Swine flu jab link to killer nerve disease - Study

[MetalMilitia]

Well, this one won't be moved ;)

A warning that the new swine flu jab is linked to a deadly nerve disease has been sent by the Government to senior neurologists in a confidential letter.

The letter from the Health Protection Agency, the official body that oversees public health, has been leaked to The Mail on Sunday, leading to demands to know why the information has not been given to the public before the vaccination of millions of people, including children, begins.

It tells the neurologists that they must be alert for an increase in a brain disorder called Guillain-Barre Syndrome (GBS), which could be triggered by the vaccine.

GBS attacks the lining of the nerves, causing paralysis and inability to breathe, and can be fatal.

The letter, sent to about 600 neurologists on July 29, is the first sign that there is concern at the highest levels that the vaccine itself could cause serious complications.

It refers to the use of a similar swine flu vaccine in the United States in 1976 when:

* More people died from the vaccination than from swine flu.
* 500 cases of GBS were detected.
* The vaccine may have increased the risk of contracting GBS by eight times.
* The vaccine was withdrawn after just ten weeks when the link with GBS became clear.
* The US Government was forced to pay out millions of dollars to those affected.

Concerns have already been raised that the new vaccine has not been sufficiently tested and that the effects, especially on children, are unknown.

It is being developed by pharmaceutical companies and will be given to about 13million people during the first wave of immunisation, expected to start in October.

Top priority will be given to everyone aged six months to 65 with an underlying health problem, pregnant women and health professionals.

The British Neurological Surveillance Unit (BNSU), part of the British Association of Neurologists, has been asked to monitor closely any cases of GBS as the vaccine is rolled out.

One senior neurologist said last night: ‘I would not have the swine
flu jab because of the GBS risk.’

There are concerns that there could be a repeat of what became known as the ‘1976 debacle’ in the US, where a swine flu vaccine killed 25 people – more than the virus itself.

A mass vaccination was given the go-ahead by President Gerald Ford because scientists believed that the swine flu strain was similar to the one responsible for the 1918-19 pandemic, which killed half a million Americans and 20million people worldwide.

Swine flu vaccines being prepared

The swine flu vaccine being offered to children has not been tested on infants

Within days, symptoms of GBS were reported among those who had been immunised and 25 people died from respiratory failure after severe paralysis. One in 80,000 people came down with the condition. In contrast, just one person died of swine flu.

More than 40million Americans had received the vaccine by the time the programme was stopped after ten weeks. The US Government paid out millions of dollars in compensation to those affected.

The swine flu virus in the new vaccine is a slightly different strain from the 1976 virus, but the possibility of an increased incidence of GBS remains a concern.

Shadow health spokesman Mike Penning said last night: ‘The last thing we want is secret letters handed around experts within the NHS. We need a vaccine but we also need to know about potential risks.

‘Our job is to make sure that the public knows what’s going on. Why
is the Government not being open about this? It’s also very worrying if GPs, who will be administering the vaccine, aren’t being warned.’

Two letters were posted together to neurologists advising them of the concerns. The first, dated July 29, was written by Professor Elizabeth Miller, head of the HPA’s Immunisation Department.

It says: ‘The vaccines used to combat an expected swine influenza pandemic in 1976 were shown to be associated with GBS and were withdrawn from use.

‘GBS has been identified as a condition needing enhanced surveillance when the swine flu vaccines are rolled out.

‘Reporting every case of GBS irrespective of vaccination or disease history is essential for conducting robust epidemiological analyses capable of identifying whether there is an increased risk of GBS in defined time periods after vaccination, or after influenza itself, compared with the background risk.’

The second letter, dated July 27, is from the Association of British Neurologists and is written by Dr Rustam Al-Shahi Salman, chair of its surveillance unit, and Professor Patrick Chinnery, chair of its clinical research committee.

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...#ixzz0OIrMU3PO

[calliope]

It refers to the use of a similar swine flu vaccine in the United States in 1976 when:

* More people died from the vaccination than from swine flu.
* 500 cases of GBS were detected.
* The vaccine may have increased the risk of contracting GBS by eight times.
* The vaccine was withdrawn after just ten weeks when the link with GBS became clear.
* The US Government was forced to pay out millions of dollars to those affected.

Concerns have already been raised that the new vaccine has not been sufficiently tested and that the effects, especially on children, are unknown.

But the herds of cattle don't object. Why should we?

(Oh, and.... rocks!!)

[HorrorReporter]

real question: How many in here are thinking about getting it? My mother in law is.. she is about 77 and regularly gets a flu shot..

[James Random]

I'm most certainly not.

[lycanox]

Actually the estimated chance of developing Guillain-Barre Syndrome is a lot smaller than actually dying of the flue.

http://www.who.int/vaccine_safety/to.../en/index.html

So it would still be silly to avoid the vaccine due to this.

[James Random]

Actually the estimated chance of developing Guillain-Barre Syndrome is a lot smaller than actually dying of the flue.

http://www.who.int/vaccine_safety/to.../en/index.html

So it would still be silly to avoid the vaccine due to this.

Well i'll tell you what. You take it and be happy. If you drop down dead we'll know to keep away from it, wont we?

[JenaS62]

real question: How many in here are thinking about getting it? My mother in law is.. she is about 77 and regularly gets a flu shot..

I'm not getting it and will do all possible to ensure that my kids don't get it either. I've never gotten a flu shot in my life and I've only had the flu once about 12 years ago. I lived.

[uki]

it seems the evidence is mounting that this "swine flu" and the vaccination measures being set into place are not in our best interests... why anyone would want to get stuck with this bullshit is beyond me, well... not really...

Two cases of swine flu resistant to the drug Tamiflu were diagnosed over the weekend, the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention said on Saturday. Tamiflu and Relenza were the only two medications that had thusfar proven effective in treating the virus (also known as H1N1), which already proved resistant to other seasonal flu remedies.

Tamiflu had been particularly popular, as it is ingested orally. Relenza, which is inhaled, is therefore not recommended for patients with respiratory conditions. Both drugs work by disabling an enzyme the virus needs in order to grow. Many governments in the world, including Israel's, have stockpiled Tamiflu in large quantities since the swine-flu pandemic began.

Reports of Tamiflu-resistant strains of swine flu began in late June. In patients with weakened immune systems the virus might stay active for longer periods, acquiring resistance to Tamiflu and potentially spreading to others.

At the end of June, a representative of the Swiss pharmaceutical company Roche, which manufactures Tamiflu, said a Danish patient infected with a strain of the virus was not responding to the medicine. Earlier studies on Tamiflu indicated that 0.4 percent of adults and 4 percent of children afflicted with normal seasonal flu were likely not to respond to the drug.

read more... http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1107725.html

[Nu Kua]

Check out this 60 Minutes segment, from 1976, about this.

I tried to link directly to the vid but can't seem to, but it's easily viewed from the site.

As far as the Tamiflu story above, yeah, they knew before they sold their stockpiles to the all that this was not going to be effective against h1n1. In fact, i think it was 2006 or 07, Tamiflu was causing the company to lose stock value due to its ineffectiveness, especially when compared to another version of the flu shot.
So this flu scare has enabled Tamiflu to still make some more of their money back.

[lycanox]

Flue strains that are being immune to Tami flue treatment have become very common in the last years. And the Mexican flue is probably a descended of a virus that was close to developing this immunity. And is now developing the immunity itself once in a while.

But this is not something new as building up resistance versus medicines is simply what microorganisms do. And is thus not some kind of weird conspiracy to sell medicines.

[uki]

Flue strains that are being immune to Tami flue treatment have become very common in the last years.

hmmmm... so one has to wonder why the press for a vaccination that won't be effective...

And the Mexican flue is probably a descended of a virus that was close to developing this immunity.

such as a bio-genetically engineered version...

And is now developing the immunity itself once in a while.

nature finds a way...

But this is not something new as building up resistance versus medicines is simply what microorganisms do.

so why the rush to stick people with what will most likely do more harm than good??

And is thus not some kind of weird conspiracy to sell medicines.

and thus another reason for you to stfu already.

[lycanox]

hmmmm... so one has to wonder why the press for a vaccination that won't be effective...

Tamiflu is not the same as a flue vaccine.

such as a bio-genetically engineered version...
nature finds a way...

Mutations like these and pandemics are nothing more than the effects of Influenza and Humanity trying to survive on the same planet.

There is no reason to suggest that the virus is not natural.

so why the rush to stick people with what will most likely do more harm than good??

For each million people vaccinated. Only 2,5 will actually get serious sick due to GBS.
Which is a lot lower than what we currently see the virus doing.

So your claim is quite incorrect.

[uki]

Tamiflu is not the same as a flue vaccine.

so you are suggesting that a regular flu shot might work differently?

Mutations like these and pandemics are nothing more than the effects of Influenza and Humanity trying to survive on the same planet.

so by this reasoning, mankind should stop making any type of vaccination so that there would be a natural balance between mankind and nature??

There is no reason to suggest that the virus is not natural.

of course it is natural, the question is wether or not was manipulated to skip a few generations.

For each million people vaccinated. Only 2,5 will actually get serious sick due to GBS.

and are there any OTHER side-effects to be given consideration?

Which is a lot lower than what we currently see the virus doing.

what we do see are more people advertly effected by the vaccination, rather than the swine flu itself.

So your claim is quite incorrect.

ah, but what about that little voice of fucking opposition? for every action, there is an EQUAL and opposite reaction. deny that one fucktard.

[calliope]

For each million people vaccinated. Only 2,5 will actually get serious sick due to GBS.
Which is a lot lower than what we currently see the virus doing.

So your claim is quite incorrect.

But it isn't just GBS. There is much much more in the arena of negative effects from this vaccine, as well as others.

If you watch television, you may have caught an ad about lawsuits pertaining to mesothelioma. It is said mesothelioma is a result of asbestos exposure, but research reveals that 50% of the current mesotheliomas being treated no longer occurs due to asbestos but rather the SV-40 virus contained in the polio vaccination. In addition, according to researchers from the Institute of Histology and General Embryology of the University of Ferrara, SV-40 has turned up in a variety other tumors. By the end of 1996, dozens of scientists reported finding SV40 in a variety of bone cancers and a wide range of brain cancers, which had risen 30 percent over the previous 20 years.

The SV-40 virus is now being detected in tumors removed from people never inoculated with the contaminated vaccine, leading some to conclude that those infected by the vaccine might be spreading SV40.

The first swine flu vaccine, polio vaccines, smallpox vaccine, anthrax vaccine, hepatitis B vaccine, and most recently Lyme disease vaccine that crippled approximately 750,000 people within months of its release and prior to its recall by the FDA contain “vaccine-injury certainty,” explains Dr. Leonard G. Horowitz.

Horowitz continues:

Most people fail to realize all vaccines carry a list of ingredients that typically increase human disease and death (i.e., morbidity and mortality). These include toxic elements and chemicals such as mercury, aluminum, formaldehyde and formalin (used to preserve corpses), MSG, foreign genetic material, and risky proteins from various species of bacteria, viruses, and animals that have been scientifically associated with triggering autoimmune disorders and certain cancers. A growing body of scientific evidence strongly suggests vaccines are largely responsible for increasing cases of autism and other learning disabilities, chronic fatigue, fibromyalgia, Lupus, MS, ALS, rheumatoid arthritis, asthma, hay fever, allergies, chronic draining ear infections, type 1 autoimmune diabetes, and many, many more pandemics. These chronic ailments are said to require long-term medical care for the patients’ management causing toxic side effects resulting in America’s leading killer — iatrogenic disease. That is, vaccines and other pharmaceutical industry inventions are literally killing or disabling millions with little effort on the part of government officials and their drug industry cohorts to arrest this scourge.

http://www.thecitizen.com/~citizen0/node/37660

Ok, all that said, it's fine to dispute this with official propaganda statistics, but really, let's examine who actually benefits on each side of the debate.

Is it the multi-billion $$ pharmaceutical companies, the medical-industrial complex, that effectively killed homeopathic universities and practices, due to competition from a much less invasive and very inexpensive form of healing? Governments, who can utilize such fabricated "pandemics" to institute greater forced control and compliance from a growing population of educated and independent citizens?


On the other side of the debate -- who benefits, and how? Do doctors who risk their livelihoods and professional standing benefit in any monetary way, or otherwise, from dissemenating information about the harms and dangers of vaccines? Perhaps modest income from a book or website, but how much more would they accumulate by toeing the party line the AMA demands with fascist-like rule? The AMA has effectively shut down many forms of alternative medicine, including homeopathy, chiropractic, naturopathy, et al -- therapies that prove extremely successful, with drastically decreased profit, and much fewer harmful effects than allopathic medicine, for precisely this reason -- their benefits far surpass those of allopathy, and keep people much healthier (but perhaps not so compliant, eh?)

I mean, what in the world is the benefit to people who try to expose the truth? Increased personal danger from corporations/governments with enormous stakes in these measures? Ridicule and harassment from the establishment?

The glaring discrepancies in the gains and motives of each side of this debate are very apparent, and should be a wake-up call to everyone who cares about his/her society, family, health and freedom.

[lycanox]

so you are suggesting that a regular flu shot might work differently?

Tamiflue is an antiviral given to combat an already ongoing flue infection.
Flue vaccinations prevent flue infections.

so by this reasoning, mankind should stop making any type of vaccination so that there would be a natural balance between mankind and nature??
of course it is natural, the question is wether or not was manipulated to skip a few generations.

Actually the status quo is a virus infection that causes no symptoms.
As the virus itself is not really interested in getting you sick. As it would mean that your body start defending itself. Or that if you die. It will lose it host.

Problem is however that once in a while, the virus mutates in a more dangerous form that destroys this balance. Resulting in a pandemic and epidemics.

and are there any OTHER side-effects to be given consideration?

None that are of any mayor concern.

what we do see are more people advertly effected by the vaccination, rather than the swine flu itself.

\ah, but what about that little voice of fucking opposition? for every action, there is an EQUAL and opposite reaction. deny that one fucktard.

Evidence please. As the data from the WHO tells another story.

[Sirius]

Tamiflue is an antiviral given to combat an already ongoing flue infection.
Flue vaccinations prevent flue infections.

Thats not exactly true, it is not 100% effective.

[uki]

None that are of any mayor concern.

you mean "major" concern... anyways... no concern of whom?? the people vaccinated or those who are legally exempt from liablity?

[calliope]

and are there any OTHER side-effects to be given consideration?

None that are of any mayor concern.

Of major concern: yes there are. See the other posts in this thread.

Also, I'd like to state that for all my disagreement with vaccines, the AMA and allopathic medicine, in general, mostly due to their fascist control over all healing methods, I do utterly believe that such elements do have a very important place in the world.

I am very grateful for numerous instances in my life that involved modern, mainstream medicine. I do not criticize all aspects of mainstream medical practices, practitioners and researchers in the least.

They serve a very crucial necessity in society. I love that we have biologists such as Lycanox, keeping us safe from dangers we don't even know exist. Technology does so much toward making life comfortable and bearable enough that we are able -- all of humanity, as opposed to a select privileged few -- to progress in areas such as spirituality, knowledge and myriad others.

But there has to be a balance, in allowing the good effects to outweigh the negative, and allowing differing approaches to exist, in harmony, and alongside such technological advances as allopathic medicine. And not allow the powerful aspects of such technology to overrun and control our lives, rather than to enhance them.

[lycanox]

But it isn't just GBS. There is much much more in the arena of negative effects from this vaccine, as well as others.

Ok, all that said, it's fine to dispute this with official propaganda statistics, but really, let's examine who actually benefits on each side of the debate.

And still the decease has already proved a lot more dangerous than the entire US vaccination program combined.

Is it the multi-billion $$ pharmaceutical companies, the medical-industrial complex, that effectively killed homeopathic universities and practices, due to competition from a much less invasive and very inexpensive form of healing? Governments, who can utilize such fabricated "pandemics" to institute greater forced control and compliance from a growing population of educated and independent citizens?


On the other side of the debate -- who benefits, and how? Do doctors who risk their livelihoods and professional standing benefit in any monetary way, or otherwise, from dissemenating information about the harms and dangers of vaccines? Perhaps modest income from a book or website, but how much more would they accumulate by toeing the party line the AMA demands with fascist-like rule? The AMA has effectively shut down many forms of alternative medicine, including homeopathy, chiropractic, naturopathy, et al -- therapies that prove extremely successful, with drastically decreased profit, and much fewer harmful effects than allopathic medicine, for precisely this reason -- their benefits far surpass those of allopathy, and keep people much healthier (but perhaps not so compliant, eh?)

I mean, what in the world is the benefit to people who try to expose the truth? Increased personal danger from corporations/governments with enormous stakes in these measures? Ridicule and harassment from the establishment?

There is always someone making a profit out of something. That is how capitalism works.

You might as well claim that Katrina was caused by the companies that build water pumps and such. Or that the people that suffered from the tsunami in Indonesia should reject aid because some of the companies that supply those made a nice profit from it.

The glaring discrepancies in the gains and motives of each side of this debate or very apparent, and should be a wake-up call to everyone who cares about his/her society, family, health and freedom.

On the other side of the debate is a growing amount of people that have completely lost touch with reality.

That believe that taking a vaccination always equate to getting sick. Despite the extremely low chance of that actually happening and the amount of people that get saved from a horrible decease each year thanks to the vaccine.

People that continually continue making false claims like the one about autism. Despite it being disproved countless of time and lacking any real scientific basis.

People that endanger their children by allowing them to remain vulnerable for dangerous deceases. Because they cant get over the fact that the companies are making money out of it or are believing some kind of conspiracy theory.

You see, it is not pro vaccination side that is having a shady agenda.
But the people from the anti vaccination side that are always trying to scare people away from a perfect normal medical procedure.

Unless you can prove that the vaccine is actually more dangerous than the flue virus itself. You simply have no point here.

[calliope]

And still the decease has already proved a lot more dangerous than the entire US vaccination program combined.

Actually, it hasn't.

There is always someone making a profit out of something. That is how capitalism works.

And that is why we have checks and balances, and good regulatory bodies in place, to protect consumers. Fascist rule for one element is quite harmful, except to those who benefit.

You might as well claim that Katrina was caused by the companies that build water pumps and such. Or that the people that suffered from the tsunami in Indonesia should reject aid because some of the companies that supply those made a nice profit from it.

Nope, apples and oranges. The injured parties benefitted after the fact. And actually, I can, unequivocally, claim that contractors and the military-industrial complex did and do contribute to the death and misery of millions of war victims for the express purpose of profit and control.

On the other side of the debate is a growing amount of people that have completely lost touch with reality.

According to those who have a vested interest in creating a reality that suits their greedy objectives.

That believe that taking a vaccination always equate to getting sick. Despite the extremely low chance of that actually happening and the amount of people that get saved from a horrible decease each year thanks to the vaccine.

This is questionable, with a lot of research that proves otherwise.

People that continually continue making false claims like the one about autism. Despite it being disproved countless of time and lacking any real scientific basis.

People that endanger their children by allowing them to remain vulnerable for dangerous deceases. Because they cant get over the fact that the companies are making money out of it or are believing some kind of conspiracy theory.

People don't mind successful companies. But when profits and societal control endanger their children, which has proved the case again and again, they mind very much. Again, the people pointing out these dangers have absolutely nothing to gain, except personal endagerment and harassment.

You see, it is not pro vaccination side that is having a shady agenda.

Actually, they do.

But the people from the anti vaccination side that are always trying to scare people away from a perfect normal medical procedure.

Scare away, for what reason? There is no other reason, except to save humanity from power-hungry interests that do not have the best interests of humanity in mind.

Unless you can prove that the vaccine is actually more dangerous than the flue virus itself. You simply have no point here.

There is adequate evidence in this thread already, or else intelligent people would not be interested in posting here. And there is just much a point for my being here as there is for you.

[uki]

And still the decease has already proved a lot more dangerous than the entire US vaccination program combined.

you mean disease?? which one is more deadly than the vaccination program?

There is always someone making a profit out of something. That is how capitalism works.

so do away with the need for profit...

You might as well claim that Katrina was caused by the companies that build water pumps and such. Or that the people that suffered from the tsunami in Indonesia should reject aid because some of the companies that supply those made a nice profit from it.

actually you are not too far from the truth here...

On the other side of the debate is a growing amount of people that have completely lost touch with reality.

reality as defined by who?? (gotta love the synchronicity here)

That believe that taking a vaccination always equate to getting sick.

so making yourself sick with a vaccination is better than getting sick naturally? why make yourself sick to begin with?

Despite the extremely low chance of that actually happening and the amount of people that get saved from a horrible decease each year thanks to the vaccine.

how do you know it was the vaccination that protected them from the percieved disease that they might get?

People that continually continue making false claims like the one about autism. Despite it being disproved countless of time and lacking any real scientific basis.

which real scientific basis disproved the vaccination-autism link?

People that endanger their children by allowing them to remain vulnerable for dangerous deceases.

and does this make them a criminal for simply allowing nature to take its course?

Because they cant get over the fact that the companies are making money out of it or are believing some kind of conspiracy theory.

but companies make money on people being sick... it's no conspiracy theory... if people weren't getting sick, there would be no money to be made.

You see, it is not pro vaccination side that is having a shady agenda.
But the people from the anti vaccination side that are always trying to scare people away from a perfect normal medical procedure.

but didn't you say that drug resistant viruses are the result of man intereferring with nature? maybe there wouldn't bbe such a global population epidemic if people would stop meddling in the affairs of nature... remember... nature finds a way and if there are too many retards on the planet, nature will find a way to kill them all off eventually - it's retarded to meddle with nature.

Unless you can prove that the vaccine is actually more dangerous than the flue virus itself. You simply have no point here.

unless you can prove that vaccination is relatively harmless, i have made my point already.

[lycanox]

It is very simple.

All your side has to do is provide concrete evidence that this years flue vaccine is going to kill or hurts more people than the virus itself. Despite this not being the case even with seasonal flue.

Untill that point. This is in my eyes nothing more than just another conspiracy theory.

[uki]

It is very simple.

of course this is most certainly why you make it so difficult...

All your side has to do is provide concrete evidence that this years flue vaccine is going to kill or hurts more people than the virus itself. Despite this not being the case even with seasonal flue.

whoa... ummmmmmmmm... so you mean this years swine flu is just gonna be in the seasonal flu shot? are people getting vaccinated for swine flu every year?

Untill that point. This is in my eyes nothing more than just another conspiracy theory.

then move the thread to conspiracy theories.

[MetalMilitia]

Well it's killing roughly 1 / 112...

I know it targets people like me (age group), but I think I could tell it to piss off and beat it the fair and square way. The only season I ever got influenza was the year I got the shot.... earlier in the summer. I'm not crying OMG CONSPIRACY - I just trust that natural immunities some times need to simply happen. Putting all the shit in ya weakens it all.

I'm not agreeing 100% with either side, but if the injections WERE to be made mandatory (not saying they will be) - I would never let anyone give me something I don't want. I think that's where most of the hostility comes from. The idea that it could be imposed or applied via force to people - I think that's where everyone differs.

[MetalMilitia]

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009...ne-paracetamol

The government rejected advice from its expert advisers on swine flu, who said there was no need for the widespread use of Tamiflu and suggested that the public should simply be told to take paracetamol.

An independent panel set up by the Department of Health warned ministers that plans to make the stockpiled drug widely available could do more harm than good, by helping the flu virus to develop resistance to the drug.

But ministers pressed ahead with a policy of mass prescription, fearing the public would not tolerate being told that the millions of doses of Tamiflu held by the state could not be used during a pandemic, one of the committee members has told the Guardian.

"It was felt ... it would simply be unacceptable to the UK population to tell them we had a huge stockpile of drugs but they were not going to be made available," Professor Robert Dingwall, a member of the Committee on Ethical Aspects of Pandemic Influenza, said.