Ecclesiastes and the Meaning of Life

[Cartesiantheater]

Obviously I am quite far from being Christian, but what a beautiful section of scripture!

Watch this video. At the end you'll hear the verses. Really powerful I think, and it highlights a great truth about the meaning of the human condition.

Enjoy.

+ YouTube Video

[Nu Kua]

There is futility which is done on the earth, that is, there are righteous men to whom it happens according to the deeds of the wicked. On the other hand, there are evil men to whom it happens according to the deeds of the righteous. I say that this too is futility.

So I commended pleasure, for there is nothing good for a man under the sun except to eat and to drink and to be merry, and this will stand by him in his toils throughout the days of his life which God has given him under the sun.

When I gave my heart to know wisdom and to see the task which has been done on the earth (even though one should never sleep day or night),

and I saw every work of God, I concluded that man cannot discover the work which has been done under the sun. Even though man should seek laboriously, he will not discover; and though the wise man should say, "I know," he cannot discover.

Most good works are ignored, while bad works often propel one into fame (or infamy) and fortune. And too often the injustice or "bad" one is trying to cancel out by applying good works seems too huge and complicated to ever fully correct. It makes you wonder often "What's the use?"
(The use is, healing)

This author seems to think that man can never know or understand the true nature of God, or of how creation came to be. On one hand I disagree, because I think we are representations of "God", and so is all the life on this earth, and to know this "creative force" is to know yourself, connect and know others, and to live life fully. You can't just read about it, you have to experience it, in order to know it.

So, in this incarnation, while on Earth, can humans "discover the work which has been done under the Sun"? Well, we are making discoveries by the minute regarding the most basic components of life. So on that level, yes again, I think we can.

However, I also think there is a core level of truth so immense in its simplicity, that we cannot ever hope to grasp it fully; and even if we do, there is no way to explain it with our words. The understanding goes beyond language based thought, and there is really no way to relay it to others on that track. So when it comes to personal understanding, it might not be so futile, but when it comes to trying to share and teach others what you have learned then that can become quite futile, indeed.

But yes, definitely, while concern for others is necessary and good, that doesn't mean to feel guilty when you are blessed with abundance. So do enjoy your food, enjoy your drink, enjoy your loving and laughter, because these are gifts, and to deny them would be rude.
Likewise, while knowledge and concrete understanding of the forces that drive us is certainly worth the work of discovery, be easy on the self for not having all of the answers. Some aspects of humanity are not to be understood in a logical manner, but are simply felt with the heart, and that is the understanding.

[Ningishiddza]

No, not even close. Ecclesiastes was ripped right from Shumerian. It ain't even funny. It's just like Job. You read Job and it's stupid and doesn't make any sense at all. Well, go read the original stories written 5,000 years earlier. There's actually 4 "Jobs" because it's four separate stories. When you read the four separate stories, then it all makes sense. And none of it has anything to do with god. Things happen. Things happen to people. Some of those things are pleasant, some aren't, sometimes things happen because we caused it, sometimes we did nothing. No matter, everyone handles adversity and triumph differently.

It was probably Ezra who plagiarized them. When Ezra edited the stories, he spliced them all together for some bizarre reason, I don't know, maybe for continuity, but in doing so, and by adding the god thing, he destroyed the essence of the stories.

It would appear the satan-stuff was added later, around 200 BCE or so. That would be Isaiah #2, who was also probably Haggai #2, and who was also probably Ezekiel #2 and another one of the Deuteronomy editors (but not Dtr #2 -- this guy would be Dtr #3 or maybe Dtr #4).

Anyway it's a much better read in the Shumerian without all the Yahweh nonsense.

[Nu Kua]

So what do the Shumerian have to say regarding what is futile, or not, in our existence, and whether or not life should be worried about, or enjoyed regardless?

[Ningishiddza]

So what do the Shumerian have to say regarding what is futile, or not, in our existence, and whether or not life should be worried about, or enjoyed regardless?

Did you read Ecclesiastes? If you did, then you know. The "Job" texts are published. I saw those at Barnes & Noble a few years ago, but I don't know how it would read with all the stupid Yahweh tricks removed and separated as 4 stories.

If I was an helpless slave, then I suppose I might ask, "Master, please hold my hand and tell me what is futile in human existence, so that I might know. Resistance is futile, now get back to work slave!." Otherwise, I will take the lead and choose a path that's clear for me.

[Nu Kua]

Yeah, I've read Ecclesiastes, and I can relate.

Ecclesiastes 4
The Evils of Oppression
1
Then I looked again at all the acts of oppression which were being done under the sun. And behold I saw the tears of the oppressed and that they had no one to comfort them; and on the side of their oppressors was power, but they had no one to comfort them.
2
So I congratulated the dead who are already dead more than the living who are still living.
3
But better off than both of them is the one who has never existed, who has never seen the evil activity that is done under the sun...

9
...Two are better than one because they have a good return for their labor.
10
For if either of them falls, the one will lift up his companion. But woe to the one who falls when there is not another to lift him up.
11
Furthermore, if two lie down together they keep warm, but how can one be warm alone?
12
And if one can overpower him who is alone, two can resist him. A cord of three strands is not quickly torn apart.

[johnb1]

James 1:27

27Religion that God our Father accepts as pure and faultless is this: to look after orphans and widows in their distress and to keep oneself from being polluted by the world.


Ecclesiastes 12:1-5

1 Remember your Creator
in the days of your youth,
before the days of trouble come
and the years approach when you will say,
"I find no pleasure in them"-

2 before the sun and the light
and the moon and the stars grow dark,
and the clouds return after the rain;

3 when the keepers of the house tremble,
and the strong men stoop,
when the grinders cease because they are few,
and those looking through the windows grow dim;

4 when the doors to the street are closed
and the sound of grinding fades;
when men rise up at the sound of birds,
but all their songs grow faint;

5 when men are afraid of heights
and of dangers in the streets;
when the almond tree blossoms
and the grasshopper drags himself along
and desire no longer is stirred.
Then man goes to his eternal home
and mourners go about the street