Nuclear Weapons: Our path to Destruction

[armageddononline]

I think that all nations should disarm their nuclear warheads. Any number of accidents or mistakes could lead to all out nuclear war that would probably kill everyone on the planet. Nuclear weapons mean that every US citizen is being held hostage by the Russian government, and vice versa.

[mike ross]

lets face it,
NO one is going to disarm all of their nukes.
the grim thought of nuclear war is what is keeping the superpowers at bay.
think of this

[CASHEWBOOO22YAHOOCOM]

Check your bible's my friend's,it's in there.Rev.ch.9,v.16.The prophecy of the 200 million man army that WILL trigger a war that WILL KILL 2 billion people,it even tells us which country can boast or even field an army of that size!Any guesses???CHINA.China will be the one to start this tragic event.Check it,it even tells us the color of their uniforms.Blue,red and yellow.So with all due respect to you Mr. Mike Ross,the only thing keeping nuclear war at bay is your creator,Jesus Christ.It's His timeclock we're all living on.I didn't come to this web site to preach,only to infect truth,because I care.May God bless you all,thanks.

[armageddononline]

I'd agree that nuclear weapons have helped keep the peace, and the fulll disarmament is not likely in the near future, but it must happen or eventually we will destroy ourselves.

The idea of keeping peace by threatening destruction is a flawed argument, as non-nuclear wars are infinitely less destructive. I would prefer wars that would occur withour nukes to the constant threat of extinction.

As for Jesus controlling nuclear war, I put that hypothosis forward in my article on Biblical prophecies. Presonally I don't believe it is likely - why would God kill us all?

[theylive]

bible has been proven to have been tampered with many times some of it is still good though. The stars shall fall might be one or a few nukes comming down but who knows? The mark of the beast fits INto (not on!)the right hand and forhead and those places have been found to be the best for the placement according to the inventers. Its a barcode sin # ID and "nothing shall be bought sold or traded without the mark of the beast"(( the barcode)) all have 666 on them! definatly no coincidence). About the army the un already has a huge army of trauma mindcontrolled slaves to enforce the One .W.orld .O.rder government through martial law. So you might be on to something there atleast in part. There are many many reports even sites of camps with ovens and barbed wire around them. Made for resisters of this N.W.O. RISIST THE DIGITAL ANGEL HAND CHIP, ITS OUR LAST HOPE OF FREEDOM!

[willnetta]

I really do think that the thing the usda has recently said, "IS OK" because they "AREN'T UNDER OUR JURISDICTION TO APPROVE OR DISAPPROVE" COULD be the MARK OF THE BEAST....anyway, I AM NOT LETTING anyone put anything IN ME>>>ANYWHERE>>>I BELONG TO GOD>>>NOT THIS WORLD>>>AND I am just waiting for HIm to come back to take US ALL up to HIM IN the RAPTURE!!! AMEN???

and to the reply that the stars falling to earth could mean nukes...falling..yes it could...or as the BIBLE says SUN AND MOON falls..gets dark? could ALL just mean that the smoke is so great from the volcanoies erupting and all the fighting (including nukes) makes so much smoke and dust etc..that we think they have all fallen...

WHEN JESUS is here on earth and we are reigning with HIM, remember we won't need the sun's light or the moons's light...as the BIBLE SAYS"JESUS LIGHT IS ALL WE WILL NEED" doesn't mean that they aren't still there...just maybe HIS light outshines them all..and what happens when you shine a BRIGHTER light on a regular LIGHT??? exactly..you think the smaller light isn't there anymore...REMEMBER>>>GOD IS IN CHARGE OF ALL OF THIS AND HE ISN't GOING TO DO ANYTHING AGAINST HIS CHILDREN (US)!!! AMEN?

LOVE YOU ALL
IN THE LORD !!!

wills

[Timothy Leary]

Hold it i am confused. You say Jesus Christ is the creator? I thought we were Created by his Father and that he was our Savior. You say you speak the truth,,, to bad you don't know what you are talking about!!!!

[Rafael]

That planet will pass us ,causing a 5000ft tidal wave ...then the super valcano will go off ....setting off all the nucluer weapons !

Come on you nerds .....God is in control . If he wants us dead there is nothing you can do about it .

Man this is a joke ....a quick way to make a buck ...just buy my book and you too can survive . Listen ...if all this happens we all will be dead won't we?

RF-

[SHIMRI]

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The fact of the matter is we are now currenly living in the last days of this "system of things" as Christ spoke of, in fact it started in the year 1914 when WW1 came about- alot that was spoken as prophecy concerning the time of the end is in the book of daniel & revelations- it is not meant to scare anyone, in fact those who follow the creators commands or at least try to do so may survive the Great Tribulation and then Armageddon- To clue some of you in Armageddon is a war between God and wicked mankind & his political systems. Even Christ did not know the day or the hour as he stated. Only his father does. I find it quite odd because i see people speaking of God, which God are you talking about, obviously the one in the old & new testament, but he has a personal name-

i can give you a breif glimpse as to what will happen on the very near future-
i believe it was John who stated there were 2 more governments or kings that would pass before the end would come and he was currently living in the 6th world government or king-kingdom. they list as
1 EGYPT/2 ASSYRIA/3 BABYLON/4 MEDO-PERSIA/5 GREECE/6 ROME/7 ANGLO AMERICA/8 THE UN
john spoke in revelations how 5 world powers had already fallen off and he was living in the 6th and one more was to come which is the Anglo American system or kingdom- then the 8th king or world government that would spring from the previous 7 world governements. ala UNITED NATIONS, then the end would come.

All Religion will be banned world wide, hard concept to believe but just wait it will come soon, The United Nations will take over as a world government- they will not be able to keep the peace as they intend and they "the UN" will go after God's appointed people because they "god's true followers/true christians" will not back down to any government when it is in direct opposition to the creators laws. Then God will enact judgement over the earth, what could armageddon be? well it is suppose to pail in comparrision to the Deluge {the flood}. but it will not be a world wide flood. Something man has never witnessed, but people will know it is god and they will cry for mercy but by then it will be to late-

what does Christian mean? it means to be an imitator of Christs teachings or examples he set for us to follow- examples like- LOVE YOUR ENEMIES - he never said kill your enemies or even criticize them because most people learn from examples.
- so a true Christian would not take part in any sort of war or military. as to note Christs words the night before his death as he was taken away by the Pharisees
"Peter, put back your sword, for those who live by the sword will persish by the sword"

on another note there is a passge in the bible that states "the earth will stand to time indefinite", it was not created for nothing, in fact the creators true purpose for the earth was never completed because Adam & Eve screwed up by an act of disobiedience- the purpose was to make te whole Earth into a paradise state, so it will be completed after the battle of Armageddon-

then there is the ressurrection- both good and bad people will be resurrected- i will state that i am not a christain because i do not always follow christs examples willingly but i believe there is one true religion- and you cannot say christianity in general is the true religion, because there are many so called christian factions that believe a number of different things and follow alot of pagan beliefs & teachings-

i find it quite funny because i never hear people speak of the resurrection, it was an act that happened 7 times in the bible. and of all of those accounts, not one of those people ever mentions of ever going to heaven, not Lazurus & not even Christ. If they did, do you not think they would speak of their accounts of this? Where did Christ go when he died? not heaven, he ascended there sometime after his ressurection.

I know im getting off the subject about the end of this system of things or Armageddon- but there is only one religion i know of that truely does as Christ commanded of his apostles.

For much of my life i was agnostic and out to disprove christianity because i found alot of faults from its teachers until well, th ones who had it right found me, because they are the only religion who had an answer or logical explanation for all of my questions.

The apostles and first century christians were commanded to go out and make a witness to all nations by systematically going from city to city and door to door preaching the teaching of Christ. What religion does this today you may ask? think about it, they are the ones that you usually see as fanatical because they tend to bother you by waking you up on Saturday or Sunday mornings by knocking on your door.
Crazy as it may sound, in all my life trying to disprove religion, the Jehovah's Wtnesses were the only ones who i could not stump.

Most people do not know that they were the only religion not to back down to the Nazi regime due to their bible trained conscience and knowledge of the scriptures.
I even knew this as an agnostic that they were the only religion not to back down to Hitler in fact they were used as an exapmle for the SS military, in that the SS had to have the same unshakable faith in their socialist movement as the then known "International Bible students"had in Jehovah God, if you do not believe me then goto the HOLOCAUST MEMORIAL MUSEUM IN WASHINGTON DC, thisis a well documented fact-
in fact most people do not know that the Jehovah's witnesses were the first since 1933 to warn the world of the concentration camps, with diagrams of some of the camps as well, which were printed in their publications, like the ones you may see from time to time like the Watchtower and Awake, they even warned the American government of the atrocities but it fell on deaf ear because most people veiw them as fanatics, but it was not until 1945 that the concentration camps were exposed by the media or government. sounds crazy huh but very true-

in fact they were the first religion to be persecuted in the united states, and thrown in prison due to their religious beliefs, this was around world war 1, when they refused military service- you cannot serve 2 gods meaning you cannot bear alligeance to a world goverment and god simultaneously, god does not work that way- in fact the WITNESS'S have won more supreme court battles than any other religion hands down & had laws passed by the supreme court preserving everyones first amendment rights, everyones, even non believers, or athiests. do not believe me research it yourself in the supreme courts database of laws tht are on the books preserving your first amendment rights

previously mentioned the creator has a name, in English it is Jehovah, i do not speak Hebrew or aramaic so i do not use that translation. Just like Jesus is the English rendering, Jesus is not a name in Hebrew or Aramaic.

and like i saw in another post , yes Christ is the son of God "the word", not God, like a god compared to man, but not God the almighty.

ok now for the whole 666 deal, the number 7 when used in the bible is a sign or rendering for perfection or completeness/wholeness, well its simple 6 is a step down from that- being imperfection, everyone is imperfect-
so 666 is like magnifying that, its like making a big statement about imperfection
here this is from the book of revelations
LET THE ONE WHO HAS INTELLIGENCE CALCULATE THE NUMBER OF THE WILD BEAST, FOR IT IS MANS NUMBER AND IT IS 666
notice how it says it is MAN's number. so i would guess where it says in the bible you will be known on account of my name, concerning the end, a true follower of Chirsts teaching will never deny Jehovah god or his laws even if it means a prison sentence, { which by the way happened to several of the aposteles} giving up their lives {temporarily that is}-

here is another example Jesus put forth when he said the lords prayer, by the way that was an example he was using, god does not want repetitive prayers, he does not want us to be like robots, he wants us to speak to him from our hearts, but when Jesus said that prayer, he said "HALLOWED BY THY NAME" who's name?
think about it- he did not say hallowed by my name.

but anways there is a reason why the scriptures say "stay awake" they mean spiritually awake- beacsue there will soon come a time when the USA hands over it reigns to the UN- this is a sign that the end is soon to come, and religion will also be banned, only the Jehoavhs witnesses have made these claims and have for a long time- so when it happens you will know what is going on.


"Beware the leader who bangs the drums of war in order to whip the citizenry into a patriotic fervor, for patriotism is indeed a double-edged sword. It both emboldens the blood, just as it narrows the mind.
And when the drums of war have reached a fever pitch and the blood boils with hate and the mind has closed, the leader will have no need in seizing the rights of the citizenry. Rather, the citizenry, infused with fear and blinded by patriotism, will offer up all of their rights unto the leader and gladly so.
How do I know? For this is what I have done. And I am Caesar." -- Julius Caesar


The idea that there is one people in possession of the truth, one answer to the world’s ills or one solution to humanity’s needs has done untold harm throughout history." - Kofi Annan UN secretary general



here is an exaple of a true christian, you realise when you read the statement he could have easily just gave in, but his faith is stronger than any government

Kurban Zakirov

Nationality:
Turkmen

Date of birth:
1980

Place of residence:
Chärjew

Religion:
Jehovah's Witness since June 1997

Sentence:
Imprisoned on April 23, 1999, and sentenced on May 25, 1999, to one year in minimum-security corrective labor colony (ITKOR) for conscientious objection to military service. In December 1999, he was granted a pardon but was not released because he refused to give the oath. In spring 2000, when he had completed his sentence, he was still not released but was transferred to another unit. That was because a condition of release for prisoners is to place their hand on the Koran and give an oath of loyalty to the President and the State. Kurban refused to do this. When Kurban should have been released, one officer, in the presence of others, ripped off his shoulder strap and said that Kurban attacked him. Immediately a protocol was made on him, and he was sentenced again on the charge of attacking the security service. The court determined the term of punishment: eight years in a high-security corrective labor colony (ITKSR) in the city of Chärjew. Now he has been transferred to a "special" regime (the strictest one, where, for example, he does not even have the right to go for a walk).


the end draws near- what ever it is - it will be supernatural- and there will be so many dead bodies on the earth that the birds will have to help do all the clean up- its in the book of revelations and also where hitch-%--%--%--%- got his idea for the movie of the same name "the birds" but to really speculate is no significance because what ever happens, it will happen without warning, on an ordinary day- like i believe the flood actually fell on a tuesday, how is that haha

[AvengingAngels]

What is going on here!! y is religion so much a part of this!??!!! Let's face it, humans haven't really evolved, we still enjoy boxing/wrestling. That's basically mindless violence, or seeing who is more physically strong than others! We are all driven by the same survival instinct and the same temptation that corrupts. all throught history, people (especially people in power) tend to become corrupted! we are always greedy, and looking for more, lustful, lookin for pleasure of the flesh and etc. etc........ so, if wars can be created, all we haf to do is to wait till technology is good enough to be created to cause humanity to destroy itself. Many predict that actually, if aliens are like us, no one will ever find another intelligent life form (unless a saviour comes, he/she may be religious or not) we will continue blowing ourselves up b4 we reach that stage......

[Conrad]

ADM/SADM
Atomic Demolition Munition/Special Atomic Demolition Munition
Backpack-sized nuclear weapons designed and intended for special forces teams to locate at strategic targets, e.g. bridges, dams, airports, motorway junctions. Variable yield 0.15kt to 0.05kt (i.e. 150 to 50 tons TNT)

What you ought to worry about are radiological weapons, which can be constructed by your average terrorist; unlike nuclear weapons, which need a physics graduate at the very least.

[Obssesd Nuker]

America didnt bully Britian! America arent devils! And if RUSSIA had never spied on us then the Cold War would have never started! And if America didnt enter the war YOU would be speaking German too.

[username]

Jun. 8, 2002
Arafat threatens 'disastrous explosion'
By THE JERUSALEM POST STAFF

In a speech broadcast today, Palestinian Authority Chairman Yasser Arafat threatened that if Israel does not retreat from PA-ruled areas that there will be a "disastrous explosion that will impact stability of the whole world."

According to the Palestinian Authority's official news agency WAFA, in an address broadcast in Spain to an awards ceremony honoring EU Middle East envoy Miguel Moratinos, Arafat claimed that "the situation in Palestine is at the edge of explosion."

Arafat warned that if Israel does not withdraw from Palestinian held territory immediately, "enabling our people to practice their legitimate rights of establishing the independent Palestinian state with Jerusalem as its capital, the whole region will witness a disastrous explosion that will impact not only the region but the stability of the whole world."

[KosonaX]

I believe that having a large amount of Nuclear Weapons at one time is a very dangerous thing, but, both sides having this large amount of weaponry maintains a tense, but steady peace.
Let me explain this. Mutual Assured Destruction is based on the theory that if two sides (A and B, for example) have a large amount of weapons of mass destruction (Nuclear Weapons), then, it would not matter who fired first or not, both sides would be eliminated. Fear of M.A.D. maintains the Balance Of Power.
If A were to disarm themselves completely, then A would not have the capability to destroy B, thus, B would be the main power, and the Balance of Power would no longer exist. Thus, B, most likely seizing the opportunity, would use Nuclear Weapons against A, knowing that A cannot respond in kind.

[Obssesd Nuker]

Okay listen here launnching even one Nuke at foriegn territory(enemy or not) will be enough for the largetest diplomatic breakdown youve ever seen. In other words ALL(except VERY loyal allys countries with nuclear capabilities will side with the attacked countries and will return fire with the attacked countrie.So lets say we are in the same sicturation you described BUT this time Lets say side C also has a large amount of Nukes But dosnt remains neutral. Now agian lets say side A disarms its nukes and B destroys it this will cause SUCH a uproar among the civillian Population of side C tahat its leader (the one that presses the button iin the first place) will be forced to luanch.WHEW!

[Zargon]

On the subject of Nukes (which is this boards topic), some thoughts. I will get round to relevant observations, but first...

With reference to Mr Obssessed Nuker's (which, by the way, is a somewhat disturbing alias) posting (made in response to someone else) I thought I'd work around to the subject of Nukes by way of a slightly broader exploration of WWII history.

Q: Did we need the US in WWII to win the war?

Before D-day Russia was already doing rather well against the Nazis. By this time they had built up vast, well trained armies and had made significant gains. It could be argued that the threat of an invasion in the West (with US forces) tied up several German armies on the Western front, but, I don't think that would have been enough to stem the Russian advances.

Hitler had possibly already sown the seeds of his final defeat by losing the Battle of Britain. With England refusing to sue for peace (or join up with the Nazis), this left a permanent need for significant forces to secure the German position in the West, whilst he embarked on the long planned war against Russia in the East (which Stalin was expecting, long since).

US involvement WAS very significant. It made it possible for a successful invasion of France to take place. Without US forces (not just military aid) the chances of a successful British cross-channel invasion would have been minimal. The bombing of the German industrial heartland by USAAF daylight bombing raids was another significant contribution that degraded the German military complex, thus impairing the Nazi ability to fight.

MOST interesting and possibly telling (although I think the Russians weren't far off - not sure of that) was that it was US forces that captured Peenemunde and grabbed German V rocket technology (which by the way they refused to share with their allies). This might have been the most significant thing achieved by the US in the war. Had there been no invasion of France the V weapon research sites could have been relocated away from the Russian front lines giving enough time for development of the V3 - intercontinental version.

Lets not forget that other little bit of technology that the Nazis were close to acquiring - Nuclear weapons!
As with the V weapons, had the invasion of France not occurred.....we could have had a situation where the Red Army were knocking on the Reichstag doors whilst Nazi controlled scientists were uniting V3 rockets and Nuclear warheads in a base in Southern France perhaps!!

Once again, it was the US that benefitted from the war(technologically) and shared not with it's allies.

Conclusion: Hmmmm. I'd say that it's a bloody good thing the US joined the war. It's possible that Russia & Britain might have been enough, but, if they had been it's a pretty safe but that Europe would be speaking Russian and that the Russians would have got some of that technology. Even then I'd imagine that some of the scientists would have escaped to Britain and from there probably to the US.

An aside (to Mr Obssessive Nuker): The cold war had nothing to do with Russians spying on the US!
It was an almost natural political condition brought about by two fundamentally different philosophies at odds with one another; Capitalism & Communism. There's not a lot of ground for agreement with these two so you sort of have to divide the world into us & them. Since side 'a' believes it's philosphy is 'good' it naturally wants all the other countries of the world to believe also. Oh dear, side 'b' thinks that it is the good guy. Whoops.

Now then, Nukes.
1) They are bloody dangerous, ie destructive.
2) They are proliferating.
3) Rogue owners could well appear any day now. Many have gone missing from former Soviet central Asian states. Who knows where they've gone.
4) Noone who has them is going to get rid of them completely under currently existing World circumstances. "He's got 'em and I don't trust him as far as... I'm keeping mine". They are perceived as a deterrent. The 'deterrent scenario' has worked pretty well so far. The only use of Nukes was against an enemy without them (no retaliation possible).
- PLEASE, noone jump on the old, "That was a crime, blah, blah". I happen to think that their use against Japan stopped the war at a saving of countless lives (US & Japanese) that could have been lost if the US had needed to launch an invasion of Japan and the Japanese resisted as they had done so far in the war, ie suicidally. Against Nukes they new they'd lost and surrendered. One 'good' thing did come out of their use, we learnt of the terrible aftermath of that use. This may have been the single biggest contributory factor to their non use in the intervening period since.

Final observation:
Ownership of Nukes has so far been demonstratably safe (noone has used them).
The problem with Nukes lies not with the weapons themselves, but with the owners.
The owners have to be responsible. Wait a minute. If all the owners were responsible....they'd throw all the Nukes away wouldn't they?
Maybe so if there weren't another problem - the political situation that owners find themselves in. This can create enormous pressure to, a) own, b) use, Nukes!

A recent example: India/Pakistan.
1) Both have developed/acquired Nukes and delivery systems.
2) They have been at loggerheads for decades over a situation for which there is no 'realistic' solution - Kashmir/Religion (until people grow up and learn to allow people to be different and co-exist harmoniously side by side).
3) It gets worse. These two Nations live side by side - 2 minutes by missile. In the old cold war it took 30+ minutes from US-USSR. If one of these modern day antagonists has a radar blip and thinks it is an incoming missile they have no time to do anything but, perhaps, react!!
4) On top of that the leaders of India/Pakistan have no equivalent of the hot-line that US/USSR had (have).
5) Control of Nukes is down to a multitude of local commanders, not the centralised command & control of US/USSR. What if one of these Commanders goes nuts one day (eg hears that his brother has been killed by a bomb blamed on the other side's supporters) and launches.
6) Both sides have used the situation to stoke up nationalistic fervour, possibly to gain political support for the leaders. Elections (Pakistan has in October '02)
7) IGNORANCE. Vast countries with multitudes of people. Huge numbers of uneducated people. People who have NO IDEA WHAT A NUKE IS! Really! Most of the populace of Ind/Pak think that Nukes are just really BIG bombs. They have no idea of the consequences of their use, en masse. I know many people who have been in both countries in the last few months, have talked to the people, and know this to be true.

Let's just hope that the leaders know!!

CONCLUSION:
Once Pandora's box was opened there was no turning back. We will never get rid of the mass ownership of Nukes by the 'Superpowers' because, so far, they do seem to have a value as a deterrent. One can't do anything about madmen so they don't really enter into the equation.
Until such time as,
a) someone develops an 'atomic reaction suppressor field' (and hopefully gives it to the world),
b) the human race matures (en masse),

Nukes are with us to stay.

[armageddononline]

Sorry but I am going to 'jump on the old, "That was a crime, blah, blah"'. The use of nukes against Japan WAS a crime. 150,000 civilians immediately burnt to death and countless more from cancer etc. Today, people are appalled if a stray bomb kills 50 civilians in Afghanistan. By that stage America had enough of an advantage to be certain of winning the war, it simply speeded it up.

Your point about it showing how destructive nukes are is a good one, but why not destroy an uninhabited island, or give the Japanese warning to evacuate the cities?

You say nuclear weapons are certain to maintain the peace until someone develops an 'atomic reaction suppressor field'. Or perhaps SDI, Star Wars? I think the US is now quite close to completing it's development. It would leave the US able to nuke other countries at will, without risk of deterrent. Obviously we hope they wouldn't do that, but it destroys the balance of power and MAD, everything that you say has kept the peace for the last 50 years.

Nukes are here to stay with us, but their ability to keep the peace has been seriously diminished by Star Wars and the possibility of 'rogue states'/terrorists acquiring them.

[Zargon]

Thanks 'Arm'.
I didn't have time yesterday to post all I might have liked to say so abbreviated slightly.

If you check what I wrote you will see that I was not actually saying it was not a crime to nuke Japan, it was just that I didn't want to provoke discussion of whether it was or not - since that is not the focus of this forum. Of course I did then sort of unintentionally invite a response by continuing to comment.
As far as evecuating the cities or some other such demonstration, yup, they could have warned the Japanese, and demonstrated that surrender was in order. Bad Americans!
My point about it being 'good' (and I don't mean that the suffering caused was good) was that the people of the Earth saw what the effects of nukes on human population were. The horrendous, long term, effects. Knowing that a full nuclear exchange would have such awful consequences, possibly worldwide, for generations (at least) to come may have contributed to nuclear non-use.
SDI/Star Wars: No. Not in the same class as 'my' ARSF. The purely Sci-Fi ARSF (so far) would completely prevent a nuclear explosion within an area.
I did point out that I hoped it would be 'given to everyone' in the event of it's invention. I am well aware of the imbalancing implications inherent in only one Superpower acquiring such an edge. And the temptation to use nukes whilst such an advantage existed.
'Star Wars' & SDI might protect against missile strikes but they still wouldn't protect against things like suitcase nukes.
At the moment my postulated 'Atomic reaction suppressor field' is only Sci-Fi.
In the event that the US (for arguments sake) develops SDI, I would hope that they would be intelligent enough to know that any such use of nukes by them (without fear of retaliation) would almost certainly create such a huge degree of ill will throughout the rest of the World (including allies of the US), toward the US, that such a use of weapons would never occur. Against the united public opinion of the World even the US would (I hope) bow.
Use of nukes on a one sided basis would probably provoke a response that would make the 'War against Terrorism' (ie 9/11) trivial by comparison. The level of mistrust and hatred spawned by such an act (nuke use) is, frankly incalculable.
In the event the US acquires SDI, one might expect the US to be warned of the consequences should they ever do such a thing (ie launch a nuclear strike). Warned by the UN perhaps/hopefully.

Once again my time runs short.
:)

[armageddononline]

Sorry, should have read what you said about Japan more carefully.

I suppose it is virtually inevitable that nukes will fall into the hands of the 'wrong' people. As more countries have nuclear programs the knowledge will become more freely available. An SDI system would stop missiles, but, as you point out, not suitcase nukes. I assume (hope) that it is quite difficult to get a suitcase nuke into America but if America can't stop drugs getting in it probably can't stop nukes. It did, however, find that 'dirty bomb' Al Qaeda was apparently sending to Washington. Until we get your ARSF then we'd better either:

1) Go round every country in the world blowing everyone who dislikes us up or...
2) Find out why they are prepared to kill themselves to hurt America.

As for America bowing to the weight of worldwide public opinion, remember Kyoto? It really would not surprise me if America used nuclear weapons if it thought it would further it's own interests, e.g. killing Bin Laden. If anyone trusts Dubya with the safety of the rest of the world, let me know.

And if America did develop this ARSF it is just as likely to share it with everyone as it is with Star Wars. Not at all.

[Obssesd Nuker]

The U.S NEVER had acces to the V-1s V-2s or V-3s!

BUT WHATS THIS!!??? In the missile section of a book about the weopans the soviets possesd(after reading the American ones) during the cold war.... V1s! And V-2s on RUSSIAN SCUDS and information about it!!!!

Plus Have you ever written a thread in an offtopics forum which is titled :| ( Soviet Power Supreme?

Oh and in the Japanese thing- Japenese men fight to the death. So which is better? Killing EVERY SINGLE Japenese men on the Island? or just destroying one or two cities?

[armageddononline]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but the US space progrm was a direct descendant of the German V1/2 program, using much of the same scientists and technology.

Looks like you did start a debate about Japan :( . I,m sorry Obsessed Nuker but burning 150,000 civilians of a virtually defeated country is not justifiable in any circumstanes. And if the Jpanese were as suicidal as you claim, they wouldn't have surrendered after any number of nukes. America would have to just invade anyway or kill them all.

[Zargon]

Toward the end of WWII, as the Red Army approached Peenemunde (the V1, 2, 3) research site, Werner Von Braun and about 40 other scientists fled West, away from the Russians, and surrendered to US forces.
The Russians captured some rockets at Peenemunde and the Western allies had the scientists. We also had unexploded missiles that landed on London and I think a few rockets that were captured further West (from launch sites away from Peenemunde).
So, both US & USSR had access to V weapons/technology.
Von Braun then went on to be instrumental in the development of missiles/rockets in the US. The Soviet missile programme was advanced thereafter because of what they captured at Peenemunde.

No, I've never written anything on the web before.

Japan: It's obviously better to just destroy the 2 cities. 'Arm's' point though is that was it really necessary to do 'even' that.
I made the point (rephrasing/expanding); Using Nukes on Hiroshima and Nagasaki was perceived, by the US, to be a necessary (evil) military action that would save more lives than it cost. The alternative seemed to be a long drawn out war that would involve the loss of an unknown number of Japanese AND American lives whilst the conquest of the remaining Japanese held islands was undertaken.
It was thought that the Japanese would fight to the death; 'To the bitter end'; 'No surrender', etc, hence the high casualty expectations and the decision to Nuke.
The use of nukes convinced the Japanese to surrender.

Arm's point; The US could have demonstrated their new toy without vapourising 150,000 Japanese civilians.

Incidentally, I have heard suggestions that there was a growing movement to surrender even before the Nukes were used. The decision to use might have been made because the US military wanted to try them - possibly so that they would have a chance to find out what the long term effects would be of such a weapon on a human population centre.
True or not I don't know.
Cynical of me? No, just something I've heard.
Do I believe it? Hmmm, neutral. I can believe Humans capable of...!!!
Anti-US propaganda? Well, an American would probably say so. I'm not anti. Keep an open mind. Not all Americans are Good. They aren't all bad either.


That, hopefully, is the last I will be saying on this subject until someone else posts something interesting enough to prompt a response/comment.
Ciao
|l

[pooeater2]

In the Bible it states that jesus was with the creator in the beginning. It also states that jesus is the creator. Yes, jesus is god and god is jesus. the holy spirit and god and jesus are all the same, but are all seperate, hence the term trinity. I hope I have helped to clarify this. THE END IS NEAR! REPENT!

[pooeater2]

Why are you lifting up your religion? Shouldn't you be lifting up the one who died for you? The people who seek after the lord with their whole hearts will be the ones to survive until and through his coming. Aren't the ones who seek Jesus with their whole hearts the ones that will survive until the end. It is not by following some stupid religion that gets us to heaven it is believing in the one who created and died for us. I just ask you to throw away your stupid religion and follow Jesus with your whole heart mind and strength. He says that you should love the lord with your whole soul mind and strength. By putting your faith in your religion you are cheapening the awesome plans he has for you. Do you want religion or do you want jesus? It is up to you. You can't have both. By seeking god with all that you are you forfeit religion because following jesus is much more important than stupid religious beliefs taught by men. The bible and jesus himself are the only guidance you need. You don't need religion. In fact Jesus told the disciples to drop your nets and follow me. I will make you fishers of men. Nowhere in this statement does it mention religion. JESUS LOVES EACH AND EVERY ONE OF US AND HE JUST WANTS TO KNOW US AS A FRIEN<AS A FATHER. DON'T WATER DOWN YOUR FAITH JUST SEEK HIM. HE IS ALL YOUR EVER NEED. "I WILL NEVER LEAVE YOU OR FORSAKE YOU.' -JESUS

[pooeater2]

A "savior" will come and his name is Lucifer.

[Obssesd Nuker]

You made no sense in your last post

[Nine]

I think they should launch 'em.

[Obssesd Nuker]

Lets just face it if any of this happens it will happen I just say lets live or life to the full right know

[Zuislide]

SHIMRI and Zargon concrats for excellent posts, ive really enjoyed reading at em (hmmp except its 5:03 in the morning and ive been studying this page since then and im supposed to go to school tomorrow)

[Kaelis Ra]

this thread seems to cover some very lagre topics. has anyone realised that nearly every post in this thread was made by a different person (user anyway) and nearly all have religious themes? why the religious stuff? were talking about nukes-were does all this supposed "God is the all mighty creator" come into this? honestly, scrap anything that alegidly comes from the bible, nuclear weapons are a current topic, so how can any of this have anything to do with the bible?


back on topic-which countries do you reckon have nukes and don't declare it? and do you think the number that thay declare is the right one?

on the whole japanese thing- america wanted to end the war as soon as possible, they were losing resourses. they could either lose more resourses or they could end it all by using a nuke. america being america im not surprised wich choice they chose. it was a move to show it's strength. they like to be the most powerful country on earth. they come in- we have nukes...you do what we say. if you read up on america during the war you see they aren't the perfect country they would have you believe. but hay, no bodies perfect i guess.

[armageddononline]

Israel is the only country known to have nuclear weapons but doesn't declare it. People also suspect that North Korea does. Iraq had an advanced nuclear program but this was destryedit the Gulf war. Other dangerous countries, such as Libya and Iran are thought not to have the resources for a nuclear program.

Full details on this at: armageddononline.tripod.com/nuclear.htm (http://armageddononline.tripod.com/nuclear.htm)

[Kaelis Ra]

are you sure on the israel thing? i might include that in my assignment...

[Chrisandrehenry]

Suuuuuuuurreee....
China....
The only country that has not participated in an invasion.
If you mention Tibet you should look at the maps...
1911 Tibet was still part of China.
Besides...there is Israel right.
Well...
Those 200 million men are the soldiers of the four angels sent down to punish the earth.
Hmmmm....
China a celestial army...
I bet that raises the ego of any chinese person...hehehe
Also...China has been the only nation not to start a war.
Besides...according to Daniel there will be 10 nations by the end of days...
And seven will be with the antichrist.
And China has never figured among them...
The other three where said to be China, Latin America and South-east Asia.
Areas with a defensive nature and philosophy...
Why do you think they built the great wall?
Besides...
Instead of trying to figure out all this you should pay more attention to more important things like the teachings of Christ...
You should worry about your own life and the lives of others...
Not about "events".
So...
Let it be...
It will happen as it will...
Knowing it or not will not change anything...
Trying to be a better person every day is a more worthy goal.

[Kaelis Ra]

"Instead of trying to figure out all this you should pay more attention to more important things like the teachings of Christ...'
Ohh quick, everyone we must listen to this guy! he sounds like a nutter. everyone we must all become christian because he said so!
God i hate that! this topic is titled Nuclear weapons. were does religon of any sort come into this?!

(PS has anyone noticed that ALL wars can be traced back to religon? if there was a god, would he/she like this fact? theres one ofr all you religious *#$%& on this site!)

[armageddononline]

Yeah I had noticed that but someone told me a totally unreligous war. Unfortunately I can't remember which it was... Possibly the Hundred Years war between England and France.

I do get you point though. We had this discussion on a another post a month or two back, and concluded it wasn't religions fault, just man's misinterpretation of it. Your views?

[mryth]

I dont think the question is a fair one. Is religion not what man interpets life and the beyond to be? Then, you have man:s interpetation of another man:s interpetation.(aka people who believe in the bible).
I think man is purely to blame. I hardly think i need to provide the evidence that we are the most savage beasts on all of this earth.
Knowing the past, and where mankind has been headed, i unfortunatly think that a world war 3 is possible among other scenerios.
I think religion IS the symbol of mankind, what he stands for, thinks, and feels. It is a great exampe atcually. just as there are multiple views, books, and gods, such is mankind. Indefinattly varied, confused, angry, wanting to be the correct one, and forgetting the one thing that ALL the religions, in one way or another, have tried to teach. To enjoy life and not worry about such trivial things; doing such would spoil this gift that was given to us (by whomever you choose to believe in).
Thanks my take.
It is a shame that others cannot see everything so simply. I do not know who said this, but the quote is worth mentioning....

blessed is he who expects nothing, for he is never dissapointed.

thats the point of this site, is it not? not that we may expect these things, or overly believe in them, but know of the possibility, and that we can discuss them. i wish people would take a more debatable (which is fun) and not the :you are all wrong; approach.

[mryth]

and my take_?
to get back to that original question as to whether countries should denuke? heck no. I�@hate nukes as much as anyone (come on, i live in japan afterall), but seriously, think about this. scenerio, circle of gansters, all of them scheming each other. all of them have guns and money. each one has thier guns pointed at another. (sound familiar?) they decide to drop at the same time. what happens?

man is to eager to easily win! someone whould try to get the money and shoot everyone as they lowered the guns! duh!

same logic to the countries (if i may use such a wierd example)..........unless everyone denuked at the same SECOND i think someone would be too eager to let one loose, or try to hide one. everyone knows this so paranoia would kick in. sheesh, back things have happened in the past becuase of paranoia!

theyd be worse off. we dug a hole . no way out , just sity where we are.

[This is Fed up]

Everyone is talking about how Russia triggered the Cold War and the danger of the Cuban Missile Crisis. Well, just for ur information, U REALLY THINK THAT RUSSIA WAS SPYING ON THE U.S, while the US was being good natured??? The US was spying and stealing as much technology and information as Russia was. And as for the Cuban missile crisis, it was nearly the over-reaction of military hot-heads in the Pentagon that would have caused a nuclear war. Russia were right to put missiles in Cuba, it was exactly what the U.S had in Turkey and I think that it is really biased the way Russia gets treated as if it was in the wrong and wanted to kill millions of people. And as for GOD controlling nuclear war???? When will people growup?? If GOD was soo powerful, why didnt he stop Sept. 11th?? The answer is that religion is general was created to control people like slaves early on and to give them hope that their lives were not in vein and that they could go to a better place after a terrible life. Religion also causes far more wars + violence than anything else. I agree with the moral systems, but i think that they are corrupt and contradictory in practice to the teachings it gives. Anyway, i hope some people can read this and change their outlook to one that isnt skewed by religion or nationality......... Nice site armageddon by the way

[Kaelis Ra]

yes i agree, russia is hardly done by. they have never used a nuke on another country. to my recolection, the only country to ever have used a nuke is america. but does anyone dis america? oh no, there the perfect country. im not saying americ'a bad, but there not as good as they would have you believe.

also the disarmment of nukes. it will never happen, unless countries build some sort of defence against them and there was no need for them. nukes keep the peace. there mere presence keeps people in line, so are they good or bad? it's hard to say...

[SHIMRI]

I understand that this post probably does not belong here, but this is to you few who may think all religions are part of the greater evil behind wars, sounds accurate to me but this is one religion you can count out.
and this is to you others who say all it takes is belief in Jesus. Sorry but Satan believes in Jesus and that is not enough to save his tail. haha. It takes courage, true integrity and actions.

Jehovah’s Witnesses endured intense persecution under the Nazi regime. Actions against the religious group
and its individual members spanned the Nazi years 1933 to 1945. Unlike Jews and Sinti and Roma (“Gypsies”),
persecuted and killed by virtue of their birth, Jehovah’s Witnesses had the opportunity to escape persecution and personal harm by renouncing their religious beliefs. The courage the vast majority displayed in refusing to do so, in the face of torture, maltreatment in concentration camps, and sometimes execution, won them the respect of many contemporaries.

According to Rudolf Höss, Commandant of Auschwitz, SS Chief Heinrich Himmler often used the “fanatical faith” of Jehovah’s Witnesses as an example to his own SS troops. In his view, SS men had to have the same “unshakable faith” in the National Socialist ideal and in Adolf Hitler that the Witnesses had in Jehovah. Only when all SS men believed as fanatically in their own philosophy would Adolf Hitler’s state be permanently secure.

Jehovah’s witnesses’ statement of principles (1934)

To the Officials of the Government:
The Word of Jehovah God, as set out in the Holy Bible, is the
supreme law, and to us it is our sole guide for the reason that we have devoted ourselves to God and are true and sincere followers of Christ Jesus.
During the past year, and contrary to God’s law and in violation of our rights, you have forbidden us as Jehovah’s Witnesses to meet together to study God’s Word and worship and serve Him. In His Word he commands us that we shall not forsake the assem-bling of ourselves together. (Hebrews 10:25) To us Jehovah com-mands: ‘Ye are my witnesses that I am God. Go and tell the people my message.’ (Isaiah 43:10, 12; Isaiah 6:9; Matthew 24:14) There is a direct conflict between your law and God’s law, and, following the lead of the faithful apostles, ‘we ought to obey God rather than men,’ and this we will do. (Acts 5:29) Therefore this is
to advise you that at any cost we will obey God’s commandments, will meet together for the study of His Word, and will worship and serve Him as He has commanded. If your government or officers do violence to us because we are obeying God, then our blood will be upon you and you will answer to Almighty God. We have no interest in political affairs, but are wholly devoted to God’s Kingdom under Christ His King. We will do no injury or harm to anyone. We would delight to dwell in peace and do good to all men as we have opportunity, but, since your government
and its officers continue in your attempt to force us to disobey the highest law of the universe, we are compelled to now give you notice that we will, by His Grace, obey Jehovah God and fully trust Him to deliver us from all oppression and oppressors.

This declaration of political neutrality failed to convince the Nazi regime that the Witnesses were harmless.

1st conscientious objector murdered in Germany during WW2 was August -%--%--%--%-mann as reported by the New York Times. He was a Jehovah's Witness.

Jehovah’s Witnesses incarcerated in prisons and concentration camps were given the opportunity to be freed, if they signed the statement renouncing their beliefs. Few did so, even when beaten or tortured by their guards.

Concentration camp..................................
Department II
DECLARATION
I, the..
born on................................................ .................................................. ...........................
in ......
herewith make the following declaration:
1. I have come to know that the International Bible Students Association is proclaiming erroneous teachings and under the cloak of religion follows hostile purposes against the State.
2. I therefore left the organization entirely and made myself absolutely free from the teachings of this sect.
3. I herewith give assurance that I will never again take any part in the activity of the International Bible Students Association. Any persons approaching me with the teaching of the Bible Students, or who in any manner reveal their connections with them, I will denounce immediately. All literature from the Bible Students that should be sent to my address I will at once deliver to the nearest police station. 4. I will in the future esteem the laws of the State, especially in the event of war will I, with weapon in hand, defend the fatherland, and join in every way the community of the people.
5. I have been informed that I will at once be taken again into protective
custody if I should act against the declaration given today.
.................................................. ..............................., Dated ............................................
.................................................. .................................................. ..................... Signature


In response to Nazi efforts to destroy them, the world-wide Jehovah’s Witness organization became a center of spiritual resistance against the Nazis.

An inter-national convention of Witnesses, held in Lucerne, Switzerland, in September 1936, issued a resolution condemning the entire Nazi regime. In this text and other literature brought into Germany, writers broadly
indicted the Third Reich. Articles strongly denounced
the persecution of German Jews, Nazi “savagery”

The children of Jehovah’s Witnesses also suffered. In classrooms, teachers ridiculed children who refused to give the “Heil, Hitler!” salute or sing patriotic songs. Classmates shunned and beat up young Witnesses. Principals expelled them from schools. Families were broken up as authorities took children away from their parents and
sent them to reform schools, orphanages, or private homes, to be brought up as Nazis.

After 1939 most active Jehovah’s Witnesses were incarcerated in prisons or concentration camps.

it still continues today

Conscientious objectors: Kurban Zakirov

Zakirov, Kurban Bagdatovich [Mr.]
Nationality:
Turkmen
Date of birth:
1980
Place of residence:
Chärjew
Religion:
Jehovah's Witness since June 1997
Sentence:
Imprisoned on April 23, 1999, and sentenced on May 25, 1999, to one year in minimum-security corrective labor colony (ITKOR) for conscientious objection to military service. In December 1999, he was granted a pardon but was not released because he refused to give the oath. In spring 2000, when he had completed his sentence, he was still not released but was transferred to another unit. That was because a condition of release for prisoners is to place their hand on the Koran and give an oath of loyalty to the President and the State. Kurban refused to do this. When Kurban should have been released, one officer, in the presence of others, ripped off his shoulder strap and said that Kurban attacked him. Immediately a protocol was made on him, and he was sentenced again on the charge of attacking the security service. The court determined the term of punishment: eight years in a high-security corrective labor colony (ITKSR) in the city of Chärjew. Now he has been transferred to a "special" regime (the strictest one, where, for example, he does not even have the right to go for a walk).

will you keep your integrity to the Almighty when the UN takes over and do the right thing, which is takes sides with Jehovah God or will you ask "how high?" when the UN tells you to jump.....

those who live by the sword will perish by the sword
LOVE YOUR ENEMIES even in the face of persecution just as Christ did. to be a Christian is to be an imitator of Christ and his teachings

Nuclear war? maybe but that will not be "armageddon". possibly the pre cursor to it. maybe as speculation thats when religion will be banned or the UN will step in and then claim they have Peace & security when there is none.
the actual Armageddon in terms of the bible will make a nuclear war seem like childs play.
in fact, Chirst said that, of what is to come, in laymens terms, as in ARMAGEDDON, will make a world wide deluge "flood" , seem like a walk in the park.

[Kaelis Ra]

were do you find the time to type all that up?

[human]

MAN CREATED HIS OWN DESTRUCTION

NUCLEAR WARHEADS
LETS FACE IT.....THE END IS NEAR
WHEN THE ANTICHRIST ARISE...BE PREPARE
FOR THE END....

[Kaelis Ra]

look at this, the anti christ. cut the religous stuff please, that is not what this place is for!

[Dion]

Can someone please explain to me what would happen to the earth if every nuclea weapon in the whole world went off at the same time, not launched, just exploaded!
All at the same time.
What would happen ?
Just something I was wondering, would the earth just break appart ? etc.

[Smersh999]

Well I couldn't be absolutely certain, Dion, but I'm pretty sure the Earth would not break apart. Certainly there would not be many survivors left afterwards , (if any,) but I reckon the earth would survive. After all, the Earth has survived things like Yellowstone erupting in its past but still remained intact. My understanding of super volcanoes such as that at Yellowstone Park is that a single eruption has a power at least approaching, if not more, than all the worlds nuclear weapons put together.

Of course, a super volcano would have all its power concentrated in one place (at least to start with,) whereas all the worlds nukes would be spread over a greater area, mostly over the USA and Russia of course, with a few in some other countries, so I'm not sure if that would make any difference.

This is only my own estimation here and not based on any research or expertise - anybody's welcome to shoot me down in flames if they believe otherwise. 0]

[Dion]

Thanks for the reply, I wonder some wierd things at times hehe.

Just wondering how it would effect the earth at the precise moment all the nukes exploded
Cheers for your input anyway.
As Smersh999 said, anyone got any theories ? fact or fiction ? on what would / could happen ?

[armageddononline]

The earth wouldn'd explode, but what MIGHT happen is that a dust cloud would be created that would block out the sun and cause nuclear winter. If this happened, plants would die first, then animals, then we'd ahve nothign to eat. This theory is conroversial amongst scientists, but i wouldn't want to chance it :)

Also wouldn't be too good for global warming or the ozone layer, I suspect...

[armageddononline]

The earth wouldnt'd explode, but what MIGHT happen is that a dust cloud would be created that would block out the sun and cause nuclear winter. If this happened, plants would die first, then animals, then we'd have nothing to eat. This theory is controversial amongst scientists, but i wouldn't want to chance it :)

Also wouldn't be too good for global warming or the ozone layer, I suspect, and we'd get a whole load of irate greenpeace treehuggers...

[Dion]

..What do you think would happen at the split 2nd all the bombs went off ?
What geological effect would it have on the earth ?

[SkidMark01]

Dion
Unregistered User
(2/6/03 10:37:56 pm)
Reply But..
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
..What do you think would happen at the split 2nd all the bombs went off ?
What geological effect would it have on the earth ?


Dion, when did you start thinking about this? You know as much as me what geological effect it would have.
It would cause total destruction to the earth and to civilization. Its really abit sickening to think about.

[Smersh999]

One thing's for sure there would be quite a loud bang

[uf051]

We'd Have to pray for help off these guys:smokin:

[Smersh999]

<blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>We'd Have to pray for help off these guys [/quote]

Could be them who set all the bombs off in the first place :mad:

:smokin: :smokin: :smokin: :smokin: :smokin: :smokin:

[cainecrawford]

If they were on the faultlines. We could have a problem. They used to test neclear weapons in Alaska and they would have earthquakes up to 1 month later that measured up to 4.0.

[zap98]

Death, ozone damge, people literaly turned to KFC, radiation, hot temperatures, Death.

[Smersh999]

Yep, all good fun isn't it
:mad:

[Hulig]

Assuming they all went off at exactly the same time.. Well I've actually seen reports and calculations of this, the explosion(s) are roughly equivalent to what is needed to physically destroy the planet x3. Note I think that was before Russia and hte US started disarming, so today that would leave us at around 1.5-2.5 x the amount of force needed to physically destroy the world.

Now definitions of destoy the world vary, but I'm fairly certain they meant "turn the earth into yet another one of those asteroid belts in the solar system".

[mrwoodchuck61]

Just for a frame of reference anything in the line of destroying the planet becomes a mute issue after the cessation of all life on the planet, after that no one is left to care if the world is a dead ball in space or a ring of orbiting gravel around the sun. Once you kill everybody once or shatter the world into pieces it no longer matters how many times over it could have been done.

[dorkboy67]

:evil: Ummmm,KFC,Aarrrrrgggghhhhh...

[squirel52]

i have only to say that this is a sad sad thread.

I was all happy when i saw the anti nuke stuff in the "google" heading, but all the talk of "god shall rule us all" and the repeated references to the bible was just about enough to make me sick. then people started arguing the obvious truth that the only thing that is gonna kill people, is other -%--%--%--%--%--%--%-ed people.

i'm a huge "anti-fan" of nukes on the whole, but they do have the nice side effect that once we have managed to scour this earth clear of all inteligent life (sp?), hopefully something less STUPID than humans will arise.

if there is a god (little g), i bet he is kicking himself now for inventing those terrors commonly refered to as "man-kind"

i have to ask, what the @#%$ happened to korea?
the Bush administration admitted that they knew korea was making nukes. Korea, the long hated enemy. Korea, the "country" with the HUGE grudge against the US (and why not too? drop 1/2 a million land mines, and then run the @#%$ away? sounds plain cowardly to me.). Korea with the ability and the motivation to build and use nukes, and NOTHING was done.
I haven't even seen anything on the news about any updates.
Personally, if there was a nice foriegn country out for my blood, i'd want to know the @#%$ about it.

to finish off my nice speal this evening, george bus with his nice little mini nukes is possibly the stupidest idea i have ever heard... the daisy cutter blew me away, the fact that they were willing to use a weapo nwith as much destructive power as a nuke, on a densely populated area...what is there to comment on, but giving soldiers the ability to take a real nuke into a town/ bunker/ war zone and set it off, well, firstly: suicide soldiers?.. doesn't this break the geneva convention? secondly: if the soldiers can do it, why can't the terrorists. we have enough problem with conventional bombs in cities. what happens when terrorists decide to stick a nuke on the plane they want to fly into buildngs,set to blow in impact? what happens when the next car bomb makes a pretty mushroom cloud?
if normal nukes are available on the black markets, whats to stop these, much more dangerous weapons fro going there too. thirdly: they can't possibly be used for any REAL military purpose. these bombs are tiny. very tiny, and they will only devestate a couple of kilometres (2-3 km radius, no more is likely). well, if there are dudes living in caves, u might get the people living near the tops, but u can't drop em from planes - can't risk them not going off. u can't use the suicide soldier (see point 1). how the heck r u gonna deploy them? and finally: once u have removed the option of miliary targets, that leaves only the sad posibility of civilian targets. need i go on. the US have been using the most stupidly dangerous waepons for years and years and years now.

oops, an after thought.
True, the US never had V rockets, but they had a fair bit worse not long after the war. V rockets were good, especially for the times, america didn't use them afterwards, cause they couldn't lay claim to them. "americans and their toys, what will the world do?"
they didn't need V rockets. they had SCIENTISTS. plan to be one, good blokes, handy to have round.

i'd put alot of money on the fact that u, mr obssesd nuker, are an american. u are the type of person who gives americans REALLY bad names. glad i'm not one (come visit us in NZ all u nice non-stupid americans....if u dont know what that is, u dont need to). If u would like to try and fact bash me, get u'r facts some backup before u start playing.
I will admit that there is a bit of potential for fault in this particular post, as it is quite late at night, and i am rather tired, but i Do know my @#%$, which is more than i can say for some people.

Oh, and japan? it was a sad sad thing to do, but i do believe that japan did want to surrender before the nukes were dropped. i mean, it takes more than a couple of days to decide for a whole nation to surrednder, especially one as proud as the japanese. Just take a look at the current legislation worldwide. not a god damned thing can be done in under 6 months.
(warning, this is hear-say, not known fact) i believe that there was an attempt to actually call off the planes carrying the "big boy" bombs, but the info didn't get through in time.

Oh god. soooo tired. must sleep.

sinse the chances of me actually coming back to this site i found by sheer chance is very slim, feel free to email any abuse back to me at squirel52@hotmail.com
I aawait u'r responses, especialy if i got some facts wrong (and i mean facts, not opinions). i always like to keep my knowledge base up to date.

Good night all
Marvin

oh yes, and Kaelis Ra. u rock. 'nuf said.

[squirel52]

Sorry bout the swearing.

I noticed it was bleeped out, so i figured an apology was in order

[armageddononline]

<blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>i have to ask, what the @#%$ happened to korea?
the Bush administration admitted that they knew korea was making nukes. Korea, the long hated enemy. Korea, the "country" with the HUGE grudge against the US (and why not too? drop 1/2 a million land mines, and then run the @#%$ away? sounds plain cowardly to me.). Korea with the ability and the motivation to build and use nukes, and NOTHING was done.
I haven't even seen anything on the news about any updates.[/quote] There's been a discussion in some other threads about this. The problem is North Korea is virtually impreganable, an attack would be much harder than one on Iraq. At the first sign of trouble they could simply devastate South Korea.

Part of the justification for the Iraq war was that it would be in a few years where North Korea is now.

Hope you do come back, enjoyed reading your views (and don't worry about the swear words, they're filtered out automatically)

[5aret]

good piont,obssesed nuker :) :) :cool: :rollin: :p




5aret

[squirel52]

ok. The Korean war was one of the few the america actaully managed to lose (not that it was portrayed that way, but thats not my point), so i can understand some reluctance to give it another shot, especially with the threat of nukes there.

However, I think that i would be more concerned with a country which STILL HATES MY GUTS having nukes, and also having the satisfaction of knowing that they won a war onc, and might be able to do it again. that would scare me no end.
While i seriously am against all the various types of wars, the US military is ALOT larger than nearly every other military in the world (excepting China, who has up to 2.5 billion serviceworthy men available for conscription...duuuuuuuude...), and would easily be able to do a campain. the problem with iraq was that it was unjustified. if it is proven beyond reasonable doubt that korea had nukes and the inclination to use them, it at least has a small justification.

Of course, that would beg the Q why other nuclear capable countries with violent temperaments, aren't being toasted (eg, India, pakistan)

wow... too late at night.. must sleep.

enjoy
Marvin

[furry]

<blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>(excepting China, who has up to 2.5 billion serviceworthy men available for conscription..[/quote]
Last I knew China and India each had just over a billion people. So figuring that half of them are women (we won't get into age issues) where you coming up with the other 2 million?

[Drummer4West]

Amen to that!!!!!!!:D

[armageddononline]

2 billion, shurely Furry?

I don't know the exact figure but I wouldn't be surprised if China had 250 million men of fighting age. Pretty similar to the whole population of the US...

[Danzaman123]

If every single nuke went off it would probably cause a shockwave, like in the movies. Have any of you seen "The Core", yes that is a sci-fi but they explode how many nukes? 7 in the core and it creates a chain reaction. Imagine, all the thousands of missiles going off at once (some being bigger than others) then what happened in "The Core" is what probably would happen on Earth. There would be a big continous explosion killing everyone. If i were to explain what would happen in a just a few words it would be; we're all screwed.

[bbbv3.5]

Danaza man you had to search a while for that shit havent you because that thread was like a year and a half old.

[nrj]

Nuclear winter, of course. If EVERY SINGLE one of our nukes would explode, it would be twice as bad as having a 15 kilometer comet, heading this way. And we all know what happened to the dinos :yikes:

[Danzaman123]

Nuclear winter, of course. If EVERY SINGLE one of our nukes would explode, it would be twice as bad as having a 15 kilometer comet, heading this way. And we all know what happened to the dinos :yikes:

True, true. Everybody dead, no life left. Nuclear winter yep. Worse than a meteor easily.

[Matt_Armagedon666]

One 9.0 earth quake makes 10,000 times more energy. Then all the nukes on earth ever. Yellow stone or Toba would cause 10,000 times that or more. One Billion times more powerful then the nuke that we hit Japan with in 1945.

Give me a fucking break guys all the nukes on earth would not even be 1/10,000ths of one 9.0 earth quake. Or 10-8 squared. Or 100,000,000 million parts. That 9.0 after chirstmas slowed the earth down it was so powerful. On top of that recording stations all the way around the world felt it.

A nuke can kill but it is with in Man kinds power. It doe's not even start to get anywhere near as powerful to distory the earth.

It would have to be 10,000 if not more times more powrful then that 9.0 to even hope to distory the earth. Thats 10,000 or 10-3 to the power of. Times that other number.

[nrj]

so, if we add the climatology effects, the INTENSE amount of radiation, wich could destroy 53 % of the worlds farming, if the nukes are targeted right, and also, the disieses and plauges that would occur, when we litteraly are being bombed back to the stone age; do you still think Yellowstone sounds more horrible?

[nrj]

By the way, what niner are you talking about? the one after christmas was a 8,4

[Danzaman123]

Danaza man you had to search a while for that shit havent you because that thread was like a year and a half old.

Dyu have something against me??

I was just looking through all the threads. Dyu have a problem with that? Thats what they're there for.