Is Santa Claus Real? Want Proof?

[B.NyeTheUruk-Hai]

PROOF THAT SANTA CLAUS IS REAL !!!

It seems to me that many of the arguments regarding the existence of God boil down to this >> "Prove that God doesn't exist."

Atheists and Agnostics understand what a colossally ridiculous "proof" this is, but the religious folks here somehow don't see it this way. So in an attempt to have them see things from OUR perspective, I challenge them to prove to me that Santa Claus doesn't exist! Go ahead! I dare you!

Let me start things off with some SOLID proof that Santa DOES exist:
Every Christmas, my wife and I exchange gifts and these gifts clearly are labelled to and from eachother. But whenever we go to her parents' home, all of our presents are labelled as being from SANTA CLAUS!!! HE EXISTS I TELL YOU!!!

[stewey]

At one time, there really was a Santa Claus, only he didn't live at the North Pole and had a different name, but the idea is the same.

[stringybeef]

you ever see the movie Badder Santa...theres your Santa Claus

[Sammy56]

The True Story of Santa Claus begins with Nicholas

The true story of Santa Claus begins with Nicholas, who was born during the third century in Patara, a village in what is now Turkey. His wealthy parents, who raised him to be a devout Christian, died in an epidemic while Nicholas was still young. Obeying Jesus' words to "sell what you own and give the money to the poor," Nicholas used his whole inheritance to assist the needy, the sick, and the suffering. He dedicated his life to serving God and was made Bishop of Myra while still a young man. Bishop Nicholas became known throughout the land for his generosity to those in need, his love for children, and his concern for sailors and ships. Under the Roman Emperor Diocletian, who ruthlessly persecuted Christians, Bishop Nicholas suffered for his faith, was exiled and imprisoned. The prisons were so full of bishops, priests, and deacons, there was no room for the real criminals -- murderers, thieves and robbers. After his release, Nicholas attended the Council of Nicaea in 325 AD. He died December 6, 343 AD in Myra and was buried in his cathedral church, where a unique relic, called manna, formed in his grave. This liquid substance was said to have healing powers which fostered the growth of devotion to Nicholas. The anniversary of his death became a day of celebration, St. Nicholas Day.

Nicholas' tomb in Myra became a popular place of pilgrimage. Because of the many wars and attacks in the region, some Christians were concerned that access to the tomb might become difficult. For both the religious and commercial advantages of a major pilgrimage site, the Italian cities of Venice and Bari vied to get the Nicholas relics. In the spring of 1087, sailors from Bari succeeded in spiriting away the bones, bringing them to Bari, a seaport on the southeast coast of Italy. An impressive church was built over St. Nicholas' crypt and many faithful journeyed to honor the saint who had rescued children, prisoners, sailors, famine victims, and many others through his compassion, generosity, and the countless miracles attributed to his intercession. The Nicholas shrine in Bari was one of medieval Europe's great pilgrimage centers and Nicholas became known as "Saint in Bari." To this day pilgrims and tourists visit Bari's great Basilica di San Nicola.

Through the centuries St. Nicholas has continued to be venerated by Catholics and Orthodox and honored by Protestants. By his example of generosity to those in need, especially children, St. Nicholas continues to be a model for the compassionate life.

Widely celebrated in Europe, St. Nicholas' feast day, December sixth, kept alive the stories of his goodness and generosity. In Germany and Poland, boys dressed as bishops begged alms for the poor-and sometimes for themselves! In the Netherlands and Belgium, St. Nicholas arrived on a steamship from Spain to ride a white horse on his gift-giving rounds. December sixth is still the main day for gift giving and merrymaking in much of Europe. For example, in the Netherlands St. Nicholas' Day is celebrated with the sharing of candies (thrown in the door), chocolate initial letters, small gifts, and riddles. Dutch children leave carrots and hay in their shoes for the horse, hoping St. Nicholas will exchange them for small gifts. Simple gift-giving in early Advent helps preserve a Christmas Day focus on the Christ Child.

Who Was St. Nicholas?

December sixth is he festival of St. Nicholas, but nowadays we celebrate him on Christmas Day as Santa Claus. The real St. Nicholas was a bishop in Asia Minor, who died about 342 A.D. He became the patron saint of Russia and of children sailor, merchants, and those in sudden danger.

There is a story about him which tells how one day he heard a man and his three daughters bewailing the fact that all their money had gone and that they would have to go out and beg to be able to buy food. Nicholas had three bags of gold, and two of these he put secretly -- on two successive nights -- through the window of the man's home. The man though that the gold had come from God. On the third night he saw Nicholas put in the third bag of gold and fell at his feet.

Nicholas told him to give thanks to God. “It was He who sent me to you,” he said. This story, like many of the stories which attach themselves to saints, may or may not be true, but it certainly is a lovely tale and is one of the reasons we connect St. Nicholas with the giving of presents at Christmas time.

Full story at http://www.christmas.com/pe/1978http://www.christmas.com/pe/1978

I know you have to be joking in this thread because I figured out the Santa Claus wasn't' real when I was like 7 years old. The myth of some fat guy in a red suit riding around in a sled pulled by flying reindeer (which is scientifically impossible) is easily proven wrong. While Saint Nicholas (aka Santa Claus) was once a real person who was generous to others less fortunate then him, he died a long time ago. We just incorporated his giving spirit into Christmas as a good excuse to get cool presents. Try doing a google search Nye, you can find lots of info. on Saint Nicholas proving that he is not alive anymore.

[Mezurashi]

my favourite version of the Santa Claus origin myth is 'Santa Claus Is Coming To Town' produced by the Rankin Bass folk for TV. gotta love claymation. and for surreal children's programming can anything beat an effeminate elf in Santa's workshop who actually wants to be a dentist? (from another RB production known as 'Rudolph The Red Nosed Reindeer.')

in Japan there was a period in the 1970's (don't know about now) where children who lived in apartments that had no chimneys could build cardboard 'chimney's' which were placed in a convenient window so Santa could have access to leave his prezzies. back then I thought it was cool, being a kid myself, as I grew older I considered it evil Western programming polluting my noble heritage (being an adolescent can suck) and now I see it as the inevitable outcome of world-wide communication.

Santa Claus should exist, in my opinion, because the idea of Santa is basically cool. So I 'believe' in Santa, too. :vbroll:

[B.NyeTheUruk-Hai]

Great story, Sammy56! All joking of this thread aside, that was a very interesting read and I thank you for posting that. Now on to the nastiness...


The myth of some fat guy in a red suit riding around in a sled pulled by flying reindeer (which is scientifically impossible) is easily proven wrong.
Scientifically impossible? Science can't be used to explain ALL things. Santa is magical. His reindeer are magical. Hello? Rudolph has a red flashing nose and all of them can fly, so OBVIOUSLY they are not ordinary reindeer, but MAGICAL reindeer! I've SEEN Santa's sleigh and his reindeer WITH MY OWN EYES. One Christmas Eve, I looked up in the night sky and saw a distinctly shaped oblong illuminated object streaking across the sky. Seeing as it was Christmas Eve, it could only mean one thing - SANTA! Coincidentally, the news said that the space shuttle would be visible with the naked eye streaking across the night sky, but I KNOW that it was Santa. And speaking of Santa, I see him EVERY YEAR at Christmas time at the local mall. He's REAL I tell you!


is easily proven wrong
Humor me and prove it then!


While Saint Nicholas (aka Santa Claus) was once a real person who was generous to others less fortunate then him, he died a long time ago. We just incorporated his giving spirit into Christmas as a good excuse to get cool presents. Try doing a google search Nye, you can find lots of info. on Saint Nicholas proving that he is not alive anymore.
He DID die, but then he was resurrected as a fat dude in an red suit. I've SEEN him! Millions upon millions of childred believe in Santa Claus, why don't you?


my favourite version of the Santa Claus origin myth is 'Santa Claus Is Coming To Town' produced by the Rankin Bass folk for TV. gotta love claymation.
Aaaaaahh, claymation is the BEST! There was Gumby and also that annoying kid and his dog - "HELooooooo, daaaaaaVEY."


can anything beat an effeminate elf in Santa's workshop who actually wants to be a dentist?
ONE thing CAN beat the effeminate elf - I believe that it was MAD TV (or maybe Saturday Night Live) that did a HILARIOUS parody of this which was very violent. I KILLED myself laughing so hard! I'll be that you can download it from one of the P2P networks. In fact, I'm going to try to look for it myself!


Santa Claus should exist, in my opinion, because the idea of Santa is basically cool. So I 'believe' in Santa, too.
He DOES exist! I'm glad that you believe in him too! How can you NOT believe in him with evidence of his existence literally EVERYWHERE!

[Bigsky770]

. . .This one I can answer 'cause I know the jolly fat dude's real. Every year just starting before Christmas, NORAD tracks Santa's whereabouts and this can be viewed by anyone -w- a computer. . .Can't recall the site's name but I am sure it can be googled up quick/the guy is probably snoozing right now on vacation, and the elves busy constructing this next Christmas' toys. . .

. . .nanny-nanny, boo-boo, sorry, this ones INDISPUTABLE! :lol:

. . .Hope that helped. . . :P

Joe (Bigsky770) :vbroll:

[B.NyeTheUruk-Hai]

. . .This one I can answer 'cause I know the jolly fat dude's real. Every year just starting before Christmas, NORAD tracks Santa's whereabouts and this can be viewed by anyone -w- a computer. . .Can't recall the site's name but I am sure it can be googled up quick/the guy is probably snoozing right now on vacation, and the elves busy constructing this next Christmas' toys. . .
The evidence keeps mounting...
And yet more evidence of Santa's existence: Here in Canada, if you write a letter to Santa and address it to the North Pole and include the postal code "H0H 0H0", then Santa will WRITE BACK to you!!!

Still waiting for evidence that Santa doesn't exist...

[nutnoodle]

I'm an agnostic, but I do have proof.

*clears throat*

There are approximately two billion children (persons under 18) in the world. However, since Santa Claus does not visit children of Muslim, Hindu, Jewish or Buddhist religions, this reduces the workload for Christmas Night to 15% of the total, or 379 million (estimate). At an average census rate of 3.5 children per household, that comes to 108 million homes, presuming there's at least one good child in each.

Santa Claus has about 31 hours of Christmas to work with, thanks to the different time zones and the rotation of the Earth assuming he travels east to west. This works out to 967.7 visits per second. This is to say that for each Christian household with a good child, Santa has around 1/1000th of a second to park the sleigh, hop out, jump down the chimney, fill the stocking, distribute the remaining presents under the tree, eat what ever treats that have been left for him, get back up the chimney, jump into the sleigh and get onto the next house.

Assuming that each of these 108 million stops is evenly distributed around the Earth (which, of course, we know to be false, but will except for the purposes of our calculations), we are now talking about 0.78 miles per household; a total trip of 75.5 million miles, not counting bathroom stops or breaks. This means Santa's sleigh is moving at 650 miles per second, 3,000 times the speed of sound. For purpose of comparison, the fastest man made vehicle, the Ulysses Space Probe, moves at a pokey 27.4 Miles per second, and a conventional reindeer can run (at best) 15 miles per hour.

The payload of the sleigh adds another interesting element. Assuming that each child gets nowt more than a medium sized LEGO™ Set (2lb) the sleigh is carrying over 500,000 tons, not counting Santa Claus himself. On land, a conventional reindeer can pull no more than 300 pounds. Even granting that the "flying" reindeer can pull 10 times the normal amount, the job can't be done with eight or even nine of them- Santa would need 360,000 reindeer. This increases the payload, not counting the weight of the sleigh, another 54,000 tons, or roughly seven times the weight of the QE2. A mass of nearly 600,000 tons travelling at 650 miles per second creates enormous air resistance - this would heat up the reindeer in the same fashion as a spacecraft re-entering the Earth's atmosphere.

The lead pair of reindeer would absorb 14.3 quintillion joules of energy per second each. In short, they would burst in to flames almost instantaneously, exposing the reindeer behind them and creating deafening sonic booms in their wake. The entire reindeer team would be vaporised in 4.26 thousands of a second, or right about the time that Santa Claus reaches the 5th house on his trip. Not that it matters, however, since Santa Claus, as a result of accelerating from a dead stop to 650 mph in 0.001 seconds, would be a subject to acceleration forces of 17,000G's. A 20 stone Santa Claus (which seems ludicrously slim considering the high calorie snacks he must have consumed over the years) would be pinned to the back of the sleigh by 2,155 tons of force, instantly crushing his bones and organs and reducing him to a quivering blob of pink goo.

Therefore, if Santa Claus did exist, he's dead now...

[mysticalzoe]

LMFAO!!!!!!! :yummm:

[Bigsky770]

. . .Surprised and dismayed as well. You should know that physics as those that you relate here are not applicable to the "Jolly fat guy", my understanding is that not only can "Time" be manipulated by Santa, but as well, what about "Santa's magic dust?" (coupla snorts'a that stuff can CHANGE EVERYTHING!) as you should know! Don't look now, but methinks yer whole arguement just bit the big'un! :lol: Anywho, welcome to the "Forum", hope you enjoy your time here! :2thumbs:

. . .And YOU, Jessica. . .(mysticalzoe) snickering in the corner! Shame on you!

(Shaking my head) Joe (Bigsky770) :vbroll:

[B.NyeTheUruk-Hai]

I'm an agnostic, but I do have proof.
BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA !!! That was AWESOME, nutnoodle !!!
Best... post... EVER !!!

Unfortunately, despite the amazing amount of logic and time that went into your post, I'm going to have to agree with Apostle Joe and claim that logic does not apply to Santa Claus just as logic does not apply to God. Hey, if THEY can do it, so can WE! Now I just HAVE to make some comments about your hilarious post!


Santa has around 1/1000th of a second to park the sleigh, hop out, jump down the chimney, fill the stocking, distribute the remaining presents under the tree, eat what ever treats that have been left for him, get back up the chimney, jump into the sleigh and get onto the next house.
Can you imagine the indigestion that Santa would have after 31 hours of treats?


and a conventional reindeer can run (at best) 15 miles per hour.
Now this is where logic does not apply. You're assuming that Santa's reindeer are conventional reindeer. But they're not! They're MAGIC reindeer!


Santa would need 360,000 reindeer.
Again, logic does not apply to Santa's reindeer. Either the reindeer, being magical and all, CAN handle such astronomical payloads OR Santa is utilizing reindeer sweatshops in Asia to acquire the 359,987 reindeer needed to supplement the 13 reindeer that he already has. As a side note, if Santa does have 360,000 reindeer, can you imagine the very beginning of the "Rudolph the Red-Nosed Reindeer" song? There was Dasher and Dancer and Prancer and Vixen, Comet and Cupid and Donner and Blitzen, and Wilfred and Igor and Margaret and etc. etc. etc. It would just go on and on and on and on for 360,000 names and become an even more annoying song than "The 12 Days of Christmas"...


Santa Claus, as a result of accelerating from a dead stop to 650 mph in 0.001 seconds, would be a subject to acceleration forces of 17,000G's. A 20 stone Santa Claus (which seems ludicrously slim considering the high calorie snacks he must have consumed over the years) would be pinned to the back of the sleigh by 2,155 tons of force, instantly crushing his bones and organs and reducing him to a quivering blob of pink goo.
And thus giving rise to the phrase "He had a broad face and a little round belly,that shook when he laughed like a bowl full of jelly." Unfortunately, although your reasoning seems sound at first, you've failed to take into consideration these high-calorie snacks that Santa has consumed over the years. Said snacks have led to inhuman amounts of arterio- and atherosclerosis of Santa's blood vessels, the end result of which is the formation of indestructable blood vessel walls which are able to withstand the phenomenal G-forces and energy absorption that you speak of, thus protecting Santa from becoming a "quivering blob of pink goo". Although the imagery that you have described is funnier, logic dictates that this realistically would not happen.

Once again, nutnoodle, bravo on a great post!

[dutchie]

The truth was glaring you all in the face all along....

Time to come clean....

ahem...


I am he.

[B.NyeTheUruk-Hai]

The truth was glaring you all in the face all along....
Time to come clean....
ahem...
I am he.
I had my suspicions! One just has to look at your new avatar to realize that, at the incredible sled speeds described by nutnoodle, numerous insects would become embedded in your teeth during your deliveries...

[DarkAce]

Those 'insights' aren't nutnoodles at all nor do I think he was concluding they were. That "joke" has been on the internet for years.

[nutnoodle]

Yes that's true, I can't take credit for calculating all that... it's been around for a while. I just thought it was the perfect answer to this thread.

Well, I would've thought it up if it hadn't already existed... honest! :shy:

...

I'll let myself out...

(By the by, I'm a she.)

[B.NyeTheUruk-Hai]

It was STILL a good post regardless of where it came from...

[DontBeAfraid]

'slong as its by an by.

[Bigsky770]

Originally posted by Dutchie
The truth was glaring you all in the face all along....Time to come clean....ahem...I am he.

. . .You do realize this creates a "Conflict of interests" between those jobs you've accepted as "Antichrist No.#1"? Just cannot work with you being Santa. We'll have to have counsel for this!:lol:



Originally posted by DarkAce
Those 'insights' aren't nutnoodles at all nor do I think he was concluding they were. That "joke" has been on the internet for years.

. . .Oh, no biggie. I've read it myself before. No harm done as I got as much of a laugh out of it THEN as I did recent. . .



Originally posted by Nutnoodle
I'll let myself out...

. . .Hey, stay around! No problem! (IT WAS funny/no matter who originated it!)

Joe (Bigsky770) :vbroll:

[Sammy56]

Ok, I have a question. If Santa Claus is magical, how come he brought me a broken stereo last year? It was what I asked for, but I had to take it back and get a new one casue the one he brought didn't work? How could a magical Santa do such a thing?

[Houston411]

No hes not real, or lord of the rings...

sorry to let you all down!

[Mezurashi]

No hes not real, or lord of the rings...

sorry to let you all down!


DAMN YOU HOUSTON YOU PRAGMATIST!! (lol j/k)

I Believe in the Idea of Santa - but maybe the big jolly guy is now unrecognizable thanks to a combination of Pilates, Kabbalah, and the better tasting Diet Coke.

BTW Santa Claus is non-partisan and all denomination. Saint Nicholas is Christian-centric. The difference is in the shade of red, Claus is Candy Apple and Nicholas is Burgundy.

and his sled and reindeer have been replaced by a truly awesome LeadSled conversion powered by a Dodge Hemi V-10 Fusion Reactor. The reindeer ride in back (there's LOTS of room) and help with the distribution, which is now handled using 'smart' guidance packages on the aerodynamically designed delivery sabots and vectored to their targets by the rack of laser spotters mounted on all four fenders. he also uses a swarm of the latest dual processor G5 Power Macs to correlate his address lists and such.

or maybe he's using UPS, that wold help explain their meteoric rise ...

[B.NyeTheUruk-Hai]

Ok, I have a question. If Santa Claus is magical, how come he brought me a broken stereo last year? It was what I asked for, but I had to take it back and get a new one casue the one he brought didn't work? How could a magical Santa do such a thing?
You have to realize that Santa works in mysterious ways. We cannot possibly comprehend WHY Santa does the things that he does. Perhaps it was a test of your faith? Perhaps it was a sign from Santa telling you to get an mp3 player instead of a primitive stereo?


No hes not real, or lord of the rings...
Have you no inkling of what you've done here?!?!?! You will bring down the wrath of dutchie-son-of-dutchie's-father upon us all. FLEE!!! FLEE FOR YOUR LIVES!!!

[Sammy56]

Perhaps it was a sign from Santa telling you to get an mp3 player instead of a primitive stereo?

But I didn't want a mp3 player. I wanted a stereo so I could play my music really loud and annoy my parents. You can't do that with an mp3 player, santa should know that.


Perhaps it was a test of your faith?

My faith in what? A fat bald guy who runs around with elves? Sorry, no faith there to test. :grin

[B.NyeTheUruk-Hai]

But I didn't want a mp3 player. I wanted a stereo so I could play my music really loud and annoy my parents. You can't do that with an mp3 player, santa should know that.
Aaahh, but Santa DOES know this! Being a father himself (where do you think all of those elves came from?), Santa knows what a pain in the ass kids can be and he was simply trying to help out your parents so that you wouldn't annoy them.


My faith in what? A fat bald guy who runs around with elves? Sorry, no faith there to test.
Aaahhh, my son. You know not the blasphemy of which you speak. You shall receive a lump of coal in your stocking next Christmas. Do you know WHY bad little boys receive coal in their stockings? Because when the Anti-Santa emerges from the bowels of the Earth after the warning signs reveal themselves (one of such signs being Muslims and Jews actually getting along), this Anti-Santa is going to shove that coal SO FAR up your TIGHT bung-hole that, when you finally crap it out, your bung-tightness will have compressed it into pure DIAMOND. Then the Anti-Santa will collect all of these diamonds and flood the world markets with them, thus sending the world economy into chaos. And to celebrate this chaos, he will then bung-rape you repeatedly until you are begging to spend the night with Michael Jackson. It is PURE genius! MWAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!! MWAAAAAAHAAhhahaaaa... cough... cough... Aw, confound it! I've just ruined the evil atmosphere that I worked so hard to create! REPENT!!!

[DontBeAfraid]

From my understanding santa only rewards good kids... You wanted a stereo to be a bad kid. So santa got brought you a broken stereo..... but like bill said; Santa works in mysterious ways so we cant be certain of his motivations.

[dutchie]

You shall receive a lump of coal in your stocking next Christmas. Do you know WHY bad little boys receive coal in their stockings? Because when the Anti-Santa emerges from the bowels of the Earth after the warning signs reveal themselves (one of such signs being Muslims and Jews actually getting along), this Anti-Santa is going to shove that coal SO FAR up your TIGHT bung-hole that, when you finally crap it out, your bung-tightness will have compressed it into pure DIAMOND. Then the Anti-Santa will collect all of these diamonds and flood the world markets with them, thus sending the world economy into chaos. And to celebrate this chaos, he will then bung-rape you repeatedly until you are begging to spend the night with Michael Jackson. It is PURE genius! MWAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!! MWAAAAAAHAAhhahaaaa... cough... cough... Aw, confound it! I've just ruined the evil atmosphere that I worked so hard to create! REPENT!!!
I'll have whatever he is drinking, bartender.... :alcoholic

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAH!!!! :Llol:

[B.NyeTheUruk-Hai]

Dutchie!!! Dutchie!!! I can see from your new avatar that you are being held prisoner and have been gagged by those blasphemous heathens who wish to stop the spread of Jedianity and Arda! We must stop them from crucifying dutchie-son-of-dutchie's-father on the White Tree on top of Minas Tirith! Use your wangsaber to cut your bindings and smite the heathens!!! SMITE THEM!!!

[dutchie]

yeah... err.... well....

never mind, I'll explain later