal housing. George Bush and co. have no problem filling land fills it leads to jobs which I am trying to reduce in the sectors he promotes and increase in the areas he cannot afford to support.
Beatnik Bob
Oct 23rd, 2005, 6:20 PM
Can you make my great, great, great, great grandmother rise from the dead?
Mezurashi
Oct 24th, 2005, 7:12 AM
I have been telling these lies since I was little and leaving deception behind me the whole way. Satan can do things that no one else has ever done and that is what I think I have done. You can call them crap but it was just common sense, smart work, superior ability and a different mindset. What you cannot achieve I have always accomplished in a very short period of time. I cannot find the destination you seek but its right in front of you when you are going in the wrong direction. The world has billions of people in the homeless and hungry category and I can solve that problem permanently. And with that comes all the other things I have talked about at the same time. I need no currency, no insurance company, no stock market, no tax collector, very few lawyers and the list goes on and on. George Bush and co. have no problem creating jobs which I am trying to reduce.
wow, the more he spews the less he makes sense. He MUST be a messiah, rofl.
wow, the more he spews the less he makes sense. He MUST be a messiah, rofl.
Jake99
Oct 29th, 2005, 3:14 PM
Christ speaks a language you only preach and christ succeeds when you always fail so follow whoever you want to. I always bet on a winner which is why I always win. George W. Bush is probably the dumbest person I have ever seen in a management position and I have seen plenty of losers.
Sammy56
Oct 30th, 2005, 1:34 AM
Originally Posted by Jake99
Christ speaks a language you only preach and christ succeeds when you always fail so follow whoever you want to.
Can you elaborate on your meaning here? I do not understand what you are trying to say.
Originally Posted by Jake99
George W. Bush is probably the dumbest person I have ever seen in a management position and I have seen plenty of losers.
Jake, it seems like you blame George Bush for most of the problems in the world today. I do not think he is the best president and I really do not agree with most of his politics, but he is not to blame for everything. I imagine being the president is a hard job. If you think you can do better, you should run. I mean, if you are the messiah you should have no problem starting your own political party and getting elected for president.
Christ speaks a language you only preach and christ succeeds when you always fail so follow whoever you want to.
Can you elaborate on your meaning here? I do not understand what you are trying to say.
Originally Posted by Jake99
George W. Bush is probably the dumbest person I have ever seen in a management position and I have seen plenty of losers.
Jake, it seems like you blame George Bush for most of the problems in the world today. I do not think he is the best president and I really do not agree with most of his politics, but he is not to blame for everything. I imagine being the president is a hard job. If you think you can do better, you should run. I mean, if you are the messiah you should have no problem starting your own political party and getting elected for president.
Defiant Noquisi
Oct 30th, 2005, 1:34 AM
Id like to see Jake post in hyperqube's Natalie Holloway thread. Jake, if you would please go to this thread and make sense of all the whacky math on it? It makes no sense whatsoever.
http://www.armageddononline.net/forums/showthread.php?t=5284
http://www.armageddononline.net/forums/showthread.php?t=5284
eyekwah
Oct 30th, 2005, 1:50 AM
Ok,Im not big into Gaelic but isnt that "Sons of the hounds come here and get flesh"? Ive seen that on every Clan Cameron webpage so GGTMK's translation makes no sense to me. Then again, it could have come out for children to come and sing or something to that affect if you really dont know the translations. Please correct me if Im wrong. Theres a Morrison in the house!
The All Powerful has just posted. :indec:
i am a cameron DN you are corect it does translate into Sons of the hounds come here and get flesh ggtmk one word for you amadan i think thats it lol cant remeber
The All Powerful has just posted. :indec:
i am a cameron DN you are corect it does translate into Sons of the hounds come here and get flesh ggtmk one word for you amadan i think thats it lol cant remeber
Defiant Noquisi
Oct 30th, 2005, 2:10 AM
i am a cameron DN you are corect it does translate into Sons of the hounds come here and get flesh ggtmk one word for you amadan i think thats it lol cant remeber Thanks for replying since my Gaelic translation skills are next to nothing. My family hasnt been strongly involved in Clan Morrison aside from discussion of the family crest and tartan. No Clan motto is going to be some whimpy flowery one thats for sure. Scots have BALLS!
Defiant Noquisi
Oct 30th, 2005, 3:29 AM
God works in strange and mysterious ways that the finite human mind cant understand. Then why is it that religious "leaders" feel they can explain it if the human mind cant understand it? Arent they human too? Additionally, why is it that in other spiritualities such as in mine, we have no problem understanding what the Creator communicates yet when we state this, we are refuted by those human minds that cant understand it to begin with?
If 6 million jews were not murdered in ww2 would they have been so adament to have their own country? Would the world have agreed? The "world" did NOT agree! The US agreed, helped them do it and the majority of the "free" (I use that term loosely) countries followed along like good sheep. Of course you are also ignoring the enormous contingent of jewish people that did not and still do not agree with the mass murder of muslim people and land theft committed by their own.
Let me clue you in on the ignorance you posted. In the manner in which you posted, since 6 million jews were exterminated they deserved their own country. Ill call it....
Genocide By The Numbers
From 1492 until the reign of terror of Columbus and family was stopped, over 8 million Arawak, Taino and Lucayan Indians in the Bahamas were held in slavery, tortured, raped, dismembered and murdered.
It is estimated that there were over 100 million Indian people in the Americas, approximately 18 million in what is now the US before European contact. The Indian populations in the area of the US were reduced to about 237,000 over the course of four centuries.
It is estimated that there were over 30 million Natives in the area of Mexico and that number was reduced to about 3 million over the course of four decades!
It is estimated that in 500 years, over 260 million American Natives were murdered or died by disease brought on by the non-Native invaders. Small pox was much more cost effective than gas chambers. Guess where Hitler got the idea on how to get rid of jewish people?
Now I agree than my ancestors had it "easy" since they wernt persecuted for 2000 years like the jewish people have been. However...
What about the 41 million Russian people murdered by their government from 1917-1987? Shouldnt they by right of murder be able to carve out their own piece of the country?
What about the 35 million Chinese people murdered by their government from 1949-1987? Shouldnt the Chinese people be able to have a big chunk of their own since Tiananmen Square seems to not be available?
So, using your justification that jewish people should have their own country because so many of them were murdered, it seems to me that there are more people than just jewish people that also deserve their own country.
The jews are Gods chosen people. Statements like that are completely arrogant, self serving and ignorant.
Who hates christians and most of all hates Jews?????........Muslims, followers of Islam. Again with the ignorance! I would bet money that if you asked a muslim extremist who they hated most they would say an AMERICAN before they would say a jewish or christian person. In the manner you posted, you make it look like ALL muslims hate jews and christians which is entirely UNTRUE.
And with highly ignorant statements like that "chosen people" one above its no wonder to me why they would hate anyone.
If 6 million jews were not murdered in ww2 would they have been so adament to have their own country? Would the world have agreed? The "world" did NOT agree! The US agreed, helped them do it and the majority of the "free" (I use that term loosely) countries followed along like good sheep. Of course you are also ignoring the enormous contingent of jewish people that did not and still do not agree with the mass murder of muslim people and land theft committed by their own.
Let me clue you in on the ignorance you posted. In the manner in which you posted, since 6 million jews were exterminated they deserved their own country. Ill call it....
Genocide By The Numbers
From 1492 until the reign of terror of Columbus and family was stopped, over 8 million Arawak, Taino and Lucayan Indians in the Bahamas were held in slavery, tortured, raped, dismembered and murdered.
It is estimated that there were over 100 million Indian people in the Americas, approximately 18 million in what is now the US before European contact. The Indian populations in the area of the US were reduced to about 237,000 over the course of four centuries.
It is estimated that there were over 30 million Natives in the area of Mexico and that number was reduced to about 3 million over the course of four decades!
It is estimated that in 500 years, over 260 million American Natives were murdered or died by disease brought on by the non-Native invaders. Small pox was much more cost effective than gas chambers. Guess where Hitler got the idea on how to get rid of jewish people?
Now I agree than my ancestors had it "easy" since they wernt persecuted for 2000 years like the jewish people have been. However...
What about the 41 million Russian people murdered by their government from 1917-1987? Shouldnt they by right of murder be able to carve out their own piece of the country?
What about the 35 million Chinese people murdered by their government from 1949-1987? Shouldnt the Chinese people be able to have a big chunk of their own since Tiananmen Square seems to not be available?
So, using your justification that jewish people should have their own country because so many of them were murdered, it seems to me that there are more people than just jewish people that also deserve their own country.
The jews are Gods chosen people. Statements like that are completely arrogant, self serving and ignorant.
Who hates christians and most of all hates Jews?????........Muslims, followers of Islam. Again with the ignorance! I would bet money that if you asked a muslim extremist who they hated most they would say an AMERICAN before they would say a jewish or christian person. In the manner you posted, you make it look like ALL muslims hate jews and christians which is entirely UNTRUE.
And with highly ignorant statements like that "chosen people" one above its no wonder to me why they would hate anyone.
B.NyeTheUruk-Hai
Oct 30th, 2005, 9:12 AM
Thank you for providing the information above, DN. Very eye-opening. I had no idea about most of what you've said. It's not only disturbing that these mass murders actually happened, but it's even more disturbing that they've been forgotten by most people. It's incredible how horribly humans can treat fellow humans...
Beatnik Bob
Oct 31st, 2005, 1:30 PM
The Jews are God's chosen people Actually, the Mishnah clearly states that, what that means is that humanity is God's chosen creatures. And G-d never said the Jews were his chosen people. He said Israel was. And Israel has the same root words (in Hebrew) as Shekinah. So in the Hebrew language, Israel is another name for humanity.
Jake99
Nov 22nd, 2005, 12:41 PM
Cherisa you are a gem, your post about hating God and Christ is right on. This is Satans world and all are sinners that follow him.
I wish I knew something about Natalie Holloway but I don't so my comments would be useless. Just another crime scene that I can prevent from happening ever again. Its not rocket science just a new simple system.
All are Gods people not just the Jews.
I thought this site went down so I have not been here for awhile.
What GW Bush and all his assistants cannot do in his lifetime I can do in an hour and that is something I have demonstrated many hundreds of times as a leader of the largest Bakeries in the world. I walked into the same chaos that the world is in and quickly changed or modified most of the systems, and chaos disappeared forever. I cannot make Capitalism work and neither can anyone else which is why I cannot be president of the US. Several union members and stewards have asked me to run for US president after seeing how easily I calmed the storm they had been fighting. I don't endorse gambling so the stock market and the casinos are not my way. And I don't believe in lines on the map so I stand alone once again. But if you are looking for peace, prosperity, long life and fair play then I am your man for that is what I specialize in doing and I have decades of extensive leadership experience that includes no failures. I am also undefeated in court against the Judicial system (25 times) and the unions (50 times) and have never had someone protest against my ways or my judgements which have been many and sometimes very unusual but never cruel. Its tough to make friends when they follow your enemy but if you vote as usual for the better looking man, then I have another advantage. Humbly speaking I have an advantage over all other men and women, just by way of genetics and what I did with such a gift.
I wish I knew something about Natalie Holloway but I don't so my comments would be useless. Just another crime scene that I can prevent from happening ever again. Its not rocket science just a new simple system.
All are Gods people not just the Jews.
I thought this site went down so I have not been here for awhile.
What GW Bush and all his assistants cannot do in his lifetime I can do in an hour and that is something I have demonstrated many hundreds of times as a leader of the largest Bakeries in the world. I walked into the same chaos that the world is in and quickly changed or modified most of the systems, and chaos disappeared forever. I cannot make Capitalism work and neither can anyone else which is why I cannot be president of the US. Several union members and stewards have asked me to run for US president after seeing how easily I calmed the storm they had been fighting. I don't endorse gambling so the stock market and the casinos are not my way. And I don't believe in lines on the map so I stand alone once again. But if you are looking for peace, prosperity, long life and fair play then I am your man for that is what I specialize in doing and I have decades of extensive leadership experience that includes no failures. I am also undefeated in court against the Judicial system (25 times) and the unions (50 times) and have never had someone protest against my ways or my judgements which have been many and sometimes very unusual but never cruel. Its tough to make friends when they follow your enemy but if you vote as usual for the better looking man, then I have another advantage. Humbly speaking I have an advantage over all other men and women, just by way of genetics and what I did with such a gift.
B.NyeTheUruk-Hai
Nov 22nd, 2005, 5:05 PM
Jake, you were whacking off while you were typing that last post, weren't ya? Yeah, you like yourself, don't you? SAY YOUR NAME!!! SAY YOUR NAME!!!
Sammy56
Nov 22nd, 2005, 6:19 PM
Originally Posted by Jake99
This is Satans world and all are sinners that follow him.
Well, since I really do not believe in an actual Satan this is kind of pointless, but I'll say it anyway. I am the last person to claim that I am free from sin. I think it is impossible for a human to go through their life without intentionally hurting someone else, which is what I think sin is. But just because you do something wrong does not mean you follow Satan. It means you are human.
Originally Posted by Jake99
All are Gods people not just the Jews.
But did you not just say in another thread that there is only one path to God? Jews and Christians have obviously taken different paths. So which is it Jake?
Originally Posted by Jake99
What GW Bush and all his assistants cannot do in his lifetime I can do in an hour and that is something I have demonstrated many hundreds of times as a leader of the largest Bakeries in the world.
Yes, because running a bakery is the same as running one of the most powerful nations in the world.
Originally Posted by Jake99
but if you vote as usual for the better looking man, then I have another advantage.
Why I sadly admit there are people out there stupid enough to vote for a candidate because of his or her good looks, most of the people I know here on AO are not of that mind set. You aren't fooling us with your so called "charm". And please tell me WTF looks have to do with being a good leader. Honestly Jake, you need to wake up and realize that just because you are some stupid pretty boy does not mean you can run the entire world.
Originally Posted by Jake99
Humbly speaking I have an advantage over all other men and women, just by way of genetics and what I did with such a gift.
Unless you are talking about your advantage of getting admitted to a psych ward, I seriously doubt the validity of this statement.
This is Satans world and all are sinners that follow him.
Well, since I really do not believe in an actual Satan this is kind of pointless, but I'll say it anyway. I am the last person to claim that I am free from sin. I think it is impossible for a human to go through their life without intentionally hurting someone else, which is what I think sin is. But just because you do something wrong does not mean you follow Satan. It means you are human.
Originally Posted by Jake99
All are Gods people not just the Jews.
But did you not just say in another thread that there is only one path to God? Jews and Christians have obviously taken different paths. So which is it Jake?
Originally Posted by Jake99
What GW Bush and all his assistants cannot do in his lifetime I can do in an hour and that is something I have demonstrated many hundreds of times as a leader of the largest Bakeries in the world.
Yes, because running a bakery is the same as running one of the most powerful nations in the world.
Originally Posted by Jake99
but if you vote as usual for the better looking man, then I have another advantage.
Why I sadly admit there are people out there stupid enough to vote for a candidate because of his or her good looks, most of the people I know here on AO are not of that mind set. You aren't fooling us with your so called "charm". And please tell me WTF looks have to do with being a good leader. Honestly Jake, you need to wake up and realize that just because you are some stupid pretty boy does not mean you can run the entire world.
Originally Posted by Jake99
Humbly speaking I have an advantage over all other men and women, just by way of genetics and what I did with such a gift.
Unless you are talking about your advantage of getting admitted to a psych ward, I seriously doubt the validity of this statement.
nrj
Nov 23rd, 2005, 1:19 AM
Hitler was responsible for 60 MILLION deaths. Not just Jewsish people. No. The one who actually kills a person is responsible for the fatality.
nrj
Nov 23rd, 2005, 1:28 AM
I wish I knew something about Natalie Holloway but I don't so my comments would be useless. Just another crime scene that I can prevent from happening ever again. Its not rocket science just a new simple system.
Rrrrrrriiiiiiight!
You could stop all the crimes worldwide just by switching system... Right...
I thought this site went down so I have not been here for awhile.
Well, so did I. It's human to err, i.e non messianic, so I won't make fun of you.
What GW Bush and all his assistants cannot do in his lifetime I can do in an hour and that is something I have demonstrated many hundreds of times as a leader of the largest BAKERIES in the world.
...
Rrrrrrriiiiiiight!
You could stop all the crimes worldwide just by switching system... Right...
I thought this site went down so I have not been here for awhile.
Well, so did I. It's human to err, i.e non messianic, so I won't make fun of you.
What GW Bush and all his assistants cannot do in his lifetime I can do in an hour and that is something I have demonstrated many hundreds of times as a leader of the largest BAKERIES in the world.
...
Philosopher Foelhe
Nov 23rd, 2005, 2:33 AM
No. The one who actually kills a person is responsible for the fatality.
Can't say I agree with that. By your argument, anyone who hires a hitman is completely free from guilt.
Not saying that the soldiers who carried out orders should be relieved of responsibility, but Hitler did have enough to do with the deaths that he was responsible for them.
Can't say I agree with that. By your argument, anyone who hires a hitman is completely free from guilt.
Not saying that the soldiers who carried out orders should be relieved of responsibility, but Hitler did have enough to do with the deaths that he was responsible for them.
nrj
Nov 23rd, 2005, 5:03 AM
Um... Dude, you just quoted the wrong person... Well, let's not make a fuss about that.
Can't say I agree with that. By your argument, anyone who hires a hitman is completely free from guilt. Yep. That's exactly what i'm saying.
Not saying that the soldiers who carried out orders should be relieved of responsibility, but Hitler did have enough to do with the deaths that he was responsible for them. Not really. He decieved the people, and he was a cruel man who did that. But he didn't kill 60 million people. Not even the germans killed 60 million people, but the americans, soviets and the brittish should also get some shit tossed at them. They killed people to.
My point is: Responsebility is always on the person commiting the act. I drank very much a few months back, due to my buddies encouraging me. But it's still my rensponsebility.
Can't say I agree with that. By your argument, anyone who hires a hitman is completely free from guilt. Yep. That's exactly what i'm saying.
Not saying that the soldiers who carried out orders should be relieved of responsibility, but Hitler did have enough to do with the deaths that he was responsible for them. Not really. He decieved the people, and he was a cruel man who did that. But he didn't kill 60 million people. Not even the germans killed 60 million people, but the americans, soviets and the brittish should also get some shit tossed at them. They killed people to.
My point is: Responsebility is always on the person commiting the act. I drank very much a few months back, due to my buddies encouraging me. But it's still my rensponsebility.
Philosopher Foelhe
Nov 23rd, 2005, 5:27 AM
Yep. That's exactly what i'm saying.
... So you're saying you'd have no ethical problems with hiring a hitman? None whatsoever?
Not even the germans killed 60 million people, but the americans, soviets and the brittish should also get some shit tossed at them.
Well, I'm all for the equal-opportunity blame-slinging. Which is actually what I'm talking about here. Blame can be given to more than one person. And if the invading armies attacked innocent people, they deserve some of that blame.
My point is: Responsebility is always on the person commiting the act. I drank very much a few months back, due to my buddies encouraging me. But it's still my rensponsebility.
That's not really comparable. Your pals may have encouraged you, but they also trusted you to stop drinking if you couldn't handle it. If you drank too much, you hurt yourself, but that was your problem. Whereas the people tossed into prison camps by Hitler's orders didn't exactly have an opportunity to say, "No thanks, I'd rather not die today." Hitler's troops were in the wrong for killing all those people, but Hitler was in the wrong for planning the execution.
I'd also argue that your friends were partly to blame for pressuring you. Not too much - that's what friends do, after all - but they should've backed off and they didn't.
... So you're saying you'd have no ethical problems with hiring a hitman? None whatsoever?
Not even the germans killed 60 million people, but the americans, soviets and the brittish should also get some shit tossed at them.
Well, I'm all for the equal-opportunity blame-slinging. Which is actually what I'm talking about here. Blame can be given to more than one person. And if the invading armies attacked innocent people, they deserve some of that blame.
My point is: Responsebility is always on the person commiting the act. I drank very much a few months back, due to my buddies encouraging me. But it's still my rensponsebility.
That's not really comparable. Your pals may have encouraged you, but they also trusted you to stop drinking if you couldn't handle it. If you drank too much, you hurt yourself, but that was your problem. Whereas the people tossed into prison camps by Hitler's orders didn't exactly have an opportunity to say, "No thanks, I'd rather not die today." Hitler's troops were in the wrong for killing all those people, but Hitler was in the wrong for planning the execution.
I'd also argue that your friends were partly to blame for pressuring you. Not too much - that's what friends do, after all - but they should've backed off and they didn't.
nrj
Nov 23rd, 2005, 5:52 AM
... So you're saying you'd have no ethical problems with hiring a hitman? None whatsoever? i have, but i don't hold them responsible for the death itself.
Well, I'm all for the equal-opportunity blame-slinging. Which is actually what I'm talking about here. Blame can be given to more than one person. Yes, but what one man does that man has responsibility for.
And if the invading armies attacked innocent people, they deserve some of that blame. In that case, they do deserve blame.
That's not really comparable. Your pals may have encouraged you, but they also trusted you to stop drinking if you couldn't handle it. If you drank too much, you hurt yourself, but that was your problem. Whereas the people tossed into prison camps by Hitler's orders didn't exactly have an opportunity to say, "No thanks, I'd rather not die today." Hitler's troops were in the wrong for killing all those people, but Hitler was in the wrong for planning the execution.
I'd also argue that your friends were partly to blame for pressuring you. Not too much - that's what friends do, after all - but they should've backed off and they didn't.Then I should add that I'm no longer friends with them. They stopped calling when i stopped drinking.
Well, I'm all for the equal-opportunity blame-slinging. Which is actually what I'm talking about here. Blame can be given to more than one person. Yes, but what one man does that man has responsibility for.
And if the invading armies attacked innocent people, they deserve some of that blame. In that case, they do deserve blame.
That's not really comparable. Your pals may have encouraged you, but they also trusted you to stop drinking if you couldn't handle it. If you drank too much, you hurt yourself, but that was your problem. Whereas the people tossed into prison camps by Hitler's orders didn't exactly have an opportunity to say, "No thanks, I'd rather not die today." Hitler's troops were in the wrong for killing all those people, but Hitler was in the wrong for planning the execution.
I'd also argue that your friends were partly to blame for pressuring you. Not too much - that's what friends do, after all - but they should've backed off and they didn't.Then I should add that I'm no longer friends with them. They stopped calling when i stopped drinking.
Philosopher Foelhe
Nov 23rd, 2005, 6:00 AM
i have, but i don't hold them responsible for the death itself.
Then how are you defining "responsible" here? If the person hadn't put out a hit, the victim would not be dead. Correct? Sounds like a perfect dictionary definition of "responsible" to me.
And if you do have ethical qualms about hiring hitmen, doesn't that imply blame? After all, without blame, there's no guilt.
Yes, but what one man does that man has responsibility for.
Please clarify. I'm not sure what you're saying here.
Then how are you defining "responsible" here? If the person hadn't put out a hit, the victim would not be dead. Correct? Sounds like a perfect dictionary definition of "responsible" to me.
And if you do have ethical qualms about hiring hitmen, doesn't that imply blame? After all, without blame, there's no guilt.
Yes, but what one man does that man has responsibility for.
Please clarify. I'm not sure what you're saying here.
nrj
Nov 23rd, 2005, 8:26 AM
Then how are you defining "responsible" here? If the person hadn't put out a hit, the victim would not be dead. Correct? Sounds like a perfect dictionary definition of "responsible" to me. The contracter told the hitman to do the act, but he did not do the act him/herself. Therefore, he/she is not directly responsible. We are discussing direct responsebility, right?
Anyway, the hitman has the option not to do the contract. But if the hitman does it any way, it's the hitmans fault.
And if you do have ethical qualms about hiring hitmen, doesn't that imply blame? After all, without blame, there's no guilt. What I mean, is that I do not find it ethical to encourage someone to do something ethically wrong. But i don't blame the contracter for the act.
Sure, the contracter did wrong, but still, it was the hitman who killed the victim.
Please clarify. I'm not sure what you're saying here. You said many people could get shit for things they do, yes, and i tried to say that every person is responsible for it's own actions. Unless they helped eachother do it, all of them can't get the blame of one murder just because one of them killed someone.
Anyway, the hitman has the option not to do the contract. But if the hitman does it any way, it's the hitmans fault.
And if you do have ethical qualms about hiring hitmen, doesn't that imply blame? After all, without blame, there's no guilt. What I mean, is that I do not find it ethical to encourage someone to do something ethically wrong. But i don't blame the contracter for the act.
Sure, the contracter did wrong, but still, it was the hitman who killed the victim.
Please clarify. I'm not sure what you're saying here. You said many people could get shit for things they do, yes, and i tried to say that every person is responsible for it's own actions. Unless they helped eachother do it, all of them can't get the blame of one murder just because one of them killed someone.
Philosopher Foelhe
Nov 23rd, 2005, 8:17 PM
The contracter told the hitman to do the act, but he did not do the act him/herself. Therefore, he/she is not directly responsible. We are discussing direct responsebility, right?
Yes, but your definition of "direct" could use some work. The contractor gives money to the hitman, thus persuading him to act, thus directly affecting the outcome of the situation.
By your definition, if you slipped poison into someone's food, and they ate it and died, you could say that the victim was to blame, because it was his choice to eat the food or not. I'm sorry, but if you line up the variables in such a way as to cause harm to another person, you are guilty of the harm caused, even if you didn't take that last step.
What I mean, is that I do not find it ethical to encourage someone to do something ethically wrong. But i don't blame the contracter for the act.
Sure, the contracter did wrong, but still, it was the hitman who killed the victim.
You're arguing a double-fault here. First you say the contracter isn't to blame, then you say that he did wrong (which is assigning blame). Which is it?
i tried to say that every person is responsible for it's own actions.
Isn't part of being responsible for your own actions considering the consequences of said actions? If you manipulate events to harm another person, then shrug it off and say, "In the end, he made his own choice to jump into the trap" isn't that pretty much the exact opposite of being responsible for your actions?
all of them can't get the blame of one murder just because one of them killed someone.
Why not? They all had a hand in it, didn't they? If a group of individuals uses their talents to land success, and one person in the group spearheads the last effort to attain it, shouldn't they all recieve kudos for their effort rather than the last member gaining all the glory? Why is this any different?
Here's a scenario to consider. It's a bit outlandish, admittedly, but the logic is sound. Say a person kidnaps a victim, incapacitates him, and throws him behind a target at a shooting range. Then he gets someone else to drop by (who is unaware of the victim's presence) and bets him he can't shoot the target with one shot. The visitor agrees, and fires at the target. The bullet punches through the target and into the victim, killing him instantly.
So, the question is: who is guilty of murder here? The kidnapper who carefully orchestrated the whole affair, or the visitor who happened to pull the trigger?
Yes, but your definition of "direct" could use some work. The contractor gives money to the hitman, thus persuading him to act, thus directly affecting the outcome of the situation.
By your definition, if you slipped poison into someone's food, and they ate it and died, you could say that the victim was to blame, because it was his choice to eat the food or not. I'm sorry, but if you line up the variables in such a way as to cause harm to another person, you are guilty of the harm caused, even if you didn't take that last step.
What I mean, is that I do not find it ethical to encourage someone to do something ethically wrong. But i don't blame the contracter for the act.
Sure, the contracter did wrong, but still, it was the hitman who killed the victim.
You're arguing a double-fault here. First you say the contracter isn't to blame, then you say that he did wrong (which is assigning blame). Which is it?
i tried to say that every person is responsible for it's own actions.
Isn't part of being responsible for your own actions considering the consequences of said actions? If you manipulate events to harm another person, then shrug it off and say, "In the end, he made his own choice to jump into the trap" isn't that pretty much the exact opposite of being responsible for your actions?
all of them can't get the blame of one murder just because one of them killed someone.
Why not? They all had a hand in it, didn't they? If a group of individuals uses their talents to land success, and one person in the group spearheads the last effort to attain it, shouldn't they all recieve kudos for their effort rather than the last member gaining all the glory? Why is this any different?
Here's a scenario to consider. It's a bit outlandish, admittedly, but the logic is sound. Say a person kidnaps a victim, incapacitates him, and throws him behind a target at a shooting range. Then he gets someone else to drop by (who is unaware of the victim's presence) and bets him he can't shoot the target with one shot. The visitor agrees, and fires at the target. The bullet punches through the target and into the victim, killing him instantly.
So, the question is: who is guilty of murder here? The kidnapper who carefully orchestrated the whole affair, or the visitor who happened to pull the trigger?
nrj
Nov 24th, 2005, 3:12 AM
Yes, but your definition of "direct" could use some work. The contractor gives money to the hitman, thus persuading him to act, thus directly affecting the outcome of the situation. Not really. The hitman can refuse because he is aware that it's going to be a killing.
By your definition, if you slipped poison into someone's food, and they ate it and died, you could say that the victim was to blame, because it was his choice to eat the food or not. Not a valid example. The person who eats the food has no idea about the consequences.
You're arguing a double-fault here. First you say the contracter isn't to blame, then you say that he did wrong (which is assigning blame). Which is it?The contracter did wrong, but did not murder the man. Thus, it is a seperate act from my point of view.
Isn't part of being responsible for your own actions considering the consequences of said actions? If you manipulate events to harm another person, then shrug it off and say, "In the end, he made his own choice to jump into the trap" isn't that pretty much the exact opposite of being responsible for your actions? In this case, the soldiers/hitmans/whatever has a choice. Although in this case calabirators were killed in Nazi Germany, you're still doing the act.
My point is: It's unethical to make someone do something but the responsebility is still on the person commiting the act. Convincing someone to do something is a seperate act.
Why not? They all had a hand in it, didn't they? If a group of individuals uses their talents to land success, and one person in the group spearheads the last effort to attain it, shouldn't they all recieve kudos for their effort rather than the last member gaining all the glory? Why is this any different? Let's say a grop of individuals get a good company, and one of them do something wich makes the buisiness get even better.
The entire group should take glory for the company existance, but the person who did whatever to increase buisiness should be proud about THAT PARTICULAR ACT
Here's a scenario to consider. It's a bit outlandish, admittedly, but the logic is sound. Say a person kidnaps a victim, incapacitates him, and throws him behind a target at a shooting range. Then he gets someone else to drop by (who is unaware of the victim's presence) and bets him he can't shoot the target with one shot. The visitor agrees, and fires at the target. The bullet punches through the target and into the victim, killing him instantly.
So, the question is: who is guilty of murder here? The kidnapper who carefully orchestrated the whole affair, or the visitor who happened to pull the trigger? As I said earlier in the post: The hitman knows he's going to kill someone.
By your definition, if you slipped poison into someone's food, and they ate it and died, you could say that the victim was to blame, because it was his choice to eat the food or not. Not a valid example. The person who eats the food has no idea about the consequences.
You're arguing a double-fault here. First you say the contracter isn't to blame, then you say that he did wrong (which is assigning blame). Which is it?The contracter did wrong, but did not murder the man. Thus, it is a seperate act from my point of view.
Isn't part of being responsible for your own actions considering the consequences of said actions? If you manipulate events to harm another person, then shrug it off and say, "In the end, he made his own choice to jump into the trap" isn't that pretty much the exact opposite of being responsible for your actions? In this case, the soldiers/hitmans/whatever has a choice. Although in this case calabirators were killed in Nazi Germany, you're still doing the act.
My point is: It's unethical to make someone do something but the responsebility is still on the person commiting the act. Convincing someone to do something is a seperate act.
Why not? They all had a hand in it, didn't they? If a group of individuals uses their talents to land success, and one person in the group spearheads the last effort to attain it, shouldn't they all recieve kudos for their effort rather than the last member gaining all the glory? Why is this any different? Let's say a grop of individuals get a good company, and one of them do something wich makes the buisiness get even better.
The entire group should take glory for the company existance, but the person who did whatever to increase buisiness should be proud about THAT PARTICULAR ACT
Here's a scenario to consider. It's a bit outlandish, admittedly, but the logic is sound. Say a person kidnaps a victim, incapacitates him, and throws him behind a target at a shooting range. Then he gets someone else to drop by (who is unaware of the victim's presence) and bets him he can't shoot the target with one shot. The visitor agrees, and fires at the target. The bullet punches through the target and into the victim, killing him instantly.
So, the question is: who is guilty of murder here? The kidnapper who carefully orchestrated the whole affair, or the visitor who happened to pull the trigger? As I said earlier in the post: The hitman knows he's going to kill someone.
Philosopher Foelhe
Nov 24th, 2005, 9:04 AM
Not really. The hitman can refuse because he is aware that it's going to be a killing.
... That's still doesn't mean the contractor didn't directly affect the situation.
It's unethical to make someone do something but the responsebility is still on the person commiting the act. Convincing someone to do something is a seperate act.
But wouldn't you agree that it's a lot worse to convince someone to kill someone else than it is to convince someone to drink too much?
Let's say a grop of individuals get a good company, and one of them do something wich makes the buisiness get even better.
The entire group should take glory for the company existance, but the person who did whatever to increase buisiness should be proud about THAT PARTICULAR ACT
That doesn't fit this situation. I'm talking about one single goal, which everyone works toward.
As I said earlier in the post: The hitman knows he's going to kill someone.
So, if someone kidnaps someone and convinces someone else to kill them, that person isn't guilty of murder, but if that person kidnaps someone and tricks someone else into killing them, the person is?
Let me ask you something from a practical standpoint. If convincing someone to kill someone else is just some type of peer pressure, you're saying that someone who hired an assassin isn't really guilty of a crime, per say. So what keeps that person from going right back out and hiring another?
... That's still doesn't mean the contractor didn't directly affect the situation.
It's unethical to make someone do something but the responsebility is still on the person commiting the act. Convincing someone to do something is a seperate act.
But wouldn't you agree that it's a lot worse to convince someone to kill someone else than it is to convince someone to drink too much?
Let's say a grop of individuals get a good company, and one of them do something wich makes the buisiness get even better.
The entire group should take glory for the company existance, but the person who did whatever to increase buisiness should be proud about THAT PARTICULAR ACT
That doesn't fit this situation. I'm talking about one single goal, which everyone works toward.
As I said earlier in the post: The hitman knows he's going to kill someone.
So, if someone kidnaps someone and convinces someone else to kill them, that person isn't guilty of murder, but if that person kidnaps someone and tricks someone else into killing them, the person is?
Let me ask you something from a practical standpoint. If convincing someone to kill someone else is just some type of peer pressure, you're saying that someone who hired an assassin isn't really guilty of a crime, per say. So what keeps that person from going right back out and hiring another?
salvador
Nov 24th, 2005, 11:55 AM
Allow me to interject?
These are problems faced by law makers, and over the centuries they have developed means of determining guilt.
These methods aren't perfect, and this is recognised in the principle of convicting someone only when it is "beyond reasonable doubt" that they committed a crime, rather than the ancient way of extracting a confession in order to be "certain" you have the right person.
In English law there is such a thing as conspiracy. In the case of someone hiring a hitman to kill someone, both people would be guilty of Conspiracy to Murder, whether or not the murder was carried out. If the hit was "successful" then both conspirators would be guilty of murder.
In the case of the person being kidnapped and hidden behind the target, it is the kidnapper who would be guilty of murder. The person unknowingly killing the victim would not be guilty under law, if it were accepted that he/she was unaware of the plan.
I understand that the law is not infallible, but these rules have been constructed by some very intelligent people over quite some time and have been found to work in a practical sense, as well as being morally acceptable to the majority of the population.
So if in doubt about some moral principle, you could well examine the relevant law in a liberal democracy and you probably won't go far wrong.
These are problems faced by law makers, and over the centuries they have developed means of determining guilt.
These methods aren't perfect, and this is recognised in the principle of convicting someone only when it is "beyond reasonable doubt" that they committed a crime, rather than the ancient way of extracting a confession in order to be "certain" you have the right person.
In English law there is such a thing as conspiracy. In the case of someone hiring a hitman to kill someone, both people would be guilty of Conspiracy to Murder, whether or not the murder was carried out. If the hit was "successful" then both conspirators would be guilty of murder.
In the case of the person being kidnapped and hidden behind the target, it is the kidnapper who would be guilty of murder. The person unknowingly killing the victim would not be guilty under law, if it were accepted that he/she was unaware of the plan.
I understand that the law is not infallible, but these rules have been constructed by some very intelligent people over quite some time and have been found to work in a practical sense, as well as being morally acceptable to the majority of the population.
So if in doubt about some moral principle, you could well examine the relevant law in a liberal democracy and you probably won't go far wrong.
Defiant Noquisi
Nov 25th, 2005, 5:39 AM
Thank you for providing the information above, DN. Very eye-opening. I had no idea about most of what you've said. It's not only disturbing that these mass murders actually happened, but it's even more disturbing that they've been forgotten by most people. It's incredible how horribly humans can treat fellow humans... Indeed B.Nye and I didn't even include the numbers of Latin American people that have been wiped off the face of the earth via genocide which is also astronomical. What pisses me off even more than these numbers is the ignorance in which people argue about the topic of the holocaust and genocide to begin with. It's like a fuqing contest to see who had it worse than who. Completely idiotic and irrelevant.
What should matter most of all is stopping genocide and not commit it to do it. That would be by stopping the ignorant statements and misinformation spread by cultures and religions about other people in the first place. You know that will never happen, especially when it comes to religion. Everybody has to out-god each other.
What should matter most of all is stopping genocide and not commit it to do it. That would be by stopping the ignorant statements and misinformation spread by cultures and religions about other people in the first place. You know that will never happen, especially when it comes to religion. Everybody has to out-god each other.
Defiant Noquisi
Nov 25th, 2005, 5:45 AM
Hitler was responsible for 60 MILLION deaths. Not just Jewsish people. Again, is that really relevant today? Genocide has been committed by every country on this planet in one form or another, at one time or another. Everyone talks about the numbers but who will step forward and be honest in doing something to stop it? War will not stop it. Defeating cultural and religious ignorance will.
Defiant Noquisi
Nov 25th, 2005, 6:33 AM
I thought this site went down so I have not been here for awhile. It never "went down" but there was a domain transfer issue with the .org so it was in limbo until that was settled. The .net domain was still functioning so we were still here. Thanks for coming back.
Humbly speaking I have an advantage over all other men and women, just by way of genetics and what I did with such a gift. Again Jake, it's not that I don't want to believe you. I would love to know that there is someone out there that could make all these things happen. However, let me point out the problems I have with your claims. And BTW, thank you for improving upon your paragraphs. Your posts are so much easier to read now than when you first began posting here.
1) You have made broad claims without much validity in the "evidence" that you point out. In fact, you have provided nothing in the way of evidence that anyone can grasp. In essence what you are doing is trying to force people not on your level to be on your level without any kind of background that can be understood or researched. You are asking us to trust and believe you when you havent done much in the way of anything to earn that trust or for us to believe you. Parents teach children on a child's level and as they grow up. they raise the level according to the child's mental and emotional capacity for understanding. Even God and Jesus explained when asked.
2) You missed the train regarding us asking you for proof of your claims and in doing so, proved more that you are not who you say you are and again, cannot be trusted. By making it difficult for us to look into your claims, you have set up a situation where at least to me, you have something to hide. You post of "saving" if you will, the largest bakeries in the world yet have never posted anything remotely possible for me to look at and see that this is in fact true. One would think that there would have been articles in the papers, mentions in company history, mentions cached on the internet, something. Instead, all we are left with is mixed informaton about some court cases and nothing plausible to read about what occured and it's outcome.
Jake, I can understand what happened during the time of Jesus since the internet and newspapers werent widely available. However, we live in modern times and I would certainly think that you can come up with something better regarding showing your claimed accomplishments. According to biblical history even God waited 400 years to bring Jesus into the picture until there were better roads connecting towns, making travel and thus spreading the word easier.
3) You have no "system" and no way to bring people together under it. Sorry Jake but that's what I think of what you have posted. You've given me nothing that I can grasp. All I've seen of your posts is that you want to eliminate my purposes in life, my culture and my spirituality and have me "live" under one roof, yours. Only going on what you have posted and in the content of how you have worded it, if I was to live my life like that I would go mad. My purpose in life and way I like to do things is not parallel to yours. I would be very unhappy if I was to live my life and kept in the dark as to why I am living that way. This is the manner in which you post, you keep people in the dark. You post a "carrot" and hope I follow along.
Jake, I've come to the conclusion that you are either bored, lonely and want of attention or that this is some kind of college psychology/divinity degree research and you are collecting answers based on the claims you make. I can think of nothing else to justify to myself this manner in which you post.
Biblically speaking, Jesus proved who he was by performing miracles in front of those in attendance and through the crowds of people who witnessed what he did. Here in modern times, in order for me to believe your claims I would need paperwork and references before I believed that what you claim is true. Posting it in this forum will never be good enough since it's so very easy for people to post nontruths. I have been lied to way too many times, I am cynical.
Again, I would like to believe you but I need you prove it by doing much more than posting in this forum. I need something "real".
Humbly speaking I have an advantage over all other men and women, just by way of genetics and what I did with such a gift. Again Jake, it's not that I don't want to believe you. I would love to know that there is someone out there that could make all these things happen. However, let me point out the problems I have with your claims. And BTW, thank you for improving upon your paragraphs. Your posts are so much easier to read now than when you first began posting here.
1) You have made broad claims without much validity in the "evidence" that you point out. In fact, you have provided nothing in the way of evidence that anyone can grasp. In essence what you are doing is trying to force people not on your level to be on your level without any kind of background that can be understood or researched. You are asking us to trust and believe you when you havent done much in the way of anything to earn that trust or for us to believe you. Parents teach children on a child's level and as they grow up. they raise the level according to the child's mental and emotional capacity for understanding. Even God and Jesus explained when asked.
2) You missed the train regarding us asking you for proof of your claims and in doing so, proved more that you are not who you say you are and again, cannot be trusted. By making it difficult for us to look into your claims, you have set up a situation where at least to me, you have something to hide. You post of "saving" if you will, the largest bakeries in the world yet have never posted anything remotely possible for me to look at and see that this is in fact true. One would think that there would have been articles in the papers, mentions in company history, mentions cached on the internet, something. Instead, all we are left with is mixed informaton about some court cases and nothing plausible to read about what occured and it's outcome.
Jake, I can understand what happened during the time of Jesus since the internet and newspapers werent widely available. However, we live in modern times and I would certainly think that you can come up with something better regarding showing your claimed accomplishments. According to biblical history even God waited 400 years to bring Jesus into the picture until there were better roads connecting towns, making travel and thus spreading the word easier.
3) You have no "system" and no way to bring people together under it. Sorry Jake but that's what I think of what you have posted. You've given me nothing that I can grasp. All I've seen of your posts is that you want to eliminate my purposes in life, my culture and my spirituality and have me "live" under one roof, yours. Only going on what you have posted and in the content of how you have worded it, if I was to live my life like that I would go mad. My purpose in life and way I like to do things is not parallel to yours. I would be very unhappy if I was to live my life and kept in the dark as to why I am living that way. This is the manner in which you post, you keep people in the dark. You post a "carrot" and hope I follow along.
Jake, I've come to the conclusion that you are either bored, lonely and want of attention or that this is some kind of college psychology/divinity degree research and you are collecting answers based on the claims you make. I can think of nothing else to justify to myself this manner in which you post.
Biblically speaking, Jesus proved who he was by performing miracles in front of those in attendance and through the crowds of people who witnessed what he did. Here in modern times, in order for me to believe your claims I would need paperwork and references before I believed that what you claim is true. Posting it in this forum will never be good enough since it's so very easy for people to post nontruths. I have been lied to way too many times, I am cynical.
Again, I would like to believe you but I need you prove it by doing much more than posting in this forum. I need something "real".
Defiant Noquisi
Nov 25th, 2005, 6:51 AM
Cherisa you are a gem, your post about hating God and Christ is right on. This is Satans world and all are sinners that follow him. Since when is this Satan's world and who actually is "satan"? I have no "satan" in my world and I am a very spiritual person. I don't hate God or Christ but I most certainly dislike those who look down upon me in arrogance because of my beliefs. That is the true hate.
Just another crime scene that I can prevent from happening ever again. Its not rocket science just a new simple system. As in my above post, this is where you fall flat with me. You have prostelytized your brilliance throughout many posts yet when you are asked to prove it, you explain it away and do nothing. If it really is simple, please post it here or email it to me so I may look it over. If it is something that cannot be explained then it must not be that simple if in fact you have a system at all.
What GW Bush and all his assistants cannot do in his lifetime I can do in an hour and that is something I have demonstrated many hundreds of times as a leader of the largest Bakeries in the world. Yet again, you cannot demonstrate it here while at the same time making claims that it's "simple".
But if you are looking for peace, prosperity, long life and fair play then I am your man for that is what I specialize in doing and I have decades of extensive leadership experience that includes no failures. Yet you have failed to back up any of it other than a few old cases numbers that cannot be found. Hardly proof that you can bring peace and prosperity and that you have done so for decades.
Its tough to make friends when they follow your enemy but if you vote as usual for the better looking man, then I have another advantage. Who are you to dictate who anyones "enemies" are? Quite frankly, just your statement about voting for who is better looking proves to me the ignorance in which you think. If looks had anything to do with how I vote then I wouldve voted for Bush and not Kerry, and Kerry wasn't that impressive to me either just as a candidate. I don't see any advantages whatsoever in you by how you posted. All I've seen is some kind of Westworld style of utopia and that isn't any kind of world I want to live in. No offense to Yul Brynner implied.
Just another crime scene that I can prevent from happening ever again. Its not rocket science just a new simple system. As in my above post, this is where you fall flat with me. You have prostelytized your brilliance throughout many posts yet when you are asked to prove it, you explain it away and do nothing. If it really is simple, please post it here or email it to me so I may look it over. If it is something that cannot be explained then it must not be that simple if in fact you have a system at all.
What GW Bush and all his assistants cannot do in his lifetime I can do in an hour and that is something I have demonstrated many hundreds of times as a leader of the largest Bakeries in the world. Yet again, you cannot demonstrate it here while at the same time making claims that it's "simple".
But if you are looking for peace, prosperity, long life and fair play then I am your man for that is what I specialize in doing and I have decades of extensive leadership experience that includes no failures. Yet you have failed to back up any of it other than a few old cases numbers that cannot be found. Hardly proof that you can bring peace and prosperity and that you have done so for decades.
Its tough to make friends when they follow your enemy but if you vote as usual for the better looking man, then I have another advantage. Who are you to dictate who anyones "enemies" are? Quite frankly, just your statement about voting for who is better looking proves to me the ignorance in which you think. If looks had anything to do with how I vote then I wouldve voted for Bush and not Kerry, and Kerry wasn't that impressive to me either just as a candidate. I don't see any advantages whatsoever in you by how you posted. All I've seen is some kind of Westworld style of utopia and that isn't any kind of world I want to live in. No offense to Yul Brynner implied.
Philosopher Foelhe
Nov 25th, 2005, 10:46 AM
So if in doubt about some moral principle, you could well examine the relevant law in a liberal democracy and you probably won't go far wrong.
Agreed, and an excellent point. But I do think it's important to logically defend the laws in place today. After all, there are some laws that I don't agree with, and if I'm going to argue why we shouldn't have those, I should be able to argue why we should have the ones I'd want to keep.
If you drive drunk and kill someone accidentally, you did not intend to kill him, you can't blame the car. YOU must blame YOU
Well... a car can't tell you not to drive it when you're drunk. But otherwise, I'm with ya. :2thumbs:
Agreed, and an excellent point. But I do think it's important to logically defend the laws in place today. After all, there are some laws that I don't agree with, and if I'm going to argue why we shouldn't have those, I should be able to argue why we should have the ones I'd want to keep.
If you drive drunk and kill someone accidentally, you did not intend to kill him, you can't blame the car. YOU must blame YOU
Well... a car can't tell you not to drive it when you're drunk. But otherwise, I'm with ya. :2thumbs:
Jake99
Nov 28th, 2005, 7:29 PM
Being a pretty boy even at 50 is part of the prophesy and having long wavy blond hair to past my shoulders as a teenager was also part of the demonstration. Flying in comparison to others on the athletic fields and outperforming all others combined in working, military, court and management positions was also an extreme demonstration of talent. Getting into the psych ward by challenging the elect and the judges is easy, getting out as no other ever has, requires superior intelligence, dedication and ability. Not one of the many doctors that examined me or testified in court said I was mentally ill, in fact they said just the opposite under oath. I had to prove I was not delusional and I had to prove I could stand by my words and actions which were as clearly as possible against the wolves in sheeps clothing who attacked me. I don't believe in an actual Satan even though I have my foot on his head, but rather a way of the anti christ which governs this planet. Satan may be as the Holy Ghost is neither of which have I seen, but have felt the presence of. All are on different paths and none are on the path with Christ, because all are buyers and sellers who have put lines on the map which divides and does not unite or provide for all of Gods creations and children. You don't need to be free from sin through anything other than a system change which prevents sin and crime from occurring.
I see no difference between managing a super bakery and this world, the principals are exactly the same. You would not have a lawyer, an actor or a politician run a bakery and I see no reason to believe they are qualified to run any system. They have no training and no success story and yet they keep getting hired and keep making things worse. GW Bush is incompetent and that is based on his accomplishments and that of his predecessors who are all the same.
As far as Hyperqube and the Natalie Holloway thread. Hyperqube is smart but he cannot find a mathematical equation for the second coming or anything else. Its a puzzle that cannot be predicted but it can be induced.
I see no difference between managing a super bakery and this world, the principals are exactly the same. You would not have a lawyer, an actor or a politician run a bakery and I see no reason to believe they are qualified to run any system. They have no training and no success story and yet they keep getting hired and keep making things worse. GW Bush is incompetent and that is based on his accomplishments and that of his predecessors who are all the same.
As far as Hyperqube and the Natalie Holloway thread. Hyperqube is smart but he cannot find a mathematical equation for the second coming or anything else. Its a puzzle that cannot be predicted but it can be induced.
Beatnik Bob
Nov 28th, 2005, 11:25 PM
Jake, lets pretend you became ruler of the world and everything. And what would happen if you died? the next leader wouldn't be a "son of G-d," so a once unified world would be plunged into chaos.
And you can't say you wouldn't die, because in your other posts you already talked about you aging.
And just so you know, Christianity is the anti-christ people. They don't follow Jesus, who supposedly was a christ, and messiah (anointed one). Think about it, the Christians got rid of the whole Gospel of Thomas.
And you can't say you wouldn't die, because in your other posts you already talked about you aging.
And just so you know, Christianity is the anti-christ people. They don't follow Jesus, who supposedly was a christ, and messiah (anointed one). Think about it, the Christians got rid of the whole Gospel of Thomas.
Sammy56
Nov 30th, 2005, 12:58 AM
Originally Posted by Jake99
Being a pretty boy even at 50 is part of the prophesy and having long wavy blond hair to past my shoulders as a teenager was also part of the demonstration. Here is the question I want you to answer. Why does being a pretty boy make you a good leader? If I were to look at the organizations at my school I am willing to bet that not many of their leaders would be considered "pretty boys". And when you use the words pretty boy it reminds me of the pricks at my school who think the world of themselves and treat others like trash because they have good looks. Plus, what does wavy blonde hair have anything to do with it? I actually have wavy blonde hair and I have never considered myself exceptionally pretty or capable of running the entire country.
Originally Posted by Jake99
Getting into the psych ward... It almost seems as if you are bragging about you being admitted to the psych ward. That sort of scares me Jake. Last week, for many reasons I would rather not go into detail about, I came very close to being admitted to a mental hospital and I promise you I take no pride in it and I really do not understand why you do.
Originally Posted by Jake99
I don't believe in an actual Satan even though I have my foot on his head That is kind of like saying you do not believe that the earth exists but you are standing right on it. It does not make sense Jake.
Originally Posted by Jake99
You don't need to be free from sin through anything other than a system change which prevents sin and crime from occurring. The problem here is it depends on your definition of sin. If you consider it a sin to think about doing something hurtful to someone then how are you going to stop sin from occurring? Everyone has those moments where they are so angry that they get carried away with their thoughts. It's only human. But I really cannot see a way for you to stop people from having "bad" thoughts without them rebelling against you for even trying. Would you blame them anyway? I would fight anyone trying to control what I think.
Originally Posted by Jake99
I see no difference between managing a super bakery and this world You must be the only one because I definitely see the difference and I think it is very obvious. First off, how many people work in a super bakery? Maybe 3,000? I really have no idea, but we will go with that number. Now, how many people live in the U.S.? 297,700,000 according to a quick look up in the encyclopedia. Now, how many people in the entire world? Over 6 billion. Thats 6,000,000,000. Ok, if the super bakery went out of business those 3,000 people and their families would be affected. I am not saying that would not be bad, it would, but compare it to if something happened to the U.S. alone. That 99000x's that amount of people affected. Now, while still a challenge, it would be possible to help fix the lives of the 3,000 who lost their jobs in the super bakery, but the entire population of the U.S. would be almost impossible. Now imagine what would happen if the entire world was "shut down". That is just the beginning of the differences. The numbers themselves show the two activities are not even closely that same, let alone if we went into more detail.
Being a pretty boy even at 50 is part of the prophesy and having long wavy blond hair to past my shoulders as a teenager was also part of the demonstration. Here is the question I want you to answer. Why does being a pretty boy make you a good leader? If I were to look at the organizations at my school I am willing to bet that not many of their leaders would be considered "pretty boys". And when you use the words pretty boy it reminds me of the pricks at my school who think the world of themselves and treat others like trash because they have good looks. Plus, what does wavy blonde hair have anything to do with it? I actually have wavy blonde hair and I have never considered myself exceptionally pretty or capable of running the entire country.
Originally Posted by Jake99
Getting into the psych ward... It almost seems as if you are bragging about you being admitted to the psych ward. That sort of scares me Jake. Last week, for many reasons I would rather not go into detail about, I came very close to being admitted to a mental hospital and I promise you I take no pride in it and I really do not understand why you do.
Originally Posted by Jake99
I don't believe in an actual Satan even though I have my foot on his head That is kind of like saying you do not believe that the earth exists but you are standing right on it. It does not make sense Jake.
Originally Posted by Jake99
You don't need to be free from sin through anything other than a system change which prevents sin and crime from occurring. The problem here is it depends on your definition of sin. If you consider it a sin to think about doing something hurtful to someone then how are you going to stop sin from occurring? Everyone has those moments where they are so angry that they get carried away with their thoughts. It's only human. But I really cannot see a way for you to stop people from having "bad" thoughts without them rebelling against you for even trying. Would you blame them anyway? I would fight anyone trying to control what I think.
Originally Posted by Jake99
I see no difference between managing a super bakery and this world You must be the only one because I definitely see the difference and I think it is very obvious. First off, how many people work in a super bakery? Maybe 3,000? I really have no idea, but we will go with that number. Now, how many people live in the U.S.? 297,700,000 according to a quick look up in the encyclopedia. Now, how many people in the entire world? Over 6 billion. Thats 6,000,000,000. Ok, if the super bakery went out of business those 3,000 people and their families would be affected. I am not saying that would not be bad, it would, but compare it to if something happened to the U.S. alone. That 99000x's that amount of people affected. Now, while still a challenge, it would be possible to help fix the lives of the 3,000 who lost their jobs in the super bakery, but the entire population of the U.S. would be almost impossible. Now imagine what would happen if the entire world was "shut down". That is just the beginning of the differences. The numbers themselves show the two activities are not even closely that same, let alone if we went into more detail.
Jake99
Nov 30th, 2005, 2:34 PM
What I did at the bakeries was put many new and revised systems into place that did not need my assistance any longer and it will run perfectly until the end of time. The same would hold true for world problems 60 minutes after adopting the simple operating system I and the bible recommend. I could die the next day and the world would still be saved by being on the right path. Christians are the anti christ, for they use the opposite operating system that the bible insists upon ( lines on the map, treating others as if they are you, Thou shall not kill, protecting the environment are just a few.) I don't want to control your thoughts just manage your resources properly the same as at the bakery and that in turn will relieve stress which causes sin, hunger, war, premature death and crime. My 6 siblings were also considered the best looking and most gifted at some of the largest and most competitive schools, businesses and colleges. Long wavy blond hair for a teenage boy was unusual and very much how Jesus is depicted. Many people asked if I was the Christ because I was playing the part and doing the things no one else had been able to do. And I was so fast at putting problems in the past that the morale and productivity skyrocketed everywhere I went. Running a company and running the world is the same thing just on a larger scale and none of your leaders have run a company they are all imposters that have very little successful experience. There is a way that you can figure out who a person who claims to be the messiah is and that is by proving and disproving. He is either a liar, lunatic, imposter or the christ and what better way to get to the truth than to be inspected and challenged by professionals. The psych ward ruled out ( first time in history) lunatic and released me with no restrictions despite their being threatened by the judicial system ( which is illegal) to say other wise. The doctors either presented reasons why I was not a lunatic or refused to testify or simply had no reason to present that I was in any way delusional. That was after 20 days in their custody and I did another 44 days after another apprehension with the same conclusions. And the 2 trials ruled out liar and imposter due to the facts and witnesses testimony while at the same time proving only the last choice of being the Christ beyond a shadow of a doubt. This is Satans world and all are sinners means it is the opposite of Christ's world and no one has so defiantly challenged and defeated the US judicial system as I have in all of time. I had my foot on their head before I was arrested and just increased the pressure as I defeated the judicial system legally on every point of view like they were children. You don't do things like that without purpose, confidence and extreme talent. And the only way a business could go out of business in my world is because it is no longer needed which is what I recommend we do with most businesses. Automation and high speed manufacturing as well as direct distribution would eliminate 90% of current jobs which leaves allot of people available for doing the things that do not get done and dramatically reduce mans negative effects on global warming. I like home schooling over the internet or interactive TV for the basics which would keep a parent in the home at all times watching over their own children. Daycare and overcrowded schools must be eliminated or at least dramatically reduced. The only way to know what goes on in the psych wards and jails is to go there and see the abuse for yourself which I did, its sickening, and Abu Graib was no surprize to me. What I propose is a system that does not land you in the wards and jails because it is fair and just. And my systems only shut down when the work is done which means no holidays and no weekends just days off and work days no religious reasons or day of the week reasons should impair an operation with excessive start ups and shut downs as they do now. I would expect a 50% reduction of fossil fuel usage in the first year and a huge improvement in all areas of life at the same time. And I always underestimate what I really believe will happen which is why I never fail to back up my words and plans with results.
DN I would be happy to supply you with references that saw what I did but company records are not and never have been available to the public. Below is one of the trial conclusions and a news clip of the event. And a pic of me with a Brown Trout.
http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b5/James99/scan3.jpg
http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b5/James99/scan4.jpg
http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b5/James99/scan5.jpg
http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b5/James99/scan6.jpg
http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b5/James99/scan7.jpg
http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b5/James99/scan8.jpg
http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b5/James99/scan9.jpg
http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b5/James99/scan10.jpg
http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b5/James99/Jim.jpg
DN I would be happy to supply you with references that saw what I did but company records are not and never have been available to the public. Below is one of the trial conclusions and a news clip of the event. And a pic of me with a Brown Trout.
http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b5/James99/scan3.jpg
http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b5/James99/scan4.jpg
http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b5/James99/scan5.jpg
http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b5/James99/scan6.jpg
http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b5/James99/scan7.jpg
http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b5/James99/scan8.jpg
http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b5/James99/scan9.jpg
http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b5/James99/scan10.jpg
http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b5/James99/Jim.jpg
B.NyeTheUruk-Hai
Nov 30th, 2005, 6:46 PM
http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b5/James99/Jim.jpg
Duuuuuude, have you looked in a mirror lately? I mean... Paul Newman? Paul Newman? Come on! From the way that you've described yourself in your posts, I FULLY expected to switch teams upon seeing your photo. If they slapped your face onto bottles of salad dressing, the only reason that I would buy a bottle would be to peel off the label and use it as toilet paper...
P.S. - Paul Newman?
Duuuuuude, have you looked in a mirror lately? I mean... Paul Newman? Paul Newman? Come on! From the way that you've described yourself in your posts, I FULLY expected to switch teams upon seeing your photo. If they slapped your face onto bottles of salad dressing, the only reason that I would buy a bottle would be to peel off the label and use it as toilet paper...
P.S. - Paul Newman?
Philosopher Foelhe
Nov 30th, 2005, 7:00 PM
If they slapped your face onto bottles of salad dressing, the only reason that I would buy a bottle would be to peel off the label and use it as toilet paper...
Great. You had to convince me to look at the damn photo.
God, that's the creepiest thing I've ever seen. Jake, you look like what would happen if my uncle Karl had a love child with a chipmunk.
Great. You had to convince me to look at the damn photo.
God, that's the creepiest thing I've ever seen. Jake, you look like what would happen if my uncle Karl had a love child with a chipmunk.
Defiant Noquisi
Nov 30th, 2005, 8:04 PM
The same would hold true for world problems 60 minutes after adopting the simple operating system I and the bible recommend. Uh, 'scuse me but I cannot believe in a book that is contradictory unto itself. If the world is full of "sinners" which it has been claimed since the days of Adam and Eve, I can't put much faith in a book that was written and transcribed by sinners. I'm not a believer in the bible.
DN I would be happy to supply you with references that saw what I did but company records are not and never have been available to the public. Below is one of the trial conclusions and a news clip of the event. And a pic of me with a Brown Trout. Yes, I did see them in another thread. I'm sorry I neglected to post that I had. Screw these guys, they're guys. You have a cherubic face. I don't see any resemblance to Paul Newman but you aren't a bad looking dude at all.
But holy shit! Screw that! (Here I go OT again but this is worth it!) Look at that trout! Where did you catch that and what kind of rig did you use to land that beauty? Do you have a simple system to catch trout like that? It's dinner time!
DN I would be happy to supply you with references that saw what I did but company records are not and never have been available to the public. Below is one of the trial conclusions and a news clip of the event. And a pic of me with a Brown Trout. Yes, I did see them in another thread. I'm sorry I neglected to post that I had. Screw these guys, they're guys. You have a cherubic face. I don't see any resemblance to Paul Newman but you aren't a bad looking dude at all.
But holy shit! Screw that! (Here I go OT again but this is worth it!) Look at that trout! Where did you catch that and what kind of rig did you use to land that beauty? Do you have a simple system to catch trout like that? It's dinner time!
Defiant Noquisi
Nov 30th, 2005, 8:14 PM
Well... a car can't tell you not to drive it when you're drunk. But otherwise, I'm with ya. Not for long! They've got a machine that a driver would have to blow in and if the alcohol level is too high the car won't start. It's been reported that in the future drivers convicted of DUI and DWI will have to have these machines installed in their cars if made into law.
Jake99
Dec 3rd, 2005, 1:01 PM
I have a cabin in Plymouth Ma. and catch fish like that regularly with my boat that some call the best small fishing boat in New England. I go to the Salmon river in N.Y.for 3 days a year and catch up to 10 salmon and trout a day up to 35#. I have many systems for catching fish but sight fishing is my favorite, its more of a hunt. Sunlight, polarized glasses, camouflage clothing, waders a curtained necked hat and a 9' fly rod. I caught an 8# Atlantic salmon the other day in the boat and it took over an hour to land it on an ultra light 4.5' rod and 6# test line, what a thrill, I threw her back for another day but I did keep 5 other Salmon this season. Its the most heavily stocked lake in New England and sometimes you can catch up to 10 trout an hour when they are hitting flies.
Its too bad you people don't take me seriously I can and have done all the things your leaders cannot do and staying the course will lead to increased problems which can easily be avoided. I hit your judges and elect as hard as legally possible and I have every intention of eliminating the systems they endorse. I want all lines off the map and the salesman to exist no more, its the only way.
Its too bad you people don't take me seriously I can and have done all the things your leaders cannot do and staying the course will lead to increased problems which can easily be avoided. I hit your judges and elect as hard as legally possible and I have every intention of eliminating the systems they endorse. I want all lines off the map and the salesman to exist no more, its the only way.
Beatnik Bob
Dec 3rd, 2005, 1:43 PM
Jake, lets pretend you did control the world. Then, when you died, the world could fall into the hands of some crazy person like Emperor Nero. And even if this didn't happen right after, it would happen eventually.
And also Jake, you say your getting old, and that you can't do many of the things you could do in your younger days, so who's to say you won't be dead by the time you actually do take over the world?
And also Jake, you say your getting old, and that you can't do many of the things you could do in your younger days, so who's to say you won't be dead by the time you actually do take over the world?
B.NyeTheUruk-Hai
Dec 3rd, 2005, 1:50 PM
A day in the life of Jake99:
I like to wake up at dawn, just before the sun comes up. In fact, I get up before the roosters do and I myself make the cock-a-doodle-doo sounds in order to wake up the roosters. Then I go to the hen house to collect the eggs for my breakfast. These are not ordinary eggs. About three or four times a day, I vigorously mount each hen and have my way with them. It is the best pounding that the hens have ever had. As a result of receiving my superior seed, the resultant eggs are the best that this world has ever seen. After the pounding of the hens, I am reminded that I also need sausage for my breakfast. So I get the Jimmy Deans out of the freezer and laugh at their pitifully small size when compared to MY sausage. I have the biggest sausage this earth has ever seen. Some of the best prostitutes in history have told me this after which they pay ME to fill them with my creamy filling. And speaking of creamy filling, I am reminded that I need a small dessert for my breakfast. Everybody knows that the best dessert snack ever to grace grocery store shelves is Twinkies. I am a hero in the small town that I currently live in because I saved the Twinkies factory by automating the production process and getting all of the workers laid off, something that the factory owners said that they couldn't believe. Ever since I saved the factory, the former employees bake their own Twinkies at home and bring them to me as thanks for laying them off. Naturally, these home-made Twinkies are not as good as the Twinkies from my factory. The cream filling is kind of bland tasting and a little bit sticky, but I eat them anyway...
Stay tuned for more adventures of Jake99!!!
I like to wake up at dawn, just before the sun comes up. In fact, I get up before the roosters do and I myself make the cock-a-doodle-doo sounds in order to wake up the roosters. Then I go to the hen house to collect the eggs for my breakfast. These are not ordinary eggs. About three or four times a day, I vigorously mount each hen and have my way with them. It is the best pounding that the hens have ever had. As a result of receiving my superior seed, the resultant eggs are the best that this world has ever seen. After the pounding of the hens, I am reminded that I also need sausage for my breakfast. So I get the Jimmy Deans out of the freezer and laugh at their pitifully small size when compared to MY sausage. I have the biggest sausage this earth has ever seen. Some of the best prostitutes in history have told me this after which they pay ME to fill them with my creamy filling. And speaking of creamy filling, I am reminded that I need a small dessert for my breakfast. Everybody knows that the best dessert snack ever to grace grocery store shelves is Twinkies. I am a hero in the small town that I currently live in because I saved the Twinkies factory by automating the production process and getting all of the workers laid off, something that the factory owners said that they couldn't believe. Ever since I saved the factory, the former employees bake their own Twinkies at home and bring them to me as thanks for laying them off. Naturally, these home-made Twinkies are not as good as the Twinkies from my factory. The cream filling is kind of bland tasting and a little bit sticky, but I eat them anyway...
Stay tuned for more adventures of Jake99!!!
Beatnik Bob
Dec 3rd, 2005, 3:33 PM
Aloso don't forget to come down to Fellatio's, and try our spagethii, complete with felatio's "special sauce."
Also a resturaunt branch started by Jake!
And also, come on down to Happy Morning's Edible Underware Co.
Replace those old whity tieties with some yummy undies!
Introducing metalic flavored bras, and our strawberry flavored granny panties!
Don't miss it! And now, for a limited time only, you can enjoy the maker of Happy Mornings as well! With the complete purchase of a sewer flavored thong!
Jake, we thank you for your contributions of society!
Also a resturaunt branch started by Jake!
And also, come on down to Happy Morning's Edible Underware Co.
Replace those old whity tieties with some yummy undies!
Introducing metalic flavored bras, and our strawberry flavored granny panties!
Don't miss it! And now, for a limited time only, you can enjoy the maker of Happy Mornings as well! With the complete purchase of a sewer flavored thong!
Jake, we thank you for your contributions of society!
Defiant Noquisi
Dec 3rd, 2005, 8:26 PM
Alright you guys, although humorous make sure you play nice.
Oooh, did *I* just post that?
Oooh, did *I* just post that?
Sammy56
Dec 4th, 2005, 5:34 PM
Originally Posted by Jake99
Christians are the anti christ, for they use the opposite operating system that the bible insists upon Can you please explain your system a little better. You are constantly mentioning it, but you have never gone into any detail about what this system is and how it would work.
Originally Posted by Jake99
I don't want to control your thoughts just manage your resources properly the same as at the bakery and that in turn will relieve stress which causes sin, hunger, war, premature death and crime. What exactly do you mean by resources? Do you mean like property? If so then you have no right to manage anyones resources. Everyone has the right to manage their resources themself and not have to government interfere. Of course people are going to make mistakes and do stupid stuff, but that is life Jake.
Originally Posted by Jake99
My 6 siblings were also considered the best looking and most gifted at some of the largest and most competitive schools, businesses and colleges. I swear I must be speaking a different language, but I will ask one more time. WHY DOES THE FACT THAT YOUR SIBLINGS HAVE GOOD LOOKS MAKE YOU A GOOD LEADER????. If good looks made a great leader then would it not be your siblings who should be in charge of the world?
Originally Posted by Jake99
Long wavy blond hair for a teenage boy was unusual and very much how Jesus is depicted.
Long wavy blonde hair is not unusual, even for a boy. Plus, I have never seen Jesus depicted with blonde hair. Usually it is brown. Besides most of those pictures make him look European when he would look more Middle Eastern for starters.
Originally Posted by Jake99
Many people asked if I was the Christ because I was playing the part and doing the things no one else had been able to do. I can see it now. Random people coming up to you and asking if you are the Christ. So believable.
Originally Posted by Jake99
Running a company and running the world is the same thing just on a larger scale and none of your leaders have run a company they are all imposters that have very little successful experience.
No Jake, they are not the same. Any sane person would see that.
Originally Posted by Jake99
This is Satans world and all are sinners means it is the opposite of Christ's world and no one has so defiantly challenged and defeated the US judicial system as I have in all of time.
I thought you said you did not believe in Satan. We are all sinners huh? Of course, everyone does something wrong occasionally, but what about you Jake? Let me guess, you are sinless?
Originally Posted by Jake99
I like home schooling over the internet or interactive TV for the basics which would keep a parent in the home at all times watching over their own children.
If school happens over the internet how are children going to get the social interactions they need? Being able to be with someone other then your family is an important part of readying children and young adults for the real world. And what about the kids who have a hard time at home? To them school can be an escape and their teachers can assist them in getting help if needed. If a kid like that who has problems at home has no one they trust to get help from they are doomed to a life of misery. Home schooling every child out there is a bad idea Jake. It's hard to imagine but there are people out there who would be dead if it wasn't for school.
Christians are the anti christ, for they use the opposite operating system that the bible insists upon Can you please explain your system a little better. You are constantly mentioning it, but you have never gone into any detail about what this system is and how it would work.
Originally Posted by Jake99
I don't want to control your thoughts just manage your resources properly the same as at the bakery and that in turn will relieve stress which causes sin, hunger, war, premature death and crime. What exactly do you mean by resources? Do you mean like property? If so then you have no right to manage anyones resources. Everyone has the right to manage their resources themself and not have to government interfere. Of course people are going to make mistakes and do stupid stuff, but that is life Jake.
Originally Posted by Jake99
My 6 siblings were also considered the best looking and most gifted at some of the largest and most competitive schools, businesses and colleges. I swear I must be speaking a different language, but I will ask one more time. WHY DOES THE FACT THAT YOUR SIBLINGS HAVE GOOD LOOKS MAKE YOU A GOOD LEADER????. If good looks made a great leader then would it not be your siblings who should be in charge of the world?
Originally Posted by Jake99
Long wavy blond hair for a teenage boy was unusual and very much how Jesus is depicted.
Long wavy blonde hair is not unusual, even for a boy. Plus, I have never seen Jesus depicted with blonde hair. Usually it is brown. Besides most of those pictures make him look European when he would look more Middle Eastern for starters.
Originally Posted by Jake99
Many people asked if I was the Christ because I was playing the part and doing the things no one else had been able to do. I can see it now. Random people coming up to you and asking if you are the Christ. So believable.
Originally Posted by Jake99
Running a company and running the world is the same thing just on a larger scale and none of your leaders have run a company they are all imposters that have very little successful experience.
No Jake, they are not the same. Any sane person would see that.
Originally Posted by Jake99
This is Satans world and all are sinners means it is the opposite of Christ's world and no one has so defiantly challenged and defeated the US judicial system as I have in all of time.
I thought you said you did not believe in Satan. We are all sinners huh? Of course, everyone does something wrong occasionally, but what about you Jake? Let me guess, you are sinless?
Originally Posted by Jake99
I like home schooling over the internet or interactive TV for the basics which would keep a parent in the home at all times watching over their own children.
If school happens over the internet how are children going to get the social interactions they need? Being able to be with someone other then your family is an important part of readying children and young adults for the real world. And what about the kids who have a hard time at home? To them school can be an escape and their teachers can assist them in getting help if needed. If a kid like that who has problems at home has no one they trust to get help from they are doomed to a life of misery. Home schooling every child out there is a bad idea Jake. It's hard to imagine but there are people out there who would be dead if it wasn't for school.
Beatnik Bob
Dec 4th, 2005, 5:38 PM
I don't know why you bother Sammy. Even when he does respond, he rarely adress responses made toward his previous posts.
Sammy56
Dec 4th, 2005, 5:40 PM
I don't know why I bother either Bob. Maybe I just want to prove to myself there is still some logic and sanity in the world, but I do not seem to be getting very far.
Defiant Noquisi
Dec 4th, 2005, 7:58 PM
I don't know why you bother Sammy. Even when he does respond, he rarely adress responses made toward his previous posts. I got that too. It's as if he can't hold his attention long enough to be capable of giving a complete answer. He just drifts off..... :dunno:
Jake99
Dec 5th, 2005, 12:49 PM
I do my best to answer all questions. What I have said is that no one has been gifted to the degree that I and my siblings have been and I am not a good leader because of good looks but tremendous leadership performance and experience that is way beyond that of anyone else.
My system professionally controls the usage of all materials on the planet just like the thousand materials and systems I and my assistants managed at bakeries. It also rewards based on work performance not gambling or selling. 8 hours as a fisherman is paid at a standard global union wage not based on the catch. No need to go fishing in bad weather because I know where the fish are and provide the best boat possible to reap responsibly. Safety always comes first and my accident rate is among if not the lowest in the industry which has a terrible track record. Order the resources you need and fill the orders that are requested, why should it matter where it is going as long as you are being paid and treated fairly. If there is reason why you cannot fill the order then take steps to prevent that and notify the requestor of delays and find future solutions. I have filled billions of orders on time and the only time I missed one is when there were not enough hours in a week to produce that much. Errors, complaints and accidents were almost unheard of after I fixed the operational problems with simple systems.
Why are the Christians the anti christ:They possess what was put here for all of us to use and sell it back at a profit which causes wars and poverty. Possession is lines on the map and that is the opposite or anti of what Jesus said to do. The mistakes and stupid stuff that people do to land they possess has to be stopped otherwise dumping, polluting and global warming just get worse. Who ever said that the first to claim something could possess it, what about the billions of people yet to come are they to possess whatever is left?
I was the only one ( probably in American history) scheduled out of public high school 2 hours early everyday for 5 years and never did any homework. I refused to be educated in ways of war and I stood firmly against the middleman of Capitalism since I was 14. The state did not require homework, lunch, homeroom or study hall so I refused to attend them as well as phys ed which I failed by intention for failure to appear. I only showed up for what was required and if I stayed home I wrote my own note as to why I did not come to school. I finished near last in my class and went on to be the most successful athlete, military and business leader and judge that I have ever heard of. I do not do things your way, I do them as Jesus suggests and I take on every wolf I can get my hands on both in public and in the courtrooms.
Many random people have asked who I was, and or implied that I acted as Jesus did and a few have asked me if I were the Christ point blank. I have ways of avoiding the answer but have admitted to being the christ in writing to the courts of Massachusetts. They challenged me and helped me to prove my point beyond a shadow of a doubt. When you are performing miracles on a daily basis and talking the way I do its not hard to put it together.
Satan is how the holy spirit is to me, a spirit but a very powerful one and through the miracles and prophesies I have performed he is just a moment away from being gone forever. I put the best judges in the US under my foot at Y2K just as predicted.
Get your social skills in the home and at the playground not in school where you are to be learning. And I do expect to see teachers and parents on the playgrounds. Take the stress out of life and homes will be a friendly place.
My system professionally controls the usage of all materials on the planet just like the thousand materials and systems I and my assistants managed at bakeries. It also rewards based on work performance not gambling or selling. 8 hours as a fisherman is paid at a standard global union wage not based on the catch. No need to go fishing in bad weather because I know where the fish are and provide the best boat possible to reap responsibly. Safety always comes first and my accident rate is among if not the lowest in the industry which has a terrible track record. Order the resources you need and fill the orders that are requested, why should it matter where it is going as long as you are being paid and treated fairly. If there is reason why you cannot fill the order then take steps to prevent that and notify the requestor of delays and find future solutions. I have filled billions of orders on time and the only time I missed one is when there were not enough hours in a week to produce that much. Errors, complaints and accidents were almost unheard of after I fixed the operational problems with simple systems.
Why are the Christians the anti christ:They possess what was put here for all of us to use and sell it back at a profit which causes wars and poverty. Possession is lines on the map and that is the opposite or anti of what Jesus said to do. The mistakes and stupid stuff that people do to land they possess has to be stopped otherwise dumping, polluting and global warming just get worse. Who ever said that the first to claim something could possess it, what about the billions of people yet to come are they to possess whatever is left?
I was the only one ( probably in American history) scheduled out of public high school 2 hours early everyday for 5 years and never did any homework. I refused to be educated in ways of war and I stood firmly against the middleman of Capitalism since I was 14. The state did not require homework, lunch, homeroom or study hall so I refused to attend them as well as phys ed which I failed by intention for failure to appear. I only showed up for what was required and if I stayed home I wrote my own note as to why I did not come to school. I finished near last in my class and went on to be the most successful athlete, military and business leader and judge that I have ever heard of. I do not do things your way, I do them as Jesus suggests and I take on every wolf I can get my hands on both in public and in the courtrooms.
Many random people have asked who I was, and or implied that I acted as Jesus did and a few have asked me if I were the Christ point blank. I have ways of avoiding the answer but have admitted to being the christ in writing to the courts of Massachusetts. They challenged me and helped me to prove my point beyond a shadow of a doubt. When you are performing miracles on a daily basis and talking the way I do its not hard to put it together.
Satan is how the holy spirit is to me, a spirit but a very powerful one and through the miracles and prophesies I have performed he is just a moment away from being gone forever. I put the best judges in the US under my foot at Y2K just as predicted.
Get your social skills in the home and at the playground not in school where you are to be learning. And I do expect to see teachers and parents on the playgrounds. Take the stress out of life and homes will be a friendly place.
nrj
Dec 5th, 2005, 1:20 PM
a few have asked me if I were the Christ point blank. You honestly think we believe this BS?
Virgo
Dec 5th, 2005, 2:04 PM
Satan is how the holy spirit is to me, a spirit but a very powerful one and through the miracles and prophesies I have performed he is just a moment away from being gone forever. I put the best judges in the US under my foot at Y2K just as predicted.
Wow...so you mean you like. Defeated The Anti Christ? So cool...
Wow...so you mean you like. Defeated The Anti Christ? So cool...
Sammy56
Dec 5th, 2005, 10:49 PM
I have officially given up on Jake. He is giving me to many headaches.
Jake99
Dec 6th, 2005, 6:50 PM
I have not defeated the anti christ but I do have my foot on his head, and can crush him like an ant with your support. Just because I mopped the floor with the beast a hundred times right at Y2K and many times prior and since does not mean he surrendered, that happens when you stand behind me instead of it. The odds on a man doing what I did for 50 years and winning against the wicked ones biblically right at Y2K are astronomical. And yet I said it would be so before I was even arrested and as early as when I was 14. I knew what was coming and I acted accordingly, its the punch you don't see coming that knocks you out and I never moved a muscle or fired an arrow. It was a hell of a punch thrown with all my might and it landed perfectly without a word being said, and I followed that up with a flurry of combination punches that started and finished a war I knew I would prevail upon against a system and its leaders that I stand against.
B.NyeTheUruk-Hai
Dec 6th, 2005, 7:29 PM
I have not defeated the anti christ but I do have my foot on his head
Who is the anti-Christ, Jake?
Just because I mopped the floor with the beast a hundred times right at Y2K and many times prior and since
What exactly did you DO to "mop the floor with the beast"? How did you accomplish said mopping?
Who is the anti-Christ, Jake?
Just because I mopped the floor with the beast a hundred times right at Y2K and many times prior and since
What exactly did you DO to "mop the floor with the beast"? How did you accomplish said mopping?
Defiant Noquisi
Dec 6th, 2005, 7:30 PM
Jake, I'm sorry but your posts are repetitive. It's the same thing over and over again. I do appreciate the scans of the documentation that you posted here to back up what you had been claiming. However, as far as saving the world from itself, I've seen nothing concrete or even suggestive as ways that we can improve what we do other than to follow your lead. I'm a cynic, I'm a skeptic. I trust no one. How is it that someone like me could just follow you when you have provided nothing for me to follow?
Jake99
Dec 7th, 2005, 7:08 PM
Faith and trust is an earned thing and I have earned both up until I claimed to be the messiah and beyond. The docs I posted only prove that I can be and have been where I am supposed to be, doing what I am supposed to be doing. Miracles come fIrst and defiance and so called blasphemy comes second. At that point it ends up in the courts and the juries hands and they must determine if the so called messiah is a liar a lunatic, an imposter or the christ. Only being the Christ was proven in the court room the others were dismissed. Amazing that a man who did not even break a law and claimed he was the messiah was put on trial with the intent of crucifying him. The jury did convict an innocent man which is why the verdict was immediately overturned. As they charged me in court I am a threat to all judges and I agree but that also is not a crime and the list goes on and on just as it did with Jesus. Wake up the time has come to leave this place and enter into the new world which is my specialty. I am very repetitious, I do not change much and my recommendations are simple to follow once you are on the right path.
RevelationNation
Dec 9th, 2005, 3:19 PM
I am pleased that I have found this place - I am only minutes old here. Haven't we all wished to be able to go back and start over at the beginning... it feels good to be at the very beginning again - if only relative to this discussion board.
In my opinion, I think this entire topic is ludicrous and always has been - but it was very interesting to weave through the debate and see it become, as most debates do involving human beings, less and less to do with the original topic of conversation and more about each individual's point of view and their desire to make it dominant. After all - what is discussion but a shared lack of understanding?
A job well done - people!
Rock on Jake - I had no idea that humanity and baked goods had so much in common. If I ever start a bakery I'll look you up!
In my opinion, I think this entire topic is ludicrous and always has been - but it was very interesting to weave through the debate and see it become, as most debates do involving human beings, less and less to do with the original topic of conversation and more about each individual's point of view and their desire to make it dominant. After all - what is discussion but a shared lack of understanding?
A job well done - people!
Rock on Jake - I had no idea that humanity and baked goods had so much in common. If I ever start a bakery I'll look you up!
Jake99
Dec 12th, 2005, 10:58 AM
Tough to imagine depising a miracle worker who helped others and placed himself in harms way in order to save all.
Virgo
Dec 13th, 2005, 5:14 AM
Tough to imagine depising a miracle worker who helped others and placed himself in harms way in order to save all.
For me who doesn't know everything and has no intention in reading this whole thread to find oout: Please explain the following:
1. When, where and how did you defeat anti-christ?
2. The Bible says anti-christ is coming back before Jesus, and will reign for seven years over ten kingdoms. There's no such thing going on today. Explain please?
3. Also, there's supposed to be the "saving of the saints" where all true beleivers will vanish into thin air, and the unfaithful shall be left behind to live during the seven dark years. Haven't happened yet...
Don't reply: "The Bible isn't the word of God." That's Kerravons line :P
For me who doesn't know everything and has no intention in reading this whole thread to find oout: Please explain the following:
1. When, where and how did you defeat anti-christ?
2. The Bible says anti-christ is coming back before Jesus, and will reign for seven years over ten kingdoms. There's no such thing going on today. Explain please?
3. Also, there's supposed to be the "saving of the saints" where all true beleivers will vanish into thin air, and the unfaithful shall be left behind to live during the seven dark years. Haven't happened yet...
Don't reply: "The Bible isn't the word of God." That's Kerravons line :P
Jake99
Dec 13th, 2005, 1:58 PM
For me who doesn't know everything and has no intention in reading this whole thread to find oout: Please explain the following:
1. When, where and how did you defeat anti-christ?
The anti christ is anyone that does the opposite of what the bible says Jesus would do. I have stood against hundreds of anti christs from the day I was born, its a common event in my life and I have been in court and in leadership positions that prove that. Turning the tables over on the judges and leaders of this world in 5 different courts in Massachusetts in the year prior to and after Y2K was just icing on the cake. All of you against one of me and I won start to finish in two trails that were biblically to the letter of what Jesus was said to have done and endured. No tricks, no magic just a complete recreation of history right under your nose. I just rolled with the punches that never hit me and threw the biggest legal war in all of time in your lap. You have to take the wrath if you want to receive the gift.
2. The Bible says anti-christ is coming back before Jesus, and will reign for seven years over ten kingdoms. There's no such thing going on today. Explain please?
The only thing I know of seven years is that many trials and tribulations will happen and they have. GW Bush is clearly an anti christ considering the US is the most wasteful and polluting nation on earth. Pope JP II was a false profit, saying that he would bring peace and prosperity to this world before the millennium. This certainly does not look like peace and prosperity and to wait for Bush to deal with global warming is like a shot gun blast to the face for all humanity.
3. Also, there's supposed to be the "saving of the saints" where all true beleivers will vanish into thin air, and the unfaithful shall be left behind to live during the seven dark years. Haven't happened yet...
I cannot find a true believer or a true follower and all are welcomed into the kingdom of heaven on earth. The jails will empty with the exception of the mentally challenged who will get better treatment. Its a system change thats needed, an automation project and it meets the needs of all people and the environment. The last seven years have not been dark? One catastrophy after another and no nation has a clue how to get the problems under control. Wars, famine, stock market crashes, layoffs, corporate corruption, trade wars, bankrupcies, 911, Afganistan, Iraq, Tsunami, earthquakes, hurricanes and it gets worse every day. The end of the money changers ( christs #1 enemy) means all on the same currency, set prices, union wages and free basic human needs. That would lay off half the work force which could be offered all the work that does not get done.
Don't reply: "The Bible isn't the word of God." That's Kerravons line :P
Kerravon has zero leadership experience or suggestions for world peace and prosperity and he says he is god. I have no idea who wrote the bible and I do not care. You will punt that religious book and all the others into the fire place after entering the new world.
1. When, where and how did you defeat anti-christ?
The anti christ is anyone that does the opposite of what the bible says Jesus would do. I have stood against hundreds of anti christs from the day I was born, its a common event in my life and I have been in court and in leadership positions that prove that. Turning the tables over on the judges and leaders of this world in 5 different courts in Massachusetts in the year prior to and after Y2K was just icing on the cake. All of you against one of me and I won start to finish in two trails that were biblically to the letter of what Jesus was said to have done and endured. No tricks, no magic just a complete recreation of history right under your nose. I just rolled with the punches that never hit me and threw the biggest legal war in all of time in your lap. You have to take the wrath if you want to receive the gift.
2. The Bible says anti-christ is coming back before Jesus, and will reign for seven years over ten kingdoms. There's no such thing going on today. Explain please?
The only thing I know of seven years is that many trials and tribulations will happen and they have. GW Bush is clearly an anti christ considering the US is the most wasteful and polluting nation on earth. Pope JP II was a false profit, saying that he would bring peace and prosperity to this world before the millennium. This certainly does not look like peace and prosperity and to wait for Bush to deal with global warming is like a shot gun blast to the face for all humanity.
3. Also, there's supposed to be the "saving of the saints" where all true beleivers will vanish into thin air, and the unfaithful shall be left behind to live during the seven dark years. Haven't happened yet...
I cannot find a true believer or a true follower and all are welcomed into the kingdom of heaven on earth. The jails will empty with the exception of the mentally challenged who will get better treatment. Its a system change thats needed, an automation project and it meets the needs of all people and the environment. The last seven years have not been dark? One catastrophy after another and no nation has a clue how to get the problems under control. Wars, famine, stock market crashes, layoffs, corporate corruption, trade wars, bankrupcies, 911, Afganistan, Iraq, Tsunami, earthquakes, hurricanes and it gets worse every day. The end of the money changers ( christs #1 enemy) means all on the same currency, set prices, union wages and free basic human needs. That would lay off half the work force which could be offered all the work that does not get done.
Don't reply: "The Bible isn't the word of God." That's Kerravons line :P
Kerravon has zero leadership experience or suggestions for world peace and prosperity and he says he is god. I have no idea who wrote the bible and I do not care. You will punt that religious book and all the others into the fire place after entering the new world.
Virgo
Dec 13th, 2005, 3:20 PM
Actually, I'm one of those "loons" that beleives in the Bible to the bone. So "several anti-christs" doesn't quite ring true in my ears.
But G.W.Bush doesn't have his "ten kingdoms". Unless you count his allies in the Iraq war. But then you get lots of countries, and not just 10.
In the last case, you actually might be right. But there still haven't been a "saving of the saints". Since I trust the Bible, I'm yet confident that Harmageddon is quite far away. Or maybe close but, in "Godly" terms.
But G.W.Bush doesn't have his "ten kingdoms". Unless you count his allies in the Iraq war. But then you get lots of countries, and not just 10.
In the last case, you actually might be right. But there still haven't been a "saving of the saints". Since I trust the Bible, I'm yet confident that Harmageddon is quite far away. Or maybe close but, in "Godly" terms.
B.NyeTheUruk-Hai
Dec 13th, 2005, 5:18 PM
You will punt that religious book and all the others into the fire place after entering the new world.
I'm just picturing in my head Jake running toward a bible being held by Lucy (from "Peanuts") and Jake kicking at empty air as Lucy pulls the bible away at the last second causing Jake to land on his ass...
I'm just picturing in my head Jake running toward a bible being held by Lucy (from "Peanuts") and Jake kicking at empty air as Lucy pulls the bible away at the last second causing Jake to land on his ass...
Jake99
Dec 14th, 2005, 11:48 AM
You don't need a bible when everything is fair and just. I don't own a bible and fixing this planet has nothing to do with religion, but rather a simple global operating system. If you did as the bible said you should, it would not even exist for lack of need. You obviously have no idea what an enemy of the planet the money changers or the lines on the map are or else they would not exist. Do you know how inefficient and destructive selling basic needs is? They all have prices on them that change by the minute and you negotiate over everything, its no wonder you live in chaos your too busy wasting your time on un christ like things.
nrj
Dec 14th, 2005, 1:52 PM
If you did as the bible said you should, it would not even exist for lack of need. not exist. Do you know how inefficient and destructive selling basic needs is? Wait a minute... You're telling me a harmonic society would be when we follow the Bible (old and new testament) literaly? Such ass killing gays in the old testament, and not trusting men with long hair in the new?
Please, do not tell me this is you're system...
Please, do not tell me this is you're system...
Virgo
Dec 14th, 2005, 3:45 PM
Nrj: Damn, I'm planning to grow long hair... but I'll get forgiveness for it ^^ Yay!
Where the h*ll does it say in the old testament that you should kill gay people?
The fifth comandment reigns higher than any "anti-gay" law ever could.
Bet you just heard it from "someone else" and haven't read it yourself, have you?
Where the h*ll does it say in the old testament that you should kill gay people?
The fifth comandment reigns higher than any "anti-gay" law ever could.
Bet you just heard it from "someone else" and haven't read it yourself, have you?
Jake99
Dec 14th, 2005, 4:32 PM
I mean as far as biblically recommended operating systems, I don't read the bible and get all caught up in things that cannot be proven or logically believed. Religion has nothing to do with repairing and maintaining this planet, it just prepares you for the messiah. Talk is cheap, I only believe what is proven or what I have witnessed. Basic needs like food, shelter, clothing and medical for free and professionally maintained land with one currency, set wages and set prices for luxuries. No salesman, no money changers and no lines on the map. Get simple and we can achieve peace and prosperity in the twinkling of an eye. If one leader using a simple system can and has solved the thousands of problems permanently that were generated by a thousand leaders using a complicated system, then I suggest you use the simple system and retrain your leaders on how to get simple. Its that fast and that easy to go from this world into the next. Its an automation project and it properly handles every problem and request you make. I have done this type of thing many times and it always turns out perfect. You should see how fast the complaints disappear that had been a way of life for decades and its not magic, anyone can do what I can do if they are on the same path. Common sense and thinking outside the box are the tools of my trade and I don't see anyone else doing that. This worlds complicated leaders are walking through the fog headed for a cliff with the deaf, dumb and blind in tow. Ford and GM are laying off 60,000 workers and Walmart gets 95% of its products from China. This is a trend that has no good news at the end of it and its the same bad news in every country in the world.
Defiant Noquisi
Dec 14th, 2005, 5:12 PM
I am very repetitious, I do not change much and my recommendations are simple to follow once you are on the right path. What are your recomendations? Please make them simple and not in parable form. Thanks!
nrj
Dec 15th, 2005, 9:39 AM
Where the h*ll does it say in the old testament that you should kill gay people? I'll post it in swedish so you can check in your own Bible:
Tredje Moseboken 20:13
Om en man ligger hos en annan man som man ligger hos en kvinna, så gör de båda en styggelse. De skall straffas med döden, blodskuld vidlåder dem. If you like, I can pull out more hate against minorities from the Bible. Go check yourself.
The fifth comandment reigns higher than any "anti-gay" law ever could. Then why do you have conflicting laws in the same testament?
Bet you just heard it from "someone else" and haven't read it yourself, have you? Come on, Virgo. You know me. I don't trust anything withput evidence, and if I have the possibility I check the facts myself.
Tredje Moseboken 20:13
Om en man ligger hos en annan man som man ligger hos en kvinna, så gör de båda en styggelse. De skall straffas med döden, blodskuld vidlåder dem. If you like, I can pull out more hate against minorities from the Bible. Go check yourself.
The fifth comandment reigns higher than any "anti-gay" law ever could. Then why do you have conflicting laws in the same testament?
Bet you just heard it from "someone else" and haven't read it yourself, have you? Come on, Virgo. You know me. I don't trust anything withput evidence, and if I have the possibility I check the facts myself.
New Creature
Dec 15th, 2005, 11:31 AM
I mean as far as biblically recommended operating systems, I don't read the bible and get all caught up in things that cannot be proven or logically believed. Religion has nothing to do with repairing and maintaining this planet, it just prepares you for the messiah. Talk is cheap, I only believe what is proven or what I have witnessed. Basic needs like food, shelter, clothing and medical for free and professionally maintained land with one currency, set wages and set prices for luxuries. No salesman, no money changers and no lines on the map. Get simple and we can achieve peace and prosperity in the twinkling of an eye. If one leader using a simple system can and has solved the thousands of problems permanently that were generated by a thousand leaders using a complicated system, then I suggest you use the simple system and retrain your leaders on how to get simple. Its that fast and that easy to go from this world into the next. Its an automation project and it properly handles every problem and request you make. I have done this type of thing many times and it always turns out perfect. You should see how fast the complaints disappear that had been a way of life for decades and its not magic, anyone can do what I can do if they are on the same path. Common sense and thinking outside the box are the tools of my trade and I don't see anyone else doing that. This worlds complicated leaders are walking through the fog headed for a cliff with the deaf, dumb and blind in tow. Ford and GM are laying off 60,000 workers and Walmart gets 95% of its products from China. This is a trend that has no good news at the end of it and its the same bad news in every country in the world.
Instead of working on this world, I would think someone of your caliber would be looking to plant seeds of salvation. Never mind this world, this whisper of a life that we think is all we have. Our time here is absolutely nothing compared to eternity.
Instead of working on this world, I would think someone of your caliber would be looking to plant seeds of salvation. Never mind this world, this whisper of a life that we think is all we have. Our time here is absolutely nothing compared to eternity.
Jake99
Dec 17th, 2005, 1:23 PM
I always speak and write in parables which is why I totally understand the sayings and ways of Jesus. The bible is not written wrong, it is misunderstood, what was symbolic has been taken literally. I walk on water and heal the sick, blind, deaf and dumb every day but that is just a comparative to what other managers before me could not do. I have been the only professional problem solver for the largest manufacturer and distributer of baked goods in the US and have done hundreds of repairs, modifications and efficiency projects. I was not sitting on my butt reading the bible, I was doing what it said to do and it worked to perfection just like the bible said it would. I just want to do the same things for the world that I did for big business. Or you can vote for unqualified criminals, liars, cheaters, imposters and thieves like GW Bush, Pope John Paul II or the Clintons, none of which has a success story to tell.
My recommendations;
Socialism for all basic human needs ( it ends wars and buying and selling). Communism of all land ownership (protects and professionally manages the environment, no stock market). Competition for jobs ( all listed on the internet in one place). One currency (eliminates the money changers and standardizes prices). Earned use of luxuries (through work credits only). A Kingdom is not a Democracy, I have been running kingdoms (huge businesses) in the US for many years with miraculous success beyond anything man has ever witnessed before. Peace, prosperity and the best safety record follow me everywhere I go and I have never received a complaint from an employee or a customer that I did not resolve quickly. I eliminate chaos in the twinkling of an eye, and the speed at which I work is nothing this world ever saw before. And did I mention that I had no assistants and no secretary, that is how easy my way is and I still only worked an average of 8 hours a day. You cannot find stress or failure in operations I manage and I have had very few college grads in the work force.
My recommendations;
Socialism for all basic human needs ( it ends wars and buying and selling). Communism of all land ownership (protects and professionally manages the environment, no stock market). Competition for jobs ( all listed on the internet in one place). One currency (eliminates the money changers and standardizes prices). Earned use of luxuries (through work credits only). A Kingdom is not a Democracy, I have been running kingdoms (huge businesses) in the US for many years with miraculous success beyond anything man has ever witnessed before. Peace, prosperity and the best safety record follow me everywhere I go and I have never received a complaint from an employee or a customer that I did not resolve quickly. I eliminate chaos in the twinkling of an eye, and the speed at which I work is nothing this world ever saw before. And did I mention that I had no assistants and no secretary, that is how easy my way is and I still only worked an average of 8 hours a day. You cannot find stress or failure in operations I manage and I have had very few college grads in the work force.
nrj
Dec 17th, 2005, 2:53 PM
The bible is not written wrong, it is misunderstood, what was symbolic has been taken literally. What symbols is hidden in:
"A witch you shall not let live"?
To me, it sounds as if you should intercept the witch and kill him/her. Tell me, oh great messiah, what does it actually mean?
I walk on water and heal the sick, blind, deaf and dumb every day Ô_o
I was not sitting on my butt reading the bible, I was doing what it said to do and it worked to perfection just like the bible said it would. How do you know that? In an earlier post you told us you haven't read it, so how do you know you're following it?
A Kingdom is not a Democracy, I have been running kingdoms (huge businesses) in the US for many years with miraculous success beyond anything man has ever witnessed before. You want to create a global nation without democracy? You can count me out. If the little guy doesn't have anything to say about this, you're building up a totalitarian society, dude.
"A witch you shall not let live"?
To me, it sounds as if you should intercept the witch and kill him/her. Tell me, oh great messiah, what does it actually mean?
I walk on water and heal the sick, blind, deaf and dumb every day Ô_o
I was not sitting on my butt reading the bible, I was doing what it said to do and it worked to perfection just like the bible said it would. How do you know that? In an earlier post you told us you haven't read it, so how do you know you're following it?
A Kingdom is not a Democracy, I have been running kingdoms (huge businesses) in the US for many years with miraculous success beyond anything man has ever witnessed before. You want to create a global nation without democracy? You can count me out. If the little guy doesn't have anything to say about this, you're building up a totalitarian society, dude.
Virgo
Dec 17th, 2005, 3:20 PM
Sorry, defending the Bible was just my top priority. Now I don't defend that law anymore.
Well, I bet that you'd find some contradiction if you'd studied Darwins book to long enough. Or, maybe you wouldn't.
What I do know, is that in the new testament, the greatest law of all is: "Thou shalt love thy neighbour as yourself." Which means: No killing gays!
Well, I bet that you'd find some contradiction if you'd studied Darwins book to long enough. Or, maybe you wouldn't.
What I do know, is that in the new testament, the greatest law of all is: "Thou shalt love thy neighbour as yourself." Which means: No killing gays!
New Creature
Dec 17th, 2005, 7:02 PM
Sorry, defending the Bible was just my top priority. Now I don't defend that law anymore.
Well, I bet that you'd find some contradiction if you'd studied Darwins book to long enough. Or, maybe you wouldn't.
What I do know, is that in the new testament, the greatest law of all is: "Thou shalt love thy neighbour as yourself." Which means: No killing gays!
This struck me as of lately our father has been dealing with me on this particular topic. I used to hate gays with a passion. Yes, I am guilty of hate crimes. Any chance I had I would destroy one. However, I understand now that we are to love all sinners without conditions. This is one of many examples of why I keep harping on apostate and whacked out Christians given the majority of the people whom only wish to please the Father a bad rap. To include myself with a great degree. We cant pick and choose which sin is acceptable to use. It was of the Father of all lies that convinced me that my sins were better then those of homsexuals. When truth be told that my sin was equal to that of any man living or asleep.
Personally I still think it is unacceptable, however so is murder and stealing and so on. Praise the Father for showing me that sin is sin no matter how it manifest itself. Love one another is Christ commandment. I have been dealt with on this and ask for forgiveness.
Jake, you are in serious violation brother. When the Messiah returns there will be no question about it. We will ALL see him coming in the clouds. With a loud Trumpet and his army of angels. Regardless to if this is your ideal of a joke or not there is nothing funny about it. As a matter of fact your most obvious violation is in direct contradiction with the word and the very same that caused Lu(ifer to be cast out. Pride. Your empire of ding dongs and twinkies is nothing compared to what Christ accomplished at Calvary.
I am not trying to be mean I would be honored to share what I have learned be it PM or email. Love in Christ.
Well, I bet that you'd find some contradiction if you'd studied Darwins book to long enough. Or, maybe you wouldn't.
What I do know, is that in the new testament, the greatest law of all is: "Thou shalt love thy neighbour as yourself." Which means: No killing gays!
This struck me as of lately our father has been dealing with me on this particular topic. I used to hate gays with a passion. Yes, I am guilty of hate crimes. Any chance I had I would destroy one. However, I understand now that we are to love all sinners without conditions. This is one of many examples of why I keep harping on apostate and whacked out Christians given the majority of the people whom only wish to please the Father a bad rap. To include myself with a great degree. We cant pick and choose which sin is acceptable to use. It was of the Father of all lies that convinced me that my sins were better then those of homsexuals. When truth be told that my sin was equal to that of any man living or asleep.
Personally I still think it is unacceptable, however so is murder and stealing and so on. Praise the Father for showing me that sin is sin no matter how it manifest itself. Love one another is Christ commandment. I have been dealt with on this and ask for forgiveness.
Jake, you are in serious violation brother. When the Messiah returns there will be no question about it. We will ALL see him coming in the clouds. With a loud Trumpet and his army of angels. Regardless to if this is your ideal of a joke or not there is nothing funny about it. As a matter of fact your most obvious violation is in direct contradiction with the word and the very same that caused Lu(ifer to be cast out. Pride. Your empire of ding dongs and twinkies is nothing compared to what Christ accomplished at Calvary.
I am not trying to be mean I would be honored to share what I have learned be it PM or email. Love in Christ.
Jake99
Dec 19th, 2005, 3:13 PM
There is no question who the messiah is but you have to look at the residue he leaves behind that proves who he is. Concealing the performance of miracles is just as important as having them witnessed and documented, and revealing that you are the Christ must also be concealed, revealed, challenged by judges and documented. I have done those things hundreds of times and I was in court as Jesus was right at Y2K, answering the same questions he was asked and proving I was the messiah beyond a shadow of a doubt. I have been performing miracles in the business world, courtrooms, on the athletic fields, the US Marines and in schools for 50 years. You cannot find a better leadership performance of turning chaos into peace and prosperity in the twinkling of an eye, a better judge or all around athletic performer in all of time. And that does not count what my 3 brothers and 3 sisters did which is also way beyond that which you have seen before. Its genetic I was built to outperform all others and understand the bible without even reading it. I get the sayings of Jesus in my email and when I read what he said, it makes perfect sense, and yet you are confused by it and do none of what he said to do. Its no wonder I am the only one who can perform miracles I am the only one who understands what Jesus said, and I walk the talk.
I need only know the bible in that it says to treat others as you would treat yourself, no lines on the map, cast out the money changers, treat all fairly and use one simple system. Thou shall not kill, steal etc.. None of the governments on this planet operate under those terms so who does not understand the bible? I outperformed all others combined in redesigning the largest and fastest bread and cake manufacturing plants on the planet and I never received a complaint from a thousand employees while I was managing operations and fixing all their problems. I have a 99.9% success rate at managing operations and problem solving in every business category and function you can think of and I can do most jobs in the plant as well as the best employee or better. Industry wide I am probably #1 in every category and that is documented. Daily bread is a fundamental need and I suggest you get busy building high speed bakeries to meet the demand. Giving out sacks of flour is not my idea of charity or intelligence.
I need only know the bible in that it says to treat others as you would treat yourself, no lines on the map, cast out the money changers, treat all fairly and use one simple system. Thou shall not kill, steal etc.. None of the governments on this planet operate under those terms so who does not understand the bible? I outperformed all others combined in redesigning the largest and fastest bread and cake manufacturing plants on the planet and I never received a complaint from a thousand employees while I was managing operations and fixing all their problems. I have a 99.9% success rate at managing operations and problem solving in every business category and function you can think of and I can do most jobs in the plant as well as the best employee or better. Industry wide I am probably #1 in every category and that is documented. Daily bread is a fundamental need and I suggest you get busy building high speed bakeries to meet the demand. Giving out sacks of flour is not my idea of charity or intelligence.
Sammy56
Dec 21st, 2005, 11:51 PM
I know I said I would never respond to Jake again, but I have to ask this question. Have you ever brought someone back after they died? Isn't that the ultimate miracle Christ achieved?
Jake99
Dec 27th, 2005, 5:03 PM
Being dead can mean dead in spirit and dead symbolically. If you are living in chaos and are failing in everything you do and I come and change your system into peace prosperity and long life, then you have been resurrected. I have brought hundreds of people back from the dead that were at their wits end and destined for doom. Its more of a rebirth than a resurrection and its my specialty. Its the magic wand of simplicity, common sense and working smart, not hard, that I bring to the table which creates miracles but it has nothing to do with magic. Anyone can do what I can do, and yet no one else does. Unless you see the world as I do, you cannot react to it as I do, and none of you see the world as I do.
New Creature
Dec 27th, 2005, 7:06 PM
I know I said I would never respond to Jake again, but I have to ask this question. Have you ever brought someone back after they died? Isn't that the ultimate miracle Christ achieved?
Doctors do it all the time. They brought me back..
Christ took upon him the worlds sins, even those that have not yet been born. The ticket was paid, and if we dont grab it. We dont get to ride.
Doctors do it all the time. They brought me back..
Christ took upon him the worlds sins, even those that have not yet been born. The ticket was paid, and if we dont grab it. We dont get to ride.
Sabazi
Dec 27th, 2005, 7:35 PM
Is that the reason for the whole "New Creature" thing?
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