11:11 Revisited

[repentantsinner]

In another thread i posted that the rapture and (second coming?) would occur 2595 days after the confirming "of the covenant with many". Personally i believe it could be December 21 2012. I got 2595 days from 7 years plus 40 days.( Genesis 7:4) Could we then count 7 years 40 days backwards from December 21 2012 to find out when the tribulation begins? December 21 2012 -7 yeaRS = dECEMBER 21 2005. SUBTRACT THE 21 DAYS OF December 40 - 21 =19. So from the end of November we subtract 19 days. 30 - 19 = 11. November 11th. 7 years and 40 days from December 21 2012 = November 11 2005. November is the 11th month, so November 11 = 11:11. Millions of people around the world are seeing 11:11 on clocks. I started seeing it when i began believing the bible. Could 11:11 on clocks be a warning about the start of the 7 yearr tribulation? There is also something else significant.The 7 year tribulation will come when the majority of the world is crying "peace and safety". 11:11, or November 11th is the date that the first world war ended. What if a peace treaty is signed November 11 2005, people will celebrate all the more on the aniversery of the end of the "war to end all wars " I do NOT have a "thus sayeth the lord" on this but the pieces seem to fit. In order for this to happen there must very shortly be a brief but violent war in the middle east. Time will tell, but it just might be later than we think.

[Mezurashi]

what was the name of that woman you were waiting for? or was that you?

and wasn't Armageddon supposed to have been about 4 - 5 years ago?

and, really, isn't there something better to do with math skills?

[nrj]

Repentant sinner, let me say it like this way: the number 253 is evil. If you double it, it will become 506. Ok, and now add the number of my grandfather: 65. Now we have 566. Ok, and this might be farfetched, but what if we would add the number of bishops in the Church of Sweden, since they are messengers of god. that's 112. Now we have 683. Ok, but what if we could just subtract the life time of Jesus? 658. Ok, and if we would add the number of bullshit prophecies I can think of and have been proven wrong: 8. Well, my good friend, now we have 666. See? The number of 253 is evil! The rapture will occur at the year 253 A.D! Oh my god!!!

[Philosopher Foelhe]

*sigh* Y'know how people complain about taking God's name in vain? Sometimes I wanna smack someone in the nose for taking Mathematics' name in vain.

Repentsinner, numbers add up. It's what they do. Take enough random numbers and string them together, you'll get whatever you want to get.


In order for this to happen there must very shortly be a brief but violent war in the middle east.

... As opposed to all the other brief but violent wars in the Middle East?

[Assassin X]

Ermm... God said no one would know the date and time or something like that. Theres no "Uber Hidden" secret dates in the bible. Anyways I would think that if a all powerful being that is a ,well, infifnitly more smarter then us wanted to hide a date in some secret riddle on the bible I think it would be a little harder then even for a some Genius to find let alone a guy at some forum.

[B.NyeTheUruk-Hai]

Repentant sinner, let me say it like this way: the number 253 is evil. If you double it, it will become 506. Ok, and now add the number of my grandfather: 65. Now we have 566. Ok, and this might be farfetched, but what if we would add the number of bishops in the Church of Sweden, since they are messengers of god. that's 112. Now we have 683. Ok, but what if we could just subtract the life time of Jesus? 658. Ok, and if we would add the number of bullshit prophecies I can think of and have been proven wrong: 8. Well, my good friend, now we have 666. See? The number of 253 is evil! The rapture will occur at the year 253 A.D! Oh my god!!!
WOW!!! That was amazing, nrj!!! We're DOOMED!!!


*sigh* Y'know how people complain about taking God's name in vain? Sometimes I wanna smack someone in the nose for taking Mathematics' name in vain.
Heh heh... Descartes-dammit!!!

[repentantsinner]

Repentant sinner, let me say it like this way: the number 253 is evil. If you double it, it will become 506. Ok, and now add the number of my grandfather: 65. Now we have 566. Ok, and this might be farfetched, but what if we would add the number of bishops in the Church of Sweden, since they are messengers of god. that's 112. Now we have 683. Ok, but what if we could just subtract the life time of Jesus? 658. Ok, and if we would add the number of bullshit prophecies I can think of and have been proven wrong: 8. Well, my good friend, now we have 666. See? The number of 253 is evil! The rapture will occur at the year 253 A.D! Oh my god!!!nrj you surprise me, i thought you were not a believer. Looking at your addition and subtraction it obvious you take quite a "leap of faith" to get the answers you do.

[Beatnik Bob]

In truth.......GOD SHOULD HAVE COME BACK THIRTY MINUTES AGO, BECAUSE THATS WHEN I BERNT THE FOOD IN THE OVEN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!
Now that’s an armageddon.

[B.NyeTheUruk-Hai]

In truth.......GOD SHOULD HAVE COME BACK THIRTY MINUTES AGO, BECAUSE THATS WHEN I BERNT THE FOOD IN THE OVEN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!
Jake wouldn't have burned the food...

[Beatnik Bob]

Jake wouldn't have burned the food.

Damn you Jake! Curses upon you! Where is that Fake when you need him!!


He did work at a bakery didn't he? That's why he's a messiah...........God just looooooooooooooooooves bread.

[nrj]

nrj you surprise me, i thought you were not a believer. Looking at your addition and subtraction it obvious you take quite a "leap of faith" to get the answers you do. You are aware that I just made up that equation, since I think this is total bullshit?

[salvador]

...if a all powerful being that is a ,well, infifnitly more smarter then us wanted to hide a date in some secret riddle on the bible I think it would be a little harder then even for a some Genius to find let alone a guy at some forum.Don't forget, Einstein was once just a guy at some forum. Ditto Darwin.

[repentantsinner]

You are aware that I just made up that equation, since I think this is total bullshit? Yes, and your sardonic humor provided for a good laugh. Reference was made to your math skills, not the gist of your post. Hey filo-sopher do you really think i posted that in "MATH's"name? :gtfo:

[repentantsinner]

For my 300th post i will pose a challenge to all the debunkers, scoffers, unbelievers and mockers. In the original post in this thread there is an error that most likely blows the idea out of the water. Are any of you sharp enough to find it?

[Philosopher Foelhe]

Hey filo-sopher do you really think i posted that in "MATH's"name?

Even worse. You used mathematics' good name like it was a two-dollar whore. And nice use on my name. Filo-sopher? Clever, I guess, in some bizarre way which apparently refuses to conform to the English language.


In the original post in this thread there is an error that most likely blows the idea out of the water. Are any of you sharp enough to find it?

Well, you counted back 2595 days and forgot Leap Year. So technically it would be November 12. Of course, you also used a completely normal time to "show" that the end of the world was coming, so pointing out a single flaw in your idea is like shooting an arrow into a lava flow.

[repentantsinner]

Yes your right, 2006 and 2010 will both be leap years. You caught that quickly philosopher foehle.

[Philosopher Foelhe]

... Actually, I think 2008 and 2012 will be Leap Years. Not 2006 and 2010. Just a small nitpick.

[nrj]

Ok... I'm talking for death ears here, but get on with you're life. Really. On November 12, my cousin turns 15, so I will pretty much go out, get some booze and get laid (If it's a nice evning). You know why? Because I can, and will be able to do so. You can sit and wait the whole day if you want to, but I can bet my watch nothing's gonna happen. Nothing. Sure, it's very likely an earthquake or anything happens, but not the rapture. We'll see who's right.

[Mezurashi]

Yes your right, 2006 and 2010 will both be leap years. You caught that quickly philosopher foehle.


your sig says something about stupid sheep -- read it, look in the mirror and realize that the best jokes are those thought out and planned.

numerology is as meaningful as astrology (and now I duck to avoid the flying debris, lmao).

[B.NyeTheUruk-Hai]

repentantsinner, you are just being paranoid. We just watched "Bowling For Columbine" last night (side note - HOLY SHIT, the U.S. is seriously fucked up) and Michael Moore did a good job of demonstrating how Bush and the American media have the entire country paranoid about everything. The fact is, for the past several years, crime has DECREASED yearly in the States. But because of Bush (side note - will somebody PLEASE wipe that shit-eating smirk off his face?) and the media, there is a perception in America that crime is running rampant. And because of this false perception, some religious people are claiming that the end of the world is nigh (or nye!). Relax, people! Nothing is going to happen, just like nothing happened at the turn of the millennium...

[Mezurashi]

a metaphor for B. Nye's statement is available in an article I read today (couldn't find the article I read but here's a related one with lots of details - http://slate.msn.com/id/2124160/?nav/navoa/ ) about the media hyping up the fear about Crystal Meth.

The media hype is doing two things. First it spreads DISINFORMATION which is bad, bad, bad. Second, this incorrect, erronous and falsified info is told to teens, who later discover they were lied to by their parents and the media, and it is any wonder late-teens don't trust anything the news or their parents say? After all, they've already been lied to for years.

The point I'm making is that there is a difference between making people AWARE of a situation/problem/crisis and creating HYSTERIA in order to sell more newspapers/land wars in Asia/tax hikes, etc.

Yes, something might be bad, but if someone points to it and screams, "It's Pure EVIL!" are you going to follow suit? Or might you just for a moment take a quick peek to see if it really Is evil or if it's just an old Smurf doll?

[Philosopher Foelhe]

Yeah, this is one of the reasons I don't actually watch the news. I really try to keep track of what's happening in the world, but the few times I've really sat down and started studying crime rates and whatnot, I eventually got the feeling the average person would gladly shoot me in the back of the head for ten bucks and a cup of coffee. Not exactly a realistic picture of the world.

[VegasRonin]

a metaphor for B. Nye's statement is available in an article I read today (couldn't find the article I read but here's a related one with lots of details - http://slate.msn.com/id/2124160/?nav/navoa/ ) about the media hyping up the fear about Crystal Meth. This is probably based on your locale. I can tell you that here in Vegas Meth use is rampant! I've seen some good intelligent people lose everything behind this stuff. Its garbage, and it turns the users into garbage. A couple of days ago, some nut job drove his mother's car onto a crowded sidewalk, and ran over 12 people, ON PURPOSE! There is no exaggeration when it come to using Meth!

[Philosopher Foelhe]

Well, yeah, Meth is dangerous. So are nuclear weapons, but no one's telling me to watch the next door neighbors' packages for plutonium shipments.

I think we all agree that at the core, reporters and newscasters tell the truth (Meth is bad, kids disappear). But it becomes a problem when we think that kids are grabbed off the street at every crosswalk, and everyone takes Meth in their coffee before work.

The frustrating thing is that it seems like everyone has two choices - they can be totally uninformed, or ridiculously paranoid. You can try to walk that line, but every day it gets harder.

[nrj]

Just so i can get a grip of the debate here... What's Meth?

[Sammy56]

The definition of meth from it's wikipedia article (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meth)-

"Methamphetamine is a synthetic stimulant drug which induces a strong feeling of euphoria and is highly addictive. Pure methamphetamine is a colorless crystalline solid, or a paste sold on the streets as crystal meth, glass, ice, or crystal. It is also sold as less pure crystalline powder called crank or speed, or in rock formation termed tweak, dope, or raw. It has become one of the world's most significant illicit drugs."

Hope that helps nrj...

[Mezurashi]

and to steer this back on topic ...

I was not saying Meth is Good for you, and VR I wasn't saying Meth use isn't a concern.

But the article I linked to points out the difference between the Media Hype of the effects of Meth and the observed data from the field workers dealing with meth cases.

And, if you lie to your kids, will they ever believe you once they find out you're a liar?

We're losing grasp of our 'youth' because, as Princess Leia put it, "The more you tighten your grip the more star systems slip through your fingers." - or - the more the media and, by proxy, parents lie to their kids about anything (drugs, wars, sex) the more kids are likely to turn their backs on the people who are supposed to help them.

And, One more thing, VR, I'd never call Las Vegas a 'typical' or average place and so I wouldn't take any observed behaviour there as anything like normal. That wold be like trying to judge someone from their behaviour at mardi Gras or something like that.

[RavenWhitefang]

Here in Portland, and really the whole state of Oregon, the meth thing is pretty damn big. Cant go a day without a story in the papers about some meth lab being found. Everywhere you go here that sells over the counter meds has a sticker on the door that says "Meth Watch" basically if you purchase your favorite cold meds or headache pills, you're being watched and the sale is tagged. If you purchase more than what a normal use would be, then you are pegged. It is quite rediculous. The thing that I thought was nuts, was front page news that they were cracking down on internet sales of the substance...ie Ebay and other auction sites where people get the shit.

As for the 11:11 thing, yeah I still keep seeing it. But as I said in a long ago forgotten post, If the end of the world comes, by fire, water, asteroid, nuclear weapons, politicians telling the truth...there is nothing we can do about it so grab a beer kick back, get laid for the last time and die with a smile on your face, cause hey, you dont have to go to work anymore =D

[nrj]

Hope that helps nrj... Oh, Methaphetamine! We have it over here to. I was asked to buy some just last week. Thanks, Sammy. :2thumbs:

[DarkAce]

Parents lie to kids all the time. Through the simple charades of Santa Claus, the toothfairy, etc. To other lies to get them to do work or behave. Are the kids going to throw a hissy fit because they've been 'lied' to?
Maybe some will for the moment, but most of the smart ones realize why they were lied to and understand.

[Philosopher Foelhe]

basically if you purchase your favorite cold meds or headache pills, you're being watched and the sale is tagged. If you purchase more than what a normal use would be, then you are pegged. It is quite rediculous.

*nods* Yeah, the store I work for has a policy where you can only buy two of anything that can be used to make Meth. Of course, if someone's actually starting a Meth lab, they just have to buy two boxes, take it out to the car, come back in, buy two boxes... lather, rinse, repeat. So it's no big deal to anyone actually starting a Meth lab, but it's Hell to people buying a ton of groceries who are just trying to stock up on cough drops. Once again, the system enthusiastically shoots itself in the foot.

Edit: DarkAce! No sneaking past!


Parents lie to kids all the time. Through the simple charades of Santa Claus, the toothfairy, etc. To other lies to get them to do work or behave. Are the kids going to throw a hissy fit because they've been 'lied' to?
Maybe some will for the moment, but most of the smart ones realize why they were lied to and understand.

I think there's a big difference between telling kids a fairy tale and outright lying to them about something important. My dad lies to me all the time, so I've just stopped listening to him. I'm not saying kids won't understand, but most of the smart ones are going to realize that if a source is unreliable, there's no point going to that source for information. Better to go to someone who might actually give you a straight answer.

[DarkAce]

I think there's a big difference between telling kids a fairy tale and outright lying to them about something important.


You're absolutely right, and it all depends on the severity of the lie. I seem to have forgotten to put that disclaimer in my other post. There is a big difference between a hurtful lie, and say a "fib". When I meant kids would understand I didn't mean in the sense they would accept it, but understand the reasoning behind why they were lied to in the first place.

I'm not sure of the situation with you're father but I could speculate ( based on what you've revealed previously) that the reasoning he lies to you is due to his hardcore "beliefs" and perhaps he's just generally a prick. I'm not saying the answers he gives you are the 'correct' ones or even reliable, but I'm sure you're aware of why he gives you those 'answers'? It's best to keep it in mind, it'll help in the forgiving process.

[Philosopher Foelhe]

I'm not saying the answers he gives you are the 'correct' ones or even reliable, but I'm sure you're aware of why he gives you those 'answers'? It's best to keep it in mind, it'll help in the forgiving process.

Well... quick disclaimer before I launch into my point. I don't really need to "forgive" my father, because I'm not angry at him. I just don't trust him. It's not an emotional, knee-jerk reaction, I just know to verify anything he tells me.

So, if reporters are biased, where are we supposed to verify anything? I mean, mostly we have personal experience (which is honest, but emotional and defies statistics and logic) and news (which twists the truth for its own personal use). Nowadays we have the internet as well (where you might be able to find the truth, maybe, if you spend weeks looking for it. Good luck recognizing it!). Am I missing anything here? Where are we supposed to go if we actually want to know what's happening in the world?

Edit: I spent twenty minutes carefully wording this damn post, and I forgot to reply to something DarkAce's said! :Llol:


When I meant kids would understand I didn't mean in the sense they would accept it, but understand the reasoning behind why they were lied to in the first place

Well, yeah, but that understanding isn't always enough. If a parent says to a kid, "There's an 80% chance of getting an STD if you have sex before marriage even once!" that's not going to sit well. They may understand a parent is just trying to protect them, but they may also believe the parent is just being paranoid about the much smaller risks (and when you compare the chance of catching an STD to that, it's gonna look insignificant), and they may act out. And they also won't talk to their parents about anything significant, since they know the grownups are being "paranoid" about this sort of thing. It's still just easier to go the honest route, in my opinion.

[Sammy56]

Where are we supposed to go if we actually want to know what's happening in the world?
Good question. The problem is there really isn't an answer. Everyone has to use their best judgement in determining the truth, but that might not be enough. Unless you were personally involved in something, determining the truth of what actually happened seems to be all but impossible.

[Mezurashi]

So why has no one suggested trying HONESTY?

I mean, we all speak of the fact that parents lie to their children now, but no one has suggested that maybe, just maybe, honesty is a good idea?

Is honesty that undesirable in the current social climate? Or are we all that afraid not not going with the flow?

Or am I hallucinating due to either a lack or an excess of medication?

(and I'm still off topic, sigh...)

[Philosopher Foelhe]

So why has no one suggested trying HONESTY?

I mean, we all speak of the fact that parents lie to their children now, but no one has suggested that maybe, just maybe, honesty is a good idea?

Is honesty that undesirable in the current social climate? Or are we all that afraid not not going with the flow?

Or am I hallucinating due to either a lack or an excess of medication?

Ahem.


It's still just easier to go the honest route, in my opinion.

If and when I have kids, I will try very hard to honestly answer anything they may ask about. Even if I'm worried about what they do with that information, I'd want my children to know I'm trustworthy enough to come to in a crisis.

[DarkAce]

Again like I stated before, I don't know your situation, but I'm pretty certain it'll eventually turn to anger then to hate at some point. Does he know your gay yet?


Where are we supposed to go if we actually want to know what's happening in the world?


There's no clear cut answer to this, as there is no absolute truth in this regard. The best we can hope for is to soak in as many sources as possible and use our reasoning and judgement to find some 'truth'. But really no one ever has all the pieces to the puzzle, but then again we can hint towards the bigger 'picture' without them.


They may understand a parent is just trying to protect them, but they may also believe the parent is just being paranoid about the much smaller risks (and when you compare the chance of catching an STD to that, it's gonna look insignificant), and they may act out. And they also won't talk to their parents about anything significant, since they know the grownups are being "paranoid" about this sort of thing.


Well that's generally the teenage attitude regardless. The honesty route is a tricky one, because it depends on the way the parent handles it. I've seen examples where parents try to much to be their kids 'friend' rather than parent, and it doesn't work out to well in the cases I've witnessed. Usually the kid controls all the power and quite literally can get away with almost anything while their parents cower in the background. A good balance is needed and not everyone is up to the job, although I have seen some examples of this work out rather well.


So why has no one suggested trying HONESTY?

I mean, we all speak of the fact that parents lie to their children now, but no one has suggested that maybe, just maybe, honesty is a good idea?


Unlike the quote, honesty isn't always the best policy. If a pet dies and the kid is very upset, does the relative tell the kid the pet is going to rot in the ground, or that the pet is in a better place, Pet Heaven? Depending on the lie it's sometimes more comforting to live with a lie than the truth, I'm not saying whether it's wrong or right, but neccesary at times to maintain social structure.

[Philosopher Foelhe]

Again like I stated before, I don't know your situation, but I'm pretty certain it'll eventually turn to anger then to hate at some point. Does he know your gay yet?

Hmm... how can I best clarify our relationship here?

My dad and I have pretty much polarized beliefs - he's a conservative Christian, I'm a more liberal gay agnostic-theist. I don't have any respect for the man. But the reason I don't have any respect for him is he constantly reads conservative books, watches conservative news... basically, he's the victim of a self-imposed brainwashing. His beliefs themselves don't bother me.

Now, when he finds out I'm gay, he'll probably be very upset and possibly throw me out (which is why I'll be financially secure long before he finds out about this). He may be angry at me, or even hate me, but I've known for a long time that the guy is trapped in his own mind. So even if he refuses to speak to me again, I'll mostly just feel sorry for him and move on with my life.


Well that's generally the teenage attitude regardless. The honesty route is a tricky one, because it depends on the way the parent handles it. I've seen examples where parents try to much to be their kids 'friend' rather than parent, and it doesn't work out to well in the cases I've witnessed.

True. My version of fathering - basically, the first time a kid breaks a rule, we sit down and carefully discuss why he shouldn't do that again, and the second time the kid breaks a rule, I bring down the fire. I don't know how much success that'll have, but to me it seems like the best method.

Of course, parenting is basically a shot in the dark much of the time. I certainly don't have all the answers.


Unlike the quote, honesty isn't always the best policy. If a pet dies and the kid is very upset, does the relative tell the kid the pet is going to rot in the ground, or that the pet is in a better place, Pet Heaven?

I would tell the child that the pet may be dead, but the point isn't to concentrate on the endings but to think about the good times, and that the child gave that pet a happy, full life, and I'd probably add something about how time is precious, and other people are precious, because they don't last forever. The way I see it, if I can't get my kids into therapy before high school, I'm not trying hard enough. :D

[Mezurashi]

ok, my attempt to get on topic...

when the first 'family death' occured for me I was about four and it was my maternal Grandfather in Japan (I was already living elsewhere). What I remember clearest about my mother's explanation for why she was so sad was when she said, "Your grandfather, my father, is dead. He died in a hospital in Osaka. I have to go to his funeral, so I want you to find a gift for him to show your respect."

I asked, "Is he ever going to come back?"

She replied, "No, he is gone forever from the world. But he will live on in Yasukuni (Japanese Heaven, i thnk i spelled it right) as one of the stars in the night sky."

And there we have what I consider to be a fine balance of brutal truth with a touch of fancifulness. My upbringing was mostly like this, I'd guess you'd call it 'Japanese' for lack of a better term. I always assumed (with the monomaniacal POV of the growing child) that Everyone grew up the same. Imagine my surprise when I got 'spoken to' by my Grade One teacher for letting the kids around me know that Dead was Dead - none of this resurrection and Holy Choir gaga.

And throughout my life I have observed how badly some people brought up with a 'softer, friendlier' POV deal with the deaths of their parents and close relatives. One woman whom I had an acquaintance with (we always met for tea at the same place and time, she was like my surrogate grandmother) killed herself when her sister died. She was only 57. And she told me lots of stories about her upbringing (as I absorbed greedily, I consider the Elders as living time machines of a sort) and I got the impression she had been taught to believe in heaven and hell, resurrection and all that soft-pedal stuff. Others in my life haven't gone so far, but their reaction to close deaths have included the fall into substance abuse, child abuse, spousal abuse and general loss of joie de vivre.

But people I know who were confronted by and/or have explained to them the whole life/death thing in more 'blunt' terms seem (I say this knowing it's a generalization) to deal with close personal deaths a little better on average.

Maybe Honesty is the Best Policy, but it's also quite unattractive because it involves a lot more work, and thinking, and being real. I think of some of the parents I know personally and I shudder, and understand better why their kids are being screwed up by the crap they're being fed to soothe their fears. These parents aren't soothing their kids, they're just making their own lives a little easier (since TV doesn't explain this stuff clearly or personally enough).

**all of the above is purely and completely subjective based on my personal set of experiences - no absolutes here, I hope**

[repentantsinner]

11/9/05


This would be ironic,eh? I DID MAKE A Mistake by posting a specific date. Most Bible codes say 2006 as do most prophets. If i'm not mistaken the 7 years 40 days formula works with all years. In the original post i did say that i don't have a "thus sayeth the lord" on the idea. It' weird, the winter solstice of Dec. 21 2012 will take place at exactly 11 :11 am universal time. Nice signature Cherisa.

[B.NyeTheUruk-Hai]

Didn't the Bible say that the world would end at the turn of the millennium? What's up with that? << said with best Jerry Seinfeld voice >> And didn't hyperqube say that the Bible predicted that Natalie Holloway would be found on August 14-16? Sup wid dat? As is typical with these Bible "predictions", nothing happens and then the "predicters" (is that a word?) hope and count on people simply forgetting that nothing happened and it gets conveniently swept under the carpet. How many times are things NOT going to happen before you guys realize that nothing ever WILL happen? Here's a prediction from ME that WILL come true, guaranteed. Many, many, MANY dates of the apocalypse will be predicted and will come and go without so much as a whimper. Put THAT in your pipe and smoke it!

[repentantsinner]

Didn't the Bible say that the world would end at the turn of the millennium? What's up with that? << said with best Jerry Seinfeld voice >> And didn't hyperqube say that the Bible predicted that Natalie Holloway would be found on August 14-16? Sup wid dat? As is typical with these Bible "predictions", nothing happens and then the "predicters" (is that a word?) hope and count on people simply forgetting that nothing happened and it gets conveniently swept under the carpet. How many times are things NOT going to happen before you guys realize that nothing ever WILL happen? Here's a prediction from ME that WILL come true, guaranteed. Many, many, MANY dates of the apocalypse will be predicted and will come and go without so much as a whimper. Put THAT in your pipe and smoke it!First thessalonians 5 " Now concerning the times and the seasons, brothers and sisters you do not need to have anything written to you. For you yourselves know very well that the day of the LORD will come like a thief in the night. When they say "There is peace and security" then sudden destruction will come upon them, as labor pains come upon a pregnent women, and there will be no escape! But you , beloved are not in darkness for that day to surprise you like a thief. for you are children of the day...................that's what the Bible says..... :2thumbs:

[B.NyeTheUruk-Hai]

Wow... yet ANOTHER incredibly vague "prediction"... I truly am shocked... Is the Bible capable of actually saying SOMETHING rather than babbling on about nothing?

[repentantsinner]

Because of my respect for you as ahuman being B. Nye the Hurk i will truthfully say you've insulted what i believe to be the inspired word of an omnicient, all knowing all powerfull being who does not appreciate it. Although you may be blind to that fact i also believe at this point i should stop as you are further bringing bad karma on yourself and i will be no part of it. I will say this thread does not stir you has you have not been drawn to see 11:11 on the clock consistantly. Google 11:11 it's all over the place, it's so common they made a movie 11:11 the gate. We will never see eye to eye on this because it is about something you have not been called to be a part of.Maybe in the future. OK, thought i was finished but you weighed heavy on my mind.....so you want the bible to say "something"........"something" that applies directly to you b. nye the Hurk? You'll have to find a bible so it can say "something" directly to YOU. revelation12:9. I wont' answer anymore, to do so would only feed your...................karma.

[DarkAce]

True. My version of fathering - basically, the first time a kid breaks a rule, we sit down and carefully discuss why he shouldn't do that again, and the second time the kid breaks a rule, I bring down the fire. I don't know how much success that'll have, but to me it seems like the best method.


In theory it seems the best solution, but not all children comprehend/act the same way, different methods for different people. Have you personally ever raised a child?


And there we have what I consider to be a fine balance of brutal truth with a touch of fancifulness.


A lie is a lie regardless of what you want to call it. I tried explaining this earlier with regards of the severity of a 'lie'. When you say honesty, and being blunt would you of prefered if she had said "No he's dead and maggots are going to decompose his body and you'll end up the same way some day like the rest of us". Would you prefer that degree of honesty?


Others in my life haven't gone so far, but their reaction to close deaths have included the fall into substance abuse, child abuse, spousal abuse and general loss of joie de vivre.


If she was one to believe in Heaven, why would she commit suicide knowing that her sister was in a 'better place' now?

Furthermore:

Others in my life haven't gone so far, but their reaction to close deaths have included the fall into substance abuse, child abuse, spousal abuse and general loss of joie de vivre.


Has to be the most loosely based connection I've laid witness to today. The way one cope's with the passing of a loved one is based on their own emotional state and how they resolve problems. I don't think not being completly honest at times would be a major factor in this situation. Besides, what led to your own 'substance' abuse?

All in all it comes down to what the situation is and what's being said/not said. Because being honest can turn out to be just as, if not worst then being dishonest.

[nrj]

I just thinks he should get laid.

[Philosopher Foelhe]

Didn't the Bible say that the world would end at the turn of the millennium? What's up with that?

No, the bible didn't say that. Christians did. Let's just keep in mind that there's not a piece of literature on earth that can't be mangled and bent until it seems to show a pattern. Christians delight in doing this to the bible, which frankly would strike me as disrespectful if I was still part of the religion, but there ya go.

In short, blame the moronic followers, not the path.


For you yourselves know very well that the day of the LORD will come like a thief in the night.

RS, you quote this verse freely enough. Why don't you take it to heart? Don't you think that God would rather you live in the now than make guesses and predictions about the future? Why do you spend so much of your time waiting for the end?


In theory it seems the best solution, but not all children comprehend/act the same way, different methods for different people. Have you personally ever raised a child?

No. Well, not really. I've given some parents advice from time to time - nothing serious, but so far it seems to help rather than hurt, so that's a plus.

I know that there's no "perfect answer" for child rearing, and that my method may be flawed in practice. But then, kids have a tendancy to turn out the way they're going to. I'm sure we've all heard stories about kids who were raised in a horrible, abusive setting and basically clawed their way out and into a better life. On the flip side, we have kids raised with loving parents in a perfect setting who turn out abusive and cruel. Parenting is a shot in the dark, which is what makes it so damn frightening. I'm just saying, this is how I'd like to handle things.


When you say honesty, and being blunt would you of prefered if she had said "No he's dead and maggots are going to decompose his body and you'll end up the same way some day like the rest of us". Would you prefer that degree of honesty?

Okay, there's a big difference between a lie and tact. That's not just a degree of honesty - that's downright cruel. You can be tactful and still be completely honest.

Of course, if a parent doesn't have any tact, it might be best for them to lie about it. I guess I see your point there.

[Mezurashi]

I just thinks he should get laid.

hey, I resemble that remark...

[Philosopher Foelhe]

How, pray tell are you going to have kids? Oh I know there are plenty of ways to have kids if you''re gay, but I want to know precisly. Are you going to have your own are you going to adopt?

Oh. Well. At the moment I'd have to say adopt, since we've got way too many kids lost in the foster system who need to be taken care of, and I'd rather help solve that problem than go after the minor comfort of my children looking like me... but at the moment I don't really know for sure. We're talking pretty far into the future here.

[nrj]

You should try picking one up sometime, before they are abolished. And actually read it. Do you not think there might be something to all of this, since every whacked-out Jesus- worshiper is thinking the same thing. If I were a non-believer I would be EXTREMELY CURIOUS and would soon wonder what all the hooplah is about. But how come you don't read the Quran then? Or hell, why not read the runestones in Scandinavia and the scollars learnings and learn about asatrue? i mean, we had a whole shabloo we to, and might not that be true in that case?

[nrj]

I DID MAKE A Mistake by posting a specific date. Yes you did! They're ment to be symbolic crap you can play with and get what you want, not hard core fact! :nono:

[repentantsinner]

I just thinks he should get laid.I remember when i was an adolescent........................................ ...

[Mezurashi]

DA - the Lie I was told by my mother was the fanciful kind, the Truth she told me was that my Grandfather was DEAD - Not 'gone to heaven,' not 'Called up by God' but simply Dead. Though it's obvious our opinions vary, I would prefer basic truth without all the details (those are for the curious). basic truth is that a relative is Dead - details are irrelevant to a child.

Now, your questions about the responses of people in my life have shown me your one BIG problem, DA. You PROJECT onto others and JUDGE them by your standards of behaviour, moral imperative, whatever. I am not saying you HAVE to be empathic, but please, please, please remember that not everyone out in the world is as logical, balanced, emotionally self-sufficient and poweful as you are. The reactions of others should not be judged against your own guidelines as absolute, though saying, "I would never do stuff like this," is OK -- saying, "No one should do stuff like this because I wouldn't," is Projection.

Not trying to poke at you DA, just wanting to point out that aspect of your replies.

Now as to my loosely based connection, instead of writing out the years of stuff I dealt with in terms of specific individuals I simply summarized, assuming that others would follow my thread of thought ... my bad. Summarizing can be as badly handled as Assumption and I am very guilty of both errors in making statements.

But please note that I was speaking of people Reacting Badly because of their upbringing not preparing them for the death of close ones. This does relate in the connection dept. because the topic was early indoctrination into how we deal with extreme situations in life (death was just an example). I wasn't saying EVERYONE brought up with lies reacts like this, but A LOT of the people I KNOW who were have reacted like this.

And my own substance abuses are my own - not as an attempt to hide from reality but an active willingness to slow down my thinking so the world can relate to me. I prefer Pot to Prozac, thank you very much, and after years of people making up excuses for not being able to keep up with me I decided to slow down my thought processes. **This is NOT saying I am better in any way - just faster, which doesn't imply control, only speed**

and, in the end, I am just another screw up on the world's stage. My lines make less sense and my choreography is weird, but a player and cast member I am...

[nrj]

I remember when i was an adolescent........................................ ... Sadly though, I don't know what that word means in swedish, but I guess it was an insult...

[repentantsinner]

No insult nrj! Just memories of times past when my priorities were different.

[DarkAce]

Ah but Mez you asked for honesty, that would still technically not be complete honesty.

Kids are quite inquisitive and usually do ask a bunch of questions. Do you lead them down the path from basic truth to brutal honesty, or does that path shift from basic 'truth' towards 'fanciful' lies?

You're probably right about the theme of projecting in my posts, although this is often done to represent different perspective points and more or less to play devils advocate...

I did not deny that what you claimed about the people as not being true, I was trying to clarify to our viewers at home who aren't that great at comprehending that what you said wasn't true for every scenario and to remember all the factors that reside.

We're all screwed up to some degree, if we weren't, the world would be pretty bland, no? :)

[Philosopher Foelhe]

Kids are quite inquisitive and usually do ask a bunch of questions. Do you lead them down the path from basic truth to brutal honesty, or does that path shift from basic 'truth' towards 'fanciful' lies?

I guess that's the question of when opinion becomes lies. The way I look at it, saying "You're going to be rotting in the dirt one day" isn't true, just because I define myself as my sense of awareness, rather than my body. And your sense of awareness is going to be gone by then.

I think you can honestly say, "Well, some people think we go to another place, where everything is wonderful, but no one really knows." Unless you're a die-hard atheist who refuses to believe there could be an afterlife, in which case sucks to be you. (Oh, I'm just KIDDING.)


We're all screwed up to some degree, if we weren't, the world would be pretty bland, no?

Y'know, I have a friend who, when she's losing an argument or wants to change the subject, grins and says, "You're just jealous because my childhood trauma is better than your childhood trauma."

[Mezurashi]

Y'know, I have a friend who, when she's losing an argument or wants to change the subject, grins and says, "You're just jealous because my childhood trauma is better than your childhood trauma."

rofl, this made me 'spit take' my cofffee. It reminded me of one of the loudest public arguments I ever had with a friend - one of those, "you're better than I am!" "NO! You're Better than I Am!" debates with each of us trying to downplay our respective 'superiority' by boosting the other up onto a pedestal. She was trying to tell me I was a creative genius, I was trying to tell her the same thing. We ended up arguing our way into bed ... ahh the memories (big, shameless grin).

Truth is relative to the situation - not all corpses rot and become slimey worm food, though that is the usual fate. To tell a child that stuff right out is wrong, but if the Child keeps asking, "What happens?" or "Why?" then I believe the gross, ugly truth can be handled with euphemism that doesn't detract from the Truth;

"Where did Grandpa go?"
"Grandpa died, hon. He got old and it was time for him to go."
"Where did he go?"
"We're not sure, exactly. Maybe heaven, maybe to another universe, maybe he's just watching us and maybe he's become an alien in another reality."
"Why did Grandpa have to die?"
"Because he was old, and everyone gets old and someday we all die. But that someday isn't for a long long time."
"Did Grandpa do something bad?"
"No, but he was old enough that it was his time to go, that's all."
"What happens to Grandpa's Body?"
"He wanted us to cremate it, that's turn it into ashes, and to scatter the ashes the next time we go on vacation."
"Why did Grandpa want us to do that?"
"Because Grandpa didn't want to become worm food like we did to Grandma."
"What's worm food?"
"Here, have some Nyquil..."

**joking, joking, trying to be humourous early in the morn...**

[B.NyeTheUruk-Hai]

"Here, have some Nyquil..."
**joking, joking, trying to be humourous early in the morn...**
LOL!!! Morning humour is ALWAYS welcome, Mez! Heh heh... Nyquil...

[nrj]

Did this thread just die, or did it just become silly?

[Philosopher Foelhe]

Hard to say, but I think it's just gotten silly. It's been meandering like a drunken toddler for awhile now, but it's still going.