The Rapture

***Doomer*** · Aug 14th, 2004 2:33 PM

When the Rapture comes, will newborn babies and young children who haven't yet accepted Jesus Christ as their savior be left behind ? How will good Christian mama feel about this ?

**CleverWeather** · Aug 14th, 2004 2:59 PM

My memory is sketchy about it but I'm pretty sure infants, martyrs, and people in the process of being accepted into the Catholic church are accepted into heaven.

***Godsgifttomankind*** · Aug 14th, 2004 7:36 PM

Originally Posted by Doomer

When the Rapture comes, will newborn babies and young children who haven't yet accepted Jesus Christ as their savior be left behind ? How will good Christian mama feel about this ?

Hello Doomer,

In regards to the rapture and your reference to babies and young children, I can assure you that all the children of God are well cared for. God created all children special and unique, with their own talents and faculties. Every child when the time is right will see the face of God and be caught up in the Rapture.

David.

***RavenWhitefang*** · Aug 14th, 2004 10:24 PM

Supposedly according to Christian Dogma, children who are under a certain age, I think its 13, not too positive, are automatically sent to heaven when they die. This is because these children have not had a chance to sin in their lives.

***evilwill*** · Aug 15th, 2004 6:14 AM

Heh, I wouldn't be so sure about that. There are plenty of little buggers that 'sin', even if they do not know they are doing it, I believe it's still a sin.

Things such as lying is a sin, does that mean a child that has never spoken a word of truth gets a free card into heaven?

***RavenWhitefang*** · Aug 15th, 2004 1:56 PM

[Mk 10:14]:"When Jesus saw this, He was indignant. He said to them, 'Let the little children come to Me, and do not hinder them, for the kingdom of God belongs to such as these."

sorry its age 12.

"By those who can't believe we mean not only infants and young children, but also all who experience physical death before they are capable of making a decision either for or against the Savior. Those individuals who are mentally incompetent or incapacited, and have therefore never been able to believe, are also included. Human life begins at conception. Those who can't believe also include babies aborted naturally or by human instigation."

of course this is Christian Dogma again.

**dcookcan** · Aug 16th, 2004 11:20 AM

The rapture that is taught in churches is a man made concept that has been around less than 200 years. There is no valid evidence in the bible that says that the christians are going to be zapped out so that god can deal with those christ-killing Jews.

For those christians out there who disagree, do a little word study of bible. The tribulation is for the believers. How can there be a tribulation if there are no believers to tribulate?

After the tribulation of those days, the sun will be darkened and the moon will not give its light .... then ... will be the sign of the coming of the son of man...

In the twinkling of an eye ... we will be changed ... we will meet Him in the air...

These two simple verses suggest that the rapture occurs after the tribulation... chew on that for a while.

As well, do a word study (use a concordance) of 'taken' and 'left behind'. In pretty much every case: being taken is a bad thing and being left behind is not.

example: The flood - everyone outside the arc were 'taken'.
another important example: "two will be in the field; one will be taken, the other left..." "Where are they taken Lord" ... "Where the body is, the vultures gather..."

I am asking you christians who think you believe in what is written in the book to actually read what the book says. Think for yourself and stop eating up everything that your pastors are feeding you.

***RavenWhitefang*** · Aug 16th, 2004 1:37 PM

Very good points there. Considering im not a follower of mainstream religion, I understand your points. My information was based on the question in the religious point of view.

The bible is man made, everything therein is man made.

**Dr. X** · Aug 18th, 2004 3:52 AM

These are some valid points. If I may put my 2 cents in....

In regards to the rapture and your reference to babies and young children, I can assure you that all the children of God are well cared for. God created all children special and unique, with their own talents and faculties. Every child when the time is right will see the face of God

Children are to be taught, that is a "chore" given to us by God. How they act and make decisions are based on what we teach them( plus thier own philosophies as they grow older), and we will be judged according to this, but there will come a time that they must make thier own decisions on whether they believe in God or not. There are too many open doors for arguments on this subject ( "If a child was born Hindu, had a horrible upbringing, but led a good life but died at age 8, would he be accepted into Heaven by Christian standards?", etc.,etc.). Fact is, no one really knows. We have to have faith in that.

The rapture that is taught in churches is a man made concept that has been around less than 200 years

True, and I think that Christians place too much emphasis on that, but that is one of the things that makes it so appealing. Jesus said that all will be judged according to thier actions, whether they are Christian or not, or are accepted into Heaven or not, and being swept away before Tribulation is contradictory to what the Bible says. If you DO study the Bible, there are several phases of Tribulation, and the last part, the worst, believers will be spared, as long as they hang on to thier belief during the first part of Tribulation.

**dcookcan** · Aug 18th, 2004 3:30 PM

there are several phases of Tribulation, and the last part, the worst, believers will be spared, as long as they hang on to thier belief during the first part of Tribulation

Yes, I do study the bible. Show me where you get this multi-phase trib/rapture stuff.

**Spartan117x** · Aug 19th, 2004 8:55 PM

HHAHHAHHAHAHAHHAHA i went to CCD for 5 weeks, once a weeka nd got commioun and confirmation alst year, so i went to 5 classes and just say my stuff to the priesta dn the bishop. And since i didnt want to go my parents did my saint project :P. i love god, but im not sure if he xists but if he does and he gonna kill the shit out of everyone i will accept him.

**Dr. X** · Sep 11th, 2004 4:30 AM

Show me where you get this multi-phase trib/rapture stuff.

When the "rapture" happens, supposedly, is in Rev. 19:7, the wedding of the lamb and His bride. As for the multi-phased stuff...the four horseman, the plagues, etc. There are many phases of Tribulation where God is giving man a chance to repent.

I have to say that it may happen, it may not. But one thing is for sure, if you believe and live your life in accordance to His word, or try to, or die trying, good things will happen during Judgement.

***Doomer*** · Sep 11th, 2004 3:04 PM

I heard that the wedding of the lamb and His bride happens every day in Colorado.

Or maybe that was sheep.

**humanhybrid** · Sep 12th, 2004 5:12 PM

I heard that the wedding of the lamb and His bride happens every day in Colorado

Your right on that one for sure. The whole thing behind prophacy is that Isreal will create this self prophacy. They are the chosen ones to rule the planet. The Jew will make the gentile his servant to the needs of their god.

**autryn2** · Sep 14th, 2004 5:21 PM

The rapture comes from Matthew Chapter 24:
(see verses 30, 31 and 40, 41)

21For then there will be great distress, unequaled from the beginning of the world until now--and never to be equaled again. 22If those days had not been cut short, no one would survive, but for the sake of the elect those days will be shortened. 23At that time if anyone says to you, 'Look, here is the Christ!' or, 'There he is!' do not believe it. 24For false Christs and false prophets will appear and perform great signs and miracles to deceive even the elect--if that were possible. 25See, I have told you ahead of time.
26"So if anyone tells you, 'There he is, out in the desert,' do not go out; or, 'Here he is, in the inner rooms,' do not believe it. 27For as lightning that comes from the east is visible even in the west, so will be the coming of the Son of Man. 28Wherever there is a carcass, there the vultures will gather.
29"Immediately after the distress of those days
" 'the sun will be darkened,
and the moon will not give its light;
the stars will fall from the sky,
and the heavenly bodies will be shaken.'[3]
30"At that time the sign of the Son of Man will appear in the sky, and all the nations of the earth will mourn. They will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of the sky, with power and great glory. 31And he will send his angels with a loud trumpet call, and they will gather his elect from the four winds, from one end of the heavens to the other.
36"No one knows about that day or hour, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son,[6] but only the Father. 37As it was in the days of Noah, so it will be at the coming of the Son of Man. 38For in the days before the flood, people were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, up to the day Noah entered the ark; 39and they knew nothing about what would happen until the flood came and took them all away. That is how it will be at the coming of the Son of Man. 40Two men will be in the field; one will be taken and the other left. 41Two women will be grinding with a hand mill; one will be taken and the other left.
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humanhybrid wrote:
'The Jew will make the gentile his servant to the needs of their god.'

Dude, you don't have a clue about Christianity....

From Matthew Chapter 8: (Jesus sez...) 11 I say to you that many will come from the east and the west, and will take their places at the feast with Abraham, Isaac and Jacob in the kingdom of heaven. 12But the subjects of the kingdom will be thrown outside, into the darkness, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth."
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Jesus is saying that it is those with faith that will go to heaven, not those with a birthright (jews).

**humanhybrid** · Sep 14th, 2004 10:42 PM

Your dogma doesnt really affect me Im not intrested. Im just an observer "human" I dont need none of it. I came into this world without knowing a god or nation and I will leave this world in the same manner. HUMANS are more important that ANY god or nation. Thank thinking humans that we dont have slavery as a norm. Thank humans that we dont put women down anymore. Thank the human spirit that we are not ruled by a pope. BEHOLD WHAT MAKES MAN CONFUSED! Bible Contradictions
http://ffrf.org/lfif/?t=contra.txt

**autryn2** · Sep 15th, 2004 10:00 AM

humanhybrid wrote: "I dont need none of it. I came into this world without knowing a god or nation and I will leave this world in the same manner."
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Then why on earth are you on a site discusing religion adding your admittedly uninformed opinion??? You are welcome to not believe in God or Christianity (all have this right), but why waste your time on a site discusing religion???

**Dr. X** · Sep 16th, 2004 10:58 AM

Then why on earth are you on a site discusing religion adding your admittedly uninformed opinion??? You are welcome to not believe in God or Christianity (all have this right), but why waste your time on a site discusing religion???

Because, as you said, he has that right.
I have noticed that on alot of these discussions that the posts are reflective of discrediting Religion instead of affirming it, or questioning it's validity. Nothing wrong with that, this is America, yes?
Chin up! As believers we speak what we believe, and if no one listens, then that's that, as long as we stand true. But this forum seems ripe for non-hostile debates, and, although I don't come here often, at least the questions posed to me have been valid ones. The one about Hitler though was waaaay out there on the hypothetical ledge, though..lol!

**humanhybrid** · Sep 16th, 2004 11:36 AM

Dr.X greetings! It is my pleasure. Please don't discredit this moment. Can people ward off superstitious ways of thinking? Or will they cling to an old habit regardless of what the Dr. says. Some people will refuse their child a blood transfusion on the basis of "faith" Do you cling to a faith or are you willing to get a transfusion if the occasion arises? If indeed something realistic is presented to you regardless of the nature, do you stand stagnant and blissfully hold yourself in ignorance? I used to be religious, I come from a family of Baptist ministers so I know what type of prison people are in. And yes when people are incarcerated they do reform themselves. Well I guess they do backslide too! good day!

**Dr. X** · Sep 16th, 2004 11:51 AM

Greetings HH!

Some people will refuse their child a blood transfusion on the basis of "faith" Do you cling to a faith or are you willing to get a transfusion if the occasion arises?

Well, if they truly believe they should hang , then hang on. I believe that God gives us situations that we must make decisions at, and certain beliefs don't hold science and medicine as a valid thing to believe in. It goes that way with any belief.

If indeed something realistic is presented to you regardless of the nature, do you stand stagnant and blissfully hold yourself in ignorance?

I believe that there are so many applications to that. If one doesn't understand why one is going thru certain things, but holds good cheer because they believe in thier faith, does that make them wrong? Or if one KNOWS why and holds good cheer forcefully, does that make them right? Problem is, that no one really knows but God, and He will be Judge over our hearts and reactions. I believe that, as long as one believes and reacts from the heart and soul, you can't really go wrong. In most cases, at least.

**humanhybrid** · Sep 16th, 2004 12:20 PM

I believe that there are so many applications to that. If one doesn't understand why one is going thru certain things, but holds good cheer because they believe in thier faith, does that make them wrong?

Dr.X It would make them wrong if their faith barred life to their child. If a child needs medical attention, that child should have that transfusion. Is that wrong? I would CHALLENGE YOU that medically more people would live by medical attention than being healed by faith. I would CHALLENGE every christian on this planet to heal themselves by faith and to neglect any type of medical procedure. Faith my friend has been misunderstood in the hearts of every man and woman as "TRUST" Heart and Soul is relative and varies according to conditioning, cultural and religion. good day!

**Dr. X** · Sep 16th, 2004 12:32 PM

You are so right, but I'm not one to challenge if one's faith is right or wrong, because I can only know what I have experienced. Everything else is specualtion. I know that, from what I believe, that medical science is something that is to be utilized, whether Christian or not, but some believe that faith alone is enough. Even the Bible says that faith isn't enough, acts (one's actions) have to back that up. Your challenge could not be met, as there isn't enough cases to validate it. It DOES happen, but not at an alarming frequency.

**humanhybrid** · Sep 16th, 2004 12:41 PM

Dr.X Please accept my apologies for being so cocky. You seem to be mature in your place and relationship with a creator. I respect you. Please visit frequently I enjoy your posts good day!