Lee Bollinger Takes it to Ahmadinejad at Columbia

[ApocalypticEnvoy]

We can all agree on something

The Columbia University president, Mr. Bollinger, in a 30-plus introduction of Ahmadinejad, just took it to him, and the students applauded. Could you explain to us why you are repressing women in your country? Could you explain to us why you are threatening your neighbors? Your maniacal statements are so embarrassing reasonable Iranian citizens that your party lost last December's mayoral elections. You have become a laughingstock. You threaten peace-loving democracies in the Middle East. I don't expect that you will answer any of these questions, Mr. President, but your refusal to do so will inform us much. He said, our military families rightly see you as the enemy. You are undermining US soldiers in Iraq. You are targeting them with your own manufactured munitions. He quoted Petraeus as an authority in a speech he gave to the National Press Club.

Man, Ahmadinejad probaly thought he was walking into a hall with full of welcome arms and got totally blindsided. Welcome to America. Land of the Free.

At first I was pissed they were giving this tyrant a stage. All I have to say now is BRAVO. I would wager they he wouldn't face those questions in Iran.

[Sirius]

I agree, I was dissapointed that he was getting a platform, but now, after he has made an ass out of himself, I am glad he came.

[lordofthemystic]

Lee Bollinger acted like a fool. Why would you invite the President of Iran to speak
at Columbia University and then attack him when he shows up? Lee Bollinger set President Ahmadinejad up and then ambushed him. You don't talk to the President of a country like that in an introduction speech. Mr. Bollinger insulted a nation of millions and I'm talking about the USA. I was insulted, ashamed and embarrassed that Lee Bollinger, the President of Columbia University would act a 'nigga' on us.

[Soultaker]

Could you explain to us why you are repressing women in your country?

Could Lee explain why the country that defends freedom, justifies torture?... Moron (I mean Lee, for God's sake).

Could you explain to us why you are threatening your neighbors?

Say What!! The only countries that have being threatening their neighbors without any credible evidence are USA and USrael... No other countries than them!!

You threaten peace-loving democracies in the Middle East.

Wait, peace-loving democracies like... Saudi Arabia or Egypt, right??, Then Lee is going to say that Mexico has nooo problems because of narcotraffic... jerk.

You are undermining US soldiers in Iraq. You are targeting them with your own manufactured munitions.

There is no conclusive evidence that links Iranians with helping the insurgency. And, again, who will they help to?... The Sunni Resistance, when Iran is Shiite ?

[ApocalypticEnvoy]

I'm glad Bollinger acted as an American that saw through Ahmadinejad's bullshit he's been spouting. He's been trying to stir the pot and trying to divide us. He got a rude awakening didn't he.

[Smoke]

what you hear about the president of Iran is pure bullshit propaganda, the guy who attacked him should be ashamed... and I disagree with it COMPLETLEY!

you hate him because of the way he talks you hate mostly every ARAB who follows the quran, the only stupid shit he says is lets erase isreal and the holocaust was faked,

all this bullshit the news tells you is really getting to you ppl, I suggest you auctually get to know the guy before you all blast the shit out of him like that, because untill you do.. you wont ever really know.

[Soultaker]

Ah, silly me . I forgot to mention the misunderstanding due to the (deliberately) incorrect translation of his speech.

[ApocalypticEnvoy]

Maybe you'd like to give us a little insight about what so good about the man Smoke. I'd really like to hear what's so good about him. Maybe you know something I don't, please elaborate.

[Smoke]

All these countries gang up on this man claiming hes this and claiming hes that, and then when he stands up to all of them and dosn't sit there and take it... it seems that media has a hayday destroying his character making everyone think what a bad guy he must be,

If bush hadn't set his sites on this guy because of the things he has we wouldnt even know about him.

Now tell me what would you do if countries around the globe are attacking you, <--- not physically but making all these accusations about suppling other countries with weapons and building nukes, SO WHAT the U.S has them and the last time I checked the United States were just tryingto be world police, they're a country all on their on and can do what they please.

What would your stance towards gays be or jews if you were brought up in a world full of that kind of stuff?

[TC]

and we'll keep this civil right? LOL ........

[Cartesiantheater]

Ethically I think it's wrong to invite a dignitary and then attempt to humiliate him on the stage.

HOWEVER, to sit here and say that what goes on in these Muslim nations is right is also foolish. The woman ARE repressed.

When deciding moral issues, it is completely foolish to measure the morality of one agent vs the morality of another (like all of you who bring up the U.S. in this- what Iran does should be measured by its own moral merit.). To do that is the epitome of moral relativism, which itself is a logical contradiction. Whether or not an act is moral or an agent is behaving morally should be decided on its own merit with respect to right and wrong, not based on some other action or another entity.

So my stance is that what goes on in these nations is often times morally wrong, I think. But by the same token, it is certainly unethical to insult an invited guest like that.

As far as what happened at Columbia, I believe Lee Bollinger was out of line. It is one thing to question, it is another to attack.

You don't solve these problems by being confrontational. You solve them with REASON.

[ApocalypticEnvoy]

and we'll keep this civil right? LOL ........

Civil? We are talking politics aren't we?

[Smoke]

Ethically I think it's wrong to invite a dignitary and then attempt to humiliate him on the stage.

HOWEVER, to sit here and say that what goes on in these Muslim nations is right is also foolish. The woman ARE repressed.

When deciding moral issues, it is completely foolish to measure the morality of one agent vs the morality of another (like all of you who bring up the U.S. in this- what Iran does should be measured by its own moral merit.). To do that is the epitome of moral relativism, which itself is a logical contradiction. Whether or not an act is moral or an agent is behaving morally should be decided on its own merit with respect to right and wrong, not based on some other action or another entity.

So my stance is that what goes on in these nations is often times morally wrong, I think. But by the same token, it is certainly unethical to insult an invited guest like that.

As far as what happened at Columbia, I believe Lee Bollinger was out of line. It is one thing to question, it is another to attack.

You don't solve these problems by being confrontational. You solve them with REASON.

Sure what goes on in that country is not right to us, but thats because we've been raised in such a different way of life.

[ApocalypticEnvoy]

As far as what happened at Columbia, I believe Lee Bollinger was out of line. It is one thing to question, it is another to attack.

You don't solve these problems by being confrontational. You solve them with REASON.

He gave him the oporrtunity to defend himself and then what does he do? He bashes gays and circumvents every other issue. I guess he thought he was among friends.

[Cartesiantheater]

Sure what goes on in that country is not right to us, but thats because we've been raised in such a different way of life.

Oh no... I've done it... I can't help it...


The thing is, we may not be able to define these particulars, but to say that there is no right or wrong really does lead to a contradiciton, and so by negation it must be false. Take this example:

All views on morality are equal in correctness.

Now we have two problems: 1.) Many views on morality directly conflict, and so both cannot be right.

And 2.) The phrase "All views on morality are equal in correctness" implies that the view on morality that states that all views on morality are equal in correctness is actually superior to all other moral views.

Thus, by making the claim that no moralities are superior, you are in fact making a claim that a morality IS superior, and therefore are contradicting yourself.


In addition, we find moral trends the world over. There ALWAYS are rules against theft, murder, etc. So we postulate a universal morality (or moral guideline at least).


In Islam, it is a moral virtue to respect other people, just like it is everywhere. The problem lies in who constitues full personhood. Are women people who are dignified enough to deserve equal respect and rights as non-female people?

If they ARE, then it is certainly immoral to deny them the respect, etc that any person deserves.

[TC]

Its a platform like anything else, Ahmadinejad has his rhetoric to maintain his popularity back home. What he may have hoped for was to get a sympathetic response from a war tired public to stave off any popular move to invade his country.

[ApocalypticEnvoy]

You should respect the rights of all citzizens of the world regardless of nationality. If you don't respect everyone's you can't respect the one's in your own country. Give me liberty or give me death.

[Smoke]

The things that happend today just pissed of millions of Iranians.

and I dont think many people realize it, and when it comes down to theyre turn to go into hand to hand combat with them because the U.S cant afford any bullits they will regret the actions of few, and its sad, this whole conflict here could be avoided, you guys wont even let him see the WTC area to lay a wreath, If i were him I would go straight back home.

Im not trying to rip on americans here, I am just sayin mainly the larger political figures seal your fate, wether your like it or not.

[Cartesiantheater]

That's why we always treat dignitaries with respect. It was that way for thousands of years. "A King cannot kill a King."

That's why I think Bollinger was wrong. There is more at stake than what meets the eye.

EDIT- Wrong in his EXECUTION... not wrong in questioning.

As far as the wreath thing at ground zero, that's garbage. Let the man pay his respects for the love of God.

[Sammy56]

Fucking pain in the ass if you ask me. Security everywhere was everywhere. Had to show our ID's constantly.

As far as what happened at Columbia, I believe Lee Bollinger was out of line. It is one thing to question, it is another to attack.

I agree and so does most of the school. He shouldn't have been invited in the first place. The World Leaders Forum is supposed to be about sharing ideas for a better future and increased international cooperation. Inviting Ahmadinejad did not further this purpose. While I don't agree with his ideas, attacking him with questions isn't going to solve anything. President Bollinger wanted something to make headlines, which it did. But it casts my school into a bad light when we invite a world leader just to fire insulting questions at him, even if his ideas are obviously harmful to other people.

[ApocalypticEnvoy]

That's why we always treat dignitaries with respect. It was that way for thousands of years. "A King cannot kill a King."

That is what Chamberlain thought of Hitler. Thank God Churchill knew better.

[Cartesiantheater]

He gave him the oporrtunity to defend himself and then what does he do? He bashes gays and circumvents every other issue. I guess he thought he was among friends.

It doesn't matter. A foriegn dignitary is supposed to be given a certain degree of respect (unless he is condemned or something). That has been the ethical standard for thousands of years.

That is what Chamberlain thought of Hitler. Thank God Churchill knew better.

Have you even considered for a moment the global political ramifications of this? You can't just beat the Muslims down, you have to win a war through ideas as well as arms. Now the Iranians have even greater reason to hate the "Great Satan," and now our victory will be even more difficult.

We are not at war with Iran, therefore we should behave as such.

[ApocalypticEnvoy]

A proxy war is still a war no matter how you look at it.

[Raptor Witness]

It would not hurt my feelings if Bush bombed their military installations back to the stone age, but it won't be that simple. According the the book of [Daniel,] what happened to Alexander the Great will be repeated, and this attack will be the beginning of the end of the U.S. as a world power. How this comes about I'm not sure, but the "great horn" is broken after this attack occurs. So as much as the West may dislike Iran, it's a trap to attack her.

[Ningishiddza]

The World Leaders Forum is supposed to be about sharing ideas for a better future and increased international cooperation. Inviting Ahmadinejad did not further this purpose.

On what basis do you draw that conclusion?

Where are your parents? Which one of them spent time in a detention camp?

Which of your parents was forcibly removed from their home and brutally beaten for making questionable coments about the president?

Who do you know that lost their job because the newspaper was shut down for printing an editorial criticizing the government?

Which country tried to assassinate your president three times?

How many of your journalists, professors and religious leaders have been exiled?

Who do you know that was imprisoned and tortured for attempting to start a political party?

You aren't worthy to dust Ahmadinejad's shoes. He lived under the horror that was the US-supported shah and the SAVAK, the US trained, equipped and funded state secret police apparatus, and you say Ahmadinejad has nothing to bring to the table?

You might have learned something, like how US surrogate dictators like the shah and others brutally oppress dissent and oppositon. That information might come in handy when your own government starts oppressing you, but then everything in the US is just peachy, isn't it?

You should stop to consider that one reason your government is hell-bent on taking away your rights is because you have repeatedly demonstrated no concern that your government denies rights to others.